The Great White Throne And The Shock

I see this judgement as the wicked dead being judged....The "dead, small and great" will stand before God. But the greatness of the great will be of no value. "There is none that doeth good, no, not one" (Rom.3:12).The book of life is opened up...why the "book of life" if there are no saved at this judgement? The wicked will be shown that God in His mercy provided space for them in the "book of Life," so that they are without excuse (Rom 1:18-20)The dead will be judge according to their works...in Hell there will be degrees of punishment...some more than others!(Luke12:42,48)Notice that it does not say the dead in Christ as it does in 1 Thess. 4:16-17...these are the dead in Christ that will be raised!!

QUOTE (setfree @ Mar 5 2009, 12:38 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70266
I see this judgement as the wicked dead being judged....The "dead, small and great" will stand before God. But the greatness of the great will be of no value. "There is none that doeth good, no, not one" (Rom.3:12).The book of life is opened up...why the "book of life" if there are no saved at this judgement? The wicked will be shown that God in His mercy provided space for them in the "book of Life," so that they are without excuse (Rom 1:18-20)The dead will be judge according to their works...in Hell there will be degrees of punishment...some more than others!(Luke12:42,48)Notice that it does not say the dead in Christ as it does in 1 Thess. 4:16-17...these are the dead in Christ that will be raised!!
That's right. Dead in Christ will not be judged at the White Throne. We will be praising God for his judgements. Also, the reason we get disiplined is so we wont get judged at the end. I can't remember exactly where it is in the NT, but it's there. It also says the saints will judge the world, and the saints will judge the angels. I realize there are interpretations of this, however, i'm taking face value for this. The final judgement is where the rewards will be handed out to the believers.

QUOTE (WhiteKnuckle @ Mar 30 2009, 05:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71446
That's right. Dead in Christ will not be judged at the White Throne. We will be praising God for his judgements. Also, the reason we get disiplined is so we wont get judged at the end. I can't remember exactly where it is in the NT, but it's there. It also says the saints will judge the world, and the saints will judge the angels. I realize there are interpretations of this, however, i'm taking face value for this. The final judgement is where the rewards will be handed out to the believers.
Whatever WhiteKnuckle, you just contradict Revelation 20:11-14, P-E-R-I-O-D. Right now, we can't judge anyone. Judging the angels is at the Millennium Reign. Those who are alive in Christ (elects - overcomer) are not sentenced to the second death. The others who aren't overcomers after the Millenium Reign will be judged at the Great White Throne Judgment... so yes, Christians who call themselves Christians, but are not is to be judged.

QUOTE (Jordan @ Mar 30 2009, 06:50 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71447
Whatever WhiteKnuckle, you just contradict Revelation 20:11-14, P-E-R-I-O-D. Right now, we can't judge anyone. Judging the angels is at the Millennium Reign. Those who are alive in Christ (elects - overcomer) are not sentenced to the second death. The others who aren't overcomers after the Millenium Reign will be judged at the Great White Throne Judgment... so yes, Christians who call themselves Christians, but are not is to be judged.
Why the attitude? If you feel you must correct, fine, but please loose the attitude. I'm always open to learning or being corrected if I'm wrong.

QUOTE (Copper25 @ Mar 2 2009, 10:44 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=70112
Revelation 21: 11) And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.The throne represents the majesty of God, HOLY AND SOVEREIGN, and ROYALTY. He is the Judge and under His power will condemn all those that take pleasure in unrighteousness, all those that did not accept the sacrifice and the atonement of the Lord Jesus. Those that have failed to come to repentance, not heeding the word of the Lord, (Luke 13:3) “I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.” Every single person who rather chose to be an enemy of God, a worker of iniquity unrepented and unchanged toward God. We must realize that under God’s judgment, His absolute righteous judgment none can stand and this is why we have Christ Jesus and all those who are not found in Him will be like the Egyptians when the angel of death, the destroyer came and killed them in the night. (1 Thessalonians 5:3) “For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.” This judgment will come as a shock to many, beholding the full glory of the same sovereign Lord God whom they denied and did not hearken untoMatthew 7:21) Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.Many who are professing ‘Christian’ are going to be shocked when the judgment is made because they never came to the truth but rather (2 Timothy 4:4) “turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned to fables.” It is what they choose, because it was convenient and it didn’t mess up their worldly living and their love, their lust for the world not even considering the scripture saying in 1 John 2:15 that “If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.” The truth is that people in many cases don’t want the truth, the sword of the word to pierce through their heart because it might ruin their blissful life of evil and riotous living. Even if someone does not sin a lot, even a little sin in one’s life is deadly, (Galatians 5:9) “A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.” And besides that they don’t realize that they have not repented, therefore they have no remission of sin. And an unrepented person cannot abide in Christ because they have not eternal life and the process of sanctification which is the working God shows no working in their life: (Hebrews 12:14) “and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord”. A person without temperance and without fruitfulness cannot be a Christian because (John 15:5) “He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit” said our own Lord. (Matthew 7:16) “Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?”
I agree we are all judged at the White throne judgement but some of your verse's are out of proper context. The white throne judgement is not untill after the 1000 year millieum period. There will be no mistake who Christ is because he will be ruling here on earth. Most of these verse's apply to the tribulation and the second coming not to the white throne judgement ....Rev 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand yearsRev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This [is] the first resurrection. Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and everRev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is [the book] of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. Notice they are judged by their works here ....because the age of grace is over it ends with Christs second coming then there is 1000 years in which Satan is chained then he is released for a short time

QUOTE (Jordan @ Mar 30 2009, 05:50 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71447
Whatever WhiteKnuckle, you just contradict Revelation 20:11-14, P-E-R-I-O-D. Right now, we can't judge anyone. Judging the angels is at the Millennium Reign. Those who are alive in Christ (elects - overcomer) are not sentenced to the second death. The others who aren't overcomers after the Millenium Reign will be judged at the Great White Throne Judgment... so yes, Christians who call themselves Christians, but are not is to be judged.
Hi Whiteknukle , you have it right , and we have a right TO JUDGE those in the Assembly , because 1 Cor 5:1-13 and 1 Cor 1-6 . 1) In 1 Cor 5:2 , Paul judges him in v 3 , because the assembly will not judge , and you can just hear it all around us now, Who are we to judge .2) Paul says in v 5 , that he will deliver him to satan , for the destruction of the flesh , for he is poisioning the ASSEMBLY . 3) 1 Cor 6:2 , Paul says , Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the World ? 4) In v3 , Paul says that we shall judge Angels .5) Also in 1 Cor 5:12 , we are judge those within the Assembly and God will judge those on the outside .6) I believe that Paul is talking about EX-communication in 1 Cor 5:13 , for we aRE TO REMOVE THE EVIL ONE FROM YOURSELVES .7) Are't you glad that the Apostle Paul does NOT live among us today ?

Thats discernment not judgement you are to only judge their fruit ....not the person as you can not read anyone's heart ... If their fruit is bad you stay away you do not sit in judegment of the person that is Gods job not mans

QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 30 2009, 09:24 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71462
Thats discernment not judgement you are to only judge their fruit ....not the person as you can not read anyone's heart ... If their fruit is bad you stay away you do not sit in judegment of the person that is Gods job not mans
I'm sorry I can't give exact quotes and a lot of references, that's a weak point of mine. The Lord gives me scriptures in my mind, but I never can seem to remember where they are.It definately does have alot to do with discernment. John 20:21 says 21Again Jesus said, "Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you." 22And with that he breathed on them and said, "Receive the Holy Spirit. 23If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven."At first glance one could say it was only for the original apostles. But as stated earlier, Paul calls the believers saints. Then he goes on to talk about judgements.Jesus did say prior to his death and resurection, "Judge not lest you be judged, for whatever measure you judge will be measured to you."Paul later stated that Christs disciplines on believers is us being judged now so at the end judgment we wont be judged. I was thinking about all this the other day. I think I should pray more about this and study more on this. However, as stated earlier, I can only take this for face value as it is written at this time no other explanation has been revealed to me.

Hi Whiteknuckle you need to remember The apostels were given the full knowledge of God so that they could preach the right gospel to start the church therefore they were in a postion to know bad fruitand discern better than the average person if we all had this gift of knowledge we might be able to discern more clearly but we do not this is why we must turn to scripture and use it as our guide ..to right and wrong ... The fact Paul may have corrected some one for something they did is a lesson about the bad action itself ...we are to learn that the bad action or bad fruit of the person Paul was dealing with is not acceptable ....we are not to follow after Paul himself an judge because we do not have the knowledge of God....We are to follow Christ not Paul you can not know what was in Pauls heart either .... Christ said,as you pointed out, "Judge not lest you be judged, for whatever measure you judge will be measured to you." we are to heed Christ words and learn from Paul and the apostels. But we need to be careful to learn the right lessons ....

QUOTE (Christina @ Mar 31 2009, 07:54 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71503
Hi Whiteknuckle you need to remember The apostels were given the full knowledge of God so that they could preach the right gospel to start the church therefore they were in a postion to know bad fruitand discern better than the average person if we all had this gift of knowledge we might be able to discern more clearly but we do not this is why we must turn to scripture and use it as our guide ..to right and wrong ... The fact Paul may have corrected some one for something they did is a lesson about the bad action itself ...we are to learn that the bad action or bad fruit of the person Paul was dealing with is not acceptable ....we are not to follow after Paul himself an judge because we do not have the knowledge of God....We are to follow Christ not Paul you can not know what was in Pauls heart either .... Christ said,as you pointed out, "Judge not lest you be judged, for whatever measure you judge will be measured to you." we are to heed Christ words and learn from Paul and the apostels. But we need to be careful to learn the right lessons ....
Careful is a good word. Thanks. It does seem the apostles had a alot more knowledge of God. However, I'm not so sure I agree that they were the only ones. From what I understand it's been given to all who are saved. Yet again, another study I should get into a little deeper. There's so much to know and learn, every time I think I know alot, I find out there's a bunch more that I haven't learned yet. I guess that's cool in a way, keeps ya hungry.