Misrepresentation of the Law

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Netchaplain

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“But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully, knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust” (1Tim 8-11).

There is a very grave danger—man’s misuse of God’s Law—which has sadly misled many, even godly souls. Yet the law is good, if one uses it lawfully (lawful use of the law is in its informing of guilt—NC). Have the misusers the inward consciousness that law is not made for a righteous man but for the lawless and unruly, and for other evil doers (those who continue to “sin willfully, i.e. after knowing [“receiving”] the knowledge of the truth and choose not to believe it, thus they are receiving or learning only the knowledge of the truth, but not receiving the truth – Heb 10:26—NC)? Far different was their thought. Herein, then as now, men betray their inability to discern God’s reveled mind.

Law does not contemplate the good, but the bad. Law is enacted to detect, convict and punish. Law never made a “just man,” much less “the good man,” if one may cite the distinction in Romans 5:7. It is a sharp weapon to wound and kill transgressors; it never was designed to form motives of integrity or a walk of true righteousness. Its excellence lies in its unsparingness of evil; and man is evil and this by nature.

Grace, not law, saves sinners. Not law but grace teaches “us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ” (Tit 2:11-13).

Here theology revolts from the truth, and even good men ignore the source of all that made them what they are through the redemption that is in Christ and the faith that casts them thus upon God (e.g. Gal 3:3—NC). It matters not to them that the Apostle elsewhere declares that “by law is the knowledge of sin” (Rom 3:20), that it “works wrath” (Rom 4:15), that it “is the power (strength) of sin” (1Co 15:56), that it is a “ministration of death” and “condemnation” (2Co 3:7, 9), that “as many as are under its works are under its curse” (Gal 3:10; the beginning of the curse of the law - Gen 2:17; Eze 18:4, 20—NC), that it was added for the sake “of transgressions” (Gal 3:19).

They will have it that the law was made for the righteous as a rule of life, though it is plain unavoidable inference from the words before us that this is precisely what the Apostle explicitly denies of the law. It is the Lord Jesus Christ Who above all acts on the believing one’s soul. Hence he needs the Word of God as a whole throughout his life, and the Spirit enables him to apply it in practical detail.

Such is the believer’s secret of true morality; which in divine wisdom binds the heart up with the risen Lord, and make the written Word to be matter for constant pondering, for comfort and conscientious application in the Spirit, but all in the sense of the true grace of God in which we stand and are exhorted to stand. For such exceeding privileges are meant to deepen our dependence upon the Father and our confidence in His love day by day.

Entirely is it not only admitted but insisted on in Scripture that the Christian is bound to do the will of God at all cost, and is never free to gratify the flesh (not fulfill the lust of the sin nature - Gal 5:16—NC). He is sanctified unto the obedience of Jesus Christ no less than to the sprinkling of His Blood (1Pet 1:2). Self-pleasing is Satan’s service (and our old man—NC). But the law is not the measure of God’s will for the believer. It was for Israel but believers are made dead to it through the body of Christ, that they should belong to Another—even to Him that was raised from the dead, that they should bring forth fruit unto God (Rom 7:4). This is now the method of divinely-wrought freedom, only to obey the Father with a nearness, fullness and absolute devotedness unknown to the Jew (non-messianic—NC).

Can anything be less satisfactory, yea more negative, than the ordinary assertion of the divines that Paul still leaves it open, so far as Scripture speaks, for the law to be the directory of Christians, and that he simply means to exclude it from justifying the soul (Gal 2:16)? It is certainly undeniable that in Romans Six and Seven Paul is treating Christian walk not to be the order to justification; and there he lays down that believers are not under law but grace. Against the fruit of the Spirit “there is no law” (Gal 5:23).

Is it not painfully instructive to see how an error once let in works to ungodliness (Gal 5:9)? For those who so strenuously contend against the uniform doctrine of the New Testament, and place the Christian under law as his rule of life, contend that if he offended as we all do too often, he is not under its curse! Is this to establish the law, or to annul it?

If the Lord Jesus Christ died and bore its curse (Heb 9:28; 1Pe 2:24), and believers too died with Him and now are no longer under law but under grace, the truth is kept intact, the authority of the law is maintained (by Christ, not the believer—NC), and yet we who believe have full deliverance. If believers were really under law for walk, we ought to be cursed, or you destroy its authority; if we are not under it, the true provision for one’s sin is Christ’s advocacy with the Father, which brings us to repentance by the washing of water with the Word.

Truly the law is a ministration of condemnation (via informing sinners of their guilt, for we would have “not known sin, but by the law” - Rom 7:7. The guilt is incurred due to the fact of being informed why we are guilty - Jhn 15:22, 24—NC). What then can minister life, righteousness and the Spirit? The Gospel of salvation based on the Lord Jesus and His work on the Cross, which faith only receives; “and the law is not of faith,” as we repeat from Scripture (Gal 3:12). Blessing is inseparable from Christ; and it is of faith that it might be according to grace (Rom 4:16). Those that speak of law for the believer may speak out of the abundance of their heart, as they certainly do out of weakness of faith, and never show the good works for which they call, but prove the wretchedness of slighting the Lord Jesus Christ (unknowingly, without awareness—NC). For the Spirit is sent to glorify Him, and will never decorate the old man by vain hopes of amelioration (law served with the only nature man had at the time, i.e. the old man, but now faith serves with the new man—NC).



— Wm Kelly (1821-1906)
 

justbyfaith

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Most certainly the law is written on the hearts and in the minds of NT believers (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16).

However, this is a righteousness that is apart from the law that is attested to by the law and the prophets (Romans 3:21).

In bearing the fruit of the Spirit there is no law that we would actually violate (Galatians 5:22-23); and therefore our obedience comes by faith and not by an attempt to obey a set of do's and don'ts.

We abide in the vine and as a result we produce the fruit of the Spirit (see John 15:1-17).

This love (see Galatians 5:22-23) is the fulfilling of the righteousness of the law within us (Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6, Romans 8:4).

It is not in word or in tongue only but in deed and in truth (1 John 3:17-18).

Therefore the righteousness of faith is practical (see Matthew 5:6, Romans 5:17-19, 1 John 3:7).
 
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Netchaplain

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Most certainly the law is written on the hearts and in the minds of NT believers (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16).
Hi and always appreciate your input and comments! Though I agree with most of your reply, my belief is that Heb 8:8-13 is referring to literal Jews (I do not spiritualize all believers are Israel), which will be derived from the present New Covenant and be established at a time when the truth of Christ will not need to be taught anymore because "all shall know Me."
 

justbyfaith

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So then, are there three covenants?

Because it is clear in Hebrews 8:8-10 that those who are under the New Covenant are the ones indicated as having the law written in their hearts and on their minds.

I believe that Gentiles also, are recipients of these New Covenant promises.

There is not a third covenant, therefore, for Gentiles; in which they are merely forgiven apart from also having the law written on their hearts and in their minds.

I believe that there are only two covenants, and that the 2nd covenant applies to Gentiles as well as Jews.

And the 2nd Covenant also is a covenant of obedience from the heart, to what God has established as a moral standard in His law.
 
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Netchaplain

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So then, are there three covenants?
That's my understanding, and I believe you're on to it! The OC for Israel only which has been annulled and two New Covenants, which are the present one for Christians and the new one for the Jews who will not believe in Christ until they see Him. Both the OC for Israel and the new one in the millennium for Israel believe at least in God, but will not inherit the "blessing" for not believing in Jesus before they see Him (Jhn 14:1, 20:29). Israel's new Covenant will not be in the fellowship of being children of God but only a people of God, for not believing in Jesus. They will not inherit the new heaven but the new earth.
 

Rocky Wiley

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Hi and always appreciate your input and comments! Though I agree with most of your reply, my belief is that Heb 8:8-13 is referring to literal Jews (I do not spiritualize all believers are Israel), which will be derived from the present New Covenant and be established at a time when the truth of Christ will not need to be taught anymore because "all shall know Me."

Judah, Jews as you say, is only one of the twelves tribes of Israel. Jesus came for all twelve of these tribes. Gentiles are allowed to become a Christian through faith but the tribes of Israel are never excluded.
 

Netchaplain

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No, I reject that idea; for the scripture nowhere speaks of a third covenant.
It's obviously not essential to understand God's eschatological plans for Israel or Scripture would have been more direct and clear concerning them, but I think to get an idea of what I'm attempting to share I think we should realize that the New Covenant, which is the only one presently existing, is not the same type of covenant God had with the Hebrews and the Jews. The Old one for them and the coming new one for them are made between God and man (the people of God). The present and new covenant is made between God and His Son in His Blood (expiation):

Most aren't aware of this truth: What Is the Covenant of Redemption?
 

Netchaplain

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Judah, Jews as you say, is only one of the twelves tribes of Israel. Jesus came for all twelve of these tribes. Gentiles are allowed to become a Christian through faith but the tribes of Israel are never excluded.
Hi and thanks for your comment, but I'm not certain of what you mean. I agree, Israel and Judah are all Jews, and aren't they all from Jacob (Israel)?
The majority of the tribes of God's people won't be believing in Christ until they see Him in the Millennium, but the Jews were first to become Christian, who are many but not most.
 
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Rocky Wiley

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Hi and thanks for your comment, but I'm not certain of what you mean. I agree, Israel and Judah are all Jews, and aren't they all from Jacob (Israel)?
The majority of the tribes of God's people won't be believing in Christ until they see Him in the Millennium, but the Jews were first to become Christian, who are many but not most.

Israel is not a tribe it is all the tribes, Judah is just one of the tribes;

Jacob is said to have had twelve sons by four women, his wives, Leah and Rachel, and his concubines, Bilhah and Zilpah, who were, in order of their birth, Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Dan, Naphtali, Gad, Asher, Issachar, Zebulun, Joseph, and Benjamin, all of whom became the heads of their own family groups, later known as the twelve tribes of Israel.
Judah is just one of twelve sons of Israel, since Jacob's name was changed to Israel.
 
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Jim B

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Hi and thanks for your comment, but I'm not certain of what you mean. I agree, Israel and Judah are all Jews, and aren't they all from Jacob (Israel)?
The majority of the tribes of God's people won't be believing in Christ until they see Him in the Millennium, but the Jews were first to become Christian, who are many but not most.

There were no Gentiles in the New Covenant until the conversion of Cornelius. Jesus, all the apostles (including James, Jesus' brother), Paul, and all those who first believed in Jesus as the Son of God, were Jews. The Gentiles came in later, primarily through Paul's missionary work.
 

Netchaplain

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Israel is not a tribe it is all the tribes, Judah is just one of the tribes;

Jacob is said to have had twelve sons by four women, his wives, Leah and Rachel, and his concubines, Bilhah and Zilpah, who were, in order of their birth, Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Dan, Naphtali, Gad, Asher, Issachar, Zebulun, Joseph, and Benjamin, all of whom became the heads of their own family groups, later known as the twelve tribes of Israel.
Judah is just one of twelve sons of Israel, since Jacob's name was changed to Israel.
I see what you mean and thanks!
 

Netchaplain

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There were no Gentiles in the New Covenant until the conversion of Cornelius. Jesus, all the apostles (including James, Jesus' brother), Paul, and all those who first believed in Jesus as the Son of God, were Jews. The Gentiles came in later, primarily through Paul's missionary work.
Amen, the Jews first then the Gentiles; and it appears the Church and Body of Christ will consist mostly of those from among the Gentiles (not that this is a significant fact).
 

Behold

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And the 2nd Covenant also is a covenant of obedience from the heart, to what God has established as a moral standard in His law.

Obedience to the law, is not the 2nd covenant.
Its actually exactly not that.
The 2nd Covenant, has nothing to do with the Law.
The 2nd Covenant, is the New Testament, who is Jesus, and the covenant is to be "under Grace"
 

justbyfaith

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Obedience to the law, is not the 2nd covenant.
Its actually exactly not that.
The 2nd Covenant, has nothing to do with the Law.
The 2nd Covenant, is the New Testament, who is Jesus, and the covenant is to be "under Grace"
It's too bad that you don't like to quote the scriptures to make your point. Because there can't be any scriptures that would support your pov, since they would then be in contradiction to the following scripture:

Heb 8:8, For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
Heb 8:9, Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
Heb 8:10, For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

Misrepresentation of the Law
 

Behold

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It's too bad that you don't like to quote the scriptures to make your point. Because there can't be any scriptures that would support your pov,
Misrepresentation of the Law

THat is your opinion.

I'll tell you again, Jesus is the mediator of the New Testament.
The Old Testament, could not, thru the law, redeem any from sin, or produce righteousness.
So, God took away the first covenant and replaced it with the BLOOD OF JESUS.
This is the new covenant, the "New Testament".
Its the Grace of God. Its "justification by faith".. Its "the Gift of Righteousness". its the "GIFT of Salvation".

"law in your mind", does not justify you before God.
If it did, the Cross would not be necessary.
God accepts FAITH.
"Faith is counted as righteousness". Not Law.
 

justbyfaith

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Faith writes the law in your mind and in your heart.

Through faith we receive the Holy Spirit, Galatians 3:14.

And through the Holy Ghost we receive the love of the Lord, Romans 5:5, Galatians 5:22-23.

This love is the fulfilling of the righteousness of the law within us, Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, 1 John 5:3, 2 John 1:6, Romans 8:4, Galatians 5:22-23.

It is not in word or in tongue only, but in deed and in truth, 1 John 3:17-18.

Again, it is the fulfilling of the law.

This is the result of faith in Jesus.

We do not achieve it by attempting to keep a set of do's and don'ts.

But it is a work of the Holy Spirit on our hearts, that the law of the Lord is written on our hearts and in our minds (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16).

And this is a righteousness that is apart from the law; which is nevertheless attested to by the law and the prophets, Romans 3:21.

Because the venue by which we obtain this righteousness is not through an attempt to meet a requirement.

Rather, through faith in Jesus, we bear the fruit of the Spirit and thus are no longer in violation of any requirement. Galatians 5:22-23.