It was the Ten Commandments that was the covenant. But the Old Testament is good to clarify things. For instance, do you believe in remarriage after divorce?
Doctrines of Demons???
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It was the Ten Commandments that was the covenant. But the Old Testament is good to clarify things. For instance, do you believe in remarriage after divorce?
The ten commandments forms part of the Mosaic covenant between the nation (children of Israel) Israel and God.
Tong
R4474
Davy
Well-Known Member
Are you someone who thinks they can no longer sin, since believing on Lord Jesus Christ? If so, then why did Jesus show us to ask forgiveness of our sins when praying to The Father in Luke 11?
The Ten Commandments is the only thing called the Covenant. Exodus 34:28. There were many ceremonial rituals that were also done away, but there were many laws that still stand about bestiality, homosexuality, virginity for marriage, remarriage after divorce, marrying close kindred, etc.
So, what happens to the covenant, which then is ten commandments?
Hebrews 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second
..,,,….,
13 In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
Tong
R4501
It was done away and the better royal law was written on our hearts by the SPIRIT, making us born again and sinless. The Spirit also plants the fruit of the Spirit in us and the rest of our life is a process of maturing those fruit to PERFECTION.
So you are saying that the ten commandments are no longer, having been made obsolete, replaced by the better royal law.
I have these initial questions relative to your view of what the old covenant is:
1. If the old covenant only refers to the ten commandments, what is the reason for replacing the old covenant?
2. If the royal law replaced the ten commandments which you say is the old
covenant, is the royal law the new covenant?
3. Tell us, how is the royal law better than the ten commandments?
Tong
R4503
Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
I think of doctrines of demons to be those of false religions and philosophies that lead people away from Christ, claim there are many ways to heaven, having a distorted view of God, etc.
Satan is the Father of lies and author of false religions, secular philosophies, cults, humanism, the occult, witchcraft, astrology, spiritism, the theory of evolution, really a long list of whatever it takes to keep you away from Christ and the Bible.
Satan is the Father of lies and author of false religions, secular philosophies, cults, humanism, the occult, witchcraft, astrology, spiritism, the theory of evolution, really a long list of whatever it takes to keep you away from Christ and the Bible.
Tong, What the Ten Commandments were based on, but could not fulfill because they didn't go deeper than the outside surface was Love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. That is the first reason. The laws of LOVE are the eternal laws of God, and the laws of Jesus fulfill those deeper laws, but even a further reason. But they are 1 John 3:23. Believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another.
Now the most important difference between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant is the Old had to be kept with the carnal flesh. It was a constant struggle as depicted in Romans 7:14-23. That carnal flesh is why Jesus came. 1 John 3:5 - He was manifest to take away our sin, and in Him there is no sin. He took away our carnal nature, Paul called, "the flesh." Not only did He take away our sin, He baptized us with FIRE. It is called the baptism of the Holy Spirit, and the Church is based on the Spirit, not the LAW. That is why Romans 8:9 says, "but you are NOT IN THE FLESH, but in the Spirit, if the Spirit of God indwells you. And if you do not have the Spirit of Christ, you do not belong to Him.
Sin separated us from God. Jesus came to reconcile us to God by taking away the desire to sin, and finishing the maturing of the fruit of the Spirit in us by pruning and giving us the steps through the apostle, Peter in 2 Peter 1:5-7. If you do this you will never stumble as in Romans 7:14-23.
Ron, it is much closer to home than you think. They are doctrines that try to undo the words of Jesus.
Jesus says He takes away our sin. DoD says we will always sin while in these bodies. Which do you believe?
I finally had to leave all denominations and pray to God to teach me His Word and what He meant. And it was amazing what followed. I also realized because there is only One who inspires, there is only one true interpretation to every verse. As you said, there are not many pathways, only one, and it is the narrow path.
After a few years I decided to look up the verses that God corrected in my thinking and all my commentaries agreed with each other, but not me. Except one. It agreed with everything God taught me, so now I can box all the commentaries full of doctrines of demons and feel confident in most of the writings in the one I have left. That Commentary is The Abingdon Bible Commentary, c. 1929. One volume.
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<<<Tong, What the Ten Commandments were based on, but could not fulfill because they didn't go deeper than the outside surface was Love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. That is the first reason. The laws of LOVE are the eternal laws of God, and the laws of Jesus fulfill those deeper laws, but even a further reason.>>>
You said it yourself, “The laws of LOVE are the eternal laws of God”. I contend that the ten commandments are laws of love. In fact in scriptures, Paul said:
Romans 13:9 For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”
So, I don’t see what you say there as to the reason why the old covenant (which for you are only the ten commandments) needs to be replaced.
Honestly, I do not find in your second and third paragraph, any that answers my other questions.
Tong
R4520
Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
Both. Jesus spiritually cleanses usnif all sin
Our spirits our white as snow so thay at any moment sudden death comes upon us, we are saved (OSAS) and go to be with the Lord, preaented ri rhe Father as pure.
However, "sarx", oir flesh still has sin capability, the old self isn't entirely dead. You can prove this. Before you became a Christian, before you believed and were washed by His blood, you lied, you were selfish (unloving in some way with your neighbor), you sinned. I don't know what sins you fancied. After you were washed, did you become a perfect sinless person who never sinned again? If you think that, you deceive yourself. We are sinners, not practicing, not slaves to sin as before, but we still slip up now and then. No? Did you become Mother Teresa all of a sudden, loving your neighbor and enemies perfectly the moment you were born again? I think not. The Holy Spirit grieves sometimes, why? We sin. HE guides us on the right path and we backslide into our old habits, we stumble and fall, but get up amd move forward back on the path. He gradually helps us mortify our old selves and we become Christlike. So we have this dual existence, our spirit and our flesh (until we die and bwxome separate from it). The flesh wars against the spirit and the spirit against the flesh.
"I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good. For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin."
Romans 7:21-25
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
I like to help people understand something about Jehovah witnesses. That they follow the practice of disfellowshipping . So many speak out against the witnesses for following what 1Corinthians 5:11 tell true Christians of the true church to do. Disfellowshipping someone means not associate with a brother or sister who are practicing these things in 1Corinthians 5:11 including when they come to the meetings. Isn't it a doctrine of men to speak out against those who practice obeying 1corinthians 5:11 and disassociate with those brothers or sisters who are practicing these things in 1Corinthians 5:11
You shall love your neighbor. But the Ten Commandments only says not to murder them, nothing about hate. What Romans is saying is that when you love, which is the New Covenant commandment, you are not breaking the Ten Commandments, only going deeper to the source.
That is before Christ and His indwelling Spirit. Read on.. Romans 8:2 for the law of the Spirit of life in Christ has made (Paul) FREE of the law of sin and death." We are free from sin, and thus the law that was to show us our sin.
Ron, it all has to do with our flesh, but that is not our body, but our NATURE. Romans 7:13, 25 shows that even knowing the Ten Commandments there was a battle going on in our mind/spirit because of our nature/flesh. But Romans 8:9 shows us that once born again of the Spirit - we are NOT IN THE FLESH but in the Spirit, if the Spirit of God indwells us. And if we do not have the Spirit of Christ (that changed us and we still desire to sin), then we do not belong to Christ.
Ron, we must be born again. And that is from the necessary baptism of the Holy Spirit.
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Yes, it would be, if the judgments were because of what Paul wrote. Just remember, we are not perfect from day one of visiting and SEEKING Christ. The key words are those who CLAIM to already be a brother, but still practice such things.
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BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
They are disfellowshipped because of what Paul spoke of, and a person is considered a brother or sister only when they are baptized. If they are not baptized then the witnesses don't even think about disfellowshipping them, because they're not brothers or sisters.
Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
You are mistaken, Paul was describimg his present condition.
We are free from the bondage of sin and the penalty of sin. But we still sin, we don't practice sin and learn to hate it. Our sins _ past, present and future _ have been forgiven - not just past sins. If we do ocasionaly lust after the flesh, fail to love oir neighbor as we should, get greedy at times, etc., these are not sins unto death but look, Christians are seen doing the SAME THINGS AS EVERYONE ELSE ARE'NT THEY. We still sin. There are so many scriptures guiding us, encouraging and warning us to walk in the spirit and not in the flesh.
Im afraid you need to go back.
Our spirit, prior to being born again was dead, non-functional. We had been made with a spiritual compartment but it was void and empty. We had our soul, which is our mind, will, emotions, talents, personality, the invisible you.
Spirit and soul are not the same. If they can be separated by His Word, And at death, they are not the same. However they are highly integrated when we are born again in such a way as to create a new you from the old, taking all that is good and leaving behind what is evil. Sorry, you are not perfect yet, spiritually, but not in how you live your life.
We are encouraged to walk in the spirit, but sometimes our old habits return, temptations, lusts, etc. We confess our sins. Or don't you think you ever do anything wrong?
"If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. 1 John 1:10
1John.2
[1] My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:"
We have an advocate (present tense). This message is to those who were and are already Christians as was Romans.
"If you say you have no sin, the truth is not in you". Who is that written to, the believer or unbeliever?
The truth is not in the unbeleiver, the truth is in us, therefore som still dwells in the members of our fleah and we need to excercise self control, patience, practice love, kindness, goodness, Daily.
But they allow them to attend your services, or must they take classes first. I honestly don't have a clue about your practices. But I do respect your works.
Hi Ron, please go back and read the whole chapter. It starts when we are dead from the law through death. The death is our nature on the cross, so read chapter 6 too. Then chapter 8 will make more sense.
But first clear out all preconceived ideas you have been taught all your life, and read it like its the first time ever. I know that will be hard, but until the Spirit actually opened my mind, I couldn't see anything remotely of truth - only what my SDA denomination said. When I had the epiphany, and it contradicted what my denomination said, I was never totally in any denomination again. Now I've been baptized in the Spirit and the Spirit of Truth is all I need, except fellowship with others who love Christ, even it they don't know the Scriptures.
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