REVELATION IS NOT ABOUT THE CHURCH

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Doug

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The focus of the book of Revelation is the remnant of Israel, during the tribulation period, the time of Jacob's trouble (Jeremiah 30:7). In the tribulation, Israel will be prepared for the restoration of their kingdom (Malachi 3:2-3).

Revelation 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

Israel was washed of their sins by the Lord Jesus, who shed his blood for the new testament; Jesus redeemed the transgressions Israel committed under the first testament (Hebrews 9:15 1 John 1:7).

Revelation 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Only Israel was promised to be a holy priesthood, to be a holy nation of kings and priests unto God (Exodus 19:5-6 Revelation 20:6 1 Peter 2:5 1 Peter 2:9).

Revelation 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

The remnant of Israel will reign on the earth (Revelation 22:5 Daniel 7:18).

Revelation 7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

The hundred and forty and four thousand are from the tribes of Israel.

Revelation 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

The remnant of Israel has come out of great tribulation (Revelation 6:11 Revelation 15:2).

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

The dragon made war with the remnant of Israel, who keep the commandments (Revelation 14:12 Revelation 22:14 Matthew 28:19-20).

Revelation 14:3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
14:4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

The hundred and forty and four thousand are said to be the firstfruits: James says that believing Israel is a kind of firstfruits as well (James 1:18). Could it be, that the hundred and forty and four thousand, are the remnant of Israel who believed the preaching of Christ and the twelve during his earthly ministry?

Revelation 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Paul said in Galatians 1:8, "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.", yet here is an angel, preaching another gospel: I would have to conclude that the gospel of grace, that Paul preached, is no longer being preached. The church, the body of Christ, has been caught up to be with Christ; the body is not appointed to the wrath of the tribulation (1 Thessalonians 4:17 5:9). I understand that the gospel of the kingdom is, once again, being preached according to Matthew 24:14.

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

The remnant of Israel was to be patient to enter the promised kingdom on earth (Luke 21:19 Luke 8:15 Romans 2:7 Hebrews 10:36).

Revelation 15:4 Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? for thou only art holy: for all nations shall come and worship before thee; for thy judgments are made manifest.

The Gentile nations that enter the kingdom along with the remnant of Israel will come and worship before the Lord in the kingdom on earth (Psalm 86:9 Isaiah 2:2 Zechariah 8:22-23 Zechariah 14:16-17).

Revelation 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

Israel was admonished to watch for the Lord's coming in Matthew 24:42-51, and be found faithful in order to enter the kingdom.

Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The remnant of Israel will have part in the first resurrection, and will be priests of God and of Christ in the kingdom, and will reign with Christ for a thousand years (Revelation 1:6 Revelation 5:10 Revelation 20:4 Isaiah 61:6 1 Peter 2:5).

Revelation 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

The remnant of Israel shall be the people of God (Genesis 17:7-8 Jeremiah 31:33 Jeremiah 32:38 Zechariah 8:8 Zechariah 13:9 Hosea 1:9-10 Hosea 2:23).

Revelation 21:12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:

Revelation 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

The new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven (Revelation 21:2) displays the twelve tribes of Israel and the twelve apostles to Israel.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

To enter into the kingdom, Israel had to do his commandments (Psalm 106:3 Matthew 7:21 John 15:14 Matthew 5:20).
 

R.C.Jones

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The focus of the book of Revelation is the remnant of Israel, during the tribulation period, the time of Jacob's trouble (Jeremiah 30:7). In the tribulation, Israel will be prepared for the restoration of their kingdom (Malachi 3:2-3).
...
Excellent—thank you for the detailed presentation. Let’s respond by integrating your points with a Sensus Plenior-informed Outline of Revelation, testing your claims with symbolic and structural consistency across Scripture.




RESPONSE: Is Revelation Solely Focused on the Remnant of Israel?​


You’ve presented a dispensational reading, where:


  • The church (Body of Christ) is removed before the Tribulation,
  • Israel is restored as God's focus,
  • The gospel of the kingdom is once again preached.

This reading is internally coherent—but it must be tested against:


  1. The internal structure of Revelation
  2. Consistency with the Gospel pattern
  3. Unified symbolic meaning across all Scripture



OUTLINE OF REVELATION (SP Format)​

SectionChaptersSP Function
1. Vision of Christ1Revelation of the Word: Alpha and Omega
2. Letters to Churches2–3Corporate body tested: Bride under refinement
3. Heavenly Courtroom4–5Scroll (Word) opened by Lamb (Christ)
4. Seals, Trumpets, Bowls6–16Judgment on earth and false teaching
5. The Two Cities17–22Bride vs. Harlot → Jerusalem above vs Babylon below



EVALUATION BY SECTION​




Chapters 1–3: Letters to the Churches


You argue: “The church is already gone.”


But:


  • Revelation 2–3 are direct letters to churches (not Israel).
  • Christ speaks to them as the bride-to-be—He rebukes, corrects, and calls to endure.

“He who overcomes…” – repeated 7x, always tied to eternal reward (Rev 2:10, 3:12)

✅ This is bridal preparation—not national Israel’s covenantal restoration.
➡ The Body of Christ is present at least through chapter 3.




Chapters 4–5: The Heavenly Scroll


You cite: Revelation 1:5–6, Christ washing “us” in His blood = Israel.


That’s plausible, but:


  • John includes himself: “Unto him who loved us…”
  • The language of priests and kings is not exclusive to Israel in the NT:
    1 Peter 2:9: “You are a royal priesthood…” — written to a mixed Jewish-Gentile church.

✅ Priesthood language is fulfilled in the church, not postponed.




Chapters 6–11: Seals and Trumpets


You point out:


  • Revelation 7: 144,000 sealed from Israel
  • Revelation 7:14: Great multitude comes out of tribulation

Agreed: Israel is highlighted.


But also note:


Revelation 7:9: “A great multitude from every nation...”
This is not exclusively Jewish. It includes Gentiles who believe during tribulation.

✅ The witness is expanded, not transferred back to Israel only.




Chapters 12–14: The Woman, the Dragon, and the Lamb


You correctly identify:


  • The woman = Israel (Rev 12:1 imagery from Gen 37: sun, moon, 12 stars)
  • The dragon persecutes her seed (Rev 12:17)

But this “seed” is described as:


“Those who keep the commandments and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

That includes:


  • Faithful Israel and
  • Believing Gentiles

✅ “The remnant” = all who remain faithful during trial—not just Israel.




Chapter 14: The Angel Preaches “Another Gospel”?


You say:


“Paul warned against angels preaching another gospel—this proves the gospel of grace is no longer in effect.”

But in SP:


  • Every gospel (kingdom, grace, eternal) is a facet of the same gospelChrist crucified, risen, and reigning
  • The “everlasting gospel” is not a new covenant—it is a final call to worship the Creator, not a contradiction of Paul’s message

“Fear God and give Him glory…” → echoes the first commandment
Not a replacement gospel—it's a final appeal using Law-language under judgment.



Revelation 21–22: The Bride and the City


You argue:


“New Jerusalem is the bride—not the church.”

But in SP:


  • The city = people (Heb 12:22–23, Rev 21:9–10)
  • The twelve apostles and twelve tribes are unified as one structure
  • The bride = the church made complete, including the remnant of Israel and Gentiles (Eph 2:14–22)

✅ This is the unified people of God—not separate programs for Israel and Church.




Final SP Verdict:​

ClaimEvaluation
Revelation focuses only on Israel during the tribulation❌ Revelation addresses church, Israel, and nations together
Church is removed before Revelation begins❌ Churches are addressed in Rev 2–3; no rapture scene in 4:1
144,000 = firstfruits of believing Israel✅ Yes—but not the only group saved
The bride is New Jerusalem, not the church❌ New Jerusalem is the church in glorified form
Gospel of grace ends in tribulation❌ Language shifts, but the content remains Christ


✅ Sensus Plenior Insight:​


Revelation is not a return to Israel-only covenant.
It is the final unveiling of Christ, where the bride is formed from Jew and Gentile, made one by the blood, refined through tribulation, and revealed in glory.
 

Doug

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Revelation 2–3 are direct letters to churches (not Israel).
There is more than just the church in this dispensation, the body of Christ. Paul persecuted the believing remnant of Israel, the church of God.
 
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Doug

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You cite: Revelation 1:5–6, Christ washing “us” in His blood = Israel.


That’s plausible, but:


  • John includes himself: “Unto him who loved us…”
  • The language of priests and kings is not exclusive to Israel in the NT
John was an Israelite so he could very well include himself when he says us

Paul never calls the body of Christ a priesthood nor a holy nation........only Israel is called a priesthood and a holy nation in Exodus 19 [Exo 19:5-6 KJV] 5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth [is] mine: 6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These [are] the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

Peter writing to the scattered Jews also calls Israel a priesthood and a holy nation [1Pe 2:9 KJV] 9 But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

Peter could well be mixed Jew and Gentile but they would still be the remnant of Israel.......Gentiles became members of the remnant in Acts 10:45
 
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Doug

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That includes:


  • Faithful Israel and
  • Believing Gentiles
Those in Rev 14:12 to me are Israel......Paul never tells us to keep the commandments of the law.......the believing Gentiles were determined not to keep the law ....Paul did say we are given commandments however
 

Marilyn C

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OVERVIEW: The Four Visions.

The predominant aim of Revelation is the setting forth the splendours of the Son of Man, & to reveal His glorious person. There are four visions of the Son of Man as He is known in the heavenly realm & each vision in turn carries through to completion one aspect of the fourfold ministry of Christ which He exercised when on earth. His Kinship was expressed in Matthew, His Heirship in Mark, His Mediatorship in Luke, & His Judgeship in John.


Vision 1. CHRIST - Head of the Body. (Rev. 1 – 3)

This reveals the empowered Son of Man as the Sovereign Administrator.

`in His right hand He held 7 stars.`



Vision 2. CHRIST - HEIR (Rev. 4 – 7)

This reveals the enthroned Son of Man as the Supreme Executor.

`in His right hand He held the 7 sealed book.`




Vision 3. CHRIST - MEDIATOR (Rev. 8 – 13)

This reveals the exalted Son of Man as the Stately Mediator.

`in His hand is a sacred censor.`



Vision 4. CHRIST - JUDGE (Rev. 14 – 22)

This reveals the entitled Son of Man as the Sublime Adjudicator.

`in His hand is a sharp sickle.`



To reveal Christ to us in Revelation, there are three hundred & thirty references to the figures, shadows, symbols, types, patterns, persons, & buildings of the Old Testament.


This unveiling is the culmination of all the truths expressed from Genesis to Revelation, for all scripture is centred on one purpose and that is to reveal Christ to us in all His Glory.
 

Ronald Nolette

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The focus of the book of Revelation is the remnant of Israel, during the tribulation period, the time of Jacob's trouble (Jeremiah 30:7). In the tribulation, Israel will be prepared for the restoration of their kingdom (Malachi 3:2-3).

Revelation 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

Israel was washed of their sins by the Lord Jesus, who shed his blood for the new testament; Jesus redeemed the transgressions Israel committed under the first testament (Hebrews 9:15 1 John 1:7).

Revelation 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Only Israel was promised to be a holy priesthood, to be a holy nation of kings and priests unto God (Exodus 19:5-6 Revelation 20:6 1 Peter 2:5 1 Peter 2:9).

Revelation 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

The remnant of Israel will reign on the earth (Revelation 22:5 Daniel 7:18).

Revelation 7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

The hundred and forty and four thousand are from the tribes of Israel.

Revelation 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

The remnant of Israel has come out of great tribulation (Revelation 6:11 Revelation 15:2).

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

The dragon made war with the remnant of Israel, who keep the commandments (Revelation 14:12 Revelation 22:14 Matthew 28:19-20).

Revelation 14:3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
14:4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

The hundred and forty and four thousand are said to be the firstfruits: James says that believing Israel is a kind of firstfruits as well (James 1:18). Could it be, that the hundred and forty and four thousand, are the remnant of Israel who believed the preaching of Christ and the twelve during his earthly ministry?

Revelation 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Paul said in Galatians 1:8, "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.", yet here is an angel, preaching another gospel: I would have to conclude that the gospel of grace, that Paul preached, is no longer being preached. The church, the body of Christ, has been caught up to be with Christ; the body is not appointed to the wrath of the tribulation (1 Thessalonians 4:17 5:9). I understand that the gospel of the kingdom is, once again, being preached according to Matthew 24:14.

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

The remnant of Israel was to be patient to enter the promised kingdom on earth (Luke 21:19 Luke 8:15 Romans 2:7 Hebrews 10:36).

Revelation 15:4 Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? for thou only art holy: for all nations shall come and worship before thee; for thy judgments are made manifest.

The Gentile nations that enter the kingdom along with the remnant of Israel will come and worship before the Lord in the kingdom on earth (Psalm 86:9 Isaiah 2:2 Zechariah 8:22-23 Zechariah 14:16-17).

Revelation 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

Israel was admonished to watch for the Lord's coming in Matthew 24:42-51, and be found faithful in order to enter the kingdom.

Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The remnant of Israel will have part in the first resurrection, and will be priests of God and of Christ in the kingdom, and will reign with Christ for a thousand years (Revelation 1:6 Revelation 5:10 Revelation 20:4 Isaiah 61:6 1 Peter 2:5).

Revelation 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

The remnant of Israel shall be the people of God (Genesis 17:7-8 Jeremiah 31:33 Jeremiah 32:38 Zechariah 8:8 Zechariah 13:9 Hosea 1:9-10 Hosea 2:23).

Revelation 21:12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:

Revelation 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

The new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven (Revelation 21:2) displays the twelve tribes of Israel and the twelve apostles to Israel.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

To enter into the kingdom, Israel had to do his commandments (Psalm 106:3 Matthew 7:21 John 15:14 Matthew 5:20).
Actually the church is mentioned in REvelation. From Rev. 1:27-3:22 and then in Rev. 19 when we wed Jesus. Other than trhat you are correct, the focus of Revelation is about Israel and the saved gentiles and the judgments on the world.
 

Doug

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Actually the church is mentioned in REvelation. From Rev. 1:27-3:22 and then in Rev. 19 when we wed Jesus. Other than trhat you are correct, the focus of Revelation is about Israel and the saved gentiles and the judgments on the world.
There is no Revelation 1:27 what verses did you have in mind........if you are talking about the seven churches you cant say for sure who these are
 

Scott Downey

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Revelation 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

The remnant of Israel has come out of great tribulation (Revelation 6:11 Revelation 15:2).

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Reading it though and it says those who come out of the great tribulation are not jews only.
The angel specifically says this, and note it also says 'after these things', so after the sealing of those people of those tribes, they are not related events.

Revelation 7

9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!” 11 All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, 12 saying:

“Amen! Blessing and glory and wisdom,
Thanksgiving and honor and power and might,
Be to our God forever and ever.
Amen.”
13 Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?”

14 And I said to him, [b]“Sir, you know.”

So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
15 Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them. 16 They shall neither hunger anymore nor thirst anymore; the sun shall not strike them, nor any heat; 17 for the Lamb who is in the midst of the throne will shepherd them and lead them to [c]living fountains of waters. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes.”
 

Doug

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Revelation 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

The remnant of Israel has come out of great tribulation (Revelation 6:11 Revelation 15:2).

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Reading it though and it says those who come out of the great tribulation are not jews only.
The angel specifically says this, and note it also says 'after these things', so after the sealing of those people of those tribes, they are not related events.

Revelation 7

9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!” 11 All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, 12 saying:

“Amen! Blessing and glory and wisdom,
Thanksgiving and honor and power and might,
Be to our God forever and ever.
Amen.”
13 Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?”

14 And I said to him, [b]“Sir, you know.”

So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
15 Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them. 16 They shall neither hunger anymore nor thirst anymore; the sun shall not strike them, nor any heat; 17 for the Lamb who is in the midst of the throne will shepherd them and lead them to [c]living fountains of waters. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes.”
Rev 7:14 may be about all people but my point is the book of Revelation pertains to Israel
 

Scott Downey

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Rev 7:14 may be about all people but my point is the book of Revelation pertains to Israel
But not all of it does it, just some of it. Yes, God saves some more Jews during the time of the end
I know why you hold that view, because of your position on the pre trib rapture, you have to.

When Christ returns a second time it is for salvation, not forgiveness of sin, our sins were dealt with when He came the first time.

Hebrews 9

Greatness of Christ’s Sacrifice​

23 Therefore it was necessary that the copies of the things in the heavens should be [j]purified with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are [k]copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us; 25 not that He should offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood of another—

26 He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.

27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.
 

Ronald Nolette

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There is no Revelation 1:27 what verses did you have in mind........if you are talking about the seven churches you cant say for sure who these are
My bad, it is rev. 1:20

And for the 7 churches, they are local assemblies and thus part of the body of Christ.

They are seven literal churches and symbolically represent 7 heart attitudes of believers and 7 ages of the church.
 

Doug

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My bad, it is rev. 1:20

And for the 7 churches, they are local assemblies and thus part of the body of Christ.

They are seven literal churches and symbolically represent 7 heart attitudes of believers and 7 ages of the church.
I posted a series on the seven churches
That they represent the church age is popular but i dont think so but you can
 

Ronald Nolette

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I posted a series on the seven churches
That they represent the church age is popular but i dont think so but you can
Well it fits perfectly when one looks at the names of the churches and their meaning and then merely follow the timeline since the birth of the church and it fits like a glove.