All who take credit away from God, and give it elsewhere, are in danger of death. Religions who make the claim, and teach that Jesus is God, are taking all credit away from the living God, and giving it to the First Born of all creation. If you teach this, God will deal with you, and all those who follow this teaching.
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No Jesus was not, and is not an angel. He is the son of the Living God. The First born of all creation. He was born into human form, as the son of the Living God. He is our lord, and at present, and for the thousand year rule, our Lord. Jesus stands between the human family and his father, the Living God.Episkopos said:
Rather than try to trap me, you should ask yourself what your take on the matter is.
The term "firstborn" is a title that was used by the Jews. It was a birthright position, It had specific meaning and privileges. We saw in Gen.27, how Jacob deceived Isaac and took away the birthright of Esau. Thus the title can be transferred, proving that it is in fact, a title.domenic said:
It should be noted that in the case of Jesus, that though He was given the title of firstborn. it is a mistake to apply this title to Him as though He was a creation of the Father. The bible says that Jesus is the beginning and the end, that He is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow. All things were created by Him, through Him, and for Him (Col.1:16). Nothing that was made was made without Him (John 1:3). If Jesus Himself was created, then this cannot be true. He has always existed with the Father. He is the co-creator of all things. (not all "other" things)
In Rev. 3:20,21, Jesus is seen standing at the door and knocking. This is an invitation to any individual who opens the door, and He said He will come into him and have fellowship. But He also included His Father in this, as promised in John 14:23, where He says.." we will come to him (anyone) and make our home with him". This, in context, is the promise of the Holy Spirit, the helper whom He promised would come. In John 14:17, Jesus declared.." He dwells with you and will be in you"
The indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit brings to us the indwelling presence of the Father and the Son. I was filled with the Holy Spirit many years ago. It is an amazing thing that happens. My testimony cannot be taken away. The fellowship I enjoy with Jesus and His Father, through the Holy Spirit , is very real.
Jesus assured His disciples that when the Holy Spirit would come, He would testify of Him (Jesus, John 15:26). In that verse, Jesus said that He would send the Holy Spirit, who proceeds from the Father.
At this present time, Jesus sits at the right hand of the Throne of God, on the throne. There is a partnership that they have which has been from the beginning. All things were created through Jesus. God has given His Son all of His own glory and His life, and His authority, and His title. He will in fact love those who honor His Son in the same way that He honors His Son.
In 1John 3:23, we see that God gave a commandment to believe on the name of His Son, and to love one another. These are the commandments of the new covenant. Faith, and love. Faith brings us the new birth and the indwelling Spirit. Love is the fruit of these.
Back in John 14, Jesus spoke of these commandments in vs. 21..."He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. AND HE WHO LOVES ME WILL BE LOVED BY ME FATHER, AND I WILL LOVE HIM AND MANIFEST MYSELF TO HIM."
With all dues respect, I am having a hard time with the prospect that anyone who has experienced these things would write a warning such as this one in the op. Jesus is knocking at the door. He wants fellowship. He wants to indwell us, along with His Father. . If He was inferior to His Father, or not of the same substance and nature, how could this even be possible?
But it not only is possible, it is God's will for us. And it is my testimony and also of millions of others.
What's the saying? You can take a Jehovah's False Witness out of the cult, but you can't take the cult out of an ex-JFW? The antithesis of the teaching you are warning against is really the essence of the JFW cult. You may have left it, but apparently it hasn't left you.domenic said:
I really do hope and pray better things for you. Jesus being subservient to the father doesn't mean that he isn't GOD. The body of a righteous man is subservient to his spirit, yet they are one being.
The Bible says: Colossians 1:15 The first born of all CREATION.Episkopos said:
If you read all of Colossians, it explains God created the first born of all creation, Jesus, and through, Jesus, God he created everything.
True it is a cult. They are not stupid people, and yes they do believe in the Bible as Gods written word...50,000 leave the cult each year.ChristRoseFromTheDead said:
I only found one thing that proved them a cult. It is easy to find many with your religion...and yet you not only stay with your cult, you defend it.
Are you asking the question because you don't know? You make claim to being a Christian. You answer the question you asked.Episkopos said:
It's like WM said, the word translated firstborn in the biblical context refers to position, not necessarily birth sequence. Ishmael was the first born, but Isaac became the firstborn. Same with Esau/Jacob, Reuben/Joseph, Manasseh/Ephraim.domenic said:
Go about your fathers business, and I will go about my Fathers business.ChristRoseFromTheDead said:
Jesus was the first born of all CREATION. Neither Ishmael, nor Isaac was the first born of all creation.
You aren't answering the question -- explaining what your originally posted -- because you can't. Trying to turn the question around fools no one. We have already answered and supported our position. Come out of your JW cult, not just half way.domenic said:
Well please be prayerful and have an open mind, and do realize that you learned Jesus was a created being from a cult.domenic said:
Which means that he inherited the rights of the firstborn for all creation, not that he was first created.domenic said:
No religion wrote the Bible. Colossians 1:15 is from God. If you do not believe what God says, than who is it your are following?ChristRoseFromTheDead said:
Polt said:
What I posted explains itself. Believe the Bible, or reject Gods word...that is what God wants you to do...explain your position to him.
Again, the word firstborn refers to a position of inheritance. Ephraim was neither the first born of Jacob, nor GOD's first born, but he did by GOD's choice inherit the rights of the firstborn, and was thus called GOD's firstborn. The word firstborn below is the exact same word in Colossians 1:15:domenic said:
...I am become a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn. Jeremiah 31:9
The word is also used in Colossians 1:18 to indicate his preeminent position in the new creation. This usage has nothing to do with birth, or even that he was the first person to be raised from the dead, which he wasn't:
and he himself is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn out of the dead, so that he himself may become first in everything, Colossians 1:18
domenic said:
You may be confusing the word "creation" meaning a creature made by God...with the New Covenant creation of a new order of people.. Jesus put on flesh to become as we are in order to bring us back to God. So He is the firstborn of THAT creation..the new creation in Himself.
It is unwise as well as very bad form to make one verse cancel out many other verses that contradict the reasoning derived from a faulty understanding of that one verse! This is how cults begin!
Read it as you will,. and follow it as you will. You take all credit from The Father, and give it to the Son. You believe what you say, and you teach others what you say. You make your stand clear as a bell before both the Father, and his son.
Rather than walking around in the dark believing what you believe, you should read Com 1: 16, and 17. If you still don't get it, it is because God has blinded you to the truth.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Are you speaking of the doctrines of your church? What I posted was from the Bible...does your religion use the Bible? God says we can't judge our own heart, so I will let him judge if I am a Christian, or the fool you think I am.aspen2 said:
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
My church is responsible for compiling the very Bible you are misinterpreting. You cannot throw out the doctrine of the Trinity and the doctrine of the Incarnation AND claim to know God because you are replacing His true nature with your private fantasy.
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