BIBLE PROMISES

[Stranger]

5My ears had heard of you
but now my eyes have seen you.
6Therefore I despise myself
and repent in dust and ashes.”

You add nothing. Again, Job is not repenting of things he did that might result in his trials. You ignore (Job:42:7) You have no response to my replies. As I have asked before, show me something in the Scripture that shows that Job is reaping what he has sowed. The verses you give do not show that. Repeat them as much as you want, they don't show it.

It does show the blindness you have toward the Scripture.

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

well, at least you're consistent

 

[Stranger]

well, at least you're consistent

As your blindness is.

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

i ignore Job 42:7 because you have shown that you don't understand the rest of the Book, wadr.

7After the Lord had said these things to Job, he said to Eliphaz the Temanite, “I am angry with you and your two friends, because you have not spoken the truth about me, as my servant Job has.

and, as i already said, i have made no statements about God, such as Eliphaz made, or if i have, then BAM quote them, but let's not kid ourselves, you got nothing to quote, so this is your cue to make another post about putting me down, and elevating yourself some more. go for it.

 

[bbyrd009]

[SIZE=medium]Greetings my fellow Christian brothers and sisters,

I love to speak the truth and I have very serious questions that I think many believers would like to know the answer to. Can you tell me please why does God's word promise so much and yet fulfils so very little to nothing in the lives of many devout Christians, in terms of, for example: long life, health, peace, joy and happiness, etc? Instead, I've seen many atheists who live very healthy, prosperous and happy lives and they obviously don't believe in keeping God's commandments. Doesn't the Bible lose credibility in this way? Isn't this part of the reason why many people don't take God, His commandments or the Bible seriously?[/SIZE]
...
[SIZE=12pt]Thank you.

God bless you,
Rachel Henderson[/SIZE]

so, my reply to you, Rachel, is that the Book plainly tells us that the church will be taken over by apostates, Paul plainly tells us that as soon as he leaves he knows "the wolves will come in," and we have many, many verses outlining "the blind leading the blind," etc, it is put many, many other ways, and you are assured that if you seek your own salvation, and recognize that those who "ate and drank in His presence,"

23“Lord,” someone asked Him, “are there few being saved? ” He said to them,
24“Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because I tell you, many will try to enter and won’t be able
25once the homeowner gets up and shuts the door. Then you will stand outside and knock on the door, saying, ‘Lord, open up for us! ’ He will answer you, ‘I don’t know you or where you’re from.’
26Then you will say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets! ’
27But He will say, ‘I tell you, I don’t know you or where you’re from. Get away from Me, all you workers of unrighteousness! ’

(compare this to the table you see in most churches, that says "This do in remembrance of Me"), and who put "Jesus" in the streets (compare this to "He will not argue or shout, and no one will hear His voice in the streets.") then you might see that, when these people plainly disconnect the described from "all you workers of unrighteousness!" which they will do, without fail, every time, because they have to--they have a business to run, after all--then you have all of the evidence you need to go somewhere else, ok? Anywhere else. Run. Let the Spirit lead you, and you won't go wrong. All those verses in the Book can, eventually, make sense, if you just keep digging, and understand that yes, there is a deception going on, and for whatever reason, it serves God to have it just this way.

Which i know initially seems to make no sense; but God wants people to reveal their hearts, meaning a way must exist for hypocrites to reveal that they are hypocrites, and Atheists to prove that they are Atheists, which is why the Book is so full of apparent contradictions, which believe me will all resolve when you dig deep enough. And just so you know, even though it is easily demonstrable that God hates religion, that doesn't mean that you can't learn from the religious, or anyone else for that matter. All are deceived. Go back to that church in ten years, and notice that all of the faces have changed, generally speaking. For the most part, iow. All of those who left have just changed their minds, like you are called to do, and are doing. Peace.

 

[Stranger]

i ignore Job 42:7 because you have shown that you don't understand the rest of the Book, wadr.

7After the Lord had said these things to Job, he said to Eliphaz the Temanite, “I am angry with you and your two friends, because you have not spoken the truth about me, as my servant Job has.

and, as i already said, i have made no statements about God, such as Eliphaz made, or if i have, then BAM quote them, but let's not kid ourselves, you got nothing to quote, so this is your cue to make another post about putting me down, and elevating yourself some more. go for it.

You ignore Job 42:7 because it contradicts what you are saying. What you are saying is that it's possible Job was reaping what he sowed in the trials he went through. That is what his friends said also. And God was clear that they did not speak the truth, just like you are not, especially when you choose to ignore Job 42:7.

I have asked you to provide Scriptures in Job to the contrary. You have not. You just continue to whine about being put down. Provide Scripture for your argument that Job was reaping what he sowed.

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

You ignore Job 42:7 because it contradicts what you are saying. What you are saying is that it's possible Job was reaping what he sowed in the trials he went through. That is what his friends said also. And God was clear that they did not speak the truth, just like you are not, especially when you choose to ignore Job 42:7.

I have asked you to provide Scriptures in Job to the contrary. You have not. You just continue to whine about being put down. Provide Scripture for your argument that Job was reaping what he sowed.

Stranger

my argument there would be that i was speaking more generally, and meant to indicate that which Job admitted to, and repented of, which i don't think came out in the discourse? Also, i am not Job's friend, meaning that as a friend it would maybe not be appropriate to point out "well, you reap what you sow;" (especially when you cannot point out the sowing, which Job's friends obviously could not; i have the advantage of getting to read the whole parable, of course). And, i forgive you, ok? :wub:

 

[Stranger]

my argument there would be that i was speaking more generally, and meant to indicate that which Job admitted to, and repented of, which i don't think came out in the discourse? Also, i am not Job's friend, meaning that as a friend it would maybe not be appropriate to point out "well, you reap what you sow;" (especially when you cannot point out the sowing, which Job's friends obviously could not; i have the advantage of getting to read the whole parable, of course). And, i forgive you, ok? :wub:

Well, you need to be specific when you make accusations. And if you're unwilling to be specific, then apparently, as I said before, you don't know what you're talking about. You speak as Job's friends spoke. That puts you in line with (Job 42:7)

Forgive me?...I don't care.

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

Well, you need to be specific when you make accusations. And if you're unwilling to be specific, then apparently, as I said before, you don't know what you're talking about. You speak as Job's friends spoke. That puts you in line with (Job 42:7)

Forgive me?...I don't care.

Stranger

no, of course not, i understand that. What you got there, that thing you got, that's basically terminal. I'd ask what accusations i made, but i guess that would get about as far as the rest of my questions, huh? Have a nice evening.

 

[Stranger]

no, of course not, i understand that. What you got there, that thing you got, that's basically terminal. I'd ask what accusations i made, but i guess that would get about as far as the rest of my questions, huh? Have a nice evening.

I have told you the accusation you have made. Now you pretend I haven't. Provide Scripture that shows that Job was reaping what he sowed in the trials he endured.

We are all terminal. So?

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

ha, ya, good point. As to the rest, i'm sorry, but if vv 5-6 can't help you, then i can't, either. You meant "accusing" Job? Lol. There are other refs, even some in Job, you might explore his address to God at the beginning v at the end, if you like; it changes. Everyone reaps what they sow, and Job did, too. "Righteous man" is supposed to be like a TIC thing, i guess? A Jew could explain that one to you better than me.

"I came not for the righteous, but sinners." Job was "a righteous man." Get it?

 

[Stranger]

ha, ya, good point. As to the rest, i'm sorry, but if vv 5-6 can't help you, then i can't, either. You meant "accusing" Job? Lol. There are other refs, even some in Job, you might explore his address to God at the beginning v at the end, if you like; it changes. Everyone reaps what they sow, and Job did, too. "Righteous man" is supposed to be like a TIC thing, i guess? A Jew could explain that one to you better than me.

I already knew you couldn't help me....or anyone else for that matter.

If there is Scripture supporting what you are saying, that Job was reaping what he sowed, then show them. If you can't show them, then they are not there. And you are just a shallow running creek.

I know you like to talk alot. But you can't support what you say. So, why should anyone take you seriously?

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

I already knew you couldn't help me....or anyone else for that matter.

If there is Scripture supporting what you are saying, that Job was reaping what he sowed, then show them. If you can't show them, then they are not there. And you are just a shallow running creek.

I know you like to talk alot. But you can't support what you say. So, why should anyone take you seriously?

Stranger

ooh, good one! Usually that device gets used on me like "Why should WE..." or something similar, like that, whenever they want to isolate me, and include themselves. That's very subtil, that one. Working up, from there, you might see that vv 6 and 7 really support me all i need, but at the same time, you can interpret them however you like. I mean, i could go spend like 30 seconds or whatever in Job, and find some more support, "for you," but really, would there be a point?

I mean, if Easter hasn't taught us anything else, it's shown us that if God Himself came down and told you Passover, you would still hold Easter, and sure, i could proudly--cuz i'm a proud guy, too--abuse some Scripture here, like "if you won't listen to the prophets, you won't listen to me," or whatever, i mean, there's always one handy for those occasions, huh? But what would that do? Make me a little surer in my own mind? Lol.

So, for others, then, from "The Book of Job Explained," by Inspiring Philosophy on YT, we might see that, as is true with just about every surface reading of Scripture, the conclusion that you currently must be holding, that "God is just capricious," holds no water whatsoever (and that i wasn't "accusing" Job of anything, anyway, but nevermind that part for now), and Job can be read as...well, the warning that it is, which might be particularly applicable to us right now, Christian Patriots all convinced that All Muslims are Lost, as we simultaneously fund both sides of a Perpetual War against them on the exact other side of the planet, and lobby for/elect Carnival Barkers to enforce our desire to stop them immigrating to America. The whole video is 45 minutes, but i'll spend 15 or 20 here, in a futile search for some more "support" for you, being as how we are surrounded by a cloud and all. Job is a Book for Christians, a warning to our generation, thus "Job was the greatest man among all the people of the east," which since you live in the West, you are prolly safe, and can safely ignore Job, almost surely probably.

So, i guess we can't really talk about what matters, right now, so i'll skip the laden symbolism in "7 sons and 3 daughters," at the beginning, and we won't even broach the "four generations" Job got to "witness" at the end, and i'll just go right to your "evidence," which, as you say, cannot help you anyway--from your own lips, that--and let's just look at Job's response, post-Apocalypse; "21saying: Naked I came from my mother's womb, and naked I will leave this life. The LORD gives, and the LORD takes away. Praise the name of Yahweh." Sounds very upright, huh? The Text even goes on to make plain that "22Throughout all this Job did not sin or blame God for anything."

So now, on the surface, anyone reading Grape Juice--which believe me is still basically me, too, as much as i might like to think otherwise--is convinced now, if they were not before, that Job had it all together, and God is just very capricious, maybe He was bored that day, or this is some game that satan likes and he finds it easy to suck God into or whatever, because let's be honest, we are trained to read the Bible the same way that Job is illustrated to be worshipping God here, so naturally Job's response sounds ok to us, and we don't stop to think "um, wouldn't someone so 'righteous,' and so 'wealthy,' have maybe a little more personal response to his Father? Like, 'gee, Father, what have i done, to deserve this?'" Something? But of course we're all busy being little Christian Perfectionists, too, so that never occurs to us.

So we swallow this "God can do whatever He wants, here on earth--" which is absolutely not true, of course, and this can be supported in many, many other Passages of Scripture--and we swallow this bait about Job's "sinlessness," to the point now that anyone suggesting anything else is "accusing" Job, meaning we cannot practically have any discussion about this parable, and Job has been elevated to God-Like status now, right? Even though we know "sinlessness" does not equal "perfect" in God's eyes, despite all the "holiness" yack getting jammed down our throats now, i think we even got a current thread on it. David was hardly "sinless," but was the "apple of God's eye," had to be for some other reason, huh--and Christ plainly castigated the "sinless," the "holiness" crowd, on more than one occasion.

And it becomes patently obvious, when you pick up a shovel, that "holiness" or "sinless" people are just looking for another way to serve themselves, and get some pride, which they pretty much got in spades, and they're looking for more.

So, now that i've covered the "talking a lot" part, and i guess you prolly aren't even reading anymore, i'll just say go watch the YT if you want an answer, it's 45 minutes, ish, but really, all the answer you should need is in the last chapter, where we see that what we usually accuse Job's friends of, we got that part wrong too, but never mind that for now, we see that Job is repenting of his "sin," right there in vv 6-7, but we can get a fuller picture in reading just a bit more of the supporting Text;

3You asked, "Who is this who conceals My counsel with ignorance?" Surely I spoke about things I did not understand, things too wonderful for me to know.

which is not going to make sense to you right now, when reflected upon in light of v7, you got another conundrum there, but i doubt you are interested in hearing any exegesis of that from such a shallow stream, being the deep guy that you are and all, so right now i'll just point out that Job sure seems to be repenting twice, here in 3, and also in vv6-7, and being as how we are Job, you might take a hint, maybe, since now you even got a Witness, right there in 3. And i guess i will too, i'm gonna go watch the rest of the video now, and i wish you the best of luck, rolling dem bones, and i hope i have sufficiently addressed your latest cry for help here. (a little ribbing, there, hope you understand, even if you are a walking cry for help, wadr)

 

[Stranger]

bbyrdoo9

No one claimed Job was sinless.

Again, pay attention. Job 42:6-7 is Job repenting for questioning God. It is not Job repenting for things he did to deserve the trials he is going through. The trials Job is going through are not the result of sowing and reaping as you have said. And as Jobs friends said.

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

ok

 

[bbyrd009]

bbyrdoo9

No one claimed Job was sinless.

Again, pay attention. Job 42:6-7 is Job repenting for questioning God. It is not Job repenting for things he did to deserve the trials he is going through. The trials Job is going through are not the result of sowing and reaping as you have said. And as Jobs friends said.

Stranger

so, where, again, is Job previously "Questioning God?" You got some Job "questioning God" somewhere? Wasn't the whole premise that it was Job's friends who were improperly questioning God, and that Job was a "Righteous Man?" Now alla sudden, see, Job is acknowledged to be a sinner, and is, somewhere, that i am not able to find, "questioning God," and not repenting, i guess, yet, of the sin that he is now acknowledged to somehow have committed. So, being as this is not my first rodeo, i will tell you that what is going to end up happening here, is that i need to "Again, pay attention," while it is revealed that you were right the whole time, and you somehow now completely agree with my opening premise, and we have just gotten a step closer to that, is all. So have it your way, i don't care how the truth comes out, tbh.

 

[Stranger]

bbyrdoo9

(Job 10:1-2) "My soul is weary of my life; I will leave my complaint upon myself; I will speak in the bitterness of my soul. I will say unto God, Do not condemn me; shew me wherefore thou contendest with me."

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

Job 10 MSG
1 I can't stand my life - I hate it! -I'm putting it all out on the table, all the bitterness of my life - I'm holding back nothing."

2 Job prayed: "Here's what I want to say: Don't, God, bring in a verdict of guilty without letting me know the charges you're bringing.


seems like a fair question to me, not exactly asked from "Why?" But maybe you're right, i dunno. i would compare the response Job gets, which is still a few chapters away, and goes for a couple chapters, culminates in

Job 42 MSG

1 Job answered God:

2 "I'm convinced: You can do anything and everything. Nothing and no one can upset your plans.

3 You asked, 'Who is this muddying the water, ignorantly confusing the issue, second-guessing my purposes?' I admit it. I was the one. I babbled on about things far beyond me, made small talk about wonders way over my head.

4 You told me, 'Listen, and let me do the talking. Let me ask the questions. You give the answers.'

5 I admit I once lived by rumors of you; now I have it all firsthand - from my own eyes and ears!

6 I'm sorry - forgive me. I'll never do that again, I promise! I'll never again live on crusts of hearsay, crumbs of rumor."


and see what you will see; if you think Job was just repenting of his recent talk with his friends,

7 After God had finished addressing Job, he turned to Eliphaz the Temanite and said, "I've had it with you and your two friends. I'm fed up! You haven't been honest either with me or about me - not the way my friend Job has.

and for what it's worth, i noticed a couple hours ago, the difference in Job's description, and Noah's; "a righteous man; Noah walked with God."
which we don't find @ Job. So, God considered Job a "friend" (but not "the apple of His eye," like David, nor did Job "walk with God," like Noah), which i gotta admit is hard for us to reconcile, David being arguably the worst of the bunch--a murderer, adulterer, etc; from which union Solomon came, even, i mean how do you reconcile these? What made David the apple of God's eye? My guess is humility, his capacity to rebound ("repent," in slave language).

 

[Stranger]

bbyrd009

You're as confused with David as you were with Job. Need help there too? Want me to look it up for you? You don't know the Bible. You just springboard off of what someone else says.

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

well, now you are back to giving your opinion of me, which i appreciate because it reveals you, but wadr you don't know if i'm confused or not, and i notice you aren't bringing any Witnesses for rebuttal here, but just making accusations from your heart. So, i didn't say you had to believe what i do, at those passages. And my understanding might be different next year, i guess, i don't know. but i don't see any holes in it right now, this morning, and i don't see you punching any in it, either.

So maybe since that isn't producing any fruit right now, for you, maybe you could relay your experience of being accused of being drunk at the third hour, or of meeting Him in the air for me.