ECT -> EVERY Logical Fallacy

[St. SteVen]

To give eternal punishment for those who rejected the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin. Its original intent was for the devil and his angels, but expanded when man fell.

What about those who have never heard of the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin?

Salvation is a free gift, but if you refuse it, you will be incinerated? Sounds more like spiritual extortion to me.

 

[Illuminator]

That's a gross over-reaction.

Then why did you bring up the off topic "love your enemies"? As if we didn't know?

Should I not bother you again?
Not a very welcoming response. I come in peace. - LOL

If you "come in peace", you wouldn't make stupid claims about an "obvious contradiction" that isn't obvious to anyone who can read. Not a very welcoming post.

 

[Illuminator]

What about those who have never heard of the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin?

Salvation is a free gift, but if you refuse it, you will be incinerated? Sounds more like spiritual extortion to me.

"spiritual extortion" is a logical fallacy. Nobody is extorted into rejecting God's love and forgiveness. God sends no one to hell, people send themselves. Since you reject the plain teachings of Jesus on hell, it wouldn't surprise me if you are anti-trinitarian, anti-Protestant, as well.

 

[St. SteVen]

Then why did you bring up the off topic "love your enemies"? As if we didn't know?

If you "come in peace", you wouldn't make stupid claims about an "obvious contradiction" that isn't obvious to anyone who can read. Not a very welcoming post.

I apologize. We seem to have gotten off to a bad start. Will you forgive me?

 

[St. SteVen]

Since you reject the plain teachings of Jesus on hell, it wouldn't surprise me if you are anti-trinitarian as well.

That was a cheap shot.
It's way too soon for tooth and claw.

"spiritual extortion" is a logical fallacy. Nobody is extorted into rejecting God's love and forgiveness. God sends no one to hell, people send themselves

More like a church reality.

If there was no afterlife, would you follow Christ?

 

[Illuminator]

I apologize. We seem to have gotten off to a bad start. Will you forgive me?

YES!

That was a cheap shot.
It's way too soon for tooth and claw.


More like a church reality.

Not my church. I can usually spot an anti-trinitarian heretic by their rebellious nature. "Protestants and Catholics are wrong except ME" attitude.

If there was no afterlife, would you follow Christ?

Please, don't bait me with a false scenario.

 

[St. SteVen]

"spiritual extortion" is a logical fallacy. ...

I forgot to ask you how you arrived at this conclusion. Pray tell. Thanks.

 

[St. SteVen]

Not my church.

Really?
What happens in the afterlife to someone you excommunicate?

Do parishioners live with that fear? (extortion)

 

[St. SteVen]

Please, don't bait me with a false scenario.

So... you make the rules because you have seniority, or what?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

What about those who have never heard of the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin?

Salvation is a free gift, but if you refuse it, you will be incinerated? Sounds more like spiritual extortion to me.

Well I will tell you what jesus said:

John 3:3

King James Version

​

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

If you believe Jesus and His Words, you can answer your question yourself.

 

[St. SteVen]

Well I will tell you what jesus said:

Apparently you don't know what he said. But thanks for half-trying.

What are you claiming about those who have never heard of the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin?
Eternal damnation?

John 3:3​

​

King James Version​

​

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

If you believe Jesus and His Words, you can answer your question yourself.

Was that necessary? We have a difference of opinion. That comment was completely uncalled for.
You are questioning whether I "believe Jesus and His Words". Boo!

And you are STILL unable to answer my question. Why?

Try again.

St. SteVen said:
What about those who have never heard of the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Apparently you don't know what he said. But thanks for half-trying.

What are you claiming about those who have never heard of the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin?
Eternal damnation?




Was that necessary? We have a difference of opinion. That comment was completely uncalled for.
You are questioning whether I "believe Jesus and His Words". Boo!

And you are STILL unable to answer my question. Why?

Try again.

St. SteVen said:
What about those who have never heard of the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin?

Well it is Jesus word we are debating and yes it wwas called for! Our authority derives from teh Word of God alone in spiritual matters.

But to make it more simple for you:

1. If one is not born again they will not see the kingdom of God.
2. If one does not accept Jesus they are condemned already
3. If one does not believe in Jesus (not just about Jesus) the wrath of God already abides on them.

As for people who have never heard the gospel?

Teh bible makes it clear.

1. there is none righteous
2. All have sinned and fallen short.
3 We are by nature, objects of wrath!
4. Only Jesus i s the way for salvation and in order to obtains that salvation:

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

If one does not confess and place their trust in Jesus- they are not saved- no matter who they are, where they are and how few or many times they heard the gospel.

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

What about those who have never heard of the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin?

Salvation is a free gift, but if you refuse it, you will be incinerated? Sounds more like spiritual extortion to me.

The day will come when the people who have never been given their chance at salvation will be resurrected and given that opportunity. It only seems like spiritual extortion to you because you're looking at it from an entirely shortsighted perspective of a human being. God will simply put them out of their misery instead of allowing them to suffer the consequences of their sins for eternity.

While God wants people to accept salvation, He is also not going to allow the people who refuse that offer to stick around, lay waste to the universe, and cause friction within the Family like Lucifer and the other rebel angels did before Adam was created. Anyone who wants eternal life had better get used to the concept of living by God's laws and His government.

Considering the fact that God wants to restore the entire universe back to its original condition, implement His government throughout Earth and the universe like the rebel angels were originally created to do, and spend eternity with His Family in this universe, anyone who is looking to sow disharmony, deceit, chaos, and willful disobedience to the rule of God cannot be allowed to exist. God's Family is going to be extremely active during the Millennium and beyond, and everything they do during that time requires the Family members to be able to follow God's instructions without question.

 

[St. SteVen]

The day will come when the people who have never been given their chance at salvation will be resurrected and given that opportunity. It only seems like spiritual extortion to you because you're looking at it from an entirely shortsighted perspective of a human being. God will simply put them out of their misery instead of allowing them to suffer the consequences of their sins for eternity.

Entirely shortsighted perspective?

So, the good news of the gospel looks like this then?
Receive the free gift of eternal life today. Or if you prefer, you will be incinerated.

How is that not spiritual extortion?

Am I misunderstanding something? Send help.