Was Mary Magdalene the sister of Lazarus?

[Grailhunter]

Since you only accept scriptural evidence, and there is no scriptural evidence linking Jesus's casting out seven demons from Mary the Magdalene to PMS (), then why do you believe it? And, would the casting out of PMS from Mary the Magdalene have been a one-time or monthly event?

I did not say I believe it, I said I suspected it. We do not know for sure. The scriptures say He cast our demons so that is fine with me.

 

[Grailhunter]

That's not an answer to what I asked. You said, "Everything she [Mary the Magdalene] did was moral." Again, are you saying everything that Mary the Magdalene did from birth to death was moral? Or, everything that she did throughout her childhood was moral? Or, everything that throughout her adulthood was moral? Or, did you misspeak?

Everything that the scriptures attest to her doing was moral and that she was a respected individual. That is not an account of a minute by minute of her life. I am sure she made mistakes just like you and I have.

 

[Sabé]

It appears that five women anointed Christ [...]

But, only two of those women, the well-known repentant woman, and Mary the Magdalene, both of whom were great sinners, anointed Jesus with ointment and wiped His feet with their hair. Why are those details insufficient reasons to deduce that they were the same person?

Do we have an example in the scriptures of immorality causing demon possession? Of the exorcisms today was the demon possession caused by immoral behavior?

Since you don't know, go find out, so that you can come back and give your answer of "yes" or "no" to the following question: Is immoral behavior a result of being possessed by a demonic spirit?

I did not say I believe it, I said I suspected it.

Suspecting is a lesser degree of belief where uncertainty still exists. So, again, why do you believe it to have been possible that the seven demons Jesus cast out of Mary the Magdalene were a severe case of PMS () when there is no scriptural evidence to support that, and you only accept as true what is indicated in Scripture? And, again, would the casting out of PMS from Mary the Magdalene have been a one-time or monthly event?

Everything that the scriptures attest to her doing was moral and that she was a respected individual. That is not an account of a minute by minute of her life. I am sure she made mistakes just like you and I have.

Thank you for clarifying yourself. So, you believe that there is no indication of how Mary the Madalene sinned, but that she did commit sins, and thus there's no type of sinful (immoral) behavior that she could've committed, such as, for example, prostitution, that is off the table for consideration?

 

[Muna]

Suspecting is a lesser degree of belief where uncertainty still exists. So, again, since you only accept scriptural evidence, and there is no scriptural evidence linking Jesus's casting out seven demons from Mary the Magdalene to PMS (), then why do you believe it to be a possibility in your mind? And, would the casting out of PMS from Mary the Magdalene have been a one-time or monthly event?

 

[Grailhunter]

But, only two of those women, the repentant prostitute and Mary the Magdalene, both of whom were great sinners, anointed Jesus with expensive ointment using their hair in Bethany. Why are those details insufficient reasons to deduce that they were the same woman?

No where in the scriptures do they refer to Mary Magdalene as a “great sinner”

 

[Grailhunter]

Since you don't know, go find out, so that you can come back and give your answer of "yes" or "no" to the following question: Is immoral behavior a result of being possessed by a demonic spirit?

I know of no examples of that.

 

[Grailhunter]

Suspecting is a lesser degree of belief where uncertainty still exists. So, again, since you only accept scriptural evidence, and there is no scriptural evidence linking Jesus's casting out seven demons from Mary the Magdalene to PMS (), then why do you believe it to be a possibility in your mind? And, would the casting out of PMS from Mary the Magdalene have been a one-time or monthly event?

I do suspect things that are not defined in the scriptures, but they stay in that category as something that is possible. Not try to tell some one that it is a fact.​

For example I suspect it is possible that the marriage at Cana was between Mary the mother of Christ. And I suspect that the women that were at the cross with Christ while the male apostles were hiding, were female apostles.​

​

 

[Grailhunter]

Thank you for clarifying yourself. So, you believe that there is no implicit/explicit indication in Scripture that Mary the Magdalene sinned, nor of how she sinned, but that she did commit sins, and thus there's no type of sinful (immoral) behavior that she could've committed, such as, for example, prostitution, that is off the table for discussion?

She was human....all have sinned and have fallen short of the glory of God. But the scriptures do not say she or anyone else had demons because of something they had done.

 

[Sabé]

No where in the scriptures do they refer to Mary Magdalene as a “great sinner”

The Bible is a book compiled from many other books pertaining to good and evil, mortal and spiritual beings, e.g., "God", "angels", "demons", "humans", "sin", etc., and how they interact with and impact one another on this planet called Earth and beyond. The scriptural verse that indicates Mary the Magdalene was a great sinner prior to her conversion is Lk. 8:2, because the Evangelist wrote that Jesus "cast out seven demons" from her, and thus "healing her of evil spirits and infirmities." Therefore, you'd have to be drunk as Noah to think that being possessed by seven demonic spirits makes for a minor sinner, or a woman with a severe case of PMS.

Now, back to the point, only the unnamed repentant woman, and Mary the Magdalene, two great sinners, did so with ointment and wiped His feet with their hair. Again, why are those details insufficient reasons to deduce that they were the same person?

I know of no examples of that.

One not being aware of something does not mean that it isn't true. Besides, I didn't ask if immorality causes demonic possession, but rather if immoral behavior is a result of being possessed by a demonic spirit?

I do suspect things that are not defined in the scriptures, but they stay in that category as something that is possible.

You not only say that you have suspected beliefs, but that you only accept scriptural evidence as well. So, again, why do you believe it to have been possible that the seven demons Jesus cast out of Mary the Magdalene were a severe case of PMS when there is no scriptural evidence to support that, and you only accept as true what is indicated in Scripture? And, again, would the casting out of PMS from Mary the Magdalene have been a one-time or monthly event?

She was human....all have sinned and have fallen short of the glory of God.

Regarding Mary the Magdalene, you believe that there is no indication in Scripture of how she sinned, but that she did commit sins. Do you understand that to believe that means there's no type of sinful (immoral) behavior that she could've committed, such as, for example, prostitution, that is off the table for consideration?

 

[Grailhunter]

The Bible is a book compiled of many books pertaining to good and evil mortal and spiritual beings, e.g., "God", "angels", "demons", "humans", and how they interact with one another on this planet called Earth and beyond. The scriptural verse that indicates Mary the Magdalene was a great sinner prior to her conversion is Lk. 8:2, because the Evangelist wrote that Jesus "cast out seven demons" from her, and thus "healing her of evil spirits and infirmities." Therefore, you'd have to be drunk as Noah to think that being possessed by seven demonic spirits makes for a minor sinner, or a woman with a severe case of PMS.

Now, back to the point, only two of the five women who have anointed Jesus, the repentant prostitute, a well-known sinner, and Mary the Magdalene, from whom Jesus cast out seven demons, anointed Jesus with expensive ointment using their hair in Bethany. Again, why are those details insufficient reasons to deduce that they were the same woman?

Again find an example of someone demon possessed because of something they did.
And the scriptures never say that Mary Magdalene was a great sinner.
You keep overriding the scriptures with what you believe. Have you ever considered writing your own Bible? It would be a lot easier than beating your head up against what the Word of God says. What you believe is not in the scriptures.
I would imagine that you have a lot of non-biblical beliefs because you just make it up as you go.

 

[Grailhunter]

You not only say that you have suspected beliefs, but that you also only accept scriptural evidence. So, again, since there is no scriptural evidence linking Jesus's casting out seven demons from Mary the Magdalene to PMS () as you say, then why do you believe it to be a possibility in your mind? And, again, would the casting out of PMS from Mary the Magdalene have been a one-time or monthly event?

Facts and possibilities are two different things.

 

[Grailhunter]

Regarding Mary the Magdalene, you believe that there is no implicit/explicit indication in Scripture that she sinned, nor of how she sinned, but that she did commit sins. Do you understand that to believe all of that means there's no type of sinful (immoral) behavior that she could've committed, such as, for example, prostitution, that is off the table for discussion?

Nothing in the scriptures even suggest that Mary Magdalene was a prostitute.
We have discussed this enough.

 

[Sabé]

And the scriptures never say that Mary Magdalene was a great sinner.

Is Mary the Magdalene explicitly called "a great sinner" by an Evangelist or any other character in the Gospels? No, but here's a helpful tidbit: there's more than one way to say something. And, fortunately for me, your unwillingness to accept or inability to understand the way in which it is said in Scripture that Mary the Magdalene was a great sinner still bears no effect on the following point: only two women who had anointed Jesus, the unnamed repentant woman, and Mary the Magdalene, two great sinners, did so with ointment and wiped His feet with their hair. Again, why are those details insufficient reasons to deduce that they were the same person?

You have yet to show that Mary Magdalene by name did anything immoral.

Again, Jesus cast out seven demons from Mary the Magdalene whom they had possessed (Lk. 8:1-2). Do demonic spirits of Satan influence and control a person to commit moral or immoral behavior?

Facts and possibilities are two different things.

Again, why do you believe it to have been possible that the seven demons Jesus cast out of Mary the Magdalene were a severe case of PMS when there is no scriptural evidence to support that, and you only accept as true what is indicated in Scripture? And, again, would the casting out of PMS from Mary the Magdalene have been a one-time or monthly event?

Nothing in the scriptures even suggest that Mary Magdalene was a prostitute.

If Scripture indicated that Mary the Magdalene was wholly moral in body and spirit and good character continually from birth to death, then you could say that there's nothing in Scripture to suggest or say that she never committed prostitution, or any other sinful behavior. But, you can't, at least not without being intellectually dishonest, because by your own admission, you believe that she did commit sins, despite also believing that there is no indication in Scripture of how she sinned, and thus there's no type of sinful (immoral) behavior that she could've committed, such as, for example, prostitution, that is off the table for consideration.

 

[quietthinker]

Mary, it seems was a commonly used name for the girls. There was Mary of Magdala, Mary of Bethany, Mary the mother of Joses, Mary the mother of Jesus, etc etc.
Which of these four do we suppose was the sister of Lazarus?

 

[Grailhunter]

Is Mary the Magdalene explicitly called "a great sinner" by an Evangelist or any other character in the Gospels? No, but here's a helpful tidbit: there's more than one way to say something. And, fortunately for me, your unwillingness to accept or inability to understand the way in which it is said in Scripture that Mary the Magdalene was a great sinner still bears no effect on the following point:

Only two of the five women who have anointed Jesus, the well-known repentant prostitute, and Mary the Magdalene, from whom Jesus cast out seven demons, anointed Jesus with expensive ointment using their hair in Bethany. Again, why are those details insufficient reasons to deduce that they were the same woman?



Again, Jesus cast out seven demons from Mary the Magdalene whom they had possessed (Lk. 8:1-2). Do demonic spirits of Satan influence and control a person to commit moral or immoral behavior?



Again, why do you believe it to have been possible that the seven demons Jesus cast out of Mary the Magdalene were a severe case of PMS when there is no scriptural evidence to support that, and you only accept as true what is indicated in Scripture? And, again, would the casting out of PMS from Mary the Magdalene have been a one-time or monthly event?



If Scripture indicated that Mary the Magdalene was wholly moral in body and spirit from birth to death, then you could say that there's nothing in Scripture to suggest or say that she never committed prostitution, or any other sin. But, you can't, at least not without being intellectually dishonest, because by your own admission, you believe that she did commit sins, despite also believing that there is no indication in Scripture that she sinned, nor of how she sinned, and thus there's no type of sinful (immoral) behavior that she could've committed, such as, for example, prostitution, that is off the table for discussion.



I have too much conviction to depart from this discussion, but to each their own.

We have discussed this enough.

 

[Sabé]

We have discussed this enough.

I wouldn't say that, because you're leaving my last post unaddressed, but I respect your decision to bow out.

 

[Grailhunter]

I wouldn't say that, because you're leaving my last post unaddressed, but I respect your decision to bow out.

If your wanting to talk some more....pick a different topic.

 

[Sabé]

If your wanting to talk some more....pick a different topic.

I do want and we will. But, regarding this thread's topic of discussion, in my last post I was just expressing disagreement, and respect for your decision to bow out of it.

 

[Sabé]

Mary, it seems was a commonly used name for the girls. There was Mary of Magdala, Mary of Bethany, Mary the mother of Joses, Mary the mother of Jesus, etc etc.
Which of these four do we suppose was the sister of Lazarus?

It depends on who you ask. For some whose sole source of knowledge and validation is Scripture, the task of trying to explicitly identify Lazarus and Martha's sister, Mary, as being, for example, Mary the Magdalene, using only scriptural verses could prove difficult. Others, like myself, refer to Scripture, as well as the writings of other truly inspired writers God has spoken through about His life on earth, and so on, the writings of the Apostolic Fathers, etc. Due to this, I've come to understand the following about the main Marys in the New Testament:

• Mary of Joseph (Matt. 1:18)

• Mary of Clopas/Cleophas (Alphaeus) (Jn. 19:25), Mary the mother of James and Joseph (Matt. 27:56), Mary mother of James (Mk. 16:1, Lk. 24:10), and "the other Mary" (Matt. 27:61, 28:1) were the same person, and she was the wife of Joseph of Nazareth's brother, Alphaeus (Clopas/Cleophas), and thus the sister-in-law of Jesus's Mother (cf. Jn. 19:25). Their sons were Jesus's brothers (relatives/kinsmen), and thus His cousins: Joseph, Simon, James, and Judas (Thaddeus) (Matt.13:55-56, Mk. 6:3). Two of those cousins, James and Judas of Alphaeus (Clopas/Cleophas), were elected by Jesus to be His apostles (Matt. 10:3, Mk. 3:18;15:40, Lk. 6:15-16, Ac. 1:13). [Note: the apostle, Matthew (Levi), was the son of a man named "Alphaeus" as well (Mk. 2:14), but he was not the same Alphaeus as the father of Jesus's cousin-apostles James and Judas (Thaddeus).]

• Lazarus and Martha's sister, Mary (Jn. 11:1-2), and the unnamed repentant woman (Matt. 26:6-13, Mk. 14:3-9, Jn. 12:1-8, Lk. 7:36-50)—both of whom anointed Jesus with ointment and wiped His feet with their hair—was Mary the Magdalene, from whom Jesus cast out seven demons (Lk. 8:1-2). Maria Valtorta, another true spokesperson of God, received and described visions of scenes from Jesus's life on earth. And, according to her account, she confirms that Mary of Magdala, Mary of Bethany, and the unnamed woman were the same person. The parents of Lazarus, Martha, and Mary were Theophilus—a Syrian, who was the governor of Antioch, a faithful servant of Caesar—and Eucheria. Mary was a well-known prostitute, even among the Romans in Israel, and thus the disgrace of her family. By extension, her family was affected. They couldn't go among people without having to put up with their mockery, including from the Pharisees and scribes, and Martha never married, because no one married the sister of a prostitute. Mary's conversion was a process, rather than an event. She, once a great sinner, became a great convert. I highly recommend reading The Story of Mary Magdalene (extracts from The Gospel as Revealed to Me, or The Poem of the Man-God), as well as A Summa and Encyclopedia to Maria Valtorta's Extraordinary Work, especially the chapters on the proofs in support of her writings having a supernatural origin.

 

[quietthinker]

It depends on who you ask. For some whose sole source of knowledge and validation is Scripture, the task of trying to explicitly identify Lazarus and Martha's sister, Mary, as being, for example, Mary the Magdalene, using only scriptural verses could prove difficult. Others, like myself, refer to not only Scripture, but other writings by inspired writers God has spoken through as well about His life on earth, and so on, the writings of the Apostolic Fathers, etc. Due to this, I've come to understand the following:

• Mary of Nazareth was the Spouse of Joseph of Nazareth and Mother of the only one called Her Son: Jesus. (Matt.13:55, Mk. 6:3)

• Mary of Clopas/Cleophas (Alphaeus) (Jn. 19:25), Mary the mother of James and Joseph (Matt. 27:56), Mary mother of James (Mk. 16:1, Lk. 24:10), and "the other Mary" (Matt. 27:61, 28:1) were the same person, and she was the wife of Joseph of Nazareth's brother, Alphaeus (Clopas/Cleophas), and thus the sister-in-law of Jesus's Mother (cf. Jn. 19:25). Their sons were Jesus's brothers (relatives/kinsmen), and thus His cousins: Joseph, Simon, James, and Judas (Thaddeus) (Matt.13:55-56, Mk. 6:3). Two of those cousins, James and Judas of Alphaeus (Clopas/Cleophas), were elected by Jesus to be His apostles (Matt. 10:3, Mk. 3:18;15:40, Lk. 6:15-16, Ac. 1:13). [Note: the apostle, Matthew (Levi), was the son of a man named "Alphaeus" as well (Mk. 2:14), but he was not the same Alphaeus as the father of Jesus's cousin-apostles James and Judas (Thaddeus).]

• Lazarus's and Martha's sister, Mary (Jn. 11:1-2), and the well-known repentant prostitute (Matt. 26:6-13, Mk. 14:3-9, Jn. 12:1-8, Lk. 7:36-50)—both of whom, in Bethany, anointed Jesus with expensive ointment using their hair—was Mary the Magdalene, from whom Jesus cast out seven demons (Lk. 8:1-2). Maria Valtorta, another true spokesperson of God, received and described visions of scenes from Jesus's life on earth. And, according to her account, she confirms that Mary the Magdalene, the well-known repentant prostitute, and Lazarus's and Martha's sister, Mary, were the same person. The parents of Lazarus, Martha, and Mary were Theophilus—a Syrian, who was the governor of Antioch, a faithful servant of Caesar—and Eucheria. Mary was a well-known prostitute, even among the Romans in Israel, and thus the disgrace of her family. By extension, her family was affected. They couldn't go among people without having to put up with their mockery, including from the Pharisees and scribes, and Martha never married, because no one married the sister of a prostitute. Mary's conversion was a process, rather than an event. She, once a great sinner, became a great convert. I highly recommend reading The Story of Mary Magdalene (extracts from The Gospel as Revealed to Me, or The Poem of the Man-God), as well as A Summa and Encyclopedia to Maria Valtorta's Extraordinary Work, especially the chapters on the proofs in support of her writings having a supernatural origin.

Mary the sister of Lazarus lived in Bethany.
It was Mary from Magdala who was subsequently named 'Mary Magdalene'......Magdalene being a derivative of Magdala. We can deduct from this that she was not Lazarus's sister.