I honestly don't know what to make of this. It's just so bizarre to me, that...well, just take a look.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7kL4MSknq8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7kL4MSknq8
"Fight Church"? Wut?
- Thread starter River Jordan
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I am uncomfortable with this as well.
We're reaching a point where theology is undergoing a shift in certain sectors because of individualism. I am all for the theological point that God is active in our lives and can work through everything. However, we've taken the supernatural and applied it to everyday life. What this has done is drilled it down to a level where, in this case, "God wants me to win this fight."
This comes from the idea that God is active and involved in all. It's essentially derived from a Reformed view that God preordains everything.
While this isn't terrible theology - going down into the weeds of God preordaining things like MMA fights is a whole other affair from the doctrine of predestination. I find this as absurd as arguing that God ordained your bodily functions for the day or something similar. That's just not the point to be made. God did not design the universe around MMA fights.
What you end up with this level of theology is a place where the church becomes a glorified community center. It's effectively taking a hobby and building a church around it. It takes God and makes everything a cosmic battle. Just seems to be unhealthy at the end of the day because you have this culture being kinda skimmed with a superficial layer of theology. This is much more about this type of fighting than it's about God.
We're reaching a point where theology is undergoing a shift in certain sectors because of individualism. I am all for the theological point that God is active in our lives and can work through everything. However, we've taken the supernatural and applied it to everyday life. What this has done is drilled it down to a level where, in this case, "God wants me to win this fight."
This comes from the idea that God is active and involved in all. It's essentially derived from a Reformed view that God preordains everything.
While this isn't terrible theology - going down into the weeds of God preordaining things like MMA fights is a whole other affair from the doctrine of predestination. I find this as absurd as arguing that God ordained your bodily functions for the day or something similar. That's just not the point to be made. God did not design the universe around MMA fights.
What you end up with this level of theology is a place where the church becomes a glorified community center. It's effectively taking a hobby and building a church around it. It takes God and makes everything a cosmic battle. Just seems to be unhealthy at the end of the day because you have this culture being kinda skimmed with a superficial layer of theology. This is much more about this type of fighting than it's about God.
Exactly. To me this came across as exactly what you described...the hobby comes first and God is superficially slapped on afterwards.HammerStone said:
This is ... nuts
I suppose if a deacon got all stroppy with you during the week, you could always meat him on Sunday
Seriously, take this out of the Church building ... how is this in any way glorifying the Name of Jesus in a house where you worship ?
I suppose if a deacon got all stroppy with you during the week, you could always meat him on Sunday
Seriously, take this out of the Church building ... how is this in any way glorifying the Name of Jesus in a house where you worship ?
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
And I am somewhat conflicted in all of this. It's easier in this case to say "Houston we have a problem." Yet, what about coffee shops and such in churches? What's the point where it becomes more about the hobby than it does God?
It seems you and I agree this is clearly too much, but where is the line?
And heaven forbid this turns into another evolution thread, but I wonder how much this subculture mindset contributes to the state of our church? Going to church for Jesus and salvation is no longer enough. Church needs to babysit properly, offer something and cater to the right interests. I think we have the same symptoms in that certain beliefs must be held by the tribe - kind of like evolution and creationism. Whatever the major issue is, it seems as though liberal, conservative and in between all have those issues.
It's hard to say where the line is, but I think when you refer to your church by the hobby first, you've definitely crossed the line. So maybe having a coffee stand in the foyer isn't such a big deal, but when you refer to your church as "Coffee Church" and the coffee becomes the major focus....yeah, you've gone too far.HammerStone said:
From what I can tell from the movie (which is all any of us have to go on), it looks like a bunch of guys who are into MMA attend this church and they decided to start having amateur fights at the church. A little odd IMO, but not all that different than church-sponsored basketball games, which are hosted by churches all over the country. But somewhere along the line it seems to have gone from an side-event to the main focus. At least that's the impression given by the movie.
So I'm not so sure it's the hobby itself that's the problem, as much as it is how the hobby has become all-important.
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