Tell Us Why There Is Both Historic and Ongoing Disagreement Upon All of Scripture.

[amadeus]

Pewsitting church talkers only know how to be double minded. They equate words with actions, and their ideas with reality. They go from narrative to narrative.

Is that your activity?

Special for an old minister of God

 

[Bob Estey]

Within Christendom.

Every Theological tenet, every Doctrine, every context, every thematic principle, every intent of God through any given writer is under discussion, debate, and divergent assessment. There is no standard model, even within single denominations. Everybody looks to fabricate their own understanding. Commonality of belief does clump together, but actual unity rarely comes forward.

The 3000 years of Scriptural authorship and the First Church epoch contained significant unity, notwithstanding the actual heresies of tares, Gnosticism, remnant Judaism, Nicolaitanism, and Paganism.

Today, there is neither drive nor effect for unity in Doctrine or Theology, in Practice or Worship, in historic narrative or textual verity. How can this be, given the incredible power and authority of God's written Word, revealed by the promise of The Holy Spirit to those who read and study it?

Do not waste our time placing blame or accusation. Do not speak to some other issue. Do not give dismissive chit chat. Do not wax long with academic obfuscation. Do not give preachy sounding church talk babble. Do not repeat or revise this question to allow a soap box answer. Just identify how such ongoing disagreement can be stopped.

Some people don't have the discipline to obey the Lord's commandments, so they devise a theology that doesn't require them to.

People who believe the entire Bible is the Word of God will disagree with those who believe the Word of God are those times the Lord is quoted.

 

[Jared42]

Some people don't have the discipline to obey the Lord's commandments, so they devise a theology that doesn't require them to.

People who believe the entire Bible is the Word of God will disagree with those who believe the Word of God are those times the Lord is quoted.

Some people think the works of obedience will give them Salvation. That is called legalism. They are deluded.

 

[Bob Estey]

Some people think the works of obedience will give them Salvation. That is called legalism. They are deluded.

But sin gets us into a lot of trouble, so the Lord taught us not to sin.

 

[Jared42]

But sin gets us into a lot of trouble, so the Lord taught us not to sin.

Does effort to not sin result in justification?

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Does effort to not sin result in justification?

Yes. James' justification. Not to be confused with the justification Paul talks about.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Some people think the works of obedience will give them Salvation. That is called legalism. They are deluded.

A few rouge denominations believe that as part of their official doctrine, but for the most part it is unsaved unbelievers outside of the true church of God, who inhabit the big mainline denominations of the world, that believe that.

 

[Jared42]

A few rouge denominations believe that as part of their official doctrine, but for the most part it is unsaved unbelievers outside of the true church of God, who inhabit the big mainline denominations of the world, that believe that.

How do you know that?

 

[Bob Estey]

Does effort to not sin result in justification?

No, effort not to sin keeps us out of trouble.

 

[Jared42]

No, effort not to sin keeps us out of trouble.

Does that effort result in justification before God?

 

[Jared42]

No, effort not to sin keeps us out of trouble.

False. Righteous people still experience trouble. Job. Apostle Paul. Jesus. John the Baptizer. Early Church Martyrs.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

False. Righteous people still experience trouble. Job. Apostle Paul. Jesus. John the Baptizer. Early Church Martyrs.

I know what he's saying. If you do not sin you will not suffer because of sin. But you may suffer persecution. Wouldn't it be better if the only reason Christians suffered is because of persecution and not because they sinned?

"Indeed, none of you should suffer as a murderer or thief or wrongdoer, or even as a meddler. But if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but glorify God that you bear that name." 1 Peter 4:15-16
​

 

[Ferris Bueller]

How do you know that?

I come from the church of the world. I was raised in it. Then I was born again and discovered the world of the Holy Spirit and the real church that I didn't even know existed.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Just identify how such ongoing disagreement can be stopped.

As long as there are unsaved people who don't have the Spirit in our churches we will have false doctrines that disagree with the truth. They are the ones that cause dissention from the truth.

"These are the ones who cause divisions, who are worldly and devoid of the Spirit." Jude 1:19​

 

[Jared42]

As long as there are unsaved people who don't have the Spirit in our churches we will have false doctrines that disagree with the truth. They are the ones that cause dissention from the truth.

"These are the ones who cause divisions, who are worldly and devoid of the Spirit." Jude 1:19​

As long as we have dishonest people in church who have deficient reading skills, theyveill be speaking delusion they refuse to be accountable for.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

As long as we have dishonest people in church who have deficient reading skills, theyveill be speaking delusion they refuse to be accountable for.

I actually started my first post directly addressing the OP with the word 'Dishonesty'. Then I deleted it and went with a different approach.

From a human perspective, dishonesty is in fact why we have historic and ongoing disagreement in Christianity. People eventually see the truth but, mainly because of pride (and not having the Spirit) they dishonestly persist in what they want to believe. It's quite annoying, and very destructive, but that's the way it is. It will be that way until the end. But as Jesus promised, the gates of hell will not overcome his church. Those who will receive salvation will in fact receive salvation and be saved. Because, ultimately, no gate of hell can keep them. No deception will be allowed to deceive those God knows will love righteousness and receive the gospel.

 

[Bob Estey]

Does that effort result in justification before God?

The word "justification" seems important to you. We need no justification before God, because he loves us. And because he loves us, he will discipline us, when necessary.

 

[Bob Estey]

False. Righteous people still experience trouble. Job. Apostle Paul. Jesus. John the Baptizer. Early Church Martyrs.

We will all experience trouble (none of us is perfect, and Jesus was our sacrificial lamb), but you will reduce your trouble tremendously if you repent of your sin.

 

[Jared42]

We will all experience trouble (none of us is perfect, and Jesus was our sacrificial lamb), but you will reduce your trouble tremendously if you repent of your sin.

 

[Jared42]

The word "justification" seems important to you. We need no justification before God, because he loves us. And because he loves us, he will discipline us, when necessary.

Justification is specified in Scripture, not by me. Learn to read.