Christ Today is still the Creator of Souls and Flesh of Man

[robert derrick]

Normally this would not need be taught, but countering foolish doctrine many times leads to reducing the argument to the basics: Reductum Absurdum.

Which is not bad in itself, since it clears the air to return to a refresher course in the first principles of the doctrine of Christ:

But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

And so, in response to the teaching that babes are made and born with sin of the devil, so that they are created children of Satan from the womb:

All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

All babes today are still created by Christ for the good pleasure of God, as Adam and Eve were yesterday, and are lightened by His Light from the womb for that very purpose.

Christ is still the Creator, and He is not creating any creature today, whether spiritual or natural, with sin, for sin, by sin, nor to sin against God.

Babes of men and women today are not automatically spit out sons of Satan and enemies of God, with inborn lust to love evil and hate the good.

And I am more than glad for the first time to debunk a devilish doctrine, because by learning to do so, I now have the greatest pleasure when seeing babes, and knowing without doubt, that these are precious rewards and heritage of the Lord, and not little sinners just waiting to act like demons: They are pure in heart, conscience, and life, and have never sinned against God nor man.

They are the pure creation of Christ on earth in natural flesh, and only being born again as newborn babes, can any person on earth be like them.

When I see them, I now truly know I see purity and love of Christ in the flesh on earth.

All newborn babes on earth are His flesh and His bones, whether from the womb, or from salvation, and both are from the Spirit.

I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.

I was cast upon thee from the womb: thou art my God from my mother's belly.

But thou art he that took me out of the womb: thou didst make me hope when I was upon my mother's breasts.

Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings,

As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby: If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious.

 

[robert derrick]

The reference to automatic production of babes on earth, is from the teaching that Adam began making his own seed with sin, so that now there is a natural selection process for sin in all flesh of man, that Christ has nothing to do with, nor can do anything about: it's out of His hands.

Which of course means He is not the Creator and Maker of all things today, as He was yesterday:

Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

But what it also preaches, is unbelief in Christ as the all-powerful and Almighty Creator.

Christ yesterday and today creates and makes every single living creature on earth one at a time, even as He did in the beginning, and He is not limited by time nor numbers nor space to do so:

Are not five sparrows sold for two farthings, and not one of them is forgotten before God? But even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: ye are of more value than many sparrows.

And so Jesus confirms, that much more than sparrows or blades of grass, does He create every single living soul and flesh of the womb specifically, completely, equally, and cleanly on earth today: And it is still good.

Christ did not begin a 'process' of creation in the beginning, that just 'goes on' mindlessly without Him at any given time on earth.

Sin-filled natural selection christian theology is false.

Any and everything created today is created and made by Christ today, especially souls and babes of men and women in His own image and lightened by Him to be conformed to His image in the flesh.

For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

This is first true from the womb, and again true from salvation, and both are by His Spirit.

 

[Lizbeth]

Each soul is born innocent, until we all sin for the first time, even as very young children and toddlers. We follow the same pattern as Adam and Eve. Created innocent until they fell into disobeying God.

 

[Webers_Home]

.

All babes today are still created by Christ for the good pleasure of God

• Gen 2:1-2 . .The heaven and the earth were finished, and all their array.
On the seventh day God finished the work that He had been doing, and He
ceased on the seventh day from all the work that He had done. And God
blessed the seventh day and declared it holy, because on it God ceased from
all the work of creation that He had done.

An important thing to note is that God is still on sabbatical, viz: the other six
days were bounded by an evening and a morning whereas the seventh isn't
bounded; indicating that it hasn't ended, i.e. God has yet to pick up where
He left off and begin adding to the current grand scheme of things.

Human life was blessed with the ability to reproduce itself (Gen 1:28a) and
so was aqua life and winged life (Gen 1:21-22). Those forms of life don't
need God on hand to micromanage their conceptions because those
conceptions don't produce anything new; they merely perpetuate life that
already exists.

For example: Heb 7:4-10 tells how Levi existed in Abraham's body before
the man was born; which tells me that Levi's creation took place prior to the
day of his conception.

Another example is Psalm 139:15 which says:

"My frame was not hidden from Thee, when I was made in secret, and
skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth."

Some folks insist that Psalm speaks of a woman's womb; but I think it best,
and far more sensible, to interpret it as relating to the author's creation
rather than his conception because everyone is made, and has been made,
from the earth; i.e. from dirt.

In other words; when God created Adam per Gen 2:7, He created Adam's
entire posterity all at the same time; including Eve because she was taken
from Adam's body; which makes Adam's dirt her dirt too. (Gen 2:21-23)

"From one man, He made every nation of men" (Acts 17:26)
_

 

[Wrangler]

Christ is still the Creator

If this were true, Scripture would not say he is the firstborn of all Creation.

 

[Lizbeth]

Many scriptures testify that God is still working/creating today. Even Jesus was working the works of He who sent Him. But there's a mystery in that God exists outside the realm of time where there is no past, present, future...from His perspective it's as though everything is already done and dusted, as the saying goes.

Psa 102:18

This shall be written for the generation to come: and the people which shall be created shall praise the LORD.

Psa 104:29-31

Thou hidest thy face, they are troubled: thou takest away their breath, they die, and return to their dust.

Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth.

The glory of the LORD shall endure for ever: the LORD shall rejoice in his works.


Isa 41:17-20

When the poor and needy seek water, and there is none, and their tongue faileth for thirst, I the LORD will hear them, I the God of Israel will not forsake them.

I will open rivers in high places, and fountains in the midst of the valleys: I will make the wilderness a pool of water, and the dry land springs of water.

I will plant in the wilderness the cedar, the shittah tree, and the myrtle, and the oil tree; I will set in the desert the fir tree, and the pine, and the box tree together:

That they may see, and know, and consider, and understand together, that the hand of the LORD hath done this, and the Holy One of Israel hath created it.


Isa 43:1

But now thus saith the LORD that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.

Isa 43:7

Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.

Isa 45:8

Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.


Isa 48:7

They are created now, and not from the beginning; even before the day when thou heardest them not; lest thou shouldest say, Behold, I knew them.


Jer 31:22

How long wilt thou go about, O thou backsliding daughter? for the LORD hath created a new thing in the earth, A woman shall compass a man.

Eze 21:30

Shall I cause it to return into his sheath? I will judge thee in the place where thou wast created, in the land of thy nativity.

 

[robert derrick]

.
Human life was blessed with the ability to reproduce itself (Gen 1:28a) and
so was aqua life and winged life (Gen 1:21-22). Those forms of life don't
need God on hand to micromanage their conceptions because those
conceptions don't produce anything new; they merely perpetuate life that
already exists.

I can be persuaded by your basic argument, and it may explain a curiosity about Gen 1:27, where it seems God created all male and female men and women at once, even as all other living things on earth in the beginning. With other living things, we envision God creating them all over the earth, but only man is first created in a pair.

However, you may be right that all men and women were created at once, and then brought forth by Christ one at a time, whether from the dust itself, or Adam's bone, or from the womb thereafter, including Jesus.

But thou art he that took me out of the womb: thou didst make me hope when I was upon my mother's breasts.

The result is the same, the creation of all men and women, as all other life on earth, is still good and not affected by the first man and woman sinned.

.

For example: Heb 7:4-10 tells how Levi existed in Abraham's body before
the man was born; which tells me that Levi's creation took place prior to the
day of his conception._

True, and Jesus was made from the seed of David, and all children of Israel are of the stock of Abraham.

However, this applies to the flesh only: Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh.

Not to the souls, which are all equally created by Christ one at a time.

A person can enter into the world blessed or cursed by the conditions of the birth, but the souls are all equally in the beginning, and it is the soul that matters most, not the body:

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

The power of sin, which is death, is only over the soul that is now sinning. That death only passes upon any soul by sinning, not by birth from the womb.

No babes are born dead from the womb, nor is the devil become their father by tempting Adam and Even to sin.

.
"My frame was not hidden from Thee, when I was made in secret, and
skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth."

Whether this is at the same time of conception in the womb, or from the time of the beginning, which makes enough sense from Gen 1:27, the truth is that Christ is the Maker of all souls equally good and clean at our creation, not the devil after Adam sinned.

The devil can only tempt us to sin, and if we do so in this life, we make ourselves unclean and evil, contrary to our creation by Christ.

.
In other words; when God created Adam per Gen 2:7, He created Adam's
entire posterity all at the same time; including Eve because she was taken
from Adam's body; which makes Adam's dirt her dirt too. (Gen 2:21-23)_

And that posterity of Adam is still created the same as Adam and Eve: good, not evil with sin 'in their flesh'.

However, it is still Christ that personally covers them in the womb at conception, and brings them forth at birth.

.
"From one man, He made every nation of men" (Acts 17:26)

And this is a good proof, that God has made all men from one man, not the devil with sin in them.

Christ makes nothing with sin, for sin, by sin, not to sin, but only good to please God, yesterday and today.

 

[robert derrick]

If this were true, Scripture would not say he is the firstborn of all Creation.

Being Creator and being firstborn of all creation does not conflict with Christ, for all things are possible with God.

 

[robert derrick]

Many scriptures testify that God is still working/creating today. Even Jesus was working the works of He who sent Him. But there's a mystery in that God exists outside the realm of time where there is no past, present, future...from His perspective it's as though everything is already done and dusted, as the saying goes.

Psa 102:18

This shall be written for the generation to come: and the people which shall be created shall praise the LORD.

Psa 104:29-31

Thou hidest thy face, they are troubled: thou takest away their breath, they die, and return to their dust.

Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth.

The glory of the LORD shall endure for ever: the LORD shall rejoice in his works.


Isa 41:17-20

When the poor and needy seek water, and there is none, and their tongue faileth for thirst, I the LORD will hear them, I the God of Israel will not forsake them.

I will open rivers in high places, and fountains in the midst of the valleys: I will make the wilderness a pool of water, and the dry land springs of water.

I will plant in the wilderness the cedar, the shittah tree, and the myrtle, and the oil tree; I will set in the desert the fir tree, and the pine, and the box tree together:

That they may see, and know, and consider, and understand together, that the hand of the LORD hath done this, and the Holy One of Israel hath created it.


Isa 43:1

But now thus saith the LORD that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.

Isa 43:7

Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.

Isa 45:8

Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.


Isa 48:7

They are created now, and not from the beginning; even before the day when thou heardest them not; lest thou shouldest say, Behold, I knew them.


Jer 31:22

How long wilt thou go about, O thou backsliding daughter? for the LORD hath created a new thing in the earth, A woman shall compass a man.

Eze 21:30

Shall I cause it to return into his sheath? I will judge thee in the place where thou wast created, in the land of thy nativity.

Excellent point: Plainly Christ has created and is now creating and shall create in future, and all for His good pleasure:

Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

And Christ creates nothing sinful and unclean of itself, but only good.

He gives angels and men power to choose otherwise. And He has also come in our same flesh Himself, to give us faith to be recreated in His image, as at the first by Him.

Every newborn babe is created by Christ good to please God, both from the womb or from His salvation.

And so Christ is all in all.

 

[Wrangler]

Being Creator and being firstborn of all creation does not conflict with Christ

Yes, it conflicts as it is a contradiction.

To say all things are possible with God does not include him violating his own 1C and speaking truth.

That limits God, you say in outrage? His own nature limits him. Yes, he is all-powerful but that power is tempered by his love, mercy, grace and holiness.

 

[Robert Gwin]

I can be persuaded by your basic argument, and it may explain a curiosity about Gen 1:27, where it seems God created all male and female men and women at once, even as all other living things on earth in the beginning. With other living things, we envision God creating them all over the earth, but only man is first created in a pair.

However, you may be right that all men and women were created at once, and then brought forth by Christ one at a time, whether from the dust itself, or Adam's bone, or from the womb thereafter, including Jesus.

But thou art he that took me out of the womb: thou didst make me hope when I was upon my mother's breasts.

The result is the same, the creation of all men and women, as all other life on earth, is still good and not affected by the first man and woman sinned.



True, and Jesus was made from the seed of David, and all children of Israel are of the stock of Abraham.

However, this applies to the flesh only: Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh.

Not to the souls, which are all equally created by Christ one at a time.

A person can enter into the world blessed or cursed by the conditions of the birth, but the souls are all equally in the beginning, and it is the soul that matters most, not the body:

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

The power of sin, which is death, is only over the soul that is now sinning. That death only passes upon any soul by sinning, not by birth from the womb.

No babes are born dead from the womb, nor is the devil become their father by tempting Adam and Even to sin.



Whether this is at the same time of conception in the womb, or from the time of the beginning, which makes enough sense from Gen 1:27, the truth is that Christ is the Maker of all souls equally good and clean at our creation, not the devil after Adam sinned.

The devil can only tempt us to sin, and if we do so in this life, we make ourselves unclean and evil, contrary to our creation by Christ.



And that posterity of Adam is still created the same as Adam and Eve: good, not evil with sin 'in their flesh'.

However, it is still Christ that personally covers them in the womb at conception, and brings them forth at birth.



And this is a good proof, that God has made all men from one man, not the devil with sin in them.

Christ makes nothing with sin, for sin, by sin, not to sin, but only good to please God, yesterday and today.

The anointer is the creator, not the anointed sir

 

[robert derrick]

Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.

The creation of man by Christ is comparable to marriage:

He first shapes the body of flesh with loving care, and then he wonderfully creates the soul in the lowest parts of the earth's wedding bed, and then He gently wraps the new babe in the swaddling clothes of the womb of a woman.

And then He kisses the babe with the light of life:

All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

Christ breathes His Spirit of life into every soul He creates in the womb, and when Jesus Christ the promised seed, is recieved into our hearts, we are created again as newborn babes in marriage to the Lamb of God:

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

As babes in the womb He first kissed us, but as newborn babes in the bosom of the Father, we kiss Him back:

We love him, because he first loved us.

When we kiss Him with a whole heart, we have His life and Light within us and become as one flesh and bones with Him:

For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

 

[robert derrick]

Or, I suppose a better teaching would be all children of men are born sons of Satan to sin from cradle to grave.