You say in another thread that the purpose of regeneration is that it is a "trial run to see who will measure up". That is a perversion and fleshly understanding (born out of pride perhaps if you esteem yourself as one who has "measured up"). Regeneration is for the purpose of saving a soul in being reconciled/rejoined back to God.....ultimately for His glory. It happens that we are tested and tried after that, but that is not the purpose and reason why the Lord has regenerated us. His ways are higher than man's ways.
Young rich ruler not saved, why ?
- Thread starter PeterAndroz
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
This is a strawman of course since I never said I measured up. You assume I'm like yourself who reads the bible looking for advantage. I do the very opposite. Stop judging me from yourself and then you might get something out of my testimony.
No, regeneration is in the spirit...giving us what is needed to the saving of the soul. Salvation is a process of becoming like Christ.
I wish you could look for a higher way than your own self-interest.
You're trying to reason with your carnal mind. Jesus Himself said to count the cost to follow Him......we do have our part and price to pay. We certainly aren't going to sin our way to heaven. And here is some more of Paul's writing:
1Co 9:26-27
I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:
But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
2Ti 2:5
And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully.
Please.
MostlyConfused
Well-Known Member
++++I myself should be a castaway.You're trying to reason with your carnal mind. Jesus Himself said to count the cost to follow Him......we do have our part and price to pay. We certainly aren't going to sin our way to heaven. And here is some more of Paul's writing:
1Co 9:26-27
I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:
But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
2Ti 2:5
And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully.
1 Cr 9:26-27 Paul was concerned about being fit for MINISTRY and not losing his salvation
Try again Liz
List the verses where Paul teaches performance is a condition to enter Heaven :)
++++I myself should be a castaway.
1 Cr 9:26-27 Paul was concerned about being fit for MINISTRY and not losing his salvation
Try again Liz
List the verses where Paul teaches performance is a condition to enter Heaven :)
Why will you not honour my wish not to debate OSAS on this thread? It's too far off topic and those debates go on forever. Just read those scriptures I've already brought for what they say and leave it at that. Thank you.
Thread is :-
Young rich ruler not saved, why
Ruler was relying on his performance to enter heaven but failed.List the verses where Paul teaches performance is a condition to enter Heaven :)
You go right ahead and give your point of view about the rich young ruler and kindly stop harassing me. Thanks.
Except I know when to stop asking. And I did stop didn't I. Not to mention that my reason for not answering the question here is not the same at all as yours.Now you know how I feel..
(We're talking about a conversation on another thread for anyone reading this and wondering.)
Last edited:
Think I'll just point out that you are not asking the right question (as often happens in my observation). It is not a question of "performing", which comes from ourselves.......it's a question of bearing fruit which is not of ourselves. And yes bearing fruit is a condition. Read the parable of the talents taught by JESUS. And as we are to endure to the end of our lives come what may......even endurance and perseverance is good fruit.
Last edited:
This is also true with the Parables of the Talents and the Minas. Yes, both taught about what Satan planned to do during the time that he is removed from the face of the earth for a time, as taught in the Old Testament in Isaiah and Ezekiel. Jesus taught that Satan would give his servants MONEY that they could use to impede the establishment of God's Everlasting Kingdom during the 1,000 years that Satan and his associated angels and kings of the earth are imprisoned in the Bottomless Pit, before they are released for the Little While period. The miss understanding of these two parables is because people have not asked the right questions about what Jesus was teaching in these two parables.
The rich young ruler asked the right question, but he did not like the answer given by Jesus to his question.
This is also true today, we often ask the right questions just like the rick young ruler, but we too do not always accept the answer provided to us and so we go away sad because we cannot follow through on what is required of us to comply with what God requires of us. The rich young ruler simply could not comply with Jesus' suggestion of selling all that he had to follow Him. We today often do this as well. We refuse to accept God's terms of Salvation. We want praise for what we do and not the relationship that we can have with God.
Shalom
Last edited:
++++And yes bearing fruit is a condition.
Please list where Jesus VIA Paul teaches that as a conditon for Lizbeth to enter Heaven.
ps
You'll have to tackle Gal 2:16. Eph 2:8-9, Rom 3:28, Titus 3:5-7, Rom 4:5, Rom 5:1
I don't understand the first part of your post.....that the parable of the talents/minas is about money etc. I understand the parable to be about the measure of faith and grace that each one has received, which differs individually.
But I believe the ultimate fate of the rich young ruler has been left open-ended on purpose, being a message to us also counting the cost. Not about riches per se, necessarily (I don't think many of us are rich), but about our whole life in this world, all that we have and are...how it costs all to follow Christ. I don't think we are meant to write the young man off necessarily.....because Jesus went on to say that all things are possible with God. Without Him, it is impossible for us.
It is a Protestant prerogative to twist the meaning the bible into thousands of different shapes, depending on the creativity or imagination of the reader. This particular "artist" has deemed to make God to be Satan for the purposes of his art.
The rich young ruler story informs us of the 2 standards by which God judges the world. In righteousness and holiness (perfection). While doing so, Jesus exposes our tendency to NOT surrender all to Him...even as we condemn others for doing exactly the same thing we are doing. So it's a double trap for Protestant "artists" who lean on their own understanding and imagination.
Perhaps @Episkopos has provide the understanding of why many misunderstand the parables of the talents and the Minas.
This understanding unfortunately is rife throughout many churches because of the twisted understanding of the "teacher/pastor/preacher".
The master who goes away gives his servants "money" in both parable to trade with, i.e. to make money with by charging lenders interest rates that encourages them to work hard to pay of their debt instead of focusing on God and His ways of establishing His everlasting kingdom her on earth during the time of those kings.
In both parables the man who goes away for a time, i.e. Satan, agrees with his wicked servant that he is not entitled to claim any part in the increase of the souls from the harvest.
Also, in the parable of the Minas, Jesus gives us a clue that shortly after the Master goes away, that the Israelite servants of Satan, send a delegation after Satan to tell God that they no longer want to serve Satan instead of God.
Shalom
But it wasn't Satan who went away to receive a kingdom.....he fell like lightning and lost his rule to Jesus. And the money given to the servants is an allegory for the spiritual riches we have in Christ, which old testament material blessings was but a type/shadow of.
Do you agree with OSAS by any chance....in which case you would have reason to want to explain away the meaning of this parable.
Lizbeth, in the parable of the talents, Satan gave his servants the number of talents, i.e. money, according to their ability to trade with the money given to them. When Satan returned, he immediately asked for the increase in money that his servants obtained for him while he was locked up in the bottomless pit for 1,000 years and invited his good and faithful servants to join him in his joy.
The allegory you quoted that the "talent" was the "spiritual riches" in Christ, is a man/Satan created understanding that has changed the understanding of the meaning of "talent" from "money" to "gifted abilities" over the past 2,000 or so years and sadly modified many's understanding of the Parables of the Talents and Minas.
As for the context of "he fell like lightning and lost his rule to Jesus.", it is found in this portion of Luke: -
Please note that Satan countenance fell because of the effectiveness of the 70 disciples who Jesus had sent out as they went from city to city.
No, I do not believe in OSAS because scripture does not confirm this understanding as Ezekiel 18 tells us that if a righteous man turns away from God and does not repent, that he will not live but that he will become a firm candidate for the second death.
I am not the one who has explained away the meaning of the Parable of the Talents. In your acceptance of the "usual" use of this parable to justify hard work to bring about the kingdom of God goes very much against what Jesus said in John 6.
If we believe in "Him whom He sent," then we will gladly lay down our lives so that God's Glory can be seen in all that we do in our life.
We should remember that money is the root of all evil.
Shalom
Similar threads
