Can LGBTQ individuals be saved?

[amigo de christo]

All liars will take their place in the lake of fire. A liar implies a habitual disposition to lie. Someone who makes a living off of lying, yea I would consider them a liar. That means it's into the lake of fire they go.

What if a man outright calls GOD a liar . IS He t hen NOT the liar . And remember all liars will have their part in the lake of fire .
SO NOW a word .
ANY who beleives NOT the testimony that GOD gave of the SON , calls GOD A LIAR .
SO I WOULD NOT HEED ecumeincal in terfaith interreglious liars . Cause they done called GOD A LIAR
when they said ALL religions , Take heed THEY ARE CHRIST DENYING , serve the same GOD we do .
IN FACT , oh YES , HERE THEY SAY , in fact our
GOD , OUR CHRIST , IS NO BE TTER THAN THEIR GOD . WE JUST ALL SERVE THE SAME GOD DIFFRENTLY .
THEY CALL GOD A LIAR . I WOULD NOT HEED OR F OLLOW THEM .

 

[bdavidc]

I ran into a Baptist Pastor/teacher and he believes that no one from LGBTQ can ever be saved in Christ. I am just curious what everyone else's biblical stand on this is. Thank you.

Scripture does not teach that someone is beyond salvation because of a particular sin. Christ came to save sinners. But Scripture is also very clear that salvation includes repentance, and repentance means turning away from the sin. A person cannot claim Christ while continuing to live in a sinful lifestyle.

The passage that directly addresses this is very clear. “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind… shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God” ~1 Corinthians 6:9-11.

Notice the wording carefully. It says “such were some of you.” That means some believers in Corinth had once lived in those sins, including homosexual behavior. They were saved. They were washed. But the sins are spoken of in the past tense. Their lives changed.

Jesus said plainly why He came: “I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance” ~Luke 5:32. Repentance means turning away from sin, not continuing in it.

Scripture also warns directly against the idea that someone can continue living in sin and still claim Christ. “What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid” ~Romans 6:1-2.

This principle applies to every sin. A thief cannot continue stealing and claim repentance. A drunkard cannot continue in drunkenness and say he has been changed. In the same way, someone cannot continue in sexual immorality and claim to belong to Christ.

The Bible is very direct about this. “Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him” ~1 John 3:6. And again, “He that committeth sin is of the devil… Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin” ~1 John 3:8-9. The point is not that believers never struggle, but that they do not live in sin as a continuing lifestyle.

So the biblical answer is clear. People who have lived in LGBTQ sin can be saved, just like anyone else. Christ forgives sinners and washes them. But if someone continues to live in that sin and refuses to repent of it, Scripture says they are not walking in Christ and have not been changed.

“And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure” ~1 John 3:3.

 

[Aunty Jane]

That repentance would take them out of being "LGBTQ," wouldn't it?

That’s an interesting point.....does repentance and a leaving behind sexual sin, mean that those under the LGBTQ “label” cease being LGBTQ?

If you were born with a hormonal deficiency that deceived your mind as to what “gender” you are, does that take into consideration what causes these ones to feel that way in the first place? What attracts us to a potential mate? What makes the attraction “unnatural” for those born in a way that leads them in a wrong direction?

Why were we created with gender? The angels were God’s first sons, but they have no gender because they do not procreate. All were direct creations of God, so gender in all species of living souls on this planet is for procreation.
God also gave us his laws on marriage and sex, which were to have a couple, committed to each other for a life together, and the children produced from their legitimate union to be a blessing for them.

In the laws God gave to Israel, many pertained to sexual relations, which God identified as outside of his provision of marriage....any that were “unnatural” unions, which included fornication (covering sex between unmarried persons) adultery (sex between married persons outside of their marriage) homosexuality (same sex unions) bestiality (sex with animals). Masturbation in principle, was also covered in Paul’s writings. (1 Cor 7:4)

What do all these unnatural unions produce? The first two can be victims of what sex was originally given to mankind for....to produce children in a committed relationship between two legally (scripturally) married individuals. A pregnancy is an unwanted by product of their lust in breaking God’s Law. Not at all what God gave as a gift to married individuals. Sexual intimacy is not to be based on just lust. Infidelity is a betrayal.
This often leads to divorce, broken families, or abortion, (which is murder in God’s eyes).

Homosexual sex will never produce children and no same sex marriage was ever recognised by God. Jesus said...”Did you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female and said, “For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh”? So that they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has yoked together let no man put apart.”

Only a “man and a woman” can be “one flesh” in God’s arrangement of marriage.

Bestiality is just depraved....

But the fact remains.....will the repentant one in the LGBTQ mindset really be able to turn off what is a “natural” attraction for them? If not, does it mean that they cannot be forgiven?
No! As it says in 2 Cor 6:9-11...

“ Or do you not know that unrighteous people will not inherit God’s Kingdom? Do not be misled. Those who are sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, men who submit to homosexual acts, men who practice homosexuality, 10  thieves, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners will not inherit God’s Kingdom. 11  And yet that is what some of you were. But you have been washed clean; you have been sanctified; you have been declared righteous in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and with the spirit of our God.”

In saying that all forms of wrong conduct will preclude those who practice those things from inheriting the Kingdom, Paul says “yet that is what some of you WERE. But you have been washed clean; you have been sanctified”.....so all those are practices, not just imperfections in the human body.
Sin is what leads humans to practice what God hates, but we can put those practices away and refuse to commit them. This is a deliberate choice.

God sacrificed much for us in sending his precious son to die for us...why shouldn’t we sacrifice things for God in our lives, in appreciation for what he has done so that our sins can be forgiven?

If we cannot enter a scripturally sanctified marriage, regardless of our gender or identity, we must remain celibate in order for God to bless that sacrifice. He knows what that will cost those so affected...and he will bless that sacrifice for what it means....loving God more than we love ourselves.

 

[Rotsen777]

I'm okay with that. Following Jesus until the end sure looks like faithfulness to me. By grace you are saved, through faith.

Did Jesus teach His disciples about salvation by grace through faith? How does that work for a person who wants the salvation of his soul?

 

[St. SteVen]

Welcome to the forum @Rotsen777

 

[rvmb]

Scripture does not teach that someone is beyond salvation because of a particular sin. Christ came to save sinners. But Scripture is also very clear that salvation includes repentance, and repentance means turning away from the sin. A person cannot claim Christ while continuing to live in a sinful lifestyle.

The passage that directly addresses this is very clear. “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind… shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God” ~1 Corinthians 6:9-11.

Notice the wording carefully. It says “such were some of you.” That means some believers in Corinth had once lived in those sins, including homosexual behavior. They were saved. They were washed. But the sins are spoken of in the past tense. Their lives changed.

Jesus said plainly why He came: “I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance” ~Luke 5:32. Repentance means turning away from sin, not continuing in it.

Scripture also warns directly against the idea that someone can continue living in sin and still claim Christ. “What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid” ~Romans 6:1-2.

This principle applies to every sin. A thief cannot continue stealing and claim repentance. A drunkard cannot continue in drunkenness and say he has been changed. In the same way, someone cannot continue in sexual immorality and claim to belong to Christ.

The Bible is very direct about this. “Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him” ~1 John 3:6. And again, “He that committeth sin is of the devil… Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin” ~1 John 3:8-9. The point is not that believers never struggle, but that they do not live in sin as a continuing lifestyle.

So the biblical answer is clear. People who have lived in LGBTQ sin can be saved, just like anyone else. Christ forgives sinners and washes them. But if someone continues to live in that sin and refuses to repent of it, Scripture says they are not walking in Christ and have not been changed.

“And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure” ~1 John 3:3.

""A person cannot claim Christ while continuing to live in a sinful lifestyle.""
Do you claim you no longer willfully sin ?
Are you brave enough to take a simple test ? :)

 

[rvmb]

It would keep them from practicing but deliverance would be needed to eliminate the temptation.

""It would keep them from practicing but deliverance would be needed to eliminate the temptation.""
Does that also apply to your willful sin ?

 

[Rotsen777]

Jesus said...”Did you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female and said, “For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh”? So that they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has yoked together let no man put apart.”

Only a “man and a woman” can be “one flesh” in God’s arrangement of marriage.

Never have I seen, so far, that a man and a woman who got married have become ‘one flesh.’ They’re still separate flesh under one roof. The ‘one flesh’ that we can clearly see here is the offspring that the couple has produced, not the two of them.

 

[Rotsen777]

Welcome to the forum @Rotsen777

Thanks!

 

[St. SteVen]

Aunty Jane said:
Jesus said...”Did you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female and said, “For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh”? So that they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has yoked together let no man put apart.”

Only a “man and a woman” can be “one flesh” in God’s arrangement of marriage.

Never have I seen, so far, that a man and a woman who got married have become ‘one flesh.’ They’re still separate flesh under one roof. The ‘one flesh’ that we can clearly see here is the offspring that the couple has produced, not the two of them.

I think the idea is that the married couple, once joined, is inseparable. One flesh, as it were, that can only be separated by the violent act of divorce.

 

[Rotsen777]

Aunty Jane said:
Jesus said...”Did you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female and said, “For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh”? So that they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has yoked together let no man put apart.”

Only a “man and a woman” can be “one flesh” in God’s arrangement of marriage.

I think the idea is that the married couple, once joined, is inseparable. One flesh, as it were, that can only be separated by the violent act of divorce.

The opinion that ‘they are inseparable’ is way beyond the realm of the truth, as divorces and legal separations are evident proof that they are not one flesh. The best evidence in this regard is the offspring, which comes from the flesh of the woman and the flesh of the man, united into one flesh through coitus.

 

[St. SteVen]

The opinion that ‘they are inseparable’ is way beyond the realm of the truth, as divorces and legal separations are evident proof that they are not one flesh. The best evidence in this regard is the offspring, which comes from the flesh of the woman and the flesh of the man, united into one flesh through coitus.

I understand your point, and it's a good one. The children literally become one flesh of their parents.
However, a married couple is one flesh in a analogical sense. We speak of a consummation of a marriage in sexual intercourse.
This is why sex outside of marriage is so wrong. Two become one flesh in the consummation of sexual intercourse.

 

[Armour of God]

I believe these people can be saved if they recognise their sin, repent and put their faith in Jesus Christ

 

[ProDeo]

Never have I seen, so far, that a man and a woman who got married have become ‘one flesh.’ They’re still separate flesh under one roof. The ‘one flesh’ that we can clearly see here is the offspring that the couple has produced, not the two of them.

Well, God sees a marriage that way.

It's imagery to the union of Christ and His Bride.

 

[ProDeo]

God sacrificed much for us in sending his precious son to die for us...why shouldn’t we sacrifice things for God in our lives, in appreciation for what he has done so that our sins can be forgiven?

If we cannot enter a scripturally sanctified marriage, regardless of our gender or identity, we must remain celibate in order for God to bless that sacrifice. He knows what that will cost those so affected...and he will bless that sacrifice for what it means....loving God more than we love ourselves.

Correct.

Like to add that Christ must have known that marriage was no option for Him and had to suppress (sacrifice) His sexual desires.

 

[Rotsen777]

I understand your point, and it's a good one. The children literally become one flesh of their parents.

Exactly!

However, a married couple is one flesh in a analogical sense. We speak of a consummation of a marriage in sexual intercourse.

I still doubt that they will become one flesh until they die, anyway, we put it.

This is why sex outside of marriage is so wrong.

Yes, but this has nothing to do with the phrase, ‘they shall become one flesh,’ even if they perfected the sanctity of their marriageriage.

Two become one flesh in the consummation of sexual intercourse.

Sorry, but there is no such thing as ‘one flesh in the consummation of coitus.

 

[Rotsen777]

Well, God sees a marriage that way.

Is that so? Have you talked to God about this ‘one flesh’ issue in marriage?

It's imagery to the union of Christ and His Bride.

Did Jesus correlate Him and His bride to couple’s marriage?

 

[ProDeo]

Is that so? Have you talked to God about this ‘one flesh’ issue in marriage?

Did Jesus correlate Him and His bride to couple’s marriage?

My brother, you lack spiritual insight.

With reference to Deut 22:28-29 and Ex 22:16, when a man and a women have sex they are married in the eyes of God, two souls who fuse as one. Exactly like when you came to Christ, you became His, fused. We are His bride in the marriage of the Lamb.

 

[Rotsen777]

My brother, you lack spiritual insight.

With reference to Deut 22:28-29 and Ex 22:16, when a man and a women have sex they are married in the eyes of God,

Okay, no problem about it.

two souls who fuse as one.

This is spiritual matter since you use ‘souls,’ which cannot become one, too.

Exactly like when you came to Christ, you became His, fused.

Have you heard this from Christ? How are you fused to Christ?

We are His bride in the marriage of the Lamb.

How do you say we are His bride? What have we done that makes us His bride?

Are you coming from the Lord, or are you expressing your opinion on biblical matters?

 

[ProDeo]

Okay, no problem about it.

This is spiritual matter since you use ‘souls,’ which cannot become one, too.

Have you heard this from Christ? How are you fused to Christ?

How do you say we are His bride? What have we done that makes us His bride?

Are you coming from the Lord, or are you expressing your opinion on biblical matters?

Last time I checked this is a Bible forum. We discuss the Bible. And the Bible contains 66 books.

We discuss the whole council, its 66 books are considered inspired.

If you consider less than its 66 books inspired, as you do, naturally we end up in conflicting opinions and belief systems.

For the record, which of the 66 books of the Bible do you consider truth ?