Secular legal question

[Jay Ross]

There is nothing to stop you from putting up a fence panel to stop entry through the gate that he installed in the fence he built.

However, you will need to know where the fence line is before you put that fence panel in place as it cannot encroach onto his property.

If the fence and gate that the neighbour built encroaches onto your property, then you have grounds to ask the neighbour to move the fence back onto the right alignment. If this is so you can also ask that the gate opening be closed off with a fencing panel. You may have to contribute to the cost of that panel.

The first step is to establish where the actual boundary is. This neighbour may have infilled the fence line going off of the other neighbours constructed fences. If this is the case, then your problem will have grown and maybe become more difficult to resolve simply.

Another thought is that the fire department for your area may have requested that your neighbour have a gate in his back fence so that they can gain access to your property to fight a fire should one be on your property. This may be so if the fire trucks can gain access through your neighbour's property to his back fence which abuts your property. You need to cover all bases and do your homework thoroughly before you start any actions to resolve the issues.

Neighbours can be real pains to deal with because it becomes an emotional issue with them and emotions are difficult to fight against.

Prayer might be the only option that you have at this point in time. We all need people who will pray that God will continue to draw us all into a deeper relationship with Him.

Shalom

 

[BlessedPeace]

There is nothing to stop you from putting up a fence panel to stop entry through the gate that he installed in the fence he built.

However, you will need to know where the fence line is before you put that fence panel in place as it cannot encroach onto his property.

If the fence and gate that the neighbour built encroaches onto your property, then you have grounds to ask the neighbour to move the fence back onto the right alignment. If this is so you can also ask that the gate opening be closed off with a fencing panel. You may have to contribute to the cost of that panel.

The first step is to establish where the actual boundary is. This neighbour may have infilled the fence line going off of the other neighbours constructed fences. If this is the case, then your problem will have grown and maybe become more difficult to resolve simply.

Another thought is that the fire department for your area may have requested that your neighbour have a gate in his back fence so that they can gain access to your property to fight a fire should one be on your property. This may be so if the fire trucks can gain access through your neighbour's property to his back fence which abuts your property. You need to cover all bases and do your homework thoroughly before you start any actions to resolve the issues.

Neighbours can be real pains to deal with because it becomes an emotional issue with them and emotions are difficult to fight against.

Prayer might be the only option that you have at this point in time. We all need people who will pray that God will continue to draw us all into a deeper relationship with Him.

Shalom

Thank you so much.

I didn't think about the fire department.

The original developer plotted one road system, lane, into and out of the development.

They lied to the fire chief who voiced a concern regarding their access and said they would make a second access point.
They knew he was terminal. He approved the planning on that condition. He died months later and that 2nd access point never appeared.

So I can certainly appreciate the idea of access to the northern side of those homes that abutt my land.

I'll call the local house and see what they say.

Thank you again.

 

[Jay Ross]

Thank you so much.

I didn't think about the fire department.

The original developer plotted one road system, lane, into and out of the development.

They lied to the fire chief who voiced a concern regarding their access and said they would make a second access point.
They knew he was terminal. He approved the planning on that condition. He died months later and that 2nd access point never appeared.

So I can certainly appreciate the idea of access to the northern side of those homes that abutt my land.

I'll call the local house and see what they say.

Thank you again.

Do your homework carefully. If the Fire department asked for the access gate then it would be prudent if they put their lock on the gate so that only they had the access. Your neighbour may demand that the gate be double locked so that he too can have access via the gate as well but that is a privilege that only you can give, and the fire department cannot give to your neighbour. However, with bolt cutters your neighbour may break the last link and then insert his own lock.

Sometimes it is better to quietly go about solving the issues you are having so that you do not get others upset as well.

 

[bluedragon]

The county could chain and padlock the gate as well .....

 

[Taken]

There's a neighbor in a HOA housing community that abuts my property. He's a serial offender as an illegal dumper of his household renovations discards and garbage on the now empty household lot to the east of his property.
We're talking years of dumping there.

Now he's taken to start his discards on the small strip of my property that abuts his fence line.

I took pictures and drove to his house to request he remove the items. He refused to come to the door but his wife said they'd remove the items.
As I was turning around to leave their culdesac he appeared and in a rage said I'm stupid, it isn't my property, it is, and he's not moving anything.

What he does not care about is the lot he dumps on isn't his property.

This guy installed a fence around his home last year. And put a gate at the back part that allows him to trespass on my land, and dump on that neighbors empty lot so to continue dumping.

Two weeks ago he opened his gate during a graduation party for his son. I came home from work for a quick lunch and 5 parked cars were blocking the length of my driveway. Two women were in lawn chairs sitting in my drive!

My question is, besides calling the police to report his illegal dumping on my land, can I move to have that gate removed so he can no longer trespass?

I contacted the HOA via email and sent pictures of his dumping on both lots but haven't heard anything back.

The minute he opens his gate and steps through he's on my land.

Any legal advice is appreciated. Especially if there's a way to get a lawyer to act on a contingency basis. I'm not flush with cash.

Thank you for reading this. And for any advice or prayers.

From here forward…
KEEP copies of all YOUR records, such as Sending a Certified Letter to your HOA.

Also…you can do a search of WHO owns the property the neighbor dumps on ( some county records are online, some you may have to call your local court house and require where property ownership is located.) You can notify the property owner of the routine dumping by the neighbor.

Video any dumping you see, along with a record of dates, and HOV notification every time he dumps….in the vacant lot and on your property.

You should be able to LOCATE the Survey for your property AND surveyors metal rods that are located at every Legal corner of your property. (Sometimes a foot or so deep, but often can be found with a Map and Magnet.)
You having your LEGAL survey and LEGAL ownership in Hand should assist you in moving your complain along swiftly.

You can ALSO contact the County Health Department and inquire HOW TO make a FORMAL Dumping Complaint. <—> THAT is a good option, IF your HOA continues to ignore your or otherwise be complacent.

You can ALSO (if possible) Ask OTHER neighbors IF they are aware of his Dumping and Trespassing. If so, see if they would be willing to give you a written letter Stating what they have witnessed.

As far as YOUR property….
POST a “NO TRESPASSING…NO DUMPING” sign on your property FACING his Property.

A more drastic measure is Where he put a GATE that opens to YOUR Property….Build a FENCE ON your property parallel the length of his GATE. You could also post your “signs” on that fence. You could also post a “sign” that says property under camera surveillance.

Get your signs UP…Thereafter if he continues to Trespass or Dump on YOUR property…
You can ALSO file a Formal Trespassing AND Dumping Complaint and Formal Charge with your local POLICE Department.

Other Options, is Attending a “CITY” or “COUNTRY” formal government meeting.
(Typically monthly).
For either you typically would need to contact them PRYOR to request Your Name be entered into the meeting DOCKET, (so they will call on you, and you have opportunity to SPEAK to the issue of your COMPLAINT. )

Your HOA is supposed to accept home-owners complaints and follow the associations by-laws of “letters of warnings” concerning Trespassing and Dumping. AND contact higher authority governments, if the Warnings Fail…
Sounds like the HOA has FAILED to do their JOB!

Hope this helps.

Taken

 

[Taken]

Call a surveyor to stake your property lines. If that's your property. Then the neighbor will know and you'll have proof to show police. Then put a fence up, its your property.

Land that is sold is first surveyed, and metal rods mark the corners. The records are located in city/ county “seat” offices and open to the public for viewing and copying.

Requesting a surveyor or putting up a fence can be costly.

Most counties already have LAWS AGAINST Trespassing and Dumping….on government land AND privately owned Land.

Often the County Health Department can be requested to get Involved, even to the point of requesting the “dumper” remove what they “dumped” or the County will clean it up and “get an order for the dumper” to pay the cost….and additional fees and fines are usual when it becomes necessary to get a Court involved.

 

[BlessedPeace]

From here forward…
KEEP copies of all YOUR records, such as Sending a Certified Letter to your HOA.

Also…you can do a search of WHO owns the property the neighbor dumps on ( some county records are online, some you may have to call your local court house and require where property ownership is located.) You can notify the property owner of the routine dumping by the neighbor.

Video any dumping you see, along with a record of dates, and HOV notification every time he dumps….in the vacant lot and on your property.

You should be able to LOCATE the Survey for your property AND surveyors metal rods that are located at every Legal corner of your property. (Sometimes a foot or so deep, but often can be found with a Map and Magnet.)
You having your LEGAL survey and LEGAL ownership in Hand should assist you in moving your complain along swiftly.

You can ALSO contact the County Health Department and inquire HOW TO make a FORMAL Dumping Complaint. <—> THAT is a good option, IF your HOA continues to ignore your or otherwise be complacent.

You can ALSO (if possible) Ask OTHER neighbors IF they are aware of his Dumping and Trespassing. If so, see if they would be willing to give you a written letter Stating what they have witnessed.

As far as YOUR property….
POST a “NO TRESPASSING…NO DUMPING” sign on your property FACING his Property.

A more drastic measure is Where he put a GATE that opens to YOUR Property….Build a FENCE ON your property parallel the length of his GATE. You could also post your “signs” on that fence. You could also post a “sign” that says property under camera surveillance.

Get your signs UP…Thereafter if he continues to Trespass or Dump on YOUR property…
You can ALSO file a Formal Trespassing AND Dumping Complaint and Formal Charge with your local POLICE Department.

Other Options, is Attending a “CITY” or “COUNTRY” formal government meeting.
(Typically monthly).
For either you typically would need to contact them PRYOR to request Your Name be entered into the meeting DOCKET, (so they will call on you, and you have opportunity to SPEAK to the issue of your COMPLAINT. )

Your HOA is supposed to accept home-owners complaints and follow the associations by-laws of “letters of warnings” concerning Trespassing and Dumping. AND contact higher authority governments, if the Warnings Fail…
Sounds like the HOA has FAILED to do their JOB!

Hope this helps.

Taken

Our property isn't part of the HOA. The HOA community that was constructed a butts our land.

They were contacted though, and even sent pictures of the dumped items. I left a message after but they never responded.

 

[Rockerduck]

Land that is sold is first surveyed, and metal rods mark the corners. The records are located in city/ county “seat” offices and open to the public for viewing and copying.

Requesting a surveyor or putting up a fence can be costly.

Most counties already have LAWS AGAINST Trespassing and Dumping….on government land AND privately owned Land.

Often the County Health Department can be requested to get Involved, even to the point of requesting the “dumper” remove what they “dumped” or the County will clean it up and “get an order for the dumper” to pay the cost….and additional fees and fines are usual when it becomes necessary to get a Court involved.

Those metal rods in your yard has been rusted out or sidewalks were put in and buried them. Fence companies also somehow move them. I've owned six houses and still own over 100 acres and, with my metal detector, still could not find them. There is also a marker in the middle of the road to mark acreage. Then the county comes along a paves over it. How do you find those property markers again? call a surveyor.

 

[Rockerduck]

I had a new house built in a subdivision two years ago and the proper markers were there until the landscapers and their bobcats demolished them. My next door neighbor wanted a fence and the fence company would not install it until a surveyor marked the property lines.

 

[Taken]

Those metal rods in your yard has been rusted out or sidewalks were put in and buried them. Fence companies also somehow move them. I've owned six houses and still own over 100 acres and, with my metal detector, still could not find them. There is also a marker in the middle of the road to mark acreage. Then the county comes along a paves over it. How do you find those property markers again? call a surveyor.

Divided property is divided by an assigned number and the original name of the land parcel along with the surveyor’s dimensions who puts the measurements on a map and files the map with information with the county seat, which is open to the public and typically a map copy included with a buyers official purchasing paperwork.

Not unusual for a land owner have road frontage, dirt, paved, sidewalks, underground utilities, above ground utility poles, which ARE Legal Easements For the Utility Companies to have Legal access, to set, maintain, repair, change, at will of necessity.

Country Acreage, bordered by a road, often Includes the measurement OF the Easement AND to the Center of the Road.

The ISSUE of complaint was regarding an abutment between the private land between two land owners, without an Easement.

I’ve owned city land, (aka a LOT), and country land (aka ACREAGE), and had no issue with FINDING the Common Metal Rod that Divides the Property between My land and a Neighbors land.

I DID NOT use a metal Detector. I used the Surveyors Map, A Tape Measure, Math to Calculate the dimensions, A shovel to remove some of the grass (particularly on a LOT, where by dirt, sod, or gravel had be added), AND a strong Rare Earth Magnet.

Regarding FENCING between neighbors…
Any individual can erect a Fence, which at first glance IMPLIES a PROPERTY DIVISION, (between private land owners, AND where a Utility Easement Begins and Ends.)
Private Land owners, MAY or MAY NOT erect a fence ON the Property Line, which an individual MAY ASSUME is correct or MAY CHECK and discover the fence IS OVER the Line encroaching on the neighbors property.

And NO, a Fence Company or Individual IS NOT LEGALLY ALLOWED to “REMOVE” a surveyors ROD, without Legally Applying for a NEW SURVEY to be conducted.

BTW, ANY Foliage, (tree branches for example) that Hangs in the air OVER the Division Line to an others Property, Becomes that Others Property, that they CAN Legally Cut, Trim, Pick Fruit from, etc.

* The ISSUE at hand was BETWEEN TWO private land owners, CROSSING and DUMPING A FORBIDDEN BOUNDARY, which Lawfully IS Called TRESPASSING.

* Scripturally TRESPASSING was Established to have a NEGATIVE Consequence.

* Secularly US was Established UPON the Standards and Principles OF the Word of God…which Includes TRESPASSING and a NEGATIVE Consequence Against the Trespasser.

* An individual who is Trespassed Against, HAS the LEGAL “option” to DO nothing, Try to Settle the issue Between them and the Trespasser, OR appeal to a Higher Authority, ie. A Government Agency, to settle the matter, According TO the Law…(The positive Law AND the negative Law (ie Consequences of fines, fees, and otherwise amending the invasive results of their Trespassing.)

Scripturally, A trespasser who is sorry and amends his Trespasses, (is Scripturally Taught (not Required) for the one Trespassed against …to Forgive the Trespasser)

Secularly, No forgiveness toward a Trespasser IS Required, but may be suggested by upstanding authorities.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[BlessedPeace]

Divided property is divided by an assigned number and the original name of the land parcel along with the surveyor’s dimensions who puts the measurements on a map and files the map with information with the county seat, which is open to the public and typically a map copy included with a buyers official purchasing paperwork.

Not unusual for a land owner have road frontage, dirt, paved, sidewalks, underground utilities, above ground utility poles, which ARE Legal Easements For the Utility Companies to have Legal access, to set, maintain, repair, change, at will of necessity.

Country Acreage, bordered by a road, often Includes the measurement OF the Easement AND to the Center of the Road.

The ISSUE of complaint was regarding an abutment between the private land between two land owners, without an Easement.

I’ve owned city land, (aka a LOT), and country land (aka ACREAGE), and had no issue with FINDING the Common Metal Rod that Divides the Property between My land and a Neighbors land.

I DID NOT use a metal Detector. I used the Surveyors Map, A Tape Measure, Math to Calculate the dimensions, A shovel to remove some of the grass (particularly on a LOT, where by dirt, sod, or gravel had be added), AND a strong Rare Earth Magnet.

Regarding FENCING between neighbors…
Any individual can erect a Fence, which at first glance IMPLIES a PROPERTY DIVISION, (between private land owners, AND where a Utility Easement Begins and Ends.)
Private Land owners, MAY or MAY NOT erect a fence ON the Property Line, which an individual MAY ASSUME is correct or MAY CHECK and discover the fence IS OVER the Line encroaching on the neighbors property.

And NO, a Fence Company or Individual IS NOT LEGALLY ALLOWED to “REMOVE” a surveyors ROD, without Legally Applying for a NEW SURVEY to be conducted.

BTW, ANY Foliage, (tree branches for example) that Hangs in the air OVER the Division Line to an others Property, Becomes that Others Property, that they CAN Legally Cut, Trim, Pick Fruit from, etc.

* The ISSUE at hand was BETWEEN TWO private land owners, CROSSING and DUMPING A FORBIDDEN BOUNDARY, which Lawfully IS Called TRESPASSING.

* Scripturally TRESPASSING was Established to have a NEGATIVE Consequence.

* Secularly US was Established UPON the Standards and Principles OF the Word of God…which Includes TRESPASSING and a NEGATIVE Consequence Against the Trespasser.

* An individual who is Trespassed Against, HAS the LEGAL “option” to DO nothing, Try to Settle the issue Between them and the Trespasser, OR appeal to a Higher Authority, ie. A Government Agency, to settle the matter, According TO the Law…(The positive Law AND the negative Law (ie Consequences of fines, fees, and otherwise amending the invasive results of their Trespassing.)

Scripturally, A trespasser who is sorry and amends his Trespasses, (is Scripturally Taught (not Required) for the one Trespassed against …to Forgive the Trespasser)

Secularly, No forgiveness toward a Trespasser IS Required, but may be suggested by upstanding authorities.

Glory to God,
Taken

Sadly, this trespasser is obstinate. My sister tried to satisfy the conflict positively and he wasn't having it. He's trespassed and dumped truckloads of household items on that lot , for years!

I pick up where she left off. This Tuesday I am free to call around and see what can be done.

None of his neighbors in that community are fans of his. Sad really.

 

[Taken]

Sadly, this trespasser is obstinate. My sister tried to satisfy the conflict positively and he wasn't having it. He's trespassed and dumped truckloads of household items on that lot , for years!

I pick up where she left off. This Tuesday I am free to call around and see what can be done.

None of his neighbors in that community are fans of his. Sad really.

As you pursue remember to keep a journal of sorts, “with dates”, as possible. The Preface can be a general statement, of your sisters attempts to reason (past history), complaints of other neighbors and your attempts with your HOA, general time-line. Trespassing AND Dumping ON your property.

Since he routinely dumps on a property adjacent to yours…Health Dept is a good option, since piles of junk is a haven for mice and rats. Ask their advice of what they can legally do. Still I would try to discover who owns that property, attempt to contact them, with photos. Yes, have photos/ videos.

The Trespassing (with him erecting a gate to your property), is suspect and something you can file with your local Sheriff’s Office.
It would be highly to your advantage to video him dumping and immediately notify police.
(May sound silly, but if he uses for example a truck or trailer to dump, and you can get a photo of any tire tracks he leaves, get a photo of that too, and the make/ model/ color and plate number of his vehicle in your notes.) Making a complaint is verbal, then written, and the more evidence you have, the more likely authorities will investigate and bring charges if he fails to cooperate with “them”.

A nuisance neighbor is an exhausting thing to repeatedly have to deal with. sorry for your issue. Hope you get some relief.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[BlessedPeace]

As you pursue remember to keep a journal of sorts, “with dates”, as possible. The Preface can be a general statement, of your sisters attempts to reason (past history), complaints of other neighbors and your attempts with your HOA, general time-line. Trespassing AND Dumping ON your property.

Since he routinely dumps on a property adjacent to yours…Health Dept is a good option, since piles of junk is a haven for mice and rats. Ask their advice of what they can legally do. Still I would try to discover who owns that property, attempt to contact them, with photos. Yes, have photos/ videos.

The Trespassing (with him erecting a gate to your property), is suspect and something you can file with your local Sheriff’s Office.
It would be highly to your advantage to video him dumping and immediately notify police.
(May sound silly, but if he uses for example a truck or trailer to dump, and you can get a photo of any tire tracks he leaves, get a photo of that too, and the make/ model/ color and plate number of his vehicle in your notes.) Making a complaint is verbal, then written, and the more evidence you have, the more likely authorities will investigate and bring charges if he fails to cooperate with “them”.

A nuisance neighbor is an exhausting thing to repeatedly have to deal with. sorry for your issue. Hope you get some relief.

Glory to God,
Taken

Thank you for your detailed advice. Far more helpful than what I would have thought to make a simple matter .

Yes, it is exhausting.

When he first bought the lot and moved into the finished house, my sister was going to get mailbox. She had to step aside as he drove past her , up her drive and turned onto his open lawn. He put the fence up years later.

She approached him and his wife and kindly let them know about the property boundary he'd just violated.

He told her he was a nurse at a mental health hospital about 5 miles north. And he took that shortcut to save time on his lunch hour.
Otherwise, he'd have to travel another mile to access the community entrance and then wind his way to his street .

She sympathized and said if it was just for that occasion, he could proceed.

Big mistake. She didn't know he was a give me an inch and I'll take a mile type guy.

Personally, I don't know how people presume to be that rude.

 

[Taken]

Thank you for your detailed advice. Far more helpful than what I would have thought to make a simple matter .

Yes, it is exhausting.

When he first bought the lot and moved into the finished house, my sister was going to get mailbox. She had to step aside as he drove past her , up her drive and turned onto his open lawn. He put the fence up years later.

She approached him and his wife and kindly let them know about the property boundary he'd just violated.

He told her he was a nurse at a mental health hospital about 5 miles north. And he took that shortcut to save time on his lunch hour.
Otherwise, he'd have to travel another mile to access the community entrance and then wind his way to his street .

She sympathized and said if it was just for that occasion, he could proceed.

Big mistake. She didn't know he was a give me an inch and I'll take a mile type guy.

Personally, I don't know how people presume to be that rude.

Wow. Sounds more like he was an outpatient than an employee at that facility. And if truly an employee, creepy he may have access to mind altering drugs, that he could potentially be more dangerous than a nuisance.
Be cautious, but stand your ground with higher authorities assistance.

 

[Jay Ross]

Hello,

When I was working supervising the laying of Gas mains in the street, we would have the boundaries of the roadway pegged. In one instance, because of an obstruction on the footpath section of the road corridor, the pie had to be laid very close to the pegged road boundary. This was not a problem.

Several years later, this property was developed, and the property was subdivided. When these surveyors initially pegged the boundaries of this development property from a reference point on the other side of the development property, they surveyors moved the property boundary one metre into what have been previously pegged by surveyors as the road corridor.

I believe that you need to check the cadastral plans around your property to see if there was a road corridor that separated your property from the adjacent property in question.

Before you go any further, you need to establish where the property's boundary is before you go any further. What you believe is your property may actually be a road corridor and your "problem" neighbour may well be in his rights to have a gate onto that road corridor. If his dumping of rubbish is in a road corridor, then the problem of his dumping is a problem for the local authority to solve.

In the development of the adjacent estate, the developer may have believed that he would easily obtain your property to add to his development later and as such he may have encroached into what you believe is "your land."

Walk hand in hand with God on this issue as it may get bigger than Ben Hur to become a war. Let God prompt you as to what you should do. Do not let your emotions control your decisions, but approach the issues rationally doing your research first and let the research reveal the truth of the matters in question.

Greedy people often do bad things.

Shalom