How are we to reckon ourselves as being dead to sin?

[Behold]

It is the power of God to be set free from the corrupt flesh ...to be liberated in the inner man to be translated into Zion to walk in resurrection life. To walk as Jesus walked without sin. In Him is no sin.

But I'm casting pearls here before swine. Away with you Oink-tions.

The more you read me, the more you sound like me., Episkopos
Good for you.
You've stopped using my Thread's titles as your Thread's Titles, and .. that's ok also.

You've not stated that the Cross is 'Whipping boy" in a while so, i guess you figure out to leave that alone.

And....Not that long ago you were teaching to "work righteousness" as Salvation.
You'll deny that now, as that is par for your course, as living in denial is typical of your type.
Now you are saying "in Him is no sin".
So, keep reading me, and keep listening to these real believers who keep giving you the attention you crave .....as. Its all doing you some good, perhaps.

-Later

 

[Lizbeth]

From where I am sitting. It wasn’t the nicest thing in the world to mock as digging to deep and ending up on the other side of the world. But you thought that was funny. So you do have a sense of humor.

I don’t get it though. You can say something that I guess you think needs to be heard, and laugh to lighten the mood. But your also the decider of when something is holy and when it is not.

Apples and oranges sister. I used an illustration to make a point for your sake, to try and help you see the point, and only added the "lol" to soften it for your sake, for the very reason that I DIDN'T want you to receive it as an insult or accusation. Epi INTENDED to accuse and insult -and they were on such a level that it would be right to report them.

If you or anyone else can't see how Episkopos' comments were inappropriate and way out of line for a purported follower of Christ, who supposedly preaches holiness to boot, then something is wrong.

 

[amigo de christo]

Apples and oranges sister. I used an illustration to make a point for your sake, to try and help you see the point, and only added the "lol" to soften it for your sake, for the very reason that I DIDN'T want you to receive it as an insult or accusation. Epi INTENDED to accuse and insult -and they were on such a level that it would be right to report them.

If you or anyone else can't see how Episkopos' comments were inappropriate and way out of line for a purported follower of Christ, who supposedly preaches holiness to boot, then something is wrong.

Follow the glorious LORD JESUS my dear sister . And let us all REMEMBER , if JESUS would not do it then let us not do it .
Remain diligent in the things of the LORD . Pointing to HE ALONE .

 

[amigo de christo]

1Co 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
1Co 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
1Co 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
1Co 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

2Ti_2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

Other foundation (themelion allon). The gender of the adjective is here masculine as is shown by allon. If neuter, it would be allo. It is masculine because Paul has Christ in mind. It is not here heteron a different kind of gospel (heteron euaggelion, Gal_1:6; 2Co_11:4) which is not another (allo, Gal_1:7) in reality. But another Jesus (2Co_11:4, allon Iēsoun) is a reflection on the one Lord Jesus.

Hence there is no room on the platform with Jesus for another Saviour, whether Buddha, Mahomet, Dowie, Eddy, or what not.

Jesus Christ is the one foundation and it is gratuitous impudence for another to assume the role of Foundation.

Than that which is laid, which is Christ Jesus (para ton keimenon, hos estin Iēsous Christos). Literally, “alongside (para) the one laid (keimenon),” already laid (present middle participle of keimai, used here as often as the perfect passive of tithēmi in place of tetheimenon).

Paul scouts the suggestion that one even in the interest of so-called “new thought” will dare to lay beside Jesus another foundation for religion. And yet I have seen an article by a professor in a theological seminary in which he advocates regarding Jesus as a landmark, not as a goal, not as a foundation.

Clearly Paul means that on this one true foundation, Jesus Christ, one must build only what is in full harmony with the Foundation which is Jesus Christ. If one accuses Paul of narrowness, it can be replied that the architect has to be narrow in the sense of building here and not there.

A broad foundation will be too thin and unstable for a solid and abiding structure. It can be said also that Paul is here merely repeating the claim of Jesus himself on this very subject when he quoted Psa_118:22. to the members of the Sanhedrin who challenged his authority (Mar_11:10.; Mat_21:42-45; Luk_20:17.). Apostles and prophets go into this temple of God, but Christ Jesus is the chief corner stone (akrogōnaios, Eph_2:20). All believers are living stones in this temple (1Pe_2:5). But there is only one foundation possible.
Robertson

I concur with you--

1Co_2:2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

Rom_1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

J.

And this is exactly what men have done . They tried to add onto the foundation of CHRIST
by allowing budda , muhammed , atheism , hinduism and whaterverism to be placed RIGTH ALONG SIDE OF CHRIST .
That IS NO FOUNDATION .
And let us remember what is written in torah . How this angered GOD when his own peoples
tried to USE HIS NAME and yet accepted other gods . That my friend truly does anger GOD .
More so than this generation is even aware of . FOR If it knew the GOD of CHRIST , the prophets , of torah
of the apostles , IT WOULD NEVER had dared to even SUGGEST such a thing .
We must stick to the one and only FOUNDATION , CHRIST JESUS and no other gods can reign along side of him .
They all false . HE is the one TRUE CHRIST OF GOD . GOD is HIS WORD and HIS WORD is HE
and no other foundation can any man lay , THAN Which is already been laid , CHRIST JESUS .

 

[Lizbeth]

1Co 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
1Co 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
1Co 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
1Co 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

2Ti_2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

Other foundation (themelion allon). The gender of the adjective is here masculine as is shown by allon. If neuter, it would be allo. It is masculine because Paul has Christ in mind. It is not here heteron a different kind of gospel (heteron euaggelion, Gal_1:6; 2Co_11:4) which is not another (allo, Gal_1:7) in reality. But another Jesus (2Co_11:4, allon Iēsoun) is a reflection on the one Lord Jesus.

Hence there is no room on the platform with Jesus for another Saviour, whether Buddha, Mahomet, Dowie, Eddy, or what not.

Jesus Christ is the one foundation and it is gratuitous impudence for another to assume the role of Foundation.

Than that which is laid, which is Christ Jesus (para ton keimenon, hos estin Iēsous Christos). Literally, “alongside (para) the one laid (keimenon),” already laid (present middle participle of keimai, used here as often as the perfect passive of tithēmi in place of tetheimenon).

Paul scouts the suggestion that one even in the interest of so-called “new thought” will dare to lay beside Jesus another foundation for religion. And yet I have seen an article by a professor in a theological seminary in which he advocates regarding Jesus as a landmark, not as a goal, not as a foundation.

Clearly Paul means that on this one true foundation, Jesus Christ, one must build only what is in full harmony with the Foundation which is Jesus Christ. If one accuses Paul of narrowness, it can be replied that the architect has to be narrow in the sense of building here and not there.

A broad foundation will be too thin and unstable for a solid and abiding structure. It can be said also that Paul is here merely repeating the claim of Jesus himself on this very subject when he quoted Psa_118:22. to the members of the Sanhedrin who challenged his authority (Mar_11:10.; Mat_21:42-45; Luk_20:17.). Apostles and prophets go into this temple of God, but Christ Jesus is the chief corner stone (akrogōnaios, Eph_2:20). All believers are living stones in this temple (1Pe_2:5). But there is only one foundation possible.
Robertson

I concur with you--

1Co_2:2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

Rom_1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

J.

Amen.

Psa 11:1-7

In the LORD put I my trust: how say ye to my soul, Flee as a bird to your mountain?
For, lo, the wicked bend their bow, they make ready their arrow upon the string, that they may privily shoot at the upright in heart.
If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?
The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.
The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.
Upon the wicked he shall rain snares, fire and brimstone, and an horrible tempest: this shall be the portion of their cup.
For the righteous LORD loveth righteousness; his countenance doth behold the upright.

If the foundation is destroyed, there is nothing to work with. And neither can there be fellowship, because of not having a foundation in common.

 

[Johann]

Apples and oranges sister. I used an illustration to make a point for your sake, to try and help you see the point, and only added the "lol" to soften it for your sake, for the very reason that I DIDN'T want you to receive it as an insult or accusation. Epi INTENDED to accuse and insult -and they were on such a level that it would be right to report them.

If you or anyone else can't see how Episkopos' comments were inappropriate and way out of line for a purported follower of Christ, who supposedly preaches holiness to boot, then something is wrong.

Amen, well said-I have this "sense" he won't be here for long.
Stay strong.
J.

 

[amigo de christo]

Amen.

Psa 11:1-7

In the LORD put I my trust: how say ye to my soul, Flee as a bird to your mountain?
For, lo, the wicked bend their bow, they make ready their arrow upon the string, that they may privily shoot at the upright in heart.
If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?
The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.
The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.
Upon the wicked he shall rain snares, fire and brimstone, and an horrible tempest: this shall be the portion of their cup.
For the righteous LORD loveth righteousness; his countenance doth behold the upright.

If the foundation is destroyed, there is nothing to work with. And neither can there be fellowship, because of not having a foundation in common.

And that is why the devil has been long at work to produce a counterfeit foundation .
Cause HE knows He is damned and wants all to be damned with him .
As for the lambs , WE SHALL POINT TO CHRIST ALONE . March ever onwards in the glorious LORD dear sister .
THE LORD is our hope and our salvation and is FULLY able to keep one from falling . Let us heed HIS VOICE
and stay well DUG in those bibles .

 

[amigo de christo]

Amen.

Psa 11:1-7

In the LORD put I my trust: how say ye to my soul, Flee as a bird to your mountain?
For, lo, the wicked bend their bow, they make ready their arrow upon the string, that they may privily shoot at the upright in heart.
If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?
The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.
The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.
Upon the wicked he shall rain snares, fire and brimstone, and an horrible tempest: this shall be the portion of their cup.
For the righteous LORD loveth righteousness; his countenance doth behold the upright.

If the foundation is destroyed, there is nothing to work with. And neither can there be fellowship, because of not having a foundation in common.

And try as they may to destroy the foundation , allow me some parting words before i head off to work .
THE FOUNDATION OF GOD STANDS SURE , having this SEAL . GOD knows those who are HIS
and let all who name the name of CHRIST depart from inquity .
TRY as they might they will never be able to REMOVE the cornerstone .
And though hand joins in hand and many follow their perniscious ways , by which CHRIST , the TRUTH , is evil spoken off ,
ON the DAY of the LORD they will be crushed to powder by the very CORNERSTONE they was doing all to remove from society .
My advice to them all who do such a thing , REPENT asap , for why will you die .
GOD is longsuffering , BUT HIS DAY OF WRATH IS COMING . And all who rejected THE CHRIST of GOD
and tried to add too HIS FOUNDATION by means of a lie , Are gonna wail under HIS wrath .
I truly desire not death for them , but rather they would repent of the lie . But if they wont and if they dont
they are gonna wish they had on the day of the LORD .

 

[Johann]

Amen.

Psa 11:1-7

In the LORD put I my trust: how say ye to my soul, Flee as a bird to your mountain?
For, lo, the wicked bend their bow, they make ready their arrow upon the string, that they may privily shoot at the upright in heart.
If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?
The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.
The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.
Upon the wicked he shall rain snares, fire and brimstone, and an horrible tempest: this shall be the portion of their cup.
For the righteous LORD loveth righteousness; his countenance doth behold the upright.

If the foundation is destroyed, there is nothing to work with. And neither can there be fellowship, because of not having a foundation in common.

Patrick paraphrases the words thus, “If men have no regard to laws and public decrees, which are the foundation of human society, but will boldly violate all known and standing rules of justice and truth; what can the righteous do? — What security can an honest man have? or what should he do, but make haste away from the place where they act so arbitrarily, and are so perfidious?”

Verse 2 relates that the wicked should be observed as bowbenders and arrow aimers from the bow-string, resolute on ambushing the righteous or upright in heart, from where they lurked, watching for them from dark places. This refers to those of either Saul or Absalom's band of followers who seemed intent on depriving David from his throne-rule in Israel, by shooting at him from out of the dark; The counsel of David's friends may be similar to that of Job's wife, Job_2:9-10; and of the disciples, Joh_11:8; and of the Pharisees to Jesus to flee from the Jerusalem and Judean area, Luk_13:31.

“Their tongue is a deadly arrow;
It speaks deceit;
With his mouth one speaks peace to his neighbor,
But inwardly he sets an ambush for him.

Proverbs 22:24-25
Do not associate with a man given to anger;
Or go with a hot-tempered man,
Or you will learn his ways
And find a snare for yourself.

Isaiah 32:7

As for a rogue, his weapons are evil;
He devises wicked schemes
To destroy the afflicted with slander,
Even though the needy one speaks what is right.

Pro 22:10 Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.

Make no friendship with an angry man; and with a furious man thou shalt not go

Spirit has a wonderful and unaccountable influence upon spirit. From those with whom we associate we acquire habits, and learn their ways, imbibe their spirit, show their tempers and walk in their steps. We cannot be too choice of our company, for we may soon learn ways that will be a snare to our soul.

Later-shalom to you and family
Johann

 

[ChristisGod]

Why are you in denial of the necessity of the rebirth?

Because he is not . No fruit no root

 

[ChristisGod]

Amen, well said-I have this "sense" he won't be here for long.
Stay strong.
J.

Light exposes darkness , they went out from us for they were not of us.

 

[Johann]

Because he is not . No fruit no root

--and a lone ranger to boot-no accountability.
Listen brother, as I read others testimonies I am falling far short- and have never "experienced" anything heavenly, or "hear" the kol/voice of the Holy Spirit-let alone Him co-witnessing with my spirit.

Lately I hear of second blessings-and that is what Wesley taught which is NOT in line with Scriptures.
What does it make me-UN-born?

The just shall live by faith, not experiences.
My 2 cents, for what it's worth.

Shalom.
J.

 

[Daniel Blogger]

Hello to all. I think it important to understand the context of everything we read about in the bible. It's too easy to misunderstand and jump to false conclusions based on an unbalanced and unlearned assumption, unless we look as deeply as possible into how it fits into the ways of God.

On this thread, I would like to look at how we are to reckon ourselves to be dead to sin....using the OT, and NT...and hopefully with some testimonials.

Any post that is not applicable to the subject matter I will respond with a "Stay on Topic" comment.

Now in Romans 6:11 we read...

" Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord."

Is this a kind of magic formula that one must accept as being life-giving in itself? As in...fake it till you make it?

I think the last thing that God wants is for people to accept the bible anecdotally....religiously.... There is no need or desire for that.

We need to go to the OT to see where the pattern of God's ways based on reckoning can be consulted for greater clarity in the present circumstance. With the next verse we see a call to spiritual militancy.

Joel 3:10 "Beat your plowshares into swords and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, I am strong."

James continues with this theme...

James 1:9 Let the brother of low degree rejoice in that he is exalted:
10 But the rich, in that he is made low: because as the flower of the grass he shall pass away.

V. 10 is very telling and apropos for we who live in the rich Western countries. Especially seeing that sound doctrine is seen by many as being so hostile (to the flesh).


We see with this, the "make the way straight in the desert for our God" from Is. 40.....filling in the valleys and making the mountains low. I would say that the major problem we have is the exaltation of the flesh rather than the rejoicing at being made low. It is the council of James in reverse for many of us.

So we, in our estimation, need to see our default setting as considering sin, and the lifestyle associated with it, as being dead to us. Does that mean we can claim to be without sin by a mere reckoning? We can only reckon with our mind. Our reckoning helps to line up our way of thinking with the direction we are hoping to go in. Only God can rescue us from the power of the flesh.

We can indeed ALWAYS triumph over the flesh..but that takes the power of the cross and walking in the Spirit. Reckoning ourselves to be dead to sin is akin to carrying our own cross...not being crucified on the cross of Christ. That is at a whole other level and at a depth that very few will be able to comprehend let alone experience.

One thing to keep in mind is that the apostles’ teachings are based on the teachings of Jesus. Start by looking at what Jesus taught. Look at how Jesus redefined the Law of God; He did not abolish it but gave us pointers how to accomplish it. Look especially at what He taught His disciples about love. Anything we do out of love for God is good, and there is no law against love.

For example, Jesus told the disciples, “Love one another as I have loved you”, and He showed them by example what love is. He ate with sinners and tax collectors not to encourage them to stay as they are, but to show them that Somebody cares for them and wants their good. All the things Jesus did were to show us that we, as His followers, can be different, and people around us can change when they see a difference. The one thing Jesus said to sum up what love means was, “Do to others as you want others to do to you”. Start here, and connect this to the rest of the Biblical teachings and what you know about life, love and God.

 

[ChristisGod]

One thing to keep in mind is that the apostles’ teachings are based on the teachings of Jesus. Start by looking at what Jesus taught. Look at how Jesus redefined the Law of God; He did not abolish it but gave us pointers how to accomplish it. Look especially at what He taught His disciples about love. Anything we do out of love for God is good, and there is no law against love.

For example, Jesus told the disciples, “Love one another as I have loved you”, and He showed them by example what love is. He ate with sinners and tax collectors not to encourage them to stay as they are, but to show them that Somebody cares for them and wants their good. All the things Jesus did were to show us that we, as His followers, can be different, and people around us can change when they see a difference. The one thing Jesus said to sum up what love means was, “Do to others as you want others to do to you”. Start here, and connect this to the rest of the Biblical teachings and what you know about life, love and God.

Amen and excellent biblical advice.

 

[ChristisGod]

--and a lone ranger to boot-no accountability.
Listen brother, as I read others testimonies I am falling far short- and have never "experienced" anything heavenly, or "hear" the kol/voice of the Holy Spirit-let alone Him co-witnessing with my spirit.

Lately I hear of second blessings-and that is what Wesley taught which is NOT in line with Scriptures.
What does it make me-UN-born?

The just shall live by faith, not experiences.
My 2 cents, for what it's worth.

Shalom.
J.

maybe we could do a zoom call over the weekend.

 

[Johann]

maybe we could do a zoom call over the weekend.

Buddy, I don't know what a zoom call is, and I am sitting with a very, very old computer with no microphone.
No knowledge re modern technology.

 

[Waiting on him]

You and epi are the ones STUCK in EGO LAND . The lambs are glued to CHRIST

I don’t believe you can quote me as saying I’m a lamb, righteous, born again, teacher, prophet, saint, priest, good deed doer…. Etc,,,

But who knows?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Don't be surprised if you get locked up with THIS post--I am going to say it--you have a serious mental disorder-maybe you know about it, or you don't.

Don't return fire.. The mental disorder comment is not helping.. when we do as they do.. it looks bad

 

[marks]

This is simply what honesty looks like compared to your religious posturing. You guys are a cult...a weird self-righteous cult. You appeal to the flesh in each other. Birds of a feather...

All I can say is shoo... Look for carrion elsewhere.

You speak without kindness and without truth of any kind. Is that edifying for you? For your carnal delusions?

You twist my words to fit your own warped mind...because you need to destroy truth. You need to mock...because your spirit loves the lie. You lie because they slip easily off your tongue.

I encourage her and would protect her against your vicious fangs that the enemy uses to tear at all that is pure and faithful.

I have found that many have been induced to believe they are something they are not. A tree is known of ts fruit.

You are a liar and delusional. Why not quote me rather than spew your usual nonsense?
Why are you so afraid of truth, O eternally hateful?

You use a double standard...accusing with snake-like venom and then taking offense in return. You pretend to be interested in spiritual things and then slander with the vigour of a bear.

You are two-faced and unstable. A hypocrite such as you is beyond help. I'm done with you. Your glory is in your shame. Enjoy your false religiosity while you can.

What a place to discuss eternally important things. The modern gospel has attracted every kind of creeping thing.

Very disappointing.

You think a recent perversion of the bible by a protesting mob is worth more than all the saintly testimony of the apostles and their successors (not to mention the teachings of Jesus Himself). The great delusion indeed.

You are pathetic.

I know that you crows only agree on some of your own errors. You would squabble over anything given the chance. What you all HATE is the truth. That's where you have common ground. You like each others posts to prop up the flesh. But how many are SO deluded as to think the power OVER sin is nothing compared to covering up the penalty for sin???

But I'm casting pearls here before swine. Away with you Oink-tions.

Do you ever read yourself? This is the face of hypocrisy. I've tried for years to see you as sincere, but I just cannot any longer. That flies in the face of every thread you post.

Truly sad!

Much love, and I still hope for you to come to know Him!

 

[marks]

Don't return fire.. The mental disorder comment is not helping.. when we do as they do.. it looks bad

No matter how low someone else goes, we should always remain on the high road. I've watched @Episkopos do that before with people, needle them until they say something off, then pouncing on their misstep. So we need to not let ourselves be provoked.

Christian love is when we in our hearts want to do and be the best we can for others, to care for their needs. Regardless of how they may treat you.

Our example is Jesus, Who sincerely desired forgiveness for those who mocked Him, as they murdered Him, because He loved them. Allowing them to murder Him so that He could bring salvation to even them. We should do no less.

Much love!