Why did Jesus pray to himself?

[Armour of God]

Jesus never prayed to Himself. He prayed to His Father in heaven

I agree with that. His father being God, a different person to Jesus

"Jesus" is the SON OF GOD. He prayed to HIs FATHER. Why can't you get that? "JESUS" was born with a body on the EARTH- He had a human mother---and His Father was God. Now if you can't comprehend this distinction- I'm not sure how else to make it clear

Again I agree. Jesus is the Son of God and prayed to his father who is God.
The thing I can't understand is how Jesus can also be God.

Clear your head, will ya? lol ------ WHO WAS HIS DADDY?

I don't think you understand my confusion.
I understand that Jesus is the Son of God.
I don't understand how Jesus can also be God.
Do you comprehend me now?

IS THE WORD OF GOD who was with God- GOD? answer YES. Did the WORD OF GOD BECOME FLESH AND PRAY TO HIS FATHER? YES.
As to your one entity comments- it is believed that the Father & Son are distinct persons.
They are one in "nature" or "essence"- meaning God nature- not human nature like us.
Does the Son now pray to the Father in heaven?

Ok two different persons. One in nature.
I can understand that.

Some say that Jesus is God, the same entity.
I don't understand that. But that's not what your saying anyway. What your saying makes more sense to me
Thanks

 

[PS95]

Is Jesus God the Father? Or are they two distinct entities?

No, Jesus is not His own Father. Oneness Pentecostals believe that. It's called Modalism. Maybe shepherdword is Oneness. Have you asked him?

 

[Anchorite]

The Holy Spirit is simply Gods spirit.
I understand that.
But I could never understand how Jesus can be God.

A human is a father by having a son. Both father and son are human, but are distinct persons, not the same person.

God is a Father who has a Son. Both Father and Son are God, but are distinct persons, not the same person.

We as Christians accept by faith that God is a complex triune entity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

This is a mystery, just as mysterious as how God does not have an origin, or how God could just speak this vast universe into existence, or how eternity is a timeless state.

Or how light can be both a particle and a wave.

Placebo effect: How can a person's belief in a treatment produce genuine physiological changes in their health?

How does the physical brain give rise to subjective experiences and self-awareness?

How does a thought arise in your mind?

Why does a dream seem to be really happening, until you wake up?

 

[RepentingChristian]

The Holy Spirit is simply Gods spirit.
I understand that.
But I could never understand how Jesus can be God.

Allow me to present a view that no Christian here or virtually anywhere else has ever espoused. The nature of God the Father, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and how they relate to one another is way beyond our ability to understand. Nevertheless, countless know-it-all (shepherdsword) Christians here and elsewhere spew their dogma on this matter and call you stupid if you don't goose-step to it.

 

[RepentingChristian]

No, Jesus is not His own Father. Oneness Pentecostals believe that. It's called Modalism. Maybe shepherdword is Oneness. Have you asked him?

He's usually insulting someone in the posts of his I've seen so I haven't dared to ask.

 

[Armour of God]

A human is a father by having a son. Both father and son are human, but are distinct persons, not the same person.

God is a Father who has a Son. Both Father and Son are God, but are distinct persons, not the same person.

We as Christians accept by faith that God is a complex triune entity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

This is a mystery, just as mysterious as how God does not have an origin, or how God could just speak this vast universe into existence, or how eternity is a timeless state.

Or how light can be both a particle and a wave.

Placebo effect: How can a person's belief in a treatment produce genuine physiological changes in their health?

How does the physical brain give rise to subjective experiences and self-awareness?

How does a thought arise in your mind?

Why does a dream seem to be really happening, until you wake up?

Father and son. Two entities. Same nature.
The father being God and Jesus the son
I understand that

But you also say that father and son are God.
That would mean there are two God's.
I don't understand that.
There is only supposed to be one God,
the father

 

[MatthewG]

My view is simple as this.


God was - speaking - (the Word) created when he was creating. The Holy Spirit of God was also there, mentioned in Genesis 1:1-3.

Jesus is the expressed heart of God. The Word sent forward through Mary by the overshadowing of the Holy Spirit of God. The Word became flesh, named Jesus or even Immanuel God with us.

Jesus as a human overcame all things, and sat with his Father on his throne and they became one as in the beginning.

Lord God Almighty.

Jesus always talked to his Father - Yahweh/Yahavah/Yehovah. (However you prefer.)
Jesus spoke of his Father - Yahweh, often through his life.

 

[Armour of God]

Allow me to present a view that no Christian here or virtually anywhere else has ever espoused. The nature of God the Father, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and how they relate to one another is way beyond our ability to understand. Nevertheless, countless know-it-all (shepherdsword) Christians here and elsewhere spew their dogma on this matter and call you stupid if you don't goose-step to it.

When someone says that the farther and the son are two persons with the same nature, I understand that.

But when some people say that their the same person or that they are both God, then I don't understand that

 

[MatthewG]

Jesus never prayed to himself.

God also left Jesus on the cross.

Idk what else to offer.

Have a good one.

 

[RepentingChristian]

We as Christians accept by faith that God is a complex triune entity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

You have no clue what you're talking about nor did any of the other countless fools who have pretended to know the unknowable and preached about it.

You show me someone who claims to know and fully understand God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and their intricate relationship with one another and I'll show you an arrogant fool.

 

[RepentingChristian]

then I don't understand that

Neither do they. Nobody does. That is God-tier knowledge.

 

[PS95]

I agree with that. His father being God, a different person to Jesus



Again I agree. Jesus is the Son of God and prayed to his father who is God.
The thing I can't understand is how Jesus can also be God.



I don't think you understand my confusion.
I understand that Jesus is the Son of God.
I don't understand how Jesus can also be God.
Do you comprehend me now?

It is a bit confusing because we have the need to know every single thing- we don't.- we can't. I call Jesus my Lord and God the Father- God- but that is to make a distinction only because let's face it the father is also called, Lord and the Son is also called, God. We are mere humans so we can't comprehend all of this.
What I can say is that those who despise the concept of the trinity have absolutely unbiblical teachings like- Jesus - unworthy of our worship creature angel or He had no pre-existence.. I will show you what I do know-
"Jesus" is the name given to the son of Mary and the son of God- so obviously He was not only just like us- we have human fathers..
Jesus is both son of man and son of God- some say godman. Is He His father? of course not. He is God's unique son. The fullness of God dwelt within Him.
Did Jesus recall His life in heaven prior to becoming flesh- YES.
WHO was He before He became flesh? HIs name wasn't Jesus--- we only know Him as the WORD and often times as YWHW in the OT. John 1:1 He was with God and was God.. HOW is that possible? It's hard to get your head around I know but--
Have a look at-
Genesis 19 "Then the LORD rained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven, 25and He overthrew those cities, and all the valley, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and what grew on the ground. 26But his wife, from behind him, looked back, and she became a pillar of salt."
I fully believe that the LORD (YHWH) on earth was Jesus- the Word of God. I believe His Father was in heaven.
He also spoke to Moses in the burning bush. etc..
They are one yet separate- One God. but distinct persons.- same nature or as the trinity calls it same "essence" meaning "stuff" as in same nature. GOD.
I have never heard same entity before. I would not use that word, myself.
I'm not your typical Christian-I say that because many say things they have been taught.
.I understand that. I wasn't taught by any men. I try not to go beyond what is written. Some things we just don't know for sure. I'm ok with that. The details cause division and those details lack in the bible on this.
We are left with a mystery- are you ok with that? I am. There can't be 2 firsts and 2 lasts. Right?
Jesus and His Father both are the First and the Last..
I guess ask yourself if you would fall on your face into the dirt worshiping Jesus as Savior Lord and God- if He was standing before you? That should tell you all you need to know.
Beware of getting into arguments over the details. I was raised a jw- and this is their favorite argument, They LOVE the endless debates on it. They refuse to worship Jesus. Avoid them at all costs- not for this only but they also teach a completely made up "gospel" of 1914 and think when you die physically you become righteous - your sins are gone by death- so you will be resurrected sinless-- so you will have a 2nd chance to earn salvation on earth. There is so much wrong with them!
I kid you not- so avoid them always.
The other extreme-
The Modalists who say the son is His own father are not teaching scripture properly- this is a very old argument. I do think they teach the gospel though.

These types of arguments go on forever and the thread goes to 2000 pages and no one learned a thing. It ends up with all sorts of confusions. Much of it comes from people not differentiating earthly life vs heavenly when they use the name- Jesus-.
"Jesus" was in a body and in a humbled state, serving----- that matters!

Ok two different persons. One in nature.
I can understand that.

Some say that Jesus is God, the same entity.
I don't understand that. But that's not what your saying anyway. What your saying makes more sense to me
Thanks

I'm saying Jesus is YHWH. but Father/son they are distinct persons- one God. Same nature- share the same name and attributes- creator of us all. If you want to message me about this I would be happy to help. I have gone thru this from top to bottom. From the bible- to the EFC's you name it. I have done it. I had to. I was taught all wrong before. I had to start from scratch with nothing but a bible and a prayer.
Some things we just have to say IDK to.. I actually find that best.

@RepentingChristian - you too- feel free to msg me on this if you like. We are not supposed to do this on here.

 

[Anchorite]

You have no clue what you're talking about nor did any of the other countless fools who have pretended to know the unknowable and preached about it.

You show me someone who claims to know and fully understand God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and their intricate relationship with one another and I'll show you an arrogant fool.

You ask questions.

When people try to provide an answer, you call them names.

You have already decided that nobody can answer your questions.

Yet you continue to ask questions.

This is a game few will feel like playing along with.

Have fun!

 

[Armour of God]

It is a bit confusing because we have the need to know every single thing- we don't.- we can't. I call Jesus my Lord and God the Father- God- but that is to make a distinction only because let's face it the father is also called, Lord and the Son is also called, God. We are mere humans so we can't comprehend all of this.
What I can say is that those who despise the concept of the trinity have absolutely unbiblical teachings like- Jesus - unworthy of our worship creature angel or He had no pre-existence.. I will show you what I do know-
"Jesus" is the name given to the son of Mary and the son of God- so obviously He was not only just like us- we have human fathers..
Jesus is both son of man and son of God- some say godman. Is He His father? of course not. He is God's unique son. The fullness of God dwelt within Him.
Did Jesus recall His life in heaven prior to becoming flesh- YES.
WHO was He before He became flesh? HIs name wasn't Jesus--- we only know Him as the WORD and often times as YWHW in the OT. John 1:1 He was with God and was God.. HOW is that possible? It's hard to get your head around I know but--
Have a look at-
Genesis 19 "Then the LORD rained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven, 25and He overthrew those cities, and all the valley, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and what grew on the ground. 26But his wife, from behind him, looked back, and she became a pillar of salt."
I fully believe that the LORD (YHWH) on earth was Jesus- the Word of God. I believe His Father was in heaven.
He also spoke to Moses in the burning bush. etc..
They are one yet separate- One God. but distinct persons.- same nature or as the trinity calls it same "essence" meaning "stuff" as in same nature. GOD.
I have never heard same entity before. I would not use that word, myself.
I'm not your typical Christian-I say that because many say things they have been taught.
.I understand that. I wasn't taught by any men. I try not to go beyond what is written. Some things we just don't know for sure. I'm ok with that. The details cause division and those details lack in the bible on this.
We are left with a mystery- are you ok with that? I am. There can't be 2 firsts and 2 lasts. Right?
Jesus and His Father both are the First and the Last..
I guess ask yourself if you would fall on your face into the dirt worshiping Jesus as Savior Lord and God- if He was standing before you? That should tell you all you need to know.
Beware of getting into arguments over the details. I was raised a jw- and this is their favorite argument, They LOVE the endless debates on it. They refuse to worship Jesus. Avoid them at all costs- not for this only but they also teach a completely made up "gospel" of 1914 and think when you die physically you become righteous - your sins are gone by death- so you will be resurrected sinless-- so you will have a 2nd chance to earn salvation on earth. There is so much wrong with them!
I kid you not- so avoid them always.
The other extreme-
The Modalists who say the son is His own father are not teaching scripture properly- this is a very old argument. I do think they teach the gospel though.

These types of arguments go on forever and the thread goes to 2000 pages and no one learned a thing. It ends up with all sorts of confusions. Much of it comes from people not differentiating earthly life vs heavenly when they use the name- Jesus-.
"Jesus" was in a body and in a humbled state, serving----- that matters!

I'm saying Jesus is YHWH. but Father/son they are distinct persons- one God. Same nature- share the same name and attributes- creator of us all. If you want to message me about this I would be happy to help. I have gone thru this from top to bottom. From the bible- to the EFC's you name it. I have done it. I had to. I was taught all wrong before. I had to start from scratch with nothing but a bible and a prayer.
Some things we just have to say IDK to.. I actually find that best.

@RepentingChristian - you too- feel free to msg me on this if you like. We are not supposed to do this on here.

Thanks for you explanation. You've made me look at it in a new light.
Two persons, one nature. I'm happy with that. It makes sense to me.

There are many things I don't comprehend. And with my limited human mind I have no problem in admitting that I simply don't understand everything. And so I put my faith in God. I'm sure all will be revealed and will make sense to me when the time comes outside of this world.

God bless.

 

[Debp]

The Holy Spirit is simply Gods spirit.
I understand that.
But I could never understand how Jesus can be God.

Father and son. Two entities. Same nature.
The father being God and Jesus the son
I understand that

But you also say that father and son are God.
That would mean there are two God's.
I don't understand that.
There is only supposed to be one God,
the father

Don't make things too complicated by trying to figure God out. God is above our understanding or comprehension.

Jesus is The Word, He became flesh and dwelt among us so He could pay the penalty for our sins.

Jesus prayed to the Father for strength and wisdom which is an example for us.

 

[Justified]

But God is Jesus and Jesus is God. They are one-in-the-same. or so I'm told.

This is not true. The Son is God, but God is not the Son; God is the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit.

Jesus and the Holy Spirit are both just God putting on a different outfit, so to speak.

No, that is the false view of Modalism/Oneness. The Father is not the Son nor the Holy Spirit, nor is the Son the Holy Spirit. They have always existed as distinct one from the other as the one being that is God.

All three have eternally existed because, after all, all three are actually God. At least this is what most Christians teach.

Yes.

So my question again is, why did God pray to himself?

The Son prayed to the Father.

 

[Anchorite]

When a person keeps asking questions, but trashes any answers that are provided, and insults the individuals trying to help them understand, the purpose of the questioning becomes clear.

 

[Lambano]

But God is Jesus and Jesus is God. They are one-in-the-same. or so I'm told. Jesus and the Holy Spirit are both just God putting on a different outfit, so to speak. All three have eternally existed because, after all, all three are actually God. At least this is what most Christians teach.

So my question again is, why did God pray to himself?

Okay; the question is a setup, but I'll dive in anyway.

Remember what Trinitarian theology actually asserts: There are three distinct persons having a common essence. (Or three hypostases, having one ousia, to use the language of the Nicene fathers.)

The Father is not the Son is not the Holy Spirit. And in this context, when you say, "Jesus is God", the term "God" no longer refers to a person, it refers to Jesus's essence or nature. In other biblical contexts, the term "God" refers to the person of the Father. When you say in the context of Jesus praying to the Father that "God is praying to God", you are conflating the essence of God with persons.

"Persons" is a relationship concept. Jesus relates to his Father as a separate person distinct from himself throughout the Bible.

 

[Lambano]

I'm saying Jesus is YHWH.

This I must object to. Names are personal identifiers, and the name of YHWH in the OT identifies the person of the Father.

I take the position that it is not proper to apply a personal name to an essence, such a calling the essence of tree-ness the name of "Harry" (though you can call individual trees "Harry").

It is also not proper to say that the Son and the Father are the same person; that is the Modalist or Sabellianist heresy.

 

[Anchorite]

When a person does not really care about understanding or believing in the triune God of the Bible, they insincerely pose Trinity questions, hoping to poke holes in the orthodoxy of young, immature believers. They seek to display the superiority of their skepticism over the doctrine they mock, to their own eternal detriment.

We could do the same to them, questioning the reality of their inner self, for no one can prove they have a mind or consciousness, nor does anyone know how a subjective ego arises from the brain, or how thoughts and dreams come and go. The “I” is constructed by language through internal monologue.