Is it possible to lose salvation?

[BreadOfLife]

The New Testament is a new passover. Because Jesus returned long ago, there are plenty of reinterpretations of it.

The Bible tells us that Jesus returns ONCE - not twice.

YOU have YET to show me any documented evidence of this “secret return” that you speak of. Jesus Himself labels YOU as a false prophet (Matt. 24:23).

Yet it is about Israel and its proselytes. That is why you see more anti-idol stuff, then pro-trinity stuff in it.

Ummm, although the word “Trinity” is not in Scripture - the Bible has PLENTY to say about the Triune Godhead . . .

The Father is God
Eph. 4:6, Psalm 68:5, Mal. 2:10, 2 Cor. 1:3-4, John 3:16, John 8:41, 1 Thess. 3:13

The Son is God
Isaiah 7:14, Isaiah 9:6, Matt. 4:7, John 1:1, John 1:3, John 8:58, John 10:30, John 14:9, John 20:28, 2 Corinthians 4:4, Phil. 2:6, Col. 2:9, 1 Tim. 3:16, Heb. 1:8, Titus 2:13, Rev. 22:13

The Holy Spirit is God
John 14:16-18, Luke 12:10, 2 Cor. 3:17, 2 Cor. 13:5, John 14:23, Acts 5:3-4

John 14:16,26; 15:26; 16:7 – the Father and the Son send the Counselor, the Holy Spirit – Isaiah 9:6 – the Counselor is Mighty God.

 

[MonoBiblical]

He was the foster-father of Jesus.
GOD was His Father.

Mary even forgot who the real father was.

My “mistakes”??

I’ve given you the literal and cultural definitions and uses of “Adelphos” from scholarly and Biblical sources. I’ve also provided several Biblical examples.

There’s been NO mistake on MY part . . .

You believe Peter didn't have a biological son, and that he came to Rome following Paul.

 

[SirJamsalot]

He's following teachings from that murderer John Calvin

To those reading this particular post, a fair discussion really shouldn’t hang on a slogan like “that murderer John Calvin.”

Historically, the Servetus case is more complicated. Servetus had already been condemned as a heretic by both Roman Catholic and Protestant cities; he was effectively on the run when he turned up in Geneva at Calvin’s church. The session of Calvin’s church reported Servetus to the civil authorities, and he was arrested. He was tried and sentenced by the civil council, not by Calvin personally. During this time, Calvin visited Servetus repeatedly in prison, urging him to repent and recant his views, but Servetus refused. When the council decided on execution, Calvin actually pleaded for a more humane method (beheading instead of burning), but he had no civil authority to overturn or commute the punishment.

Calvin did believe that persistent, blasphemous heresy could be a capital offense (as did almost all major theologians of his day), and most of us today will say that was a serious mistake. But branding him simply “a murderer” rips a complex 16th-century situation out of its context, in a world where all sides used the state to enforce religious uniformity.

In any case, the truth or falsity of his teachings has to be judged from Scripture, not decided in advance by a loaded label about a complicated historical episode.

In His Grip.
c

 

[MonoBiblical]

Isaiah 7:14

What does this have to do with a trinity doctrine? More of your Roman mistakes.

 

[MonoBiblical]

And thou doesn’t understand that Jesus wasn’t talking about Passover in John 3.

Like I said – you’ll pervert God’s Word just to disagree.

I was not talking about John 3.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Calvin did believe that persistent, blasphemous heresy could be a capital offense

And yet we do not see any teaching in the New Covenant where the Lord tells us to go murder those that don't follow the false doctrines of calvinism or catholicism

So the truth is John Calvin was in fact a murderer who did not have the Holy Spirit as he was not even a born again Christian.

He is the definition of what a heretic actually is and his picture should be in the dictionary next to heretic

He was tried and sentenced by the civil council, not by Calvin personally.

And of course Calvin controlled the "civil counsel" as those members would be murdered if they did not do what Calvin wanted.

Calvinism has much in common with islam as they both sought to convert thru force as did the catholics

the truth or falsity of his teachings has to be judged from Scripture

Done! Based on the New testament, calvinism is doctrines of demons.

These are the tares Jesus warned about, the children of the wicked one.

 

[MonoBiblical]

First of all - Biblical Christian Baptism in NOT always described as “dunking”. In fact, it almost never is. Acts 2:41 tells us that over 3000 people were Baptized at Pentecost. The logistics of that would be nearly impossible without Baptism by pouring, as described in the Didache.

Do be true. He did not say "dunking". Immersion was the term, and baptism canbe a name, the Holy Spirit of the God the Father, water, and perhaps mud. Thus, the immersion of the Holy Spirit had nothing to with water, and it is the final name and stage of the triad. Your logistics are very limiting.

 

[GodsGrace]

I always notice that it seems just about every denomination and realm within christendom
always has their books and their scholars and even t heir greek , heremunetics , exegis and who knows what other words
they use to sound wise .
But you wanna know what else i notice , HOW come their books contradict each others book
and M ORE SO why do it contradict even THE VERY BIBLE .
I have one book for us all and its known and called THE HOLY B IBLE .
And we darn sure dont need to be sitting under these scholars and their study books .
Beleive me GOD can reveal as we need to know and to learn . Be on gaurd
for their books are always twisted to fit their own place and own men . just saying . i see it a lot . Bible time .

When sources contradict I don't use them.
If Hahn and Bergsma agree on something, you could bet it'll be correct.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Hahn and Bergsma

These are not Apostles so anything they say is not on the same level as scripture.

 

[amigo de christo]

When sources contradict I don't use them.
If Hahn and Bergsma agree on something, you could bet it'll be correct.

This sheep dont bet on any man . If even Hahn and Bergsma do agree , you can BET I TEST IT .
if even the mighty peter and barnabas fell into a dissumlation and had to be corrected
WELL then . KNOW and understand that the ONLY ONE we can TRULY TRUST , THAT BE GOD ALL MIGHTY .
And I KNOW I CAN TRUST HIS W ORDS in that bible .
Even peter and barnabas agreed on a dissumulation . AND BOTH OF THEM MEN WERE MEN OF GOD .
We didnt hear paul say , WELL if pe ter and barnabas agree it has to be co rrect .
NO sir and no mam . ITS ONLY CORRECT IF GOD AGREES and it dont contradict HIS WORDS .
Now i hope that just lit you up on fire with encouragement .
IN GOD , IN CHRIST the sheep do trust . in man , YEAH NOT SO MUCH at all . while we love all
While i desire the death of none
I DARN sure dont trust IN MAN . And any one can slip . always man must never be put up on a pedastool .
no ma tter if he speak truth . Do be encouraged my friend .

 

[SirJamsalot]

And of course Calvin controlled the "civil counsel" as those members would be murdered if they did not do what Calvin wanted.

Again, for those reading this post, please do your diligence before believing these myths.

For a no-nonsense understanding of Geneva’s legal system in Calvin’s day, look up legal historian John Witte Jr. (his site is under his full name). If you search for “CHURCH, STATE, AND FAMILY IN JOHN CALVIN’S GENEVA: Domestic Disputes and Sex Crimes in Geneva’s Consistory and Council John Witte, Jr.” you should find his paper. I quote from it below.

In short: Geneva was a republic with four elected councils that drafted, ratified, and enforced the laws. Calvin was a pastor, not a magistrate. He sat on the Consistory, which had no formal legal power and had to refer cases to the Small Council. That council sometimes accepted his recommendations and sometimes rejected them- they were not his “fanboys,” to put it bluntly.

Witte notes that in difficult cases the Small Council might ask the Consistory for more fact-finding or advice. Calvin was often sent to present those recommendations, and sometimes he went on his own initiative to urge clearer laws or more equitable treatment. But he was “sometimes accommodated, sometimes rebuffed”... hardly a dictator holding a dagger over elected officials.

I’m done with this thread, but I’d really encourage anyone interested to read the history before latching onto dogmatic slogans just because they’re confidently stated.

CHURCH, STATE, AND FAMILY IN JOHN CALVIN’S GENEVA: (around page 8ish?)

In complicated cases, the Small Council would often refer issues back to the Consistory for further fact-finding, investigation of witnesses, or advice on novel questions that were not addressed at all or clearly enough in the statutes. The Consistory would then make recommendations of whether or how to proceed, which the Small Council would take under advisement. If an issue was particularly complex or pressing, or if the Consistory decided that the Small Council was not proceeding properly, they would send a representative to the next Council meeting to put their recommendations or press their case. John Calvin was the one often tapped to represent the Consistory’s interest before the Council in these cases. On occasion, Calvin showed up at Council’s meetings on his initiative, sometimes to press the Council to enact clearer rules to address an issue heard by the Consistory, sometimes to urge equity in a given case that the Consistory had removed to the Council. He was sometimes accommodated, sometimes rebuffed.

 

[GodsGrace]

These are not Apostles so anything they say is not on the same level as scripture.

Correct.

 

[GodsGrace]

This sheep dont bet on any man . If even Hahn and Bergsma do agree , you can BET I TEST IT .
if even the mighty peter and barnabas fell into a dissumlation and had to be corrected
WELL then . KNOW and understand that the ONLY ONE we can TRULY TRUST , THAT BE GOD ALL MIGHTY .
And I KNOW I CAN TRUST HIS W ORDS in that bible .
Even peter and barnabas agreed on a dissumulation . AND BOTH OF THEM MEN WERE MEN OF GOD .
We didnt hear paul say , WELL if pe ter and barnabas agree it has to be co rrect .
NO sir and no mam . ITS ONLY CORRECT IF GOD AGREES and it dont contradict HIS WORDS .
Now i hope that just lit you up on fire with encouragement .
IN GOD , IN CHRIST the sheep do trust . in man , YEAH NOT SO MUCH at all . while we love all
While i desire the death of none
I DARN sure dont trust IN MAN . And any one can slip . always man must never be put up on a pedastool .
no ma tter if he speak truth . Do be encouraged my friend .

The reply is too complicated.

Do YOU understand everything in the bible?
I don't and need help every now and then.

 

[amigo de christo]

The reply is too complicated.

Do YOU understand everything in the bible?
I don't and need help every now and then.

Do I understand everything in the bible . No .
However even when i dont understand something
IF a man comes along and teaches me something about what i did not understand
DID YOU KNOW i can still percieve if he is telling me a LIE . OH YES .
Any guesses on why that might be . GOD is with the sheep .
The problem with many , however is they RUN to men, they sit under whatever teacher tickles their fancy .
AND THAT IS A MAJOR problem my friend .
SO while its true i do not UNDERSTAN D IT ALL
What GOD has taught me in what i have read and do read , ITS A GEM i shall hold onto .
FOR GOD has kept me safe . AND I TRUST IN HE WHO KNOWS ALL and UNDERSTANDS ALL .
HE will teach me as i need to know and if or when i need to know .
You would marvel , however at how easy things would come together IF WE actually DID read it for ourselves .
You would marvel at how simple things can and would have come together .

 

[GodsGrace]

Again, for those reading this post, please do your diligence before believing these myths.

For a no-nonsense understanding of Geneva’s legal system in Calvin’s day, look up legal historian John Witte Jr. (his site is under his full name). If you search for “CHURCH, STATE, AND FAMILY IN JOHN CALVIN’S GENEVA: Domestic Disputes and Sex Crimes in Geneva’s Consistory and Council John Witte, Jr.” you should find his paper. I quote from it below.

In short: Geneva was a republic with four elected councils that drafted, ratified, and enforced the laws. Calvin was a pastor, not a magistrate. He sat on the Consistory, which had no formal legal power and had to refer cases to the Small Council. That council sometimes accepted his recommendations and sometimes rejected them- they were not his “fanboys,” to put it bluntly.

Witte notes that in difficult cases the Small Council might ask the Consistory for more fact-finding or advice. Calvin was often sent to present those recommendations, and sometimes he went on his own initiative to urge clearer laws or more equitable treatment. But he was “sometimes accommodated, sometimes rebuffed”... hardly a dictator holding a dagger over elected officials.

I’m done with this thread, but I’d really encourage anyone interested to read the history before latching onto dogmatic slogans just because they’re confidently stated.

Just happened to see this when replying and am not too interested because there's plenty of balme to go around.
From what I can remember, what you're stating is correct except that I seem to remember that IF Calvin had spoken on Severtes behalf he might have been released...you seem to be saying that he did....

I don't know why this is important since it's what the reformed/calvinist faith actually teaches that should be the issue.
Popes in the CC have caused death...Protestants have caused death.

The CHURCH is pure...
but man is not.

 

[GodsGrace]

Do I understand everything in the bible . No .
However even when i dont understand something
IF a man comes along and teaches me something about what i did not understand
DID YOU KNOW i can still percieve if he is telling me a LIE . OH YES .
Any guesses on why that might be . GOD is with the sheep .
The problem with many , however is they RUN to men, they sit under whatever teacher tickles their fancy .
AND THAT IS A MAJOR problem my friend .
SO while its true i do not UNDERSTAN D IT ALL
What GOD has taught me in what i have read and do read , ITS A GEM i shall hold onto .
FOR GOD has kept me safe . AND I TRUST IN HE WHO KNOWS ALL and UNDERSTANDS ALL .
HE will teach me as i need to know and if or when i need to know .
You would marvel , however at how easy things would come together IF WE actually DID read it for ourselves .
You would marvel at how simple things can and would have come together .

So tell me Amigo....
How many Marys were at the foot of the cross?

John 19:25

English Standard Version
but standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene.


Berean Standard Bible
Near the cross of Jesus stood His mother and her sister, as well as Mary the wife of Clopas and Mary Magdalene.

 

[amigo de christo]

So tell me Amigo....
How many Marys were at the foot of the cross?

John 19:25

English Standard Version
but standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene.


Berean Standard Bible
Near the cross of Jesus stood His mother and her sister, as well as Mary the wife of Clopas and Mary Magdalene.

Well of course we both know that this is not necessary to know .
However my best guess it at least three . Mary wife of cleopas , mary magdalene , mary mother of Christ .
at least three . thanks for asking my friend . could have been more . I aint sure . but at least them three .

 

[GodsGrace]

Well of course we both know that this is not necessary to know .
However my best guess it at least three . Mary wife of cleopas , mary magdalene , mary mother of Christ .
at least three . thanks for asking my friend . could have been more . I aint sure . but at least them three .

LOL
This is what the discussion was about.
It might be 3.
It might be 4.

Of course it's not important...which was also stated.

But,,,looks like you hit the nail on the head...
Three.

 

[amigo de christo]

So tell me Amigo....
How many Marys were at the foot of the cross?

John 19:25

English Standard Version
but standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene.


Berean Standard Bible
Near the cross of Jesus stood His mother and her sister, as well as Mary the wife of Clopas and Mary Magdalene.

King james spells that out too . three .

 

[Marvelloustime]

King james spells that out too . three .

@amigo de christo