Attack, Accuse, Tempt

[Rach1370]

Wow, Robbie, what a testimony! It's a real statement of how good Jesus is, that He can turn those dark days of yours into glory about and for Him! Through Christ we can do anything!

I find it sad that people judge so quickly...I find it even sadder that I'm also guilty of it. I don't always succeed, but I do try to hold that opinion back until I'm given something real to made a decision. And besides, just because I don't agree with a person doesn't make them bad...or even wrong!!

Anyway, I just wanted to say that all your posts show such a love for Jesus, that I find so wonderful....so keep it up!

 

[Larry Conlley]

"So maybe you shouldn't be judging people you've read a few posts from on a message board?"

Or

Maybe you should not be judging a great man of God whom you have admitted is greater than you.

And you still say a lot of things that are just flat out not true.

 

[Robbie]

So I guess reading about King David and saying, "David blew it by committing adultery and murder" is also judging David?

I don't see that as judging... I see that as learning from their mistakes and struggles... which I thought is one of the purposes the bible serves?

I don't read the bible to put men up on pedestals... and one of the most important thing I believe you can take from the bible is learning from people's mistakes and struggles.. the way David blew it by getting sucked into lust... the way Solomon was the smartest guy ever and still miserable.... the way Peter denied the Lord because he didn't want to suffer persectution... the way Job mistook what was happening to Him as coming from God... the way Paul couldn't understand the conflict in himself... the way Adam doubted God's goodness and questioned His Word... and on and on and on... the bible is full of people blowing it and in that I find that I'm just like them... someone trying and sometimes succeeding but a lot of times failing... thanks to Jesus for doing what I never could...

As far as what's true... you're not the test of that... Jesus is... so I'm not concerned about whether I'm in agreement with you or anyone else... as long as I'm in agreement with Him...

I do know this... Jobeliano asked for help... I tried to offer help by being as honest as I possibly could about my own struggles and how I found victory in Jesus... to which you turned around and tried to tear me down for... so now this guy who's looking for help instead of you sharing your experiences with him or trying to lift him... you felt it was more important to insult me and tear me down... do you realize how retarded that makes us all look? Like a bunch of whiny pharisees bickering about shiz that don't even matter and ignoring our brother who needs some love.

So check it dude... don't waste your time talking to me because I aint gonna repond to you again until I see that you value glorifying God by loving people over lame bickering... go ahead and post about what a bad person I am all you want... I wont even see you... because I've found people that respnd the way you did are really just looking for someone to bicker back and forth with and sorry bud... I'm not gonna give you my energy...

Hope you find peace and blessings and love...

 

[Larry Conlley]

"so if I don't agree with you... you're obviously going to see me as not telling the truth..."

No

If I read where you write something that I know is not true.

Then I am going to see you as not telling the truth.

And I am not a dude, I am your elder.

"Hope you find peace and blessings and love..."

You do not have to hope any more.

I found them all in God.

 

[Robbie]

Thanks for the positive word Rach...

Blessing to you to = )

 

[Larry Conlley]

"to which you turned around and tried to tear me down for"

No

I pointed out what you were proclaiming as facts. Not to be factual. Being deceived is one thing, but deceiving others is too much for me.

"God doesn't give us evil, He delivers us from it..."

God does give us evil. And he does not deliver everyone from it.

God created evil.

When I read the things you write about yourself on here, this comes to mind. They worshipped me with their lips but their hearts are far from me.

And when Jesus comes back, he is going to kill many with a double edge sword.

 

[Robbie]

So anyways... back to the topic... the pattern being...

That if satan can convince me that God isn't good that's were he finds the ability to tempt me...

I've been thinking about how this follows the pattern in the garden of eden...

The enemy claims that God is just holding out on them... basically accusing that God was doing evil to them... once he got them to doubt God's goodness, he got them to doubt God's Word... once he got them to doubt God's Word, he found a place to temp them...

If Adam and Eve would have known in their heart without a doubt that God was good their response would have been something like, "Our Father only gives us good and He's not a liar and doesn't hold back what'a good for us... He said if we eat from the tree we'll die so you're trying to kill us... you're a liar and a murderer"

I feel this is where I find victory... in the finished revelation of God being in Jesus and in that seeing that God is only good...

When I believe God is only good, I then find faith to believe His Word... and when I believe His Word satan loses his power to tempt...

I still fail at this... but I'm practicing believing...

Hope this blesses...

 

[Robbie]

Good words Martin... thanks for sharing and being honest...

I've found the way I keep a healthy level of confession is surrounding myself with people that I know really love me and who realize they two are just as guilty as me so they have no right to judge... when I really know someone loves me and won't judge me I have the faith to confess because I know their intention will be to rehabilitate me and not to condemn me... I personally don't like the idea of confession to someone I don't know... I prefer confession to someone who I have a deep symbiotic relationship with... where we both love each other and trust each other and both feel safe to live in our true selves... even Jesus had his couple closest disciples that he'd share stuff about himself with... like when he took the couple disciples on top of the mountain and they got to see Him shine in glory... of course Jesus never had to confess anything... but just having those couple people that we feel safe to let see into our truest selves is so healthy... it's what true fellowship is... the Light...

Thank you for that example Aspen . I think that is what I was trying to say. There is something about confession that is both terrifying and tremendously beneficial. Pardon my choice of words but you get my point.

I am also a deep thinker at times. Often I have pondered the power of confession. Even the little confessions for little things done in a moment of anger to friends and neighbors. Later I will give some personal examples.

But for now the deep thinking part. I do not know if the following is true , but I have considered it. As follows:

-one of the meanings of the world "occult" is "things done in secret"
-the occult (and sin) can be very powerful
-we Christians are not occult of course
-we do everything wide open for the whole world to see
-Christians are an open book right ????
-ahem ... except for the few pet secrets we keep , ahem.
-lots of power for things done in secret.
-reveal those little secrets (confess) public-ally (ouch)
-the power of the little secret sin is disarmed
-I think that is the power of confession.
-it is like it releases the power (stranglehold) a bit of sin can have over us
-once the power of sin is released , (christian) life seems much more productive
-until the next tiny sin of course ... they always pop up (smile)

The few times I have confessed my errors (to people I do not care for) (and hated every minute of it) (and did it for my own reasons) (it was bugging me something terrible) .... I experienced tremendous relief and found it tremendously beneficial.

Confession does indeed have power and good results.

At least the couple of times I tried it
When I get real brave , I may even try it again

More later
Arnie M.
Terrified of confession.

 

[aspen]

I didn't give my first confession until I knew my priest, personally for two years - he is my sole confessor.

 

[Robbie]

That's cool Aspen... it's great to have at least one person we can live in the light with...

Now if I could just live the kind of life that I never felt that I wanted to hide in darkness about... when I do what's right it's easy to live in the light because who cares if people find out that I'm doing good... but when I blow it and do wrong I hate the light because I don't want people to know what I've been up to... that is unless I know the people will accept me and love me no matter what... it's the promise of the forgiveness of sins that allows me to step into the light... because I know when I step into the light through confession... that's when I'm forgiven...

Thanks for your fellowship...

 

[Martin W.]

I am going to give a small (and poor) example of a situation that happened to me about 12 years ago. I came home one day (I live on an acreage) and found a junk yard guy and his helpers rummaging around my yard. I was furious , I promptly forgot I was a christian gentleman , told him to get the phuck out of my yard , never come back , and take his thieving helpers with him. I was also able to recall a few more favorite swear words I use on special occasions. I huffed and puffed some more until he got in his truck and drove away.

But before he left , he hung his head , mumbled an apology , told me he was not a thief , handed me his card , and said he had heard I had a metal storage container for sale. Then he left.

I am normally a swell guy , and my outburst surprised me , I was embarrassed by how I handled myself , and It began to weigh heavy on me over the next couple of hours. We had indeed been having theft problems in our area ..... but was I accusing the wrong people ?? .... It bothered me terrible , and yes I had mentioned earlier in some coffee shop somewhere that I had a metal storage shed for sale.. I am thinking I have done the wrong thing.

I have strong arms , good fingers , and my phone is not very heavy. I also make the claim to be fearless from time to time. That is unless I am heading to confession

I found it extremely hard to do , but that evening , after supper , I picked up my phone and dialed the number on the card he had given me. I wanted to apologize for my outburst. It was not my nature to be that ugly. I had to get the guilt off my chest.

His name was Abe , when he answered his phone and I introduced myself , I heard a big sigh ..... , I started to explain to him I was a christian , and the way I treated him was completely out of character .... I heard another big sigh from his end .......

His reply caught me by surprise , he said that he also was a christian , and the very moment I called him he said he then knew right then I was a christian (thus his big sigh in the background)...... We became good friends.

I found the act of confession , and the asking for forgiveness were very beneficial. I hope I am brave enough to try it again in the future. I find the quicker I admit my errors , the quicker problems are resolved. Admission of guilt is both terrifying and rewarding. I like the rewarding part , not the admitting part

And yes , Abe did buy the metal storage shed , and a collector car I also had in my yard. A beautiful , all black 1977 Cadillac Eldorado Biarritz with the 500 cubic inch engine. Sadly he passed away a few years ago. He was only 49. When we all get to heaven , I will introduce you all to him.

Keep your eye out for a Christian junk yard guy driving a Cadillac.

Arnie
Martin W.
I loved that car

 

[Martin W.]

That's cool Aspen... it's great to have at least one person we can live in the light with...

Now if I could just live the kind of life that I never felt that I wanted to hide in darkness about... when I do what's right it's easy to live in the light because who cares if people find out that I'm doing good... but when I blow it and do wrong I hate the light because I don't want people to know what I've been up to... that is unless I know the people will accept me and love me no matter what... it's the promise of the forgiveness of sins that allows me to step into the light... because I know when I step into the light through confession... that's when I'm forgiven...

Thanks for your fellowship...

You make some good points that I think apply to most of us. Thank you.

There are a lot of things I do not have answers for , I ponder them continually. I find what you said very appropriate. Most of us "live in the light " ....... except for the times our own personal bits of darkness invades. I think we all have them. It is like the Lord helps us overcome many things , but leaves us a few reminders. Paul the Apostle used to speak about his thorn in the flesh as well. Was he going thru similar things we all face ?? Who knows.

I do not have any real deep dark secrets , just a few little ones. They harm no one else , but I am ashamed I have them. Now here is a point I am trying to make ... If I confessed them to you , probably nothing would change (for me) (I am trying to define confession) . All it would do (for you) is reassure you that all of us have imperfections too.

For me to confess those things to you has no real value , and would not accomplish much (my words) ... but lets say that I had harmed you personally , or caused you grief over something (and I was at fault) .... then my confession to you (my admission of guilt) would have tremendous value to both of us , and we could go forward as even better christians. Something like that.

My personal faults are known only to me , and my Lord , and I confess them to him on a regular basis. Often without the results I hoped for. Does he leave us with a few faults because our perfection comes in the afterlife , not this current life. ?? Maybe that is why. I don't know. I ponder these things on a regular basis. I find it frustrating when the Lord does not immediately rescue me from my personal issues. I like instant results. I have had many prayers answered , but not all of them.

In the meantime , I find I have much more respect for Christians who continually acknowledge we are not quite as good as we all think we look sometimes. It encourages us to go forward knowing we are not the only ones who struggle.

Robbie , you bring a lot of light to this forum. That I know for sure.
I thank you again.


Arnie Martin W.
...... always trying to be spotless and free of blemish ..... way to far ahead of schedule

 

[Robbie]

Great testimony about your relationship with Abe and I hear ya as far your perspective on confession...

The reason why confession is so important to me is because as soon as I don't live in the light in a transparent way I find it much easier to blow it.

For me living in darkness has been a unique experience because I grew up with the pastors kids and let's just say they weren't the best influences in my life and it was understood we weren't to talk about anything that we did. Well when I first decided to follow Jesus I just opened myself up... I was in a constant state of confession... I had no problem confessing my sins because I didn't want to hold on to them and I hadn't yet set any self righteous outward expectation of myself that I couldn't live up to in the truth.

I personally have found that when I don't want to confess it's because I also don't want to repent. Well the pastor eventually called me into his office and told me I didn't have to be so open about my past life... at the time I kind of believed that whatever that guy said is what went so I stopped confessing... well once I stopped living in the light I found myself soon slipping back into my old behavior. Now I've actually realized the reason why the pastor didn't want me to talk about all my sins is because a lot of them were done while hanging out with his kids... haha...

So now I've found that the healthiest place for me is in the light... there's really no point in me hiding anything anyways since the day's coming when everything is uncovered. I might as well live as much like that now so when the day comes I don't run away from the fullness of the Light.

The way I now see it is how can anyone guide me into the truth if they're affraid of it? and how can I come to the truth if I'm affraid of it?

I need to learn to love the Light now even though I know it's going to basically expose me for being a worthless sinner... but I guess that's what will cause me to love much... because he who's forgiven much loves much...

Hope this blesses... thanks for all your insight and perspective Martin... a lot of good words...

 

[Martin W.]

Great testimony about your relationship with Abe and I hear ya as far your perspective on confession...

The reason why confession is so important to me is because as soon as I don't live in the light in a transparent way I find it much easier to blow it.



I personally have found that when I don't want to confess it's because I also don't want to repent. in my opinion



The way I now see it is how can anyone guide me into the truth if they're afraid of it? and how can I come to the truth if I'm afraid of it?

I need to learn to love the Light now even though I know it's going to basically expose me for being a worthless sinner... but I guess that's what will cause me to love much... because he who's forgiven much loves much...

Hope this blesses... thanks for all your insight and perspective Martin... a lot of good words...

Robbie , I have snipped a few parts from your above reply that hit home for me. Just a quick reply from me for now. Hope it makes sense.

---I found my "confession" about Abe was not all that hard to admit. Everything worked out , and besides it is just one of those bumps and grinds we all face in life. There is something I find much harder , and you touched on it as well. Here goes ....

-- The things I wish not to confess are because I do not wish to repent. I love my few faults. I do not want the Lord to take them away. I ask him to take them away , but I really hope he doesn't. He honors my hopes.

--- Fine , I feel I am able to be a great Christian , my flaws harm nobody else .... and I do not expect to ever be perfect down here , no problem .... except for ....

--- I do not feel like a phony , but how can I expect anyone to see me as living in the light , when I know darn well I do not always.

---Furthermore , how can I expect the Lord to view me as living in the light when I know darn well I do not always , and I know he knows it too.

--- There are times I have chosen not to represent Christianity , because I feel like I am a poor representative.

--- I have set the Lord aside many times in my life (not really set him aside) (just recognize I am not qualified to represent "the light" )

--- Yet here is what I have great difficulty with ....

--- for his own reasons he chooses to involve me in some profound projects that could only come from above .... and he does it in spite of myself ... and I am puzzled as to why . It ends up making me think he overlooks my flaws and makes use of me anyway.

--I find it encouraging , and it helps me to go forward as best I can , flaws and all. To this day , I do not feel he should overlook my flaws , but he does.

It leaves me puzzled , it does not add up to me , and I am left without an explanation.

The best I can do is tell the truth.

And I just have.

-----------------.
I am extremely surprised that the Lord can use me for anything. It just doesn't add up. But he did , and I do. At least as best I can anyway.
As long as the world does not get to see my faults. They love to quench the light. It is what they do.
It helps them to keep the focus off their own lives. I find that by examining my own faults , I have less time to examine others.

Look for the good in everything , it is there. Maybe that is how God looks too. Sure seems that way anyway. So far I like it.

 

[Robbie]

Robbie , I have snipped a few parts from your above reply that hit home for me. Just a quick reply from me for now. Hope it makes sense.

---I found my "confession" about Abe was not all that hard to admit. Everything worked out , and besides it is just one of those bumps and grinds we all face in life. There is something I find much harder , and you touched on it as well. Here goes ....

-- The things I wish not to confess are because I do not wish to repent. I love my few faults. I do not want the Lord to take them away. I ask him to take them away , but I really hope he doesn't. He honors my hopes.

--- Fine , I feel I am able to be a great Christian , my flaws harm nobody else .... and I do not expect to ever be perfect down here , no problem .... except for ....

--- I do not feel like a phony , but how can I expect anyone to see me as living in the light , when I know darn well I do not always.

---Furthermore , how can I expect the Lord to view me as living in the light when I know darn well I do not always , and I know he knows it too.

--- There are times I have chosen not to represent Christianity , because I feel like I am a poor representative.

--- I have set the Lord aside many times in my life (not really set him aside) (just recognize I am not qualified to represent "the light" )

--- Yet here is what I have great difficulty with ....

--- for his own reasons he chooses to involve me in some profound projects that could only come from above .... and he does it in spite of myself ... and I am puzzled as to why . It ends up making me think he overlooks my flaws and makes use of me anyway.

--I find it encouraging , and it helps me to go forward as best I can , flaws and all. To this day , I do not feel he should overlook my flaws , but he does.

It leaves me puzzled , it does not add up to me , and I am left without an explanation.

The best I can do is tell the truth.

And I just have.

-----------------.
I am extremely surprised that the Lord can use me for anything. It just doesn't add up. But he did , and I do. At least as best I can anyway.
As long as the world does not get to see my faults. They love to quench the light. It is what they do.
It helps them to keep the focus off their own lives. I find that by examining my own faults , I have less time to examine others.

Look for the good in everything , it is there. Maybe that is how God looks too. Sure seems that way anyway. So far I like it.

Good Word brother... honest and humble... seeing yourself in the light of who you are, and who He is, and realizing His is the power, so His is the glory... without Him we can do nothing... WORD!!!

 

[paul1234]

I've noticed this pattern in my life of when I fall and it goes something like this.

1) First the enemy attacks me through some kind of negativity in my life.

2) He accuses God to me, "If God loves you why is this happening to you", "If Jesus died for your sins why are you still suffering"

3) Then he tempts me... "Since God sucks you should just sin... fulfilling some kind of lust will make you feel better."

I've found that as long as He doesn't get me with number 2 he can't get me with number 3.

It's when I start to look at the Father through my perception of what's going on that he can get me to doubt my Father's goodness and once he get's me to doubt my Fathers goodness he can tempt me.

It seems like as long as I look at God through Christ alone he can't get me to doubt my Father's goodness... and as long as I don't doubt my Father the enemy has no power to tempt... but I can find this hard some times when I'm going through the enemies attacks.


Anyone else have similar experiences?

When we are prepared to battle with the enemy god gave us armour to wear because we need it, clink on the link and read up on how to put it on then we just laugh at the enemy



Helmet of salvation

Breastplate of righteousness

Belt of truth

Shield of faith

Sword of the spirit

Shoes of peace



http://www.aboundingjoy.com/sw-helmet.htm

 

[Martin W.]

When we are prepared to battle with the enemy god gave us armour to wear because we need it, clink on the link and read up on how to put it on then we just laugh at the enemy

What does that mean "laugh at the enemy"

 

[paul1234]

When I say laugh at the enemy example I use to have unpleasant thoughts had it for years and it got to me, how the devil can get to you he can give you ugly thoughts now the shoes of peace which is the gospels when I started reading the bible the ugly thoughts went that’s what I mean when I say laugh at him which I am doing because I am using what god has given me to fight and do battle with dark forces his armour