When the tribulation period begins, there will be much debate whether it has started or not. God has provided a secondary sign (a sign which will confirm the tribulation period has started) which will take place 255 days after the tribulation period begins. This sign is found in the vision of the two horned ram by Daniel. The details are found in the following verses.Dan 8: 13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to him, "How long will it take for the vision to be fulfilled—the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender of the sanctuary and of the host that will be trampled underfoot?" 14 He said to me, "It will take 2,300 evenings and mornings; then the sanctuary will be reconsecrated."If you review the entire chapter of Daniel 8 you will see that events transpire as follows:1. The A/C downs “starry host” and tramples them underfoot2. The A/C desecrates the temples (the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender of the sanctuary)3. The sanctuary(Temple) is reconsecrated....for a duration of 2300 days.According to the OT, the temple mount, if desecrated must be reconsecrated before sacrifices and worship can be started. At some time when the yet-to-be built Temple is being built the mount will have to be reconsecrated because it has been defiled for centuries. The minute the A/C steps in the holy place and proclaims himself God, the temple will again be defiled and will remain desecrated until the advent of Christ where Christ the High Priest will reconsecrate the mount again.This reconsecration of the sanctuary by Christ provides us with an endpoint of this 2300 day vision. And we know that the A/C will desecrate the temple 1263 ½ days before the advent of Christ. The significance of this vision is that the A/C will down “starry host” 2300 days before TDOL. And both the tribulation period and this vision of the 2300 days both end with TDOL.The tribulation period is supposed to be seven years in duration. 7 x 365 = 2555If you subtract 2300 days from the 2555 you have a difference of 255 days. So, if the tribulation period is seven years in duration then the “starry host” will be downed by the A/C 255 days after the start of the tribulation period. What or who the “starry host” are is a whole different topic.In Yehoshua,Guy Smith
the 2300 day vision
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I always wondered how we would really know when the tribulation period had begun, now I got something to look for...eventually. Thanks Guy Smith
(guysmith;28522)
When the tribulation period begins, there will be much debate whether it has started or not. God has provided a secondary sign (a sign which will confirm the tribulation period has started) which will take place 255 days after the tribulation period begins. This sign is found in the vision of the two horned ram by Daniel. The details are found in the following verses.Dan 8: 13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to him, "How long will it take for the vision to be fulfilled—the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender of the sanctuary and of the host that will be trampled underfoot?" 14 He said to me, "It will take 2,300 evenings and mornings; then the sanctuary will be reconsecrated."If you review the entire chapter of Daniel 8 you will see that events transpire as follows:1. The A/C downs “starry host” and tramples them underfoot2. The A/C desecrates the temples (the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender of the sanctuary)3. The sanctuary(Temple) is reconsecrated....for a duration of 2300 days.According to the OT, the temple mount, if desecrated must be reconsecrated before sacrifices and worship can be started. At some time when the yet-to-be built Temple is being built the mount will have to be reconsecrated because it has been defiled for centuries. The minute the A/C steps in the holy place and proclaims himself God, the temple will again be defiled and will remain desecrated until the advent of Christ where Christ the High Priest will reconsecrate the mount again.This reconsecration of the sanctuary by Christ provides us with an endpoint of this 2300 day vision. And we know that the A/C will desecrate the temple 1263 ½ days before the advent of Christ. The significance of this vision is that the A/C will down “starry host” 2300 days before TDOL. And both the tribulation period and this vision of the 2300 days both end with TDOL.The tribulation period is supposed to be seven years in duration. 7 x 365 = 2555If you subtract 2300 days from the 2555 you have a difference of 255 days. So, if the tribulation period is seven years in duration then the “starry host” will be downed by the A/C 255 days after the start of the tribulation period. What or who the “starry host” are is a whole different topic.In Yehoshua,Guy Smith
My problem with this is that the tribulation period is shortened to 5.months for the Elects sake (150 days) Rev. 9:5 and 9:10 both tell us Antichrist will only be here five months. The seven years is not changed it stands as it is but the actual time of the Antichrist being on earth before the Return of the Lord is 5 mo.
When the tribulation period begins, there will be much debate whether it has started or not. God has provided a secondary sign (a sign which will confirm the tribulation period has started) which will take place 255 days after the tribulation period begins. This sign is found in the vision of the two horned ram by Daniel. The details are found in the following verses.Dan 8: 13 Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to him, "How long will it take for the vision to be fulfilled—the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender of the sanctuary and of the host that will be trampled underfoot?" 14 He said to me, "It will take 2,300 evenings and mornings; then the sanctuary will be reconsecrated."If you review the entire chapter of Daniel 8 you will see that events transpire as follows:1. The A/C downs “starry host” and tramples them underfoot2. The A/C desecrates the temples (the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender of the sanctuary)3. The sanctuary(Temple) is reconsecrated....for a duration of 2300 days.According to the OT, the temple mount, if desecrated must be reconsecrated before sacrifices and worship can be started. At some time when the yet-to-be built Temple is being built the mount will have to be reconsecrated because it has been defiled for centuries. The minute the A/C steps in the holy place and proclaims himself God, the temple will again be defiled and will remain desecrated until the advent of Christ where Christ the High Priest will reconsecrate the mount again.This reconsecration of the sanctuary by Christ provides us with an endpoint of this 2300 day vision. And we know that the A/C will desecrate the temple 1263 ½ days before the advent of Christ. The significance of this vision is that the A/C will down “starry host” 2300 days before TDOL. And both the tribulation period and this vision of the 2300 days both end with TDOL.The tribulation period is supposed to be seven years in duration. 7 x 365 = 2555If you subtract 2300 days from the 2555 you have a difference of 255 days. So, if the tribulation period is seven years in duration then the “starry host” will be downed by the A/C 255 days after the start of the tribulation period. What or who the “starry host” are is a whole different topic.In Yehoshua,Guy Smith
My problem with this is that the tribulation period is shortened to 5.months for the Elects sake (150 days) Rev. 9:5 and 9:10 both tell us Antichrist will only be here five months. The seven years is not changed it stands as it is but the actual time of the Antichrist being on earth before the Return of the Lord is 5 mo.
(followerofchrist;28545)
I always wondered how we would really know when the tribulation period had begun, now I got something to look for...eventually. Thanks Guy Smith
The thing about Satan(antichrist) is we need to understand his motive he wants to be God (Christ) it's what he has wanted from day one when he became filled with pride and iniquity was found in him. So he is the big imposter , a pretender, a copy cat if you will, he will mimic what Christ will do. Just as Guy has described above about the temple Antichrist(Satan will attempt to consecreate it but that is an abomination to God (abomination of Desolartion) in doing this he actullay desacrates the temple. But you see in this his attempt to mimic Christ actions (this is why he is called the Antichrist anti = instead of the true one) Now watch here what Luke says about the coming of Antichrist (Satan) Luk 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.Notice he is falling from heaven Now look at what happens when the true Christ returnsMat 24:27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Notice we see the lightning from east to west Luk 17:24 For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one [part] under heaven, shineth unto the other [part] under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day. See how Satan will fake the lightning So as to appear to be christthats why we need to know Satan comes first the 6th trump Christ will not return until the 7th and last.because he will be pretending to be christ.
I always wondered how we would really know when the tribulation period had begun, now I got something to look for...eventually. Thanks Guy Smith
The thing about Satan(antichrist) is we need to understand his motive he wants to be God (Christ) it's what he has wanted from day one when he became filled with pride and iniquity was found in him. So he is the big imposter , a pretender, a copy cat if you will, he will mimic what Christ will do. Just as Guy has described above about the temple Antichrist(Satan will attempt to consecreate it but that is an abomination to God (abomination of Desolartion) in doing this he actullay desacrates the temple. But you see in this his attempt to mimic Christ actions (this is why he is called the Antichrist anti = instead of the true one) Now watch here what Luke says about the coming of Antichrist (Satan) Luk 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.Notice he is falling from heaven Now look at what happens when the true Christ returnsMat 24:27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Notice we see the lightning from east to west Luk 17:24 For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one [part] under heaven, shineth unto the other [part] under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day. See how Satan will fake the lightning So as to appear to be christthats why we need to know Satan comes first the 6th trump Christ will not return until the 7th and last.because he will be pretending to be christ.
Kriss,You stated: My problem with this is that the tribulation period is shortened to 5.months for the Elects sake (150 days) Rev. 9:5 and 9:10 both tell us Antichrist will only be here five months. The seven years is not changed it stands as it is but the actual time of the Antichrist being on earth before the Return of the Lord is 5 mo.My response: I'm sorry, I do not see it, however, I am willing to discuss it. You need to provide more details as how you came to this conclusion.In Yehoshua,Guy Smith
The actual tribulation does not begin until Antichrist (Satan) arrives on earth.We have the first four trumps the one world system ect. the deadly wound all coming into being.But the event of the Tribulation is about the hour of temptation.that is when Antichrist will tempt us.That one hour in Gods time (2 Pet.3:8 ) 2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day [is] with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. This understimated verse was a hidden mystery revealed by Peter and is one of the main keys to unlocking the timing of certain things ONE HOUR in Gods time is 5 months the hour of temptation is five(5) earthly Months. This is the tribulation.We are told in Rev. 12 that Satan (antichrist) is currently held by Michael untill he is kicked out of heaven to the earth with his fallen angels (his Locust Army)then we are told in Rev.9 that Satan and his Army have 5 months Rev.9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. (Luke also tells us of this)Star is translated as angel here. Just as in Revelation 1:20, "the stars are the angels." 9:2 And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. A counterfeit has appeared, shown by the darkness of the sun and the air. Just the opposite of what happens when Christ comes. 9:3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power. The locust devours everything in it's path, but these were not like regular locust that feed on the grass or plants. They had the power like the scorpion. A scorpion stings with power in it's tail and paralyzes it's victims. Then it's body fluids turn it's victim to mush before it devours it. Just like Satan does with the minds of people. 9:4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. The locust army is commanded to hurt those without the seal of God in their minds. What is the seal of God? The Word of God! A working knowledge of the Word and God's overall plan, so you cannot be tempted or deceived by Satan and receive his mark, also known as "the beast mark." This locust army was sent by God among His own people, and is spoken of in "Joel 2:25-31" when it speaks of the outpouring of God's spirit, just before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes! They cannot hurt the ones with the seal of God in their heads because they have power over them and over Satan, as stated in the Book of Luke. Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. (Luke 10:19) They can only hurt the one's who follow Satan! Rev.9:5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man. For five months their minds will be turned to mush because of the flood of lies and deception. Satan will steal your thought process right from you and you will be in his control!9:10 And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months. Remember that they cannot touch those who have the seal of God, but can hurt all others. They will only have five months of power! Now, when will this five month period take place? No one knows the exact date, but Christ does tell us the time period when referring to the locust. (The time of the locust is May through September). This is the natural time of the locust, and God always uses nature in His Word to give us insight and clues in the Word. 9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon. Satan is their king; Apollyon means destroyer. Satan is the destroyer and son of perdition, playing his roll as anti-Christ. This is spoken of in "II Corinthians 11:13-15" when false apostles are transforming themselves into apostles of Christ, and Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. In the Strong's, "transformed" is to "transfigure or disguise." Strong's #3345 in the Greek dictionary. So we see that Satan and his locusts Army only have five Months(to men) = One Hour (to God)
The way I see it, the locusts have 5 months to torment but it doesn't say that 'Apollyon' has only 5 months. I think that after the 5 months the locust plague will cease but they are the only thing that will go away after the 5 months.
This locust plague is Satans army of fallen Angels not literal locusts notice they can not harm the grass or plants This is the Hour of Temptation the tribulation itself not just a plagueRev12:12 "Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time."
this is another example of me taking things to literally, this happened on another topic already today.
(followerofchrist;28620)
this is another example of me taking things to literally, this happened on another topic already today.
I would rather you take it to literal and be willing to learn deeper truths than to believe some man made symbolism:)
this is another example of me taking things to literally, this happened on another topic already today.
I would rather you take it to literal and be willing to learn deeper truths than to believe some man made symbolism:)
Kriss,I understand your point, however, I still disagree with your conclusion concerning the five months. There are some objections that you must overcome if you are to change mine and other peoples minds .You stated:The locust army is commanded to hurt those without the seal of God in their minds. ......This locust army was sent by God among His own people, and is spoken of in "Joel 2:25-31" when it speaks of the outpouring of God's spirit, just before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes! My response: I agree. This does not show that the Satan will rule for only 5 months. Notice that we are provided with a reference which tells us when the plague of the fifth trumpet will occur. If you agree that the seals, trumps and vials are in order, then the fifth trumpet will occur shortly after the event where the “sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood.”Rev 6:12And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;Christ clarifies that this event will take place after the 1260 days of the Great Tribulation.Mat 24: 29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:Which means that the 150 days (in relation to the fifth trump) spans five months into the millennium. Which means this plague is not from Satan, because his power stops on TDOL.That said, you have made an observation which I have also seen but I have drawn a different conclusion.You stated:The locust army is commanded to hurt those without the seal of God in their minds. ......This locust army was sent by God among His own people, and is spoken of in "Joel 2:25-31" when it speaks of the outpouring of God's spirit, just before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes! They cannot hurt the ones with the seal of God in their heads because they have power over them and over Satan, as stated in the Book of Luke. Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. (Luke 10:19) They can only hurt the one's who follow Satan! My response: You are correct. I think you will agree that the only Christians alive at the sounding of the fifth trumpet are these people that have been sealed. Where our conclusions differ is that I have found that the ones that have been sealed are the 144,000.Rev 7: 3Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. 4And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel. And where will the 144,000 be for the duration of the GT?Revelation 14The Lamb and the 144,000 1Then I looked, and there before me was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads.In Yehoshua,Guy SmithJoel 2:31 The sun will be turned to darkness and the moon to blood before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD. 32 And everyone who calls on the name of the LORD will be saved; for on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there will be deliverance, as the LORD has aid, among the survivors whom the LORD calls.
(followerofchrist;28620)
this is another example of me taking things to literally, this happened on another topic already today.
are you talking about me
this is another example of me taking things to literally, this happened on another topic already today.
are you talking about me
(Letsgofishing;28691)
are you talking about me
I am talking about both of us! :study: (maybe I should build an ark too...)
are you talking about me
I am talking about both of us! :study: (maybe I should build an ark too...)
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