A time of great distress that will come upon God’s people: The time of Jacob’s trouble.

[rebuilder 454]

The time of Jacob’s trouble was the holocaust.


God refers to the Jews as “Jacob” when they are not in the land of Israel but have been scattered unto the nations.

Jacob is a diaspora term.

• Like a woman in labor, and all faces turned pale?

This was fulfilled with them in the gas chambers.

• That I will break his yoke from your neck, and will burst your bonds;

‘This refers to a man; Hitler


“For thus says the LORD:
‘We have heard a voice of trembling,
Of fear, and not of peace.
Ask now, and see,
Whether a man is ever in labor with child?
So why do I see every man with his hands on his loins
Like a woman in labor,
And all faces turned pale?
Alas! For that day is great,
So that none is like it;
And it is the time of Jacob’s trouble,
But he shall be saved out of it.
‘For it shall come to pass in that day,’
Says the LORD of hosts,
‘That I will break his yoke from your neck,
And will burst your bonds;
Foreigners shall no more enslave them.
But they shall serve the LORD their God,
And David their king,
Whom I will raise up for them.
‘Therefore do not fear, O My servant Jacob,’ says the LORD,
‘Nor be dismayed, O Israel;
For behold, I will save you from afar,
And your seed from the land of their captivity.
Jacob shall return, have rest and be quiet,
And no one shall make him afraid.
For I am with you,’ says the LORD, ‘to save you;
Though I make a full end of all nations where I have scattered you,
Yet I will not make a complete end of you.
But I will correct you in justice,
And will not let you go altogether unpunished.’
Jeremiah 30:5-11


Though I believe the Lord has blessed the nation of Israel mightily, and protected them from their enemies, I believe the fullness of this word will be fulfilled at His coming.

• But they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up for them.

Much like the word through Isaiah.


“The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon Me,
Because the LORD has anointed Me
To preach good tidings to the poor;
He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,
To proclaim liberty to the captives,
And the opening of the prison to those who are bound;
To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,
And the day of vengeance of our God;
To comfort all who mourn,
Isaiah 61:1-2


And the day of vengeance of our God; To comfort all who mourn,

This part will be fulfilled at His coming, which is why He stopped there and didn’t quote that part when He read from Isaiah in the synagogue that day.



“The Spirit of the LORD is upon Me,
Because He has anointed Me
To preach the gospel to the poor;
He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,
To proclaim liberty to the captives
And recovery of sight to the blind,
To set at liberty those who are oppressed;
To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD.”
Then He closed the book, and gave it back to the attendant and sat down. And the eyes of all who were in the synagogue were fixed on Him. And He began to say to them, “Today this Scripture is fulfilled in your hearing.” Luke 4:18-20

^^^^That is not even close to being plausible.

1) The mark in the forehead
2) The flying scorpions that Sting men for 5 months.
3)The hailstones of fire.
4) Anyone refusing the mark just be headed. 5) Christian's not being allowed to buy or sell.
6) The oceans becoming as blood and the creature's dying in the ocean.
7) One third of mankind on the planet killed

Way too much for tge bible to be wrong about a future tribulation.

Jesus Said "tribulation such as the world has never seen and never will see again."

 

[rebuilder 454]

The "mark" is essentially the forbidden fruit of the following Age.

However, I do not agree that the temptation to receive it constitutes the tribulation; the temptation is equally to accuse people of wanting to take it or taking a liking to sharing it with others who want it more than you - these are all excuses to sin and must be dealt with one by one (over the Ages).

EDIT: What the tribulation is regardless of what tempts you, is a struggle with the idea of dying with faith - instead of the opposite of it.

Sounds like you are spiritualizing a clear vivid mark required by the AC.

 

[JLB]

^^^^That is not even close to being plausible.

1) The mark in the forehead
2) The flying scorpions that Sting men for 5 months.
3)The hailstones of fire.
4) Anyone refusing the mark just be headed. 5) Christian's not being allowed to buy or sell.
6) The oceans becoming as blood and the creature's dying in the ocean.
7) One third of mankind on the planet killed

Way too much for tge bible to be wrong about a future tribulation.

Jesus Said "tribulation such as the world has never seen and never will see again."

‘Where are all these things mentioned in Jeremiah 30:5-11 ?

 

[rebuilder 454]

‘Where are all these things mentioned in Jeremiah 30:5-11 ?

The great trib is not Jacob's trouble?

Maybe that is where yout views are getting off?

 

[Gottservant]

Sounds like you are spiritualizing a clear vivid mark required by the AC.

I want to be able to reach people, with the "mark". I'm not prepared to condemn them.

In the same way Paul urges us to be "in the world, but not of it", I am urging us to be "aware of the mark, but not for it"?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

The Great Tribulation will be the last 1335 days of the 7 years of the 70th week of Daniel 9:27 (which is also the 7 years of Ezekiel 39:9). The Great White Throne Judgement will be a thousand years later.

View attachment 74556

The destruction of the Gog invasion does not start the 70th week of Daniel or the tribulation period. It is Israel signing a 7 year covenant with teh Antichrist that begins that period.

 

[Douggg]

The destruction of the Gog invasion does not start the 70th week of Daniel or the tribulation period. It is Israel signing a 7 year covenant with teh Antichrist that begins that period.

Hi Ronald, I agree that the destruction of Gog's army does not start the 70th week, but will be right before it start.

The actual starting of the 70th week will not be a signing of a 7 year covenant, but a big speech that the Antichrist ( as the false perceived messiah by the Jews for a while) will make from the temple mount, declaring that God has given the land of Israel to the children of Israel as their forever. The speech will be made according to a requirement that Moses made in Deuteronomy 31:9-13 (the 7 years is in that text).

The speech will be a world wide broadcast event. So there will be no doubt as to when the 7 years begin.

 

[Davy]

The "mark" is essentially the forbidden fruit of the following Age.

However, I do not agree that the temptation to receive it constitutes the tribulation; the temptation is equally to accuse people of wanting to take it or taking a liking to sharing it with others who want it more than you - these are all excuses to sin and must be dealt with one by one (over the Ages).

EDIT: What the tribulation is regardless of what tempts you, is a struggle with the idea of dying with faith - instead of the opposite of it.

I wish it were that easy, but that's not what the Scriptures teach about the future "great tribulation".

Matt 24:21
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
KJV

Mark 13:19
19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
KJV

Dan 12:1
12 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
KJV


God's Word defines the coming tribulation as a time that has never been on earth before, nor will ever be again. How... exactly is that meant though?

That is why Lord Jesus commanded His servants to not allow any man to deceive us. It is because DECEPTION TO THE COMING FALSE-MESSIAH in place of Jesus Christ is to be the MAIN TEMPTATION at the END for the TRIBULATION.

But with some men, when they hear the phrase "great tribulation", they immediately attach ideas like all out war with it, basically the events that are to happen PRIOR to the trib with Jesus' "beginning of sorrows" time. Men's Pre-trib Rapture theory especially does that, for 'shock value', to scare the Biblically illiterate into accepting their false pre-trib rapture theories.

And because Jesus and Apostle Paul, and the Book of Daniel, all describe the END will be a time of world peace and safety, that means the TEMPTATION of the tribulation will in reality be about DECEPTION to the false Messiah, falling away to believe he will be Christ having returned.

 

[rvmb]

^^^^That is not even close to being plausible.

1) The mark in the forehead
2) The flying scorpions that Sting men for 5 months.
3)The hailstones of fire.
4) Anyone refusing the mark just be headed. 5) Christian's not being allowed to buy or sell.
6) The oceans becoming as blood and the creature's dying in the ocean.
7) One third of mankind on the planet killed

Way too much for tge bible to be wrong about a future tribulation.

Jesus Said "tribulation such as the world has never seen and never will see again."

Sounds like you are having to deal with Scripture twisters twisting Scripture to suit a manmade dogs meal of a dogma.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Sounds like you are having to deal with Scripture twisters twisting Scripture to suit a manmade dogs meal of a dogma.

Double post

 

[rebuilder 454]

Hi Ronald, I agree that the destruction of Gog's army does not start the 70th week, but will be right before it start.

The actual starting of the 70th week will not be a signing of a 7 year covenant, but a big speech that the Antichrist ( as the false perceived messiah by the Jews for a while) will make from the temple mount, declaring that God has given the land of Israel to the children of Israel as their forever. The speech will be made according to a requirement that Moses made in Deuteronomy 31:9-13 (the 7 years is in that text).

The speech will be a world wide broadcast event. So there will be no doubt as to when the 7 years begin.

View attachment 75244

Nope
It says in Daniel ,"in the middle of the week, he descicrates the temple".
7 yr covenant is made on his arrival.
The bow in his hand represents covenant.

 

[rebuilder 454]

I want to be able to reach people, with the "mark". I'm not prepared to condemn them.

In the same way Paul urges us to be "in the world, but not of it", I am urging us to be "aware of the mark, but not for it"?

The saints refusing the mark are beheaded.
It says in Rev "every man Woman and child receive it, not in the book"

Postribbers imagine the trib will be some medium size trial that they "endure" by running from cave to cave.
Not at all biblical.
Most postribbers stumble at GODS PURPOSE for the trib.
1) it is Jacob's trouble....not church trouble.
2) the times of the Gentiles has to end.

Postribs fail at this dynamic.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Hi Ronald, I agree that the destruction of Gog's army does not start the 70th week, but will be right before it start.

The actual starting of the 70th week will not be a signing of a 7 year covenant, but a big speech that the Antichrist ( as the false perceived messiah by the Jews for a while) will make from the temple mount, declaring that God has given the land of Israel to the children of Israel as their forever. The speech will be made according to a requirement that Moses made in Deuteronomy 31:9-13 (the 7 years is in that text).

The speech will be a world wide broadcast event. So there will be no doubt as to when the 7 years begin.

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Verse 27 shows the start of Jacobs trouble.

 

[rvmb]

Double post

Happens to worst of us :)