Once Saved Always Saved
- Thread starter Charlie24
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
- Status
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Are you saying that the genuine Christian have not been raised with Christ, contrary to what scriptures says?
Yes and no
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Sola scriptura
Sola scriptura ("by scripture alone" in English) is a theological doctrine held by some Protestant Christian denominations that posits the Christian scriptures as the sole infallible source of authority for Christian faith and practice.
Yes they have not been raised with Christ contrary to what scriptures say? And no they have not been raised with Christ contrary to what scriptures says? If you care to explain that would be appreciated and helpful to this discussion. If not, then perhaps you don’t want to be clear. And that’s fine with me. At least I know why such responses.
Tong
R2916
Behold
Well-Known Member
Without the shedding of Blood there is no righteousness.
So, its GOD's BLOOD that made you righteous.
So what does that have to do with my posts#3676?:
Perhaps it would be helpful to list here what scriptures says of the genuine Christian.
1. They were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, Jesus Christ.
2. They have been justified by faith, having been justified by the blood of Christ Jesus.
3. The love of God has been poured out in their hearts.
4. They have died to sin.
5. They are not under law but under grace.
6. They have been set free from sin.
7. They have been delivered from the law.
8. They are in Christ Jesus and in the Spirit.
9. They have the Holy Spirit dwelling in them.
10. They have the Spirit of Christ in them.
11. They are children of God, having received the Spirit of adoption, heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ.
12. They were predestined to be conformed to the image of Jesus Christ.
13. They shall not be separated from the love of Christ.
14. They are not their own as they were bought at a price. They are Christ’s. They are God’s.
15. They were washed, were sanctified, were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of God.
16. Their bodies are members of Christ. Together they are one body, the body of Christ, and members individually.
17. Their body is the temple of the Holy Spirit.
18. They are a new creation in Christ.
19. They are children of promise.
20. They were chosen by God in Christ before the foundation of the world.
21. They were predestined to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to God.
22. They have in Christ obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to the purpose of God.
23. They were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, who is the guarantee of their inheritance.
24. They were made alive together with Christ, raised up together, and made to sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus.
25. They have been saved by grace through faith.
26. They are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand to walk in.
27. God works in them both to will and to do for His good pleasure.
28. Their citizenship is in heaven, not in this world.
29. They have been delivered by the Father from the power of darkness and were conveyed into the kingdom of the Son, Jesus Christ.
30. They were, in Christ, circumcised with the circumcision made without hands.
31. They have been forgiven of all trespasses.
32. They are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ.
33. They were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Now, consider all of those truth about the genuine Christian, them who were born of God and see what becomes of the issues that confront the Christians today, such as the issue under this thread.
Tong
R2917
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Not sure what you are trying to say. But yes we are raised with Christ when we are baptizes and this is backed up with scripture.
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Behold
Well-Known Member
Then you understand that "ALL have sinned and fallen short "
That even means you.
And what defines that?
THE LAW.
Its the LAW that defines you as a sinner.
Its the law and commandments that are broken.
THe Cross is the solution for the Law, as "Christ has redeemed US from the CURSE of the LAW". = the Born again.
That means everyone is under that curse, (The Law) until Christ redeems you from it.
Not just "jews" but YOU also.
There you go. That’s #24 in the list I posted in post #3676. And that’s right, it is backed up with scriptures.
If we are raised with Christ, what does that mean?
Besides a Yes answer, you also answered No to the question “Are you saying that the genuine Christian have not been raised with Christ, contrary to what scriptures says?”. So please explain your No answer.
Tong
R2918
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Sola scriptura ("by scripture alone" in English) is a theological doctrine held by some Protestant Christian denominations that posits the Christian scriptures as the sole infallible source of authority for Christian faith and practice.
So you ask what does sola scriptura have to do with your post?
Your term "genuine Christian" does not occur in the scriptures. Now on a forum such as this that strongly lean toward fundamentalisms...ie a strict theological methodology focusing on sola scriptura only. Your term is irrelevant.
Still your personal terms are personal, that is ok. But in a conversation if you are going to use personal terms you have to define your personal terms. So then your statement...Perhaps it would be helpful to list here what scriptures says of the genuine Christian...Is not applicable because the term "genuine Christian" does not appear in the scriptures so the scriptures cannot define your idea of what a genuine Christian is. Now if you rephrase that to...The following list defines what I believe is a genuine Christian....That is fine and we can continue the discussion from there.
So as far as your list of 33 items that you believe describes the beliefs of "genuine Christians" I would say I agree with some of them and disagree with some of them.
Last edited:
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,...agreed
No. If I lived in the biblical era...maybe. As a Christian in modern times....the Law has nothing to do with me. I have never lived under the Law...again I am not a Jew and never have been.
I have never broken the Law or the 613 Laws of the Mosaic Law because I have never been in the Covenant of the Old Testament.
Again I have never been under the curse of the Law because I have never been a Jew nor a member of that Old Covenant with God. The conversations you are referencing to were valid in the biblical era for some...but not now. The Mosaic Law was given to the Israelites only. There is no biblical example of the Mosaic Laws being given to anyone outside of the Old Covenant with God.
As stated I disagree, I was never under the Law.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
He tells us just eight verses later from the verse you are quoting......
They will forsake me and break the covenant I made with them. And in that day I will become angry with them and forsake them Deuteronomy 31:16-17
And now, before you start ranting "that's old testament!", read this.......
Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,” d and again, “The Lord will judge his people.” Hebrews 10:28-30
If we disown him, he will also disown us 2 Timothy 2:12
And now, before you start ranting "that's old testament!", read this.......
Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,” d and again, “The Lord will judge his people.” Hebrews 10:28-30
If we disown him, he will also disown us 2 Timothy 2:12
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
I believe in it. Just not in Calvin's definition of those things. I believe what the Bible says those things are.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
I believe that Jesus indwells me and that it is through him that I can endure and believe to the very end and live a holy life. I sure can't do that by myself!
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
No one can trust God except that God first give them the evidence of the gospel through the gift of faith, through which they can then trust God for salvation, if they want to do that. Most people don't, and so they cast the word of faith about the gospel from their hearts. There are a few, though, who will retain the word of faith they heard, and retain it all the way to the end, and are saved.
- Status
Similar threads
