Thanks for stating this as it’s started a chain of thought xxx
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quietthinker
Well-Known Member
An emotional connection is what he desires ....as a healthy parent with a child. Many of us have been emotionally damaged and to a large extent hamstrung but he knows. Learn of me Jesus says, I am meek and lowly of heart and you will find rest for your souls.
God does not threaten, exploit or manipulate, contrary to many theories around. He wants us in a place of safety and security always. To this end he encourages us so we can boldly be his witnesses.
Thanks @quietthinker , I don’t want to side track the study but your words are all being added to the mix within my reflection time today xx
You know I didn’t think what I shared was relevant to the study, but in many respects it could be.
Sometimes we have limited hearing, in so much as we hear things through filters. Those filters can impact how we hear from the Lord. Filters of other peoples judgments, others peoples opinions ( which can make us doubt what we are hearing ). Also the filters of role models , whether that be leaders in church, Husbands, other Christian’s in authority ( whether that be by age or position ) and parents.
A person with an abusive father, will perceive words spoken by God in a harsh way. Abuse on many levels can affect how we hear things. Our own emotions can pick things to pieces in our minds and what filters into the heart will be only part of what we have heard.
Maybe ‘ Hold every thought captive to the Lord ‘
Maybe ‘ renew the mind ‘
Many years ago a very wise lady said that we often play old messages , like rewinding a tape recording but we need to re record the truth over the old lies x
Sometimes we have limited hearing, in so much as we hear things through filters. Those filters can impact how we hear from the Lord. Filters of other peoples judgments, others peoples opinions ( which can make us doubt what we are hearing ). Also the filters of role models , whether that be leaders in church, Husbands, other Christian’s in authority ( whether that be by age or position ) and parents.
A person with an abusive father, will perceive words spoken by God in a harsh way. Abuse on many levels can affect how we hear things. Our own emotions can pick things to pieces in our minds and what filters into the heart will be only part of what we have heard.
Maybe ‘ Hold every thought captive to the Lord ‘
Maybe ‘ renew the mind ‘
Many years ago a very wise lady said that we often play old messages , like rewinding a tape recording but we need to re record the truth over the old lies x
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
'Learn of me' Jesus said. My question is, are you learning of him? Are those in teaching roles showing you Jesus? You will know by what you share with others....We share what we learn and love.
From my personal experience, this changes everything.
Paul has said, and for good reason, 'I am determined to know nothing except Jesus......' He was a man with a head full of theology yet he says, 'I count all things loss for the knowledge of knowing Jesus'.....and by that he didn't mean knowing about him like a person might know about the prime minister.
Yes it is relative to the study.
But working such a sensitive matter through is better on a private thread with folks you are comfortable with.
I can speak into this but prefer not to for this reason.
It’s okay @Carl Emerson I was talking generally in my last post - just making the general point about filters as a means to not hearing xx
The Christian bookshop in our town is call Isaiah 53
You still have a christian book shop, I miss the one that use to be here !!!
Rita, as a friend in Christ, I truly hope one day soon you can say you have placed your really deep personal concerns that bind you, into Jesus' hands. Your daughter may even see more smiles of a new Mum. I know you want to live a life that God desires, as also shown and expressed by your words on this thread. I see you have already reached to me and others with an open heart. And it is taken by me very seriously, and I pray for you Rita, because it means that much. Human life is so fragile that we all need our savior to lean on, including myself.
I believe we all have things in our lives that might haunt us, for years. I had a couple at least, and they eventually left me, all went into the arms of my saviour. When I began to take these few major issues seriously, I began praying about them for years. Especially about a martial situation that nearly cost both my wife and I our marriage. You know though, even before that time, many years ago, I always 'saw' felt or expressed openly that my trust is always placed in God, above anything on this planet, even my wife. When I said I gave my life to Christ and believed in God's words for my salvation I meant it. I've never really stray off that course even today. And today my walk seems much easier. It took me time and genuine effort to reach out to God, and he tested me many times and I thank him for it.
Remember Rita, you are not unique. I have a sister that you both could share and swap stories, of some of the real emotions and pain you and her endured, and most of them are about personal relationship issues, over many years. She also lived them all in England, further up north from you, in Nottingham. She now lives in the US.
She is a survivor, and I believe loves the Lord, although she does not share these experiences with me that much.
//
So, for the cause of this Bible Study discussion, an example of a recent spontaneous call from God, laid on my heart...to pray for a community neighbor...I did not have time to reason or question, I just did it Rita....
The other day as I was on my usual morning walk, I began to pass a house and I knew who lived there. It was impressed upon my heart at that very moment to pray for Jack as he may need surgery around his chest. I did indeed, and I was overwhelmed with joy and peace afterwards. I did not care why, I knew I was in the service of my saviour and God.
Later, another day, he, Jack, passed me by in his car and stopped to say hello. Jack told me he was going into surgery a week later. I prayed for his over the days, and then I texted him, thinking he was already out of his 6-7 hour surgery that day. He quickly texted me back and said he did not need surgery, as the surgeon called late the previous evening to say that the pills he was taking were effective and showing signs of regression in his cancer. He had a complex cancer that intertwined around below his thorax and into his rib cage. They were going to cut a couple of his bones to get to all the cancer. So he was very happy indeed. He was blessed. Halleluiah And how do you think I felt Rita to hear this great news. I could not stop raising my hands to heaven in thanksgiving.......I hope I get to do more for the Lord in the future...
I don’t want to side track this study @APAK , but thank you. The Lord has healed much over the years, and released me. There are just remnants that I cling onto , and I am reflecting on these things now - so the openness has achieved much xxx
Talking about baking cakes and even bread...I've volunteered my wife again here for such occasions. She loves to give in her own way.
Years back, we had a section of our roof repaired, and my wife and I felt badly for this nearly 70 year-old fella, in good shape thought. He was on the hot roof in the scorching hot Florida sunshine. He worked for a company that had him come out in the weekend, instead of a young lad to redo a portion of the new roof already installed a few weeks back....so my wife felt she would bake him a cake to take home for him and his wife. He was an Hungarian man who always worked for a living in the old country.
My wife makes great cakes... it came from her heart.....she has a thing for older people...loves them to death..
And then since we moved here, a now 93 years widow across the street gets her monthly cinnamon raisin baked bread from my wife's kitchen, hot and ready. I'm the bread man as Rita calls me when I come over...and we have lovely chats at the same time.
Now I cannot know for sure what and who prompted my wife to spontaneously give of your time and kindness, although it I were a gambling man, it all came into her heart from the LORD, every time!
I was thinking about this - Love from Our Perfect Father is vastly different than what often is expressed through the imperfect hearts of humans, even when they are indwelled by Him.
This is why forgiveness is so critical - Peter denied Him 3 times with curses - Jesus particularly embraced him and forgave him. He who is without sin cast the first stone...
This Love of God makes no sense in human terms because the human terms are flawed.
What we do know is that He councils us to forgive like He does - for our own good.
We are to be in the world but not of the world.
Something I can share where God has planted a desire, and spoken to me through others and directly. At my church, we currently are with out a pastor, and our interim pastor retired recently. He led a bi-monthly prayer and fellowship night on Fridays. I was asked to lead the first one, after he left. Now, I'm the type of person who enjoys serving behind the scenes, as I'm an introvert. I also don't have experience in talking in front of a group, as I have to give a short devotional before we go into prayer. Before I led the first prayer night, God gave me a burning desire to take over and lead it. The plan from leadership was people would take turns, as they didn't know who could lead it regularly. However, I know those who would fill in have busy lives with work and families. When I wrote my first devotional, I went with the topic of how God uses suffering to bring us to Him in prayer. Before I began to write it, I went to God in prayer, asking for His help, and that the words would be His words, not mine. Right before I finished praying, God brought to mind the word "guidance". It came out of no where, as far as where my mind was focusing. So I asked God for His guidance. After I gave the devotional to a small group, my mom got feedback from someone, asking about my biblical knowledge and if I was trained as a pastor. I was shocked when my mom told me this.
So my mom started to share about my devotional and how I led that first prayer night, at her church. She started to be told that I should consider being trained for a pastor role. Now, at first, I didn't see how this could work out for me, especially having to attend a seminary and giving up my business. I also didn't know much about what is required to be trained as a pastor. At the second prayer night, I gave a devotional about how faith effects our prayer. The amount of people who attended was about almost three times more. As we are still waiting for a new pastor, I pointed out at the end of the devotional, that despite having been with out one for three years, God can increase our faith and how we pray. Along with how our search committee isn't searching, however, waiting for God to reveal that pastor who He has already chosen. At the end of the event, my mom once again received feedback from others. I also received direct feedback on my devotional. Now, I know God is using me at my church to lead in some way, however, I wasn't sure what my role is to be. During previous prayer nights, God would plant seeds of direction for our prayer group, which I came to realize later was for me to use for leading us. The pastor who led before, made the prayer nights a bit more of an open forum prayer, with not much direction for prayer needs effecting our church and the community around us.
Last Thursday, I decided to go with my mom to her church, for their weekly prayer time. When we got there, all the prayer warriors were out with other people, except for one lady. This is where I knew coming here was God's will. This lady happened to be a prayer warrior at my church, years ago, and had insight on many things. As well, shes good friends with my mom, and has been praying for me over the years. As I talked to her, telling her how I'm seeking God's answer for what my exact role is at my church, the Holy Spirit spoke through her, that God's plan is for me to become a pastor. While she spoke, God addressed an issue I had about it. He brought to mind I could find online training through a school. I had also mentioned a vision God gave me, trying to understand what a pastor really is. I didn't realize it was a vision at the time, just my imagination. So she confirmed it was a vision from God, which was from a month ago or so. After I got home, I tried looking up different seminaries. As I looked at what was to be expected for training, God spoke again to me. He brought to mind He has given me his wisdom, so studying wouldn't be any hardship for me. This is also confirmed by others who have told me about the wisdom God gave me, over many years.
The last part, where God spoke again, was through a pastor friend at my church. After the service, I asked him for insight, and told him I was interested in becoming a pastor by God's guidance. As he shared, he brought up something important for me, which only God knows. The term he used was a "tent maker pastor". When it comes to serving God, I don't feel its right to be paid, for myself. God knows I rather earn my income with my hands outside of serving Him in church. He planted this in my heart during the only season I took BSF, some 20 years ago. I remember reading about Paul, and learning how he was a tent maker, and used that for income and to meet needs, as he served God. I took this as God giving me another reason to have peace and pursue this goal in my life now. In a short amount of time, God rested all my concerns, and also validated what His will is for me.
Looking at 1Corinthians chapter 12 and the references to ‘ The Body ‘. It conveys that we all have different roles ect, different functions. Well ‘ hearing ‘ is obviously one of those functions. So where does this fit in to the discussion on hearing from God.
It conveys to me that at times only certain things will be heard by certain people because within the body that will be their role.
In other words some things won’t be heard by us as individuals, but will be relevant to all of us.
So this Implies that one barrier to ‘ hearing what God is saying ‘ is hindered by not listening to others at times.
So if we are open to listen, we may hear God speaking to us through another.
I think I have shared before about when my daughter was pregnant and they were pretty sure she would lose the baby. The Lord laid on my heart ‘ Tell Sarah the baby will be okay ‘ I didn’t have a lot of confidence, so didn’t relay the message. So it came again ….i ignored it again…so it came a third time.
I relayed the message but added a ‘ but let’s see ‘ !!!!!!
Then another Christian I was listening to asked a general question ‘ what’s the difference between goats and sheep ‘ ?
The answer ‘ Goats butt ‘ . I instantly knew i was getting a reprimand from the Lord , you butted !!
So I went back to Sarah and conveyed just the message, and went out and brought wool and started knitting for the baby as an act and sign of faith. That baby is now 20years old.
Sarah was a young Christian at the time and she asked me ‘ why didn’t God speak to me directly ‘
I answered with a question….’ Who do you trust more right now ‘ …she answered ‘ you mum ‘ ,
I just said, well God knows that , so he used me to speak to you.
The other thing I conveyed to her was that God knew her by name as the message did not say ‘ tell your daughter , it said ‘ tell Sarah ‘
I claim that over her life now ( that God knows her by name ) as she backslid many years ago due to mental health issues and Christian’s not being very helpful within her situation.
It conveys to me that at times only certain things will be heard by certain people because within the body that will be their role.
In other words some things won’t be heard by us as individuals, but will be relevant to all of us.
So this Implies that one barrier to ‘ hearing what God is saying ‘ is hindered by not listening to others at times.
So if we are open to listen, we may hear God speaking to us through another.
I think I have shared before about when my daughter was pregnant and they were pretty sure she would lose the baby. The Lord laid on my heart ‘ Tell Sarah the baby will be okay ‘ I didn’t have a lot of confidence, so didn’t relay the message. So it came again ….i ignored it again…so it came a third time.
I relayed the message but added a ‘ but let’s see ‘ !!!!!!
Then another Christian I was listening to asked a general question ‘ what’s the difference between goats and sheep ‘ ?
The answer ‘ Goats butt ‘ . I instantly knew i was getting a reprimand from the Lord , you butted !!
So I went back to Sarah and conveyed just the message, and went out and brought wool and started knitting for the baby as an act and sign of faith. That baby is now 20years old.
Sarah was a young Christian at the time and she asked me ‘ why didn’t God speak to me directly ‘
I answered with a question….’ Who do you trust more right now ‘ …she answered ‘ you mum ‘ ,
I just said, well God knows that , so he used me to speak to you.
The other thing I conveyed to her was that God knew her by name as the message did not say ‘ tell your daughter , it said ‘ tell Sarah ‘
I claim that over her life now ( that God knows her by name ) as she backslid many years ago due to mental health issues and Christian’s not being very helpful within her situation.
Glad you raised this...
1 Cor 12 is about the Gifts of the Spirit, and associated ministries which are distributed as He wills.
This is an outpouring usually associated with the Baptism in the Spirit (as at Pentecost.)
What I am presenting here is not about the gifts, but about the conversational friendship that all believers can enjoy because they have the indwelling Christ. It is for all, not a special gift for some.
At the same time you are right about Him speaking at times through others.
I really don't believe this has been well understood, the norm for all should be personally hearing Jesus as a friend.
Consider the 7 aspects of the indwelling presence all true believers have...
4 of them are His personal communication with you
Jesus as a wise voice within you.
Jesus as a councillor within you.
Jesus as a font of knowledge within you.
Jesus giving understanding within you.
So anyone saying they never hear God, should seek an ear for these within - as a close special friend walking with you would naturally and lovingly communicate.
Interesting…..Can there not be times when it’s not so much about the gifts, but about Jesus speaking to one person to reassure or encourage another as a friend, but within us we hear it personally at that moment as well, almost as if the words spoken unlock our inner ear because it had been blocked and something was getting in the way of us hearing it directly.
I know I have had moments when I am working through something, or struggling and just through a normal conversation, or A sermon, or a book , something will hit home and within me and I will know that Jesus was speaking personally to me.
I also believe that others around us, both Christians or not, sometimes convey message to our hearts to act upon. Especially when we are in the middle on making a major decision in our lives. That is when our spirit sensitivity should be as it peak and our 'hearing' unimpeded. And many times we still 'miss' it.
I do not think though, there is a unique function of the spirit for 'hearing,' given only to specific members. I believe all in the Body of Christ possess this 'hearing' function in some form. It is a byproduct of possessing all the 7 spirits as Carl mentioned. And this word 'hearing' can take many forms, as I believe Carl has at least implied, and foot-stomped already. The one form you raised here, is the hearing via a stranger, to get your attention, and it worked as your faith became very active.
God will get a hold of us, get our attention, eventually, whether in the 'harder' drawn out way, and it's usually because of us, not being in the Spirit and in the light, as most of us find ourselves. Our Spirit sensitivity and the open door to God and his personal messages, should be on 'max' as our own faith can sustain it.
'Goats butt' that funny.....
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