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All the religions are based on appeasement in some form. Either sacrifices (blood or otherwise) or good works. Even the Hebrew sanctuary service was interpreted that way. In fact it is so endemic that it is assumed that the more blood offered the happier God(s) will be. We can read the accounts...

Spunnnnky!

Didn't Jesus nail their sins to the cross 2000 yrs ago. Isn't it a forgone conclusion according to what has transpired that they are forgiven. They just don't know it, therefore they can't believe it.....but you can bring them the Good News.

Consider it like this Bruce as an example, a man enslaved and familiar with his surroundings is set free by the higher authorities but he hasn't heard of it. The message of his freedom hasn't reached him yet....but soon it will, when it does he is in a position to make choices. Will he leave the...

You have me pegged as a Universalist Johann however the thing is, I don't peg myself as a Universalist.....Isn't that odd? Ahhhhh, these names/ titles that get bandied around and plastered on ourselves and lobbed onto others is just another trick to short circuit any need for further enquiry. I...

The gift of life is given to all mankind. If it is not wanted, if it is rejected, the promise remains....you shall surely die ie, not die a little bit, not be transformed into a spirit being....no no, 'surely die'. In other words, life will be withdrawn and you will be as if you had never been...

All means All Bruce. Believers are the ones who take advantage. Unbelievers refuse what has been done for them and given to them. God's justice is deliverance. Man's justice is payback, to put it roughly. Paul went to the Gentile communities announcing Salvation IN Jesus. It was good news for...

You said 'if you are saved' Tell me what good news you tell babylonians Ronald?

Roman 3:23-24 'for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus'. Titus 3:7. 'Because of his grace he made us right in his sight and gave us confidence that we will inherit eternal life' There...

Christina, I see Jesus as what Paul describes as 'For all the promises of God are “Yes” in Christ. And so through Him, our “Amen” is spoken to the glory of God'. 2 Cor. 1:20 It shifts how the OT is understood.

Johann, please excuse my forwardness in this little blurb. I am trying to be objective while following this discussion however I conclude you are adept at not answering the questions put to you. My guess is you are snowed in preconceptions and a multitude of words coupled with your academic...

In my view Johann, you have missed the objective. I asked to tell me your understanding of God's Wrath.

Too many words Johann. Be succinct.

Check post #150 addressed to Jack. Herein is my understanding briefly explained.

Roman 1 tells us what God's wrath is in vs 18, vs 24, vs 26, and vs 28....It tells us 'he gave them over'. To what I would ask? Chapter 1:29-32 reveals he gave them over to the consequences of their choices. In other words, insist on choosing to put your hand in fire and it will get burned...

You haven't given me your version of how you understand 'the wrath of God' ....and I would add, you have missed the description of God's wrath made clear in Romans which you have posted.

God/ Jesus will rescue those waiting for him at his return. That is his preventative plan. Those who don't want anything to do with his righteousness will be left to their choice which will result in self destruction. God does not violate them or their choices but leaves them to the inevitable...

how would you define 'the wrath of God' Johann?

I see you haven't understood the God of Jesus....but prefer the God the Hebrews insisted on

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that Moses who wrote of these events believed God was responsible for everything that happened on Earth both good and bad. All the Hebrews had this understanding. It was an error Jesus corrected by telling us it wasn't God who brought about destruction but the...