'Gay'-rights Bill Define Church's 'Purpose'

[Christina]

'Gay'-rights bill lets court define church's 'purpose''Most sweeping and culturally devastating law in Oregon history, establishing pagan morality'A plan being shoved down a fast track in the Oregon Legislature would give homosexuals a vast range of new state laws they could use to impose their moral perspective on Christians across the state, according to opponents who fear for their speech and religious expression rights. Senate Bill 2, on its face, is written to enshrine in state law special protections for homosexuals by classifying them as a protected civil rights group. But hundreds of pastors – whose churches include tens of thousands of evangelical Christians – are horrified by what they see advancing virtually without opposition. "Senate Bill 2, in the Oregon House of Representatives, if passed, will limit your free speech rights and rights of conscience; require public schools to teach that homosexual/lesbian/bisexual behavior is 'okay' and 'moral'; impact your rights as a business owner; and put judges in authority on certain church matters," according to David Crowe, of the Christian ministry called Restore America. "This bill is arrogantly, defiantly and deceptively crafted to accomplish a lot more than what it is saying," he told WND. "It definitely adds sexual orientation to the list of protected civil rights groups. "But there is verbiage in the bill and the verbiage has to do with the primary purpose of a church. They're seeking really to gain a foothold for homosexuals into the Christian church with the court's approval," he said. "It's more than the nose of the camel, they want the whole camel in the tent to ruminate around however they would like," he said. "The word we've gotten from attorneys is that of all the bills around the country this is the worst," Crowe said. "The bottom line this is a total effort by the left to subvert our morality, our Judeo-Christian morality and impose on us a morality they consider superior. What it is really is challenging everything we as Christians stand for." The bill would affect churches even though it has a so-called church exemption, he said, because it would require every church operation that isn't directly in support of its primary mission goal to be subject to mandatory homosexual hiring requirements and other restrictions. And it would leave the determination of what is in support of a church's primary mission to be determined by a secular judge. It is possible, for example, that a lesbian could sue a church if not hired to be a pastor's secretary. For Christian business owners, it would require them to hire and promote homosexuals irrespective of the religious beliefs the owner might hold -- or whether the employee agrees with the products, in a Christian bookstore for example. For parents, it means their children in public schools would be subject to the state-sponsored and state-required indoctrination that the homosexual lifestyle choice is moral – even if the parents hold religious beliefs that contradict that. "The law – and this is onerous – has a clause that talks about developing a program of education to change our attitudes," Crowe said. "To change our attitudes? Is it the government's business to change attitudes? But that's precisely what's in the bill." "They want to put into law [their] view of morality, and that's a small minority view of morality. They are seeking to impose that on the rest of us," he said. Nearly 500 Christian pastors from across the state recently gathered with representatives of the Legislature to express their opposition to the proposal, and afterwards issued a statement that the law, if approved, would be "the most sweeping and culturally devastating law in Oregon history, establishing pagan morality under the guise of a 'civil right,' and imposing it upon all Oregonians under the cover of 'law.'" Crowe noted that of the 14 states that have added "sexual orientation" to their protected classes, all except Senate Bill 2 provide clear protection for churches. "Not one includes wording that allows courts to determine the 'primary purpose' of a church, but SB 2 does," he noted. "The majority of our legislators have chosen to believe the lie that those who engage in homosexual activity cannot help themselves, and that they are being unjustly and wrongly discriminated against, when in fact, neither is true," Crowe said. The proposal "clearly opens the door to liberal judges to redefine and decide the 'primary purpose' of a church, and violates the rights of everyone," said Crowe, who recommends people sign a petition to encourage legislators to oppose the plan. The governor had appointed a commission to study the issue, but included only representatives of liberal or "gay" churches, leaving members of 2,500 Bible-believing and teaching churches unrepresented on the panel, he said. Individual leaders from Christian organizations already have begun contacting not only their lawmakers, but Gov. Ted Kulongoski too. A letter from Vernon M. Marks, superintendent of the Oregon Assemblies of God churches, told Kulongoski that the more than 30,000 members of those churches are urging the rejection of the plan. His letter told the governor the bills will: Violate the very moral and ethical foundations of our culture.Restrict the rights of our citizens to make moral distinctions and to speak freely.Disregard fundamental biblical guidelines for the sanctity of traditional family.Promote dysfunctional family structures that will rob the next generation.Ignore the overwhelming vote of Oregonians to preserve traditional marriage.Discriminate against parents raising mentally and physically challenged adult children.Provide special rights for a few and ignore the civil rights of the majority of Oregonians.Discriminate against parental moral values and convictions.Promote behaviors that clearly violate common sense and social stability.Will create a huge strain on Oregonians economically.Will elevate the already taxed judicial system in dealing with lawsuits over these issues.Infringe on the constitutional protection of the free exercise of religion.John Fortmeyer, publisher of the Christian News Northwest reported that the Legislature has given the appearance of allowing public input, but it doesn't appear to impact any decisions. Nick Graham of the Oregon Family Council told him a March hearing on the plan lasted seven hours and had 126 people register to oppose it. Sixty-five supported it. "We had fantastic testimony in opposition, such as from legal firms and executive pastors," Graham said. "But to no avail, that evening, the bill was passed out of committee and sent to the floor of the Senate ... We were given the appearance of public input, but ultimately it meant nothing." "Also, PRAY!" said a message from Marks to the church group's pastors. "This is possibly the most dangerous piece of legislation to come from Oregon's legislature." The Constitution Party said the plan is a "recipe for civil war." "Everyone should read this legislation. It clearly gives those who choose non-traditional sexual behavior preference over those with traditional moral values," said state Chairman Jack Brown. "This legislation will lock religious people inside their church buildings and let perversion occupy the rest of the landscape!"

 

[HammerStone]

This comes up in Congress all the time. A pastor has already been arrested in Sweden for preaching the OT on this topic. If memory serves me right, Canada already has something very similar. I said this months ago, it's going to become illegal to say anything that "they" define as negative about homosexuals. Basically, anything short of full embracement of their ways will be branded hate speech.

 

[Jesus Is Real]

Hi all, Our only plumb-line can be what Jesus has already said:Even Lot still had the right to name, to the homosexual's, what evil was and they didn't dispute Lot's words they just went on wanting what their flesh wanted.But they did accuse him for acting as their judge, when Lot was bringing judgment that they might not be destroyed. But flesh will never see it like that. For the most part, today's Homosexual's are in denial of what spirit they are of and without offense, for we all were "guilty" of before God saved us, I might add. But Does God Saves? Yes!!! But back on Topic:But (below) this is how open it will get in the near future that is still to come; in other words, that spirit will not be hiding any longer in them. Gen 19:55 and they called to Lot and said to him, " Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may have relations with them. NASUGen 19:6-76 But Lot went out to them at the doorway, and shut the door behind him, 7 and said, "Please, my brothers, do not act wickedly. NASUGen 19:8-11 9 But they said, "Stand aside." Furthermore, they said, "This one came in as an alien, and already he is acting like a judge; now we will treat you worse than them." So they pressed hard against Lot and came near to break the door. 10 But the men reached out their hands and brought Lot into the house with them, and shut the door. 11 They struck the men who were at the doorway of the house with blindness, both small and great, so that they wearied themselves trying to find the doorway. NASUThat with is flesh is flesh, and always be. But the hope is, is that which is of God's Spirit is spirit and that is what God comes here to save. PRAISE GOD!!! So as the days of Lot,...so will the coming of Christ be~Connie

 

[Prometheus]

Disregard fundamental biblical guidelines for the sanctity of traditional family.

Again' date=' the government is not a theocracy so what the Bible has to say on the matter is irrelevant.

Promote dysfunctional family structures that will rob the next generation.

Can you give me some actual evidence that married homosexuals would create a "dysfunctional family structure?" As far as I can tell' date=' encouraging people to love and be faithful to one another is a good thing, regardless of their sex.

Ignore the overwhelming vote of Oregonians to preserve traditional marriage.

What if 51% of Americans voted to kill the remaining 49%? The Majority is not all-powerful. Minorities still need to be protected. Also' date=' how would allowing homosexual unions negatively effect traditional marriage whatsoever? Does what two other people consent to do in private really threaten your marriage?

Discriminate against parents raising mentally and physically challenged adult children.

You'll have to explain this one to me. I don't understand it at all.

Promote behaviors that clearly violate common sense and social stability.

Define common sense. Also' date=' homosexuality is going on now regardless if people marry their own gender or not. It has been going on in human society and the animal kingdom for thousands of years. Society still seems pretty stable to me.

Will create a huge strain on Oregonians economically.

Would you mind explaining how? It's not that I don't believe you' date=' but you'll have to show me why this is the case. Regardless, giving your money to help the poor can strain you economically. Does that make it wrong?

Will elevate the already taxed judicial system in dealing with lawsuits over these issues.

Heaven forbid our judicial system should be bothered with such trivial matters as peoples' rights.

federal government[/i] should allow it.

 

[Christina]

You infringe on my rights FROM religion.{quote}Hey no one asked you to come here we are as entiled to our opinions as you are yours.YOU WILL TAKE A MORE RESPECTFUL ATTITUDE AND NOT MAKE OFFENSIVE POSTS.To answer your question Gods word is the only one that matters to us.

 

[Prometheus]

(kriss;9005)
You infringe on my rights FROM religion.{quote}Hey no one asked you to come here we are as entiled to our opinions as you are yours.YOU WILL TAKE A MORE RESPECTFUL ATTITUDE AND NOT MAKE OFFENSIVE POSTS.
I never said you are not entitled to your opinions. However, I will share mine openly and will not be intimidated by you or anyone else to do otherwise. It's not my problem if someone disagreeing with you offends you. Perhaps you should learn to be more open-minded. By the way, I've been perfectly respectful of you. It's your beliefs I take issue with.(kriss;9005)
To answer your question Gods word is the only one that matters to us.
That's fine and dandy, but if you're going to tell people they can't do something because of what a God they don't even believe in says, you don't sound very convincing. If I told you my God, Zeus, (who is the real, true God by the way and I'd like to see you prove otherwise) said you can't eat chocolate. Would you listen or think I'm being completely irrational?What I'm saying is come up with a secular reason to ban homosexual marriage. If you can't, then why should anyone listen to you?

 

[Christina]

Perhaps you should find another site where you opinions matter

 

[HammerStone]

Again, the government is not a theocracy so what the Bible has to say on the matter is irrelevant.
Maybe you're not aware of this, I don't know. However, the Bible is not a laughing matter for a Christian. When you say what the Bible says doesn't matter, you're in effect saying what the person believes doesn't matter. So yes, that's a pretty personal attack on any Christian.