Changed my political party

[preciousmessage]

(tim_from_pa;23888)
Well, speaking of over 100 years ago, I have on my web site in my signature a good book called "Judah's Sceptre/Joseph's Birthright". I think if one reads and believes what it says will clarify my position regarding earthly governments.I look at the US government established by God the same manner as the theocracy of Israel. Don't confuse what I am saying with mixing religion and government as I sense someone is jumping to do. I am dealing with purpose here. It is the utilization of government to fit into God's bigger plan until He comes to take the throne of David from the one that presently occupies it over Israel. I hope we do not despise that throne here on earth, even though the people occupying it are not the best examples?I want to just get back to the founding father's wishes and the government that God established in the constitution, or are some of you going to fall for handing in your guns if a minister says that the government asked us to (I believe marshal law is coming) so that "we all follow Romans 13"? No, such wussy obedience is only going to fall into the hands of antichrist. I would rather disobey that mandate. The Christian, and I should say, Israelite, has every right to be the salt of the earth in more ways than just the spiritual. When I see the masses, including some Christians(?) about to hit a brick wall, I'm supposed to stand back and watch them kill themselves? To separate the worldly from the spiritual is Gnosticism.
With all do respect, was Jesus Christ "wussy" when He laid down his life, rather than fight with the sword? May we too have the "mind of Christ." To mix the worldly with the spiritual is heathenism. The government's wishes of bloodshed and political wire-working may not be God's wishes, we need only to look back at Israel's dreadful history, eventually leading them to murder the Son of God. "... and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world ... sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth." Pilate said to Jesus, "Thine own nation ... have delivered thee unto me" ... Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, ... but now is my kingdom not from hence." John 17 and 19. Quote:"In the Revelation, John points to the fierce spirit of war as one of the conditions which should exist at the time of the end. “The nations were angry, and Thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged.” Rev. xi. 18. As it was in the days of Noah—when violence filled the earth—so the Lord said it would be in the last days.No one need expect anything other than violence in the earth so long as Satan is the god of this world. He it is that stirs up the fierce spirit of war, wherever it is. As the apostle saw almost the very end of the history of this world’s sin, he saw the spirits that are manifestly already at work—“the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them together to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.” Rev.16:14. End QuoteJake

 

[Unorthodox Christian]

(tim)
I look at the US government established by God the same manner as the theocracy of Israel.
True, but unlike Israel the state of Apostasy will endure til the Coming of Christ, the Apostasy of Israel will not endure til he comes but by his Grace will remove the veil of Apostasy and his People will know his Son is the Moshiach(Messiah from the Blood line of David) and that not only is the Moshiach Yeshua HaMashiach but God! America is Fallen like the Great Babylon. America is trying to compromise the Word of God which is a big no no. They are trying to create a land where foreigners can dwell with the Overcomers of Canaan(The Jews) also a no no.
It is the utilization of government to fit into God's bigger plan until He comes to take the throne of David from the one that presently occupies it over Israel.
God said Moses Led his People, but whose hand was mightier? The Sound of the Horns blew down the Walls of Jericho but was it really the Sound of the Horns? Will we Establish the Kingdom of God on this Earth or will he? Will he use the worldly system to bring about his coming, or will he come when everyone of his elect and bride has been spiritually ready? Utilization of the Government to fit into God's Plan? NO NO NO! Why would God uses a worldly government, that lies, deceives, beguiles like the serpent, compromises and water down his word, BIG NO NO. He does not need this Worldly system to fit his Plan.
I hope we do not despise that throne here on earth, even though the people occupying it are not the best examples?
Why would anyone of his Elect and Saints despise his Kingdom of Earth. In revelation we won't know any evil, we won't know darkness or sin, We will be worshiping him all day and night.
I want to just get back to the founding father's wishes
The Founding Fathers who were Masons? Who are your founding fathers? Masonic Anglo Saxons, or Abraham, Issac, and Israel(Jacob)?
the government that God established in the constitution
The Constitution is a declaration of MAN, NOT GOD.
are some of you going to fall for handing in your guns if a minister says that the government asked us to
No, because the Spirit of God will lead us. The Disciples and prophets were always AGAINST principalities and high POWERS, they were never part of it. The Theocracy in Israel is Different, I even heard a comparison of Bill Clinton to KING DAVID, LOL! Far far farcry
When I see the masses, including some Christians(?) about to hit a brick wall, I'm supposed to stand back and watch them kill themselves? To separate the worldly from the spiritual is Gnosticism.
This has nothing to do with why we should be involved in government. This world is done with, the god of this world is Satan, the ruler of this World is the wicked one. There will be a Time WHEN ANTI-CHRIST COMES, AND NOT ALL CHRISTIANS AND JEWS WILL BE ABLE TO FLEE, SOME WILL BE KILLED! Your VOTE does not Count, but your Love and Faith in Christ does. God Bless HaShem Y'shua HaMashiach

 

[preciousmessage]

(Unorthodox Christian;23904)
True, but unlike Israel the state of Apostasy will endure til the Coming of Christ, the Apostasy of Israel will not endure til he comes but by his Grace will remove the veil of Apostasy and his People will know his Son is the Moshiach(Messiah from the Blood line of David) and that not only is the Moshiach Yeshua HaMashiach but God! America is Fallen like the Great Babylon. America is trying to compromise the Word of God which is a big no no. They are trying to create a land where foreigners can dwell with the Overcomers of Canaan(The Jews) also a no no. God said Moses Led his People, but whose hand was mightier? The Sound of the Horns blew down the Walls of Jericho but was it really the Sound of the Horns? Will we Establish the Kingdom of God on this Earth or will he? Will he use the worldly system to bring about his coming, or will he come when everyone of his elect and bride has been spiritually ready? Utilization of the Government to fit into God's Plan? NO NO NO! Why would God uses a worldly government, that lies, deceives, beguiles like the serpent, compromises and water down his word, BIG NO NO. He does not need this Worldly system to fit his Plan.Why would anyone of his Elect and Saints despise his Kingdom of Earth. In revelation we won't know any evil, we won't know darkness or sin, We will be worshiping him all day and night.The Founding Fathers who were Masons? Who are your founding fathers? Masonic Anglo Saxons, or Abraham, Issac, and Israel(Jacob)?The Constitution is a declaration of MAN, NOT GOD. No, because the Spirit of God will lead us. The Disciples and prophets were always AGAINST principalities and high POWERS, they were never part of it. The Theocracy in Israel is Different, I even heard a comparison of Bill Clinton to KING DAVID, LOL! Far far farcryThis has nothing to do with why we should be involved in government. This world is done with, the god of this world is Satan, the ruler of this World is the wicked one. There will be a Time WHEN ANTI-CHRIST COMES, AND NOT ALL CHRISTIANS AND JEWS WILL BE ABLE TO FLEE, SOME WILL BE KILLED! Your VOTE does not Count, but your Love and Faith in Christ does. God Bless HaShem Y'shua HaMashiach
Thanks for the input, interesting ideals indeed. Some more thought on the subject: “He saved others.” The Jews acknowledged this, yet they crucified him. He whose only offense was that “he went about doing good,” was hanged as a malefactor, and He lifted no hand in self-defense, nor uttered a word of reproach against His persecutors. “He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth; he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he opened not his mouth.” Isa. 53:7. He saved others, and even while hanging on the cross, “a reproach of men, and despised of the people,” he showed his power to save, in the case of the penitent thief; but himself he could not save.Jake

 

[tim_from_pa]

("preciousmessage")
With all do respect, was Jesus Christ "wussy" when He laid down his life, rather than fight with the sword? May we too have the "mind of Christ." To mix the worldly with the spiritual is heathenism.
Jesus said:
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
and again Jesus said:
But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.
There's times for that. Again, Christ does expects us to be active in this world to show the world the proper way. ("preciousmessage")
The government's wishes of bloodshed and political wire-working may not be God's wishes, we need only to look back at Israel's dreadful history, eventually leading them to murder the Son of God.
That was only the Jews. Many of the Israelites accepted the gospel, and in turn became Christian nations. This will not bring the Kingdom of God onto the earth, but is meant to be a precursor of light to the fallen world, as God sowed Israelites to become Gentiles and witness to the fallen world. Most missionary societies came from the United States and Britain, which are God's chosen people. The Jew does not have the birthright in other words. The crooked politics IMO are the Canaanites infesting the land---- but that is not excuse to give up until the Son of God returns. Again, if we see corruption going on in government, we are to turn face "because it is of the world"?Back to Ron Paul---- he is more true to life of the founding fathers thinking and the constitution that was set up. As for the constitution---
For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
And again, what about the United states?
He (Manasseh) shall become a people, and he also shall be great
So if the bible prophesies the United States, and it is in God's plan for this age, am I supposed to turn my back and despise scripture by saying "it's all worldly"? This is the promised land given to his people Israel in this age.I think the serious error comes when the physical realm is separated from the spiritual realm as if the physical is evil. No it is not. What is really happening is that Satan enters into the picture and has his contorted system enter into this world because most people are worldly. The coming Kingdom of God is an actual, literal Kingdom here on this earth where government aligns with the spiritual because it is governed by God. IN the meantime, those who have the truth ought to make a difference in this world and not bury their heads in the sand as if it makes no difference.I am NOT aligning present government, with all its corruptions, and somehow claiming it is spiritual. I agree 100% that this is a worldly system. I am advocating the influence of those who know the truth to emulate in this world the things of heaven, especially when God gave us this land over here by His grace. And I'm trying to get people to see things from a Godly perspective.

 

[Unorthodox Christian]

Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
A Sword is symbolic of the Word of God, He came to bring the Word of God whether there was peace or turmoil.
But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.
Armor of God in the Book of Ephesians
Most missionary societies came from the United States and Britain, which are God's chosen people.
So you're saying the Anglo Saxons are the Chose People of God? The Missionaries are of America and Britain? WOW, never mind. To call oneself a Jew is an abomination. These Anglo Saxon Jewish Proselytes are doing a disservice to God's People when they do this. God's Chosen people ARE HIS SAINTS, HIS ELECT AND BRIDE, AND THE TRUE JEWS!
The Jew does not have the birthright in other words
SMH, In the book of Jeremiah God gave Israel a Bill of Divorce, but that did not mean that one day Israel would come back to him and reconcile. There is always space for reconciliation. Although not apparent today, Israel will recompense God for the time they left him for the World. Jews have the Birthright From Issac on down to today. Blasphemy how you say so.
Back to Ron Paul---- he is more true to life of the founding fathers thinking and the constitution that was set up. As for the constitution-
Again here you go about with your founding fathers, WHO, by a small fraction, WERE MASONS were able to have a hand in the WRITING OF THE CONSTITUTION!
So if the bible prophesies the United States, and it is in God's plan for this age, am I supposed to turn my back and despise scripture by saying "it's all worldly"? This is the promised land given to his people Israel in this age.
THIS IS NOT THE PROMISED LAND! I'M TIRED OF THESE ANGLO SAXON JEWISH BELIEVERS, WHO THINK THEY ARE AN EXTENSION OF GOD'S PROMISED LAND. THERE IS ONE PROMISED LAND AND THAT IS CANAAN'S LAND! Israel! ALL NATIONS WILL go battle in Megido. All nations will turn against Israel, even the US.
I think the serious error comes when the physical realm is separated from the spiritual realm as if the physical is evil. No it is not. What is really happening is that Satan enters into the picture and has his contorted system enter into this world because most people are worldly.
Y'shua HaMashiach Said this would happen and that it should not worry or concern us, Just be about his Word and that should be good enough. What is his Word? His Will, His Power and his Purpose for his People. AMEN!
The coming Kingdom of God is an actual, literal Kingdom here on this earth where government aligns with the spiritual because it is governed by God.
The Only Kingdom that will be established is the one that Will come When Christ Comes Again. I will not compromise God's word or say what he thinks, but for a fact, This world is at it's end, this world is not his kingdom, Jesus Told pilate his Kingdom is not of THIS WORLD.
IN the meantime, those who have the truth ought to make a difference in this world and not bury their heads in the sand as if it makes no difference.
That Difference WOULD BE SPREADING THE GOSPEL OF SALVATION TO THOSE IN NEED OF IT. WHICH IS EVERY CORNER OF THE EARTH. WHETHER IT BE REJECTED OR NOT, THAT IS THE DIFFERENCE THAT WE WILL MAKE.
I am NOT aligning present government, with all its corruptions, and somehow claiming it is spiritual. I agree 100% that this is a worldly system. I am advocating the influence of those who know the truth to emulate in this world the things of heaven, especially when God gave us this land over here by His grace. And I'm trying to get people to see things from a Godly perspective.
Brother i LOVE you in the Name of JESUS CHRIST, but I will not argue, rather Rebuke! This whole paragraph contradicts what you initially posted and what you initially stood for. I'm sorry If I'm harsh, Christ Was Harsh. Away with the Worldly systems, and I have a testimony. I told God while I was walking this morning, how can someone enjoy this life in a world you told us not to Care for. Then a Lady whom I prayed for couple months back said, You prayed for me and I had hope if Jesus Christ and he gave me a car. The difference wasn't the Car, The difference was the Hope God gave her through Prayer and Faith. SPREAD THE WORD and that will be the difference maker.AMEN?! AMEN!!!

 

[preciousmessage]

(tim_from_pa;23913)
Jesus said:and again Jesus said:There's times for that. Again, Christ does expects us to be active in this world to show the world the proper way. That was only the Jews. Many of the Israelites accepted the gospel, and in turn became Christian nations. This will not bring the Kingdom of God onto the earth, but is meant to be a precursor of light to the fallen world, as God sowed Israelites to become Gentiles and witness to the fallen world. Most missionary societies came from the United States and Britain, which are God's chosen people. The Jew does not have the birthright in other words. The crooked politics IMO are the Canaanites infesting the land---- but that is not excuse to give up until the Son of God returns. Again, if we see corruption going on in government, we are to turn face "because it is of the world"?Back to Ron Paul---- he is more true to life of the founding fathers thinking and the constitution that was set up. As for the constitution---And again, what about the United states?So if the bible prophesies the United States, and it is in God's plan for this age, am I supposed to turn my back and despise scripture by saying "it's all worldly"? This is the promised land given to his people Israel in this age.I think the serious error comes when the physical realm is separated from the spiritual realm as if the physical is evil. No it is not. What is really happening is that Satan enters into the picture and has his contorted system enter into this world because most people are worldly. The coming Kingdom of God is an actual, literal Kingdom here on this earth where government aligns with the spiritual because it is governed by God. IN the meantime, those who have the truth ought to make a difference in this world and not bury their heads in the sand as if it makes no difference.I am NOT aligning present government, with all its corruptions, and somehow claiming it is spiritual. I agree 100% that this is a worldly system. I am advocating the influence of those who know the truth to emulate in this world the things of heaven, especially when God gave us this land over here by His grace. And I'm trying to get people to see things from a Godly perspective.
Firstly, let's deal with the idea that the Jews and Israelites are two distinct groups of people. This has certainly picked up ground amongst many. There is no need of any controversy or speculation over this concept. Let us examine the scripture. In Rom. 3: 1, 2 it states, “What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? Much every way: chiefly that unto them were committed the oracles of God.” Here we learn that the law was given to the Jews. But we read in Ex. 19:1, 2 that it was the children of Israel that camped before the mount in the third month after their departure from Egypt; and in Mal. 4:4 it states, “Remember ye the law of Moses My servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel.” And again in 2 Cor. 3:13, 14, Moses put a veil upon his face when he came down from the mount, on account of the blindness of the minds of the children of Israel, which blindness remains to this day. In the case of the giving of the law, therefore, we see that the terms “Jews” and “children of Israel” are used interchangeably.Again, when the Apostle Paul had been seized by the Roman soldiers, and was about to be scourged, he said in reply to the centurion’s question as to who he was, “I am a man which am a Jew of Tarsus.” Acts 21:39. He also said that he and Peter were “Jews by nature,” as distinguished from Gentiles. Gal. 2:15. And yet he said, “I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.” Rom. 11:1. The Jew and the Israelite are one and the same person. Jake

 

[tim_from_pa]

I'm "British-Israelite" in my theology, because none of the other mainline theology just advocated answers everything in the bible, so I have absolutely nothing in common with it, and can understand why the talking past each other when one says apples and the other oranges. These nations are the lost tribes of Israel as several people on this forum also believe.OK---- are there any others out there that want to stay on the topic of the thread in spite of the previous two posts? Anyone want to say something about Ron Paul and down-to-earth things without going into spiritual utopianism and preachiness?

 

[preciousmessage]

(tim_from_pa;23913)
That was only the Jews. Many of the Israelites accepted the gospel, and in turn became Christian nations.
Hi Tim,I have not been on forums very long, perhaps you can share with me how to use the multi-quote concept as you have, I've tried but have no clue! Do I hit the multi-quote button and then the quote button? Can you give me some simple steps of instruction please? I can only give you what I believe the Lord has revealed to me, as you believe you are sharing what the Lord has revealed to you. Thanks for your kindly spirit and may we come into the unity of faith. I do agree with you the little I have heard of Ron Paul. He does seem to have some principles that lean towards being a "peacemaker" than most. Perhaps his Doctor background, to preserve life, not to take it.As George Washington stated: "In the execution of such a plan nothing is more essential than that permanent, inveterate antipathies against particular nations and passionate attachments for others should be excluded, and that in place of them just and amicable feelings toward all should be cultivated. The nation which indulges toward another an habitual hatred or an habitual fondness is in some degree a slave. It is a slave to its animosity or to its affection, either of which is sufficient to lead it astray from its duty and its interest. Antipathy in one nation against another disposes each more readily to offer insult and injury, to lay hold of slight causes of umbrage, and to be haughty and intractable when accidental or trifling occasions of dispute occur." End QuoteAs far as your statement "Christian nations." :In the Bible the "nations" are the heathen, if you will. The Hebrew word which is often rendered "nations" is the identical word from which the word "heathen" always comes. "For all the gods of the nations are idols; but the Lord made the heavens." Ps. 96:5. In Ps. 2:1 it states "Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing?" The Revision has it, "Why do the nations rage, and the people imagine a vain thing?" A "Christian nation" is in contradiction of the term "Christian heathen." There may be Christians among the nations or heathen. The government can "only" make "civil" law, not moral. There are no moral laws set forth by the government. A Christian nation would follow the precepts of Christ. Jake

 

[preciousmessage]

(tim_from_pa;23939)
I'm "British-Israelite" in my theology, because none of the other mainline theology just advocated answers everything in the bible, so I have absolutely nothing in common with it, and can understand why the talking past each other when one says apples and the other oranges. These nations are the lost tribes of Israel as several people on this forum also believe.OK---- are there any others out there that want to stay on the topic of the thread in spite of the previous two posts? Anyone want to say something about Ron Paul and down-to-earth things without going into spiritual utopianism and preachiness?
To preach actually means to teach. Sorry my method of communicating does not line up with your method. Christ Jesus "taught" the people. I like to expound on the scripture as I share them. Is this offensive to you in some manner? Do you think that is my purpose? How do you teach? And if you want to throw "quips" at me, so be it. I love to talk of heavenly things, is that not the purpose of this forum? "He who comes from above is above all; he who is of the earth is earthly and speaks of the earth. He who comes from heaven is above all." John 3:31. This is who I am: "For if anyone thinks himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself." Perhaps America and England are for the most part, the "white Christian nations" and places like India and Pakistan are the heathen nations. God is not a respecter of persons. I will leave you alone now. Forgive me for whatever it is that I did to you. Jake

 

[preciousmessage]

(tim_from_pa;23939)
I'm "British-Israelite" in my theology, because none of the other mainline theology just advocated answers everything in the bible, so I have absolutely nothing in common with it, and can understand why the talking past each other when one says apples and the other oranges. These nations are the lost tribes of Israel as several people on this forum also believe.OK---- are there any others out there that want to stay on the topic of the thread in spite of the previous two posts? Anyone want to say something about Ron Paul and down-to-earth things without going into spiritual utopianism and preachiness?
I'm an Israelite also, literal and spiritual Israel are not opposed to one another. Spiritual is opposed to carnal, not literal. ...The word of God is not divided against itself in His repeated words to do “violence to no man” as there have been many scriptures with synonymous meaning. Quote:THINK not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man’s foes shall be they of his own household. Matt. 10:34-36.NOTWITHSTANDING the above statement, it is true that the gospel of Jesus Christ is a “gospel of peace;” and this loving exhortation should be most carefully heeded: “But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes. And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, in meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth.” 2 Tim. 2:23-25.AND this: “But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.” “Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you.” Matt. 5:39, 44.THEN how can there be strife and a sword, as the Saviour said, if these injunctions are followed? They exist just because these injunctions are followed. He does not say that it will be the Christian man who will be at variance with his father. This could not be, for variance is one of the things the possession of which will shut a man out of Heaven. Gal. 5:19-21. But men are naturally prone to evil; and they resent anything which condemns their course. So the sinful son will be at variance with his pious father; the father himself will be at peace with all men. “And a man’s foes shall be they of his own household.” The man will not be a foe to those of his own household, but they will be his foes because of his goodness, just as Stephen was stoned because he was a Christian; just as Daniel was cast into the den of lions, because he prayed to God; just as “all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution,” because “evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse.” … The opposition which the disciples met in their work did not surprise them, for the Master had told them that such would be the case. He said: “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.” And gospel messengers found that it was even so. Wherever they went the wrath of Satan was stirred up against them; and it was only too often manifested through civil rulers. End QuoteJake

 

[tim_from_pa]

Hi Tim,I have not been on forums very long, perhaps you can share with me how to use the multi-quote concept as you have, I've tried but have no clue! Do I hit the multi-quote button and then the quote button? Can you give me some simple steps of instruction please?
Sure. All I do is hit that quote icon (second from the right) at the top. Then I copy and paste a person's quote, a bible verse, or whatever within the quote brackets that it brought up.If I want to add a name to the quotes, then after the first bracketed quote just add ="name" whatever the name is. For example I may add:QUOTE="tim_from_pa" and enclose those in brackets (I can't do that or else it will actually make a quote box.Hope that helps.

 

[preciousmessage]

(tim_from_pa;23970)
Sure. All I do is hit that quote icon (second from the right) at the top. Then I copy and paste a person's quote, a bible verse, or whatever within the quote brackets that it brought up.If I want to add a name to the quotes, then after the first bracketed quote just add ="name" whatever the name is. For example I may add:QUOTE="tim_from_pa" and enclose those in brackets (I can't do that or else it will actually make a quote box.Hope that helps.
Much appreciated, will give it a try very soon. Jake