Reviving Biblical Christianity (The Way) Part 2

[marks]

I would say the bible is insufficient without the Holy Spirit.

Of course!

Much love!

 

[marks]

THAT IS THE CONTEXT.

Actually, the context was Paul speaking on Mars Hill.

Much love!

 

[amigo de christo]

Of course!

Much love!

yeah and i would also say that anyone teaching the teachings of JESUS and of the apostels
OMIT TING the fact ONE must BELEIVE ON HIM , teaches a second death sentence for sure and for certain .
That be WHY i preach JESUS CHRIST and HIM crucified .
Not some works of holiness without FAITH IN THE MOST HOLY SON of GOD .
This inclusive generation seems to not know something .
WITHOUT FAITH in GOD it is impossible to please God . And if one has not Faith IN JESUS CHRIST
ANY GUESSES on who THEY DO NOT PLEASE but actually call a liar . IF YA SAID GOD you are RIGHT ON the mark , mark .
So as for me i shall POINT to CHRIST JESUS as a dire absolute MUST to BELIEVE ON HIM
and teach them to observe all Things HE DID teach .
YOU SEE i dont , by grace , make the mistake more and more now do .
Actually thinking somehow we can get the job done WITHOUT having FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST .
NO mark , This sheep KNOWS who I NEED and who i shall always NEED . IT IS JESUS the SON of the CHRIST of GOD .
For without HIM , i can do NOTHING . and that , my friend is A FACT . but nor can any other man or woman either .
YEAH , i shall stick to and cling to the one true gospel of GOD and of CHRIST . HE is the only NAME whereby one may be saved .

 

[amigo de christo]

He is not spiteful at all............He is simply just. Which is a righteous thing. And that is why He went even further in righteousness so as to provide a way that man could escape His justice. The second mile. And it is the ONLY way.

but what must WE do to work the works of GOD .
Any guesses on what JESUS told those who asked him this question .
THIS IS THE WORK OF GOD , TO BELIEVE ON HE WHOM GOD DID SEND . you did catch the word BELEIVE right .
Something the Hic seems to omit as he does all to so called work such works .
You ever heard the phrase they would have a Form of godliness but DENY the power thereof .
What is THE POWER of GOD sister .
For it is the POWER of GOD unto salvation unto all who do BELEIVE . that IS WHO and what THE POWER OF GOD is sister .
Something the Hic seems to NOT KNOW and understand .
GOD will not be denied . AND the DESIRE OF GOD is that ALL DO HONOR THE SON .
well omitting the fact that one must beleive on JESUS , on the fact HE was crucified for our sins
and r aised again for our justification , OH IT do not HONOR THE SON , NOR THE FATHER .
In fact IT calleth GOD A LIAR . ME oh my , how i just dont think calling GOD a liar is HONORING THE HOLY GOD .
something the Hic better learn real fast .

 

[amigo de christo]

LOL. Only sometimes. Other times it's 4 divided by 2 = 2.

Now why can't you be honest and acknowledge what someone else already pointed out to you, concerning Cornelius:

Act 11:9
But the voice answered me again from heaven, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

Without the preaching of the gospel, without the washing of the water of the word…… without the blood of JESUS and faith in it/Him…….how could Cornelius have been cleansed? How can anyone? It was for that reason Peter was sent to Cornelius. This isn't rocket science, it's not hard to see this. 1 + 1 = 2.

Act 11:13-14
And he shewed us how he had seen an angel in his house, which stood and said unto him, Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;
Who shall tell thee words, WHEREBY thou and all thy house shall b

What a narrow road it is indeed dear sister . and anyone whose faith be NOT ON Jesus the Christ
well they aint on it . He thinks its pride to claim and proclaim the dire necessity to Beleive on JESUS the CHRIST .
I say its pride to NOT BELIEVE ON HIM and preach a message that makes FAITH N CHRIST seem as RELIGOIUS dogma .
The man is every bit guilty of what he is trying to accuse us of my sister .

 

[shepherdsword]

Another enigma:

Heb 4:16
Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

and

1 Pe 1:17
And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:


Boldness or fear? Seems duplicitous to the rational mind. Perhaps the Spirt has a secret in walking in both at the same time? Or, how about this?

This same guy who said this:
1 Jn 4:18
There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

Did this when he saw the risen resurrected Lord coming from the Holy of Holies:

Rv 1:17
And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead...

Perfect love casting out fear:
And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

I think we all need to take heed to this warning and hunger for more understanding:

Epi

God has hidden things ....as it is written in the bible. He hides the truth from the shallow speculators and selfish investigators.

and from the wise and reveals them to babes

 

[marks]

That's not in context....that is a novice mistake of thinking one verse cancels all other verses that says something different. You have taken one verse out of context and destroyed righteousness that God accepts. Amazing.

If you think this passage cancels another that's your issue. No need to project that onto others. Except you do seem to have that need, so then what is to be said? Other then that the Scriptures all work together, we don't need to overlook any of them, nor do we need to deny what they teach.

I suggest you believe all of it, and not just some of it. God's Word, that is.

 

[Episkopos]

If you think this passage cancels another that's your issue. No need to project that onto others. Except you do seem to have that need,

You are the one doing the cancelling. You are projecting that onto me. You still do not believe the bible...God accepts those who DO righteousness. It's right there and you refute it.

so then what is to be said? Other then that the Scriptures all work together, we don't need to overlook any of them, nor do we need to deny what they teach.

I suggest you believe all of it, and not just some of it. God's Word, that is.

You really need to turn your views back onto yourself. Most here can't see when a person is FULLY deceived....because they are too!

 

[Episkopos]

Another enigma:

Heb 4:16
Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

and

1 Pe 1:17
And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:


Boldness or fear? Seems duplicitous to the rational mind. Perhaps the Spirt has a secret in walking in both at the same time? Or, how about this?

This same guy who said this:
1 Jn 4:18
There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

Did this when he saw the risen resurrected Lord coming from the Holy of Holies:

Rv 1:17
And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead...

Perfect love casting out fear:
And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

I think we all need to take heed to this warning and hunger for more understanding:

Epi



and from the wise and reveals them to babes

Fear on the outer man. Fearlessness on the inner man. We are really 2 people until we are either fully weaned of the flesh, able to carry our cross...or better yet, crucified with Christ. From there we will no longer be duplicitous, double minded, compromised, and unstable.

 

[Lizbeth]

LOL. He is simply...simple. You confuse a lack of intelligence as being righteous. Of course. Because you have no critical thinking...therefore anyone who has forsaken critical thinking and looks down on intelligence must have done so to follow a god who they think wants us to be simple and unintelligent.

But you are under-thinking this...with a limited intelligence.

People charge modern believers with hypocrisy and being not intelligent. And you think that is being a good witness.

So hypocrisy is to see things upside down. People see the church as unrighteous...which is correct. What they don't see is how unholy the church has become. Judgment day awaits on that score.

It should be obvious to anyone with a little bit of perception that you truly do need healing. You can stop wasting your time with trying to dig in a knife, I've been long dead to it already. I just don't care, Epi. Nice try if someone wants to win a battle in the flesh I suppose, except that it is SIN. I have prayed and truly do hope you will receive the healing that you need.

Nobody should think of themselves more highly than they ought, we should all just view ourselves with sober judgment.....and of course humility. God doesnt' care how intelligent anyone is..........that has no bearing on the kingdom of heaven any more than the colour of anyone's eyes......we do not "live" by intelligence but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God. He gives us the light to see by and guides our lives. It is even a case of His strength is made perfect in our weakness. Intelligence is the thing that is often in His way in my observation. Maybe you should try becoming weak so that you can become strong, and become a fool so that you can become wise.

 

[Lizbeth]

Actually God is waiting on you. When will you allow a very basic honesty to overthrow what the devil has instilled in you?
When will anyone see the degree to which the devil deceives the WHOLE world...and especially the church.

Actually I forgot the Lord already showed me something about that verse. Which I already shared in a post, and I think you ignored it. I will try to find it again if I have time. Starts out with "filthy" referring to all unbelievers........according to the BIBLE, if we let it interpret itself.

 

[Lizbeth]

Of course!

Much love!

Thought you would agree brother, just wanted to mention it as a reminder. ;)

 

[Episkopos]

It should be obvious to anyone with a little bit of perception that you truly do need healing. You can stop wasting your time with trying to dig in a knife, I've been long dead to it already. I just don't care, Epi. Nice try if someone wants to win a battle in the flesh I suppose, except that it is SIN. I have prayed and truly do hope you will receive the healing that you need.

You say this because you always need to be half-right. And you only allow others to be only half-right too. This is a pride issue that you need help with. The very silly notion that I need help for your difficulties with the truth display that I am a mirror here. People always see themselves in my exposing their darkness.

Nobody should think of themselves more highly than they ought, we should all just view ourselves with sober judgment.....and of course humility.

Amen

God doesnt' care how intelligent anyone is..........that has no bearing on the kingdom of heaven any more than the colour of anyone's eyes......we do not "live" by intelligence but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.

Amen again. But we are talking about a man who looks down on intelligence as getting in the way of a robotic belief. He thinks God is looking for robot-type people that continually recite the same mantra over and over again without any intelligence. But that is false...a myth. And I'm a myth-buster. :)

He gives us the light to see by and guides our lives. It is even a case of His strength is made perfect in our weakness. Intelligence is the thing that is often in His way in my observation. Maybe you should try becoming weak so that you can become strong, and become a fool so that you can become wise.

In your case your cleverness gets in the way of a true humility. Agreed. Maybe you should try becoming weak and a fool in order that you may be wise.

 

[Episkopos]

Actually I forgot the Lord already showed me something about that verse. Which I already shared in a post, and I think you ignored it. I will try to find it again if I have time. Starts out with "filthy" referring to all unbelievers........according to the BIBLE, if we let it interpret itself.

This is false. The filthy are those who soil holiness. The wicked are those who love unrighteousness. And both of these categorizes include MANY believers in our time.

What I teach is that we should AT LEAST be as the righteous...if not be among the holy. Jesus taught that...at least giving the talent we have been given to the money-changers.

 

[bdavidc]

Most people that read the bible today understand neither holiness nor righteousness. Consequently what comes from a reading of the bible is an unbalanced mess. Enter the devil who proclaims a falsehood that quickly gains popularity, that God permits to test those who are neither humble themselves, nor fear the Lord (and hate the truth), and a delusion (sent from God) quickly overtakes any proper understanding of the bible. To the extent where people can no longer tolerate a balanced and sound doctrine...as we see here and as is attested to in the bible.


What are you comparing a spiritual interpretation to? It has to be a first hand knowledge of God, and an experience IN DEPTH of the kingdom realm. Preferably a significant amount of time in God's immediate presence. Paul says...comparing spiritual things with spiritual things, IOW comparing what we read to what we EXPERIENCE in Christ. When these line up perfectly we know we are both reading the bible correctly...AND experiencing the God of the bible. That's what it means to compare.


What people don't see is any depth of meaning from the scriptures. Eyes that don't see and ears that don't hear. People take one verse so out of context and so improperly as to throw out major themes of the bible...and don't even bat an eye.


I have not met very many who understand a parable that doesn't already line up with their previous indoctrination...and refuse to see the truth even when it is pointed out very plainly.

An example of this is the 2 cuts (double edged sword) or two levels of judgment for believers in Jesus in Mat 13... whereby the wheat is separated from the tares and vice-versa.

The first cut is to separate the sons of God from the world. The second cut is to separate the workers of iniquity from the saints (where MOST believers fail). And that's why I warn them. Look at how my warnings are received including yourself.

As an example you won't see it or admit that the bible says what it says...because it doesn't suit you. And that's just one bad understanding that basically everyone here fails to see...or fails to understand in its true significance. Do most people realize they are failing the grace of God? Of course not. They are waiting for the surprise at the end. No wisdom, no fear, no humility.


Holiness is the perfection of Christ. But a person can still be tempted away from holiness by a lack of understanding of righteousness. The truth sets us free...but God continues to provide grace only to the humble.



There is no agreement with modern believers because there is no common experience of God. It used to be that spiritual believers helped other believers No longer. People want to see others as being no farther along than they are due to pride. People have opinions and judge that others only have opinions as well. So no deeper understanding can be conveyed...due to indoctrination, a lack of honesty, and a religious hubris that they cling to even in the face of clear evidence from the bible.


We need those kind of novices again. Proving ONLY what is from the bible...and not from a twisted interpretation...comparing bible with bible.


God has hidden things ....as it is written in the bible. He hides the truth from the shallow speculators and selfish investigators.

You are citing the bible teaching without seeing the implications.

The two water crossings are indeed baptisms...the first from Egypt...the world and the second into the kingdom realm of the Spirit...the baptism of the Spirit,

This lines up perfectly with the rest of the bible. Tarry ye in Jerusalem...and the 2 cuts I mentioned earlier from Matt 13...with the parable of the wheat and the tares.

You have now exposed the real source of your interpretation. You compare Scripture with your own spiritual experiences and then treat those experiences as proof that your interpretation is correct. That is not what 1 Corinthians 2:13 says. Paul wrote of truths revealed and taught by the Holy Spirit. The verse says nothing about using alleged experiences “in the kingdom realm” or time spent in God’s immediate presence as the key to interpreting Scripture.

Your experience is not what the standard teaches. Scripture is. Your “two cuts,” “two baptisms,” and “two levels of judgment” are still not found in the passages you cite. Jesus explained the wheat and tares Himself. The field is the world, the good seed are the children of the kingdom, the tares are the children of the wicked one, the harvest is the end of the world, and the reapers are the angels. There is no first cut separating believers from the world and second cut separating ordinary believers from your supposed higher class of saints. You inserted that scheme into the parable.

The Bible also never says that Israel crossing the Jordan represents a second baptism, a second work of grace, or entrance into some superior “kingdom realm.” Saying that it “lines up perfectly” is not proof. You have repeatedly been asked to show where Scripture assigns those meanings, and you repeatedly answer with more assertions, accusations, and claims of superior experience.

You accuse everyone who rejects your interpretation of being blind, proud, shallow, dishonest, and lacking spiritual experience. The truth is, we are none of those things. We study the Bible carefully because we want to learn what it actually says, and that is exactly why we recognize false teaching when we see it. Your anger seems to come from the fact that your claims are being tested by Scripture and exposed for what they are: false. Calling everyone spiritually blind does not answer the biblical objections. It only shows that you cannot defend your teaching from the text. That is a convenient way to protect your teaching from biblical examination, but it is not an answer to the text.

This is not spiritual depth. It is Scripture being twisted to support your private system. You better enjoy what little money you make from selling your books because it will not work well for you in the end. Repent. Show from the actual words and context of Scripture that your meanings are there, or stop pretending that the Bible says what only you have imagined into it.

 

[bdavidc]

I can't respond to your every comment but yes. However, it doesn't mean everyone will see what the scripture is showing. The things that Jesus preached, the gospel, can be shown in OT scripture but it didn't mean that the religious leaders of Jesus' day could "see" those things in their scrips and accept them. Jesus spoke in parables but it didn't mean everyone could "see" and understand what His parables were depicting.

You know, I don't think we as Christians are going to have perfect agreement and unity until or unless the Body of Christ has become a "perfect man" and grown up into the full stature of Christ.

Eph 4:13
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Nobody is arguing that every person sees and understands everything Scripture teaches. The religious leaders missed what the Old Testament said about Christ, but Jesus and the apostles were still able to show those truths from the Scriptures.

That is the point you keep avoiding. It is not enough to say that some people cannot “see” your interpretation. You still have to show that your interpretation is actually in the text.

The blindness of the Pharisees does not prove that the wilderness generation represents the old man, their children represent the new man, Jordan represents a second baptism, or Canaan represents entire sanctification. Those claims must still be demonstrated from Scripture.

Ephesians 4:13 does not teach otherwise. Paul is speaking about the body growing into unity, maturity, and the fulness of Christ through the ministry described in the surrounding verses. He is not saying that interpretations which cannot be proven from the text should be accepted because the church has not yet reached perfect unity.

Saying that others cannot “see” something is not biblical proof. I don't see it because it is not there. I am actually showing you from the actual Bible what it says so you can see it. Show where Scripture gives those meanings. That is still the unanswered question.

 

[bdavidc]

This is false. The filthy are those who soil holiness. The wicked are those who love unrighteousness. And both of these categorizes include MANY believers in our time.

What I teach is that we should AT LEAST be as the righteous...if not be among the holy. Jesus taught that...at least giving the talent we have been given to the money-changers.

You are once again inventing classes of believers that the Bible never creates. Revelation 22:11 does not teach that some true believers are “filthy” and “wicked,” while others reach a higher level called “righteous” or “holy.” It contrasts those who remain in sin with those who belong to God. Scripture says plainly, “the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God,” and then tells believers, “such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified” (1 Corinthians 6:9–11). Paul does not say they remained wicked believers. He says that is what they were before Christ saved them.

A Christian can stumble and must still confess and forsake sin, but Scripture does not describe the regenerate as people who love unrighteousness. “Whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God” (1 John 3:10). Those who continually practice wickedness while claiming to believe are giving evidence that their profession is false.

Your appeal to the talents does not prove your doctrine either. Jesus did not teach two acceptable classes, ordinary righteous believers and a superior holy group. The unprofitable servant was cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30). That is judgment, not a lower level of Christian reward.

All true believers are called saints, are sanctified in Christ, and are commanded to pursue holiness. There is no biblical caste system of filthy believers, wicked believers, righteous believers, and elite holy believers. That system comes from your teaching, not from the text. Get a Bible and read it.

 

[bdavidc]

We need to read and search the scriptures like the Bereans certainly. But understanding them all is a another thing. That goes hand in hand with growth, which happens over time. And there is the aspect that we pay a price for truth and to grow.........like where Jesus spoke about the one building the tower counting the cost to build it and to finish it. The bible says "BUY the truth, but sell it not." (which today's modern merchants of Babylon are not obeying)

I have never denied that understanding grows over time or that following Christ has a cost. But neither of those points answers what I asked.

When Jesus spoke about counting the cost of building a tower, He was warning people to count the cost of being His disciple. The passage says nothing about paying a price in order to unlock hidden meanings in Scripture.

“Buy the truth, and sell it not” means truth, wisdom, instruction, and understanding are to be valued and held fast. It does not mean that a person’s sacrifices or spiritual experiences prove that his interpretation is correct.

Growth may help someone understand Scripture better, but every interpretation still has to be shown from Scripture. Spiritual maturity does not turn an unsupported meaning into a biblical one.

You still have not shown where the Bible says that the wilderness generation represents the old man, their children represent the new man, Jordan represents a second work of grace, or Canaan represents entire sanctification.

Quoting verses about growth, sacrifice, and valuing truth does not prove those claims. The interpretation still has to come from the text.

 

[bdavidc]

Here is an honesty test for you.

How many kinds of people...eternal destinies... do you read here? (and then compare that to someone with grade 1 reading skills, what any unbiased 5 year old would say...as a child would read it))

He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. Rev. 22:11

I realize that the answer is a very high number for any evangelical to count to...

Your “honesty test” begins by adding something to the verse that it never says. Revelation 22:11 gives four descriptions. It does not teach four eternal destinies. The unjust and filthy are contrasted with the righteous and holy. You are counting adjectives and pretending that every adjective creates a different final destination.

The immediate context makes the division clear. Those who have right to the tree of life “enter in through the gates into the city” (Revelation 22:14). The wicked are “without” (Revelation 22:15). Revelation 21:8 identifies the final destination of the wicked as the lake of fire.

That is two final outcomes, not four.

A child can count four descriptions in the verse. That does not mean a child would invent four eternal destinies from them. You inserted “eternal destinies” into your question because the verse itself does not give you that conclusion.

If you believe Revelation 22:11 teaches four separate eternal destinies, then name all four and show where Scripture identifies each one. Sarcasm is not proof, and neither is pretending that your interpretation is simply what the verse says.

Your teaching sounds like the serpent’s old question: “Yea, hath God said?” (Genesis 3:1). God says, “There is none righteous, no, not one” (Romans 3:10), yet you keep creating a class of righteous unbelievers without Christ.

That is not deeper truth. It directly contradicts Scripture and gives false hope to the lost. “He that hath not the Son of God hath not life” (1 John 5:12). A message that contradicts God’s Word is not coming from God.

 

[MostlyConfused]

Annihilation Lake of fire
Inherit the earth
Rule and reign with christ over the nations
Outer darkness

I didn't give verses because I'm pretty sure you will remember the verses.
That shows four.