IF YE CONTINUE IN THE FAITH
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To say this verse applies to us is a mistake.......it is wrong to say that Jesus saying the branches in him would be taken away applies to us because we are in Christ
For eternal life Israel had to believe on his name .......[1Jo 5:13 KJV] 13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.............................[Jhn 20:31 KJV] 31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
To enter the kingdom and have positions of authority believing Israel had to be fruitful........they dont lose salvation unto eternal life
Paul here is not talking about us the church the body of Christ.......he is saying the Gentiles who believed the preaching of Peter and the disciples became members in the believing remnant of Israel. They could be broken off thru unbelief just as Israel.....theese Gentiles are not us
Behold
Well-Known Member
Use these 2 verses..
2 Tim 4:7,8
Paul said...
"""""I have fought the good and worthy and noble fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the FAITH = [firmly guarding the gospel against error].... so, Now there is in store for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day—and not only to me, but also to all who have longed for his appearing.""""
John 15
5 “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing. 6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. 7 If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you[b] will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you. 8 By this My Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit; so you will be My disciples.
Of course, Christ is the vine
His sheep abide in the vine cause God put them there.
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 He was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
4 In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.
5 And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not [a]comprehend it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
Of course, Christ made all men, Christ is their Creator
The source of the life of all men is Christ as in Him we live, move, and have our being, as Paul said in Acts to the unbelieving gentiles.
All men are naturally born having life, and this life comes from Christ.
But if you do not abide in Him, you are cut off from the source of all LIFE and are burned in a fiery destruction, meaning you will perish.
Your life, come from God is temporary life if you do not abide in the Vine.
You have no right to life in the vine, that is up to the mercy of God and is only for those who abide (live) in the Vine as believers.
Christ saves believers only, not unbeievers.
So this implies nothing about a saved believer, born of God, getting cut off from Life. IT is speaking about unbelievers, false believers, people who depart from Christ in unbelief.
They LEFT us, which showed they were not of us, for if they were of us, they would have remained in the faith.
No doubts John wrote John 15 and 1 John 2, as they are so much the same
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the[d] Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you[e] know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
26 These things I have written to you concerning those who try to [f]deceive you. 27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you [g]will abide in Him.
5 “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing. 6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. 7 If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you[b] will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you. 8 By this My Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit; so you will be My disciples.
Of course, Christ is the vine
His sheep abide in the vine cause God put them there.
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 He was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
4 In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.
5 And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not [a]comprehend it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
Of course, Christ made all men, Christ is their Creator
The source of the life of all men is Christ as in Him we live, move, and have our being, as Paul said in Acts to the unbelieving gentiles.
All men are naturally born having life, and this life comes from Christ.
But if you do not abide in Him, you are cut off from the source of all LIFE and are burned in a fiery destruction, meaning you will perish.
Your life, come from God is temporary life if you do not abide in the Vine.
You have no right to life in the vine, that is up to the mercy of God and is only for those who abide (live) in the Vine as believers.
Christ saves believers only, not unbeievers.
So this implies nothing about a saved believer, born of God, getting cut off from Life. IT is speaking about unbelievers, false believers, people who depart from Christ in unbelief.
They LEFT us, which showed they were not of us, for if they were of us, they would have remained in the faith.
No doubts John wrote John 15 and 1 John 2, as they are so much the same
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the[d] Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you[e] know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
Let Truth Abide in You
24 Therefore let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father. 25 And this is the promise that He has promised us—eternal life.26 These things I have written to you concerning those who try to [f]deceive you. 27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you [g]will abide in Him.
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As you notice the word 'abide' is in proper use and explained by Apostle John who wrote these words about abiding in the Father and the Son. John explains this to us.
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
I have read the Holy Bible many times.
The context is clear.
You should get back into reading the Bible frequently and daily.
Paul in Romans 9-11 was speaking of the remnant of believing Israel
Gentiles were included in the remnant as can be seen in Acts 10
Gentiles had to remain in belief otherwise they too would be broken off
Paul was talking about Israel in Romans 9 thru 11 not us the church the body of Christ
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
“Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.” (Romans 11:20-21, KJV)
Paul is speaking to believers in the faith.
THIS APPLIES TO EVERYONE IN THE FAITH.
INCLUDING YOU.
Wise up.
Some doctrines of devils has blinded you.
this is not productive
Care to give your comments on verses from Romans 9 thru 11 to refute mine
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
The scriptures end discussions (as they should).
What did you want to “produce” here?
Anything that points away from the plain written word with faith is detrimental.
“…charge some that they teach no other doctrine, Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.” (1 Timothy 1:3-4, KJV)
Big Boy Johnson
Well-Known Member
Your claim is that God is not all knowing and He did not know in advance that all people would be born?
The "god" the calvinists serve doesn't know because he is the devil.
God called ALL people to salvation. Calvinists don't have the Holy Spirit so sadly they are cherry pickers
Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth ALL men every where to repent:
John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.
1 Timothy 2:4
Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance.
Since you believe this, did you ever think maybe you are one of the ones God decided to reject?
If God is rejecting most people than this is the claim that Jesus is a lair:
John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.
It's really sad to see the calvinists claim Jesus is a liar and that they don't know the meaning of the word ALL
Big Boy Johnson
Well-Known Member
The warning still stands.
“…let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.” (1 Corinthians 10:12, KJV)
No where in the chapter does it say “…let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall, but Christians cannot fall.”
The entire New Testament is written to Christians!
And she should repent from following false doctrine that teaches people to be cherry pickers, to not accept the entire Word of God.
That's what the devil keeps saying!
"no need to listen to Jesus, He don't know what he's talking about"
That's what the devil keeps saying!
"no need to listen to what Jesus said thru Paul, He don't know what he's talking about"
Ah, you're still twisting it now saying God does not know is what I said.Your claim is that God is not all knowing and He did not know in advance that all people would be born?
The "god" the calvinists serve doesn't know because he is the devil.
God called ALL people to salvation. Calvinists don't have the Holy Spirit so sadly they are cherry pickers
Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth ALL men every where to repent:
John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.
1 Timothy 2:4
Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance.
Since you believe this, did you ever think maybe you are one of the ones God decided to reject?
If God is rejecting most people than this is the claim that Jesus is a lair:
John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.
It's really sad to see the calvinists claim Jesus is a liar and that they don't know the meaning of the word ALL
The foreknowing is for WHOM He foreknew as in a relationship of love. Which is why God saves and gloried them.
Knew as His saints, not that God did not know all people.
This entire foreknowing is only about those people God foreknew as His saints, and He knows them as He called them to be saints.
As it clearly says, and everyone except for a few apparently, understand the book of Romans is written to the saints, not the unbelieving world.
Romans 8
27 Now He who searches the hearts knows what the mind of the Spirit is, because He makes intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. 29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
The progression carries on till its completion, for everyone who are the called according to His purpose.
Foreknew, predestined, called, justified, glorified.
As it clearly says, and everyone except for a few apparently, understand the book of Romans is written to the saints, not the unbelieving world.
Romans 8
27 Now He who searches the hearts knows what the mind of the Spirit is, because He makes intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. 29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
The progression carries on till its completion, for everyone who are the called according to His purpose.
Foreknew, predestined, called, justified, glorified.
Big Boy Johnson
Well-Known Member
That's is a classic example of eisegesis which is adding one's preconceived ideas to the Word of God in their attempt to get it to say what God never actually said.
God is actually all knowing and had foreknowledge of each and every person that would ever been born
To claim He did not is to call God a liar and to belittle the fact that He is all knowing and all powerful
To claim God does not want all to be saved and did not provide opportunity for all to be saved in blatant rejection of what God clearly says in His Word which is of course what clavinists do. They specialize in this which is why then continue to be deceived.
In order to hold to the false calvinist doctrine doctrine of limited atonement, a good calvinist must claim the following verses are lies and that God is in error by not agreeing with calvinism
Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth ALL men every where to repent:
John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.
1 Timothy 2:4
Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance.
Sister-n-Christ
Well-Known Member
All that reading, and you still don't know Paul was reminding the Jews to whom he penned his epistle that you excised in small part and that didn't take that into account.
