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  1. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    Yes, I did refer to the θεον of the second clause as the Father. θεον is used rather generically to refer to either one or all of the members of the Triadic Unity. Since the text of John 1 is making a distinction between the λογος and the θεον of the second clause, this only leaves us with three...
  2. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    No, there is only one God but, God is not a numeric one. He is a unity of persons. The language of John 1:1 is very clear and the grammatical structure and syntax of the Greek gives no other alternative. If you do not know anything about Greek, this evidence may not mean much to you but, those...
  3. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    A little common sense will often go a long way is Bible reading. Jesus is praying to someone other than himself, addressing a number of issues to the Father. 'We' is a simple plural pronoun and by definition infers more than one. This particular statement shows three interactive points between...
  4. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    The word you are missing here is 'we'. 'One' does not imply a numeric one any more than the many believers who are to be one.
  5. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    Part Three A Cloak of Humility, Philippians 2:8: Humility is not foreign to the character of man but rather intrinsic to it. Humility is demonstrated by obedience that characterized the life and ministry of the Lord. He "became" obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross." ‘Became’...
  6. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    Part Two Emptying of Equality: The word translated equality is nominative and accusative plural neuter suggesting equality in quantity or quality, Thayer's p 307. This is the same language used by Jesus in Matthew 20:12. Here, Jesus relates the parable of the workers in the vineyard. The...
  7. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    For anyone who may still be following along in this discussion, here is Philippians 2 Part One THE EMPTYING OF GODLY FORM AND EQUALITY In Philippians 2:6, the apostle Paul begins with the acknowledgement that Jesus is God and provides us with a revealed analysis of his redemptive function...
  8. oldhermit

    The Deception of the Teaching of the Trinity

    I really do not think there is any reason in you and I continuing this discussion. You do not seem to believe the evidence of scripture and all you can do is accuse me of lying. I am not the one that said it. Scripture is the one who said it. I think we are done here.
  9. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    I have answered this question repeatedly. The reason you keep asking the same question again and again is not because I have not answered it. It is because you are not getting the answer you want to hear. All I can do is supply you with the testimony of scripture. If you will not believe the...
  10. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    Again you are trying to force a distinction that the text does not supply. The name Jehovah is applicable to each member of the Triadic Unity. Why would you think I am trying to change the words or their definitions. I am simply telling you what the word ἀλλήλους mean and how it is repeatedly...
  11. oldhermit

    The Deception of the Teaching of the Trinity

    He tells you why in the text. Isaiah 6:9-10, "He said, “Go, and tell this people: ‘Keep on listening, but do not perceive; Keep on looking, but do not understand. Render the hearts of this people insensitive, their ears dull, and their eyes dim, otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear...
  12. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    When you see the word Lord in all caps in the OT in some translations this is because it is always a rendering of the word Jehovah. The idea that there is a 'shared' state, at least in the way you are trying to use the word, is not constant with the use of ἀλλήλους. This is a reciporical pronoun...
  13. oldhermit

    The Deception of the Teaching of the Trinity

    I will address your first question here. The rest of the questions will be addressed at different times on The Problem With The Trinity if you would like to follow along on that thread. The answer to your question is NO. Satan not called god in 2Cor. 4:4 or anywhere else in scripture. 2Cor. 4:4...
  14. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    It was not meant to be 'slick'. It is simply a critical analysis of the Greek syntax of the verse. The concept of diversified oneness is nothing new to me. I have heard all of that before. If you prefer not to continue this, I understand.
  15. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    I am going to go ahead and post the second part of the John 1 discussion for your consideration and then I am going to bed. It is midnight here. CRITICAL LINGUISTIC ANALYSIS OF VERSE ONE εν αρχη ην ο λογος και ο λογος ην προς τον θεον και θεος ην ο λογος . This is the most concise theological...
  16. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    I am not dodging you question. The answer is YES. 1 Tim 1:1, "Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus according to the commandment of God our Savior, and of Christ Jesus, who is our hope." Jude 1:25, "To the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord...
  17. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    You are looking for an either / or answer. Yes, you are quite correct. In each of these passages, God is generic. The truth is that all three members of the Triadic Unity have a specific function in connection with the creation and redemption of man. The Father is the source of the idea of human...
  18. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    God is portrayed as the Savior in all of these. What we will later see is that the act of salvation is a Second Position function. This is the position which Jesus occupies.
  19. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    I am quite familiar with each of these passages. We both know that Jesus is the Savior of the world. Later we will look at some passages that cearly separate Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Perhaps part two will help shed some light of the separation of Jesus and the Father.
  20. oldhermit

    The Problem With The Trinity

    Part One In John’s prologue, it seems that the Holy Spirit is more interested in dealing with the function of the Second Position than with the question of the identity of the Word. This will also be my primary focus here. Although the identity of the Word is well established in the first two...