The Conundrum of Zechariah Ch. 14

[WPM]

Yes, I push what I have been taught, but YOU no doubt have arrived at your understanding through intense personal study of the Bible yourself! NO one but you apparently have the Holy Spirit to guide you, so we must depend on others to study for us. You see how you take delight in belittling others, while calling yourself a Christian. Since you haven't shown any glaring holes in my understanding of doctrine, there is nothing to address. But then this is your usual comeback when you cannot address what is shown from the Bible is not true, because even you understand arguing against the God is an exercise in futility!

Can you not be honest any more?

I refer you back to my avoided posts.

 

[WPM]

What contradictions in my position? You are becoming more and more a Preterit with every post you defend Preterit doctrine!

If you think that title is an offence it is not. I believe in past fulfillment and also future fulfillment. I have been called both Preterist and Futurist. It doesn't offend me. Unlike you, I let context speak. You spiritualize everything literal away in Scripture. It is all an elaborate esoteric metaphor - understood only by Tony, TS and you.

You cannot even tell me whether Jesus is a literal man or not.

 

[rwb]

Can you not be honest any more?

I refer you back to my avoided posts.

You are the liar who is not being honest!

 

[WPM]

You are the liar who is not being honest!

It must be so frustrating to be left defending the indefensible by your mentors.

 

[rwb]

If you think that title is an offence it is not. I believe in past fulfillment and also future fulfillment. I have been called both Preterist and Futurist. It doesn't offend me. Unlike you, I let context speak. You spiritualize everything literal away in Scripture. It is all an elaborate esoteric metaphor - understood only by Tony, TS and you.

You cannot even tell me whether Jesus is a literal man or not.

Of course it's not! What have I spiritualized? Show my elaborate esoteric metaphor, that you are convinced comes from TW and TS! How arrogant you are, and how hostile, and belittling. When have I ever questioned what Jesus is? Perhaps your need to set EVERYONE posting here straight has you confused about who has said what???

 

[rwb]

It must be so frustrating to be left defending the indefensible by your mentors.

Prove what you allege or apologize, apparently you believe that you alone are indwelt with the guiding, teaching Spirit of Christ! And you only possess all truth!

 

[WPM]

Of course it's not! What have I spiritualized? Show my elaborate esoteric metaphor, that you are convinced comes from TW and TS! How arrogant you are, and how hostile, and belittling. When have I ever questioned what Jesus is? Perhaps your need to set EVERYONE posting here straight has you confused about who has said what???

What have you not spiritualized?

You refused to answer my queries re Jesus.

 

[WPM]

Prove what you allege or apologize, apparently you believe that you alone are indwelt with the guiding, teaching Spirit of Christ! And you only possess all truth!

More lies.

 

[rwb]

What have you not spiritualized?

You refused to answer my queries re Jesus.

Oh, I get it! You couldn't find anything I spiritualized, IOW you LIE!

Queries re Jesus??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

 

[WPM]

Oh, I get it! You couldn't find anything I spiritualized, IOW you LIE!

Queries re Jesus??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Pick a subject. That is what you do now.

Now can you address my posts that you are avoiding like the plague?

 

[rwb]

Pick a subject. That is what you do now.

Now can you address my posts that you are avoiding like the plague?

I have no desire to rehash your posts, not because I am avoiding them, but because they have become a means for belittling, and engaging in ungodly back and forth that only serves to bring down other Christians!

I also have no idea of what you're talking about when you say "Pick a subject. That is what you do now."

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Yes, I push what I have been taught, but YOU no doubt have arrived at your understanding through intense personal study of the Bible yourself!

Yes, he has, actually.

NO one but you apparently have the Holy Spirit to guide you, so we must depend on others to study for us.

Does the Holy Spirit guide you alone in your interpretation of Revelation 2:22 that you have all to yourself? Did the Holy Spirit decide to give the correct interpretation of that verse only to you and no one else in the world?

You see how you take delight in belittling others, while calling yourself a Christian. Since you haven't shown any glaring holes in my understanding of doctrine, there is nothing to address. But then this is your usual comeback when you cannot address what is shown from the Bible is not true, because even you understand arguing against the God is an exercise in futility!

You are the one belittling others when you do things like call him a preterist when he's not and saying other things that misrepresent what others believe to try to make them look bad.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a DUCK!

LOL. This is what you're saying in relation to having called him him a preterist. Even though he disagrees with most of how preterists interpret the Olivet Discourse and the book of Revelation, you want to insist on calling him a preterist, anyway. You try to act as if you are holier than everyone else here while you are being dishonest and blatantly misrepresenting what others believe. You need help.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

What contradictions in my position? You are becoming more and more a Preterit with every post you defend Preterit doctrine!

So, when He argues with preterists about their understanding of the rest of the Olivet Discourse and their interpretation of other scriptures like Revelation, he is defending the doctrine he is arguing against? LOL. You keep digging your hole deeper and deeper. Do you never tire of embarrassing yourself?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You are the liar who is not being honest!

This is a serious accusation, so tell me what he has lied about. Be specific. Otherwise, if you can't do so, then you need to repent of your own lie that you told here.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Prove what you allege or apologize, apparently you believe that you alone are indwelt with the guiding, teaching Spirit of Christ! And you only possess all truth!

Who is the one who has an interpretation of Revelation 2:22 that literally no one else has? How much more hypocritical can you get? You are the one acting as if the Holy Spirit only teaches you, not him. He does not claim to have an understanding of any scripture that no one else has like you do.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I have no desire to rehash your posts, not because I am avoiding them, but because they have become a means for belittling, and engaging in ungodly back and forth that only serves to bring down other Christians!

That is exactly what you're doing by falsely accusing him of lying and of being a preterist. Look in the mirror. Take the log out of your own eye.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Of course it's not! What have I spiritualized?

Matthew 24:15-22, for one. There is no indication there whatsoever that it should be spiritualized rather than taken literally. Jesus had just been asked one question about when the temple buildings in Jerusalem would be destroyed and what He said in Matthew 24:15-22 (Mark 13:14-20, Luke 21:20-24) answers that question. He had been speaking literally right up until that point, so what basis is there for thinking He suddenly started speaking figuratively or spiritually at that point? Where in scripture is there ever any reference to a spiritual or heavenly Judea? Nowhere. But, you spiritualize Judea in Matthew 24:15, anyway. I have read TS's ludicrous attempts to spiritualize Jesus saying that fleeing to the mountains would be particularly difficult for nursing mothers and pregnant women. It's just laughable. But, you buy into that. And his spiritualizing of why Jesus said to pray that their flight to the mountains would not have to occur during the winter or on the Sabbath. Just ridiculous. Yet, you go along with it.

Also, you contradict yourself sometimes so it's hard to know what you believe about some things. You have liked posts by TS where he said that Satan represents the spirit of man or mankind. But, you also seem to have said you believe Satan is a created spirit being. So, which is it? What is your current understanding of Satan and demons and angels? Are they real created spirit beings or something else?

 

[CrowCross]

I fail to see how Zech 14 was fulfilled....as Jesus hasn't returned and the Mt of Olives hasn't been split.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I fail to see how Zech 14 was fulfilled....as Jesus hasn't returned and the Mt of Olives hasn't been split.

How much thought and study have you given this? How do you interpret Zechariah 14:16-21 and the following passages...

1 Thessalonians 5:2 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. 3 For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. 4 But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief.

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up. 11 Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness, 12 looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be dissolved, being on fire, and the elements will melt with fervent heat?