Why do Catholics…

[Cassandra]

Hello Romald,

You think not?
For 2000 years our brothers and sisters have recognized the sacrifice of the Eucharist as the fulfilment of Malachi 1:11.
If there is no more sacrifice to be offered, how then is Malachi 1:11 fulfilled?

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding feast of the Lamb of God!

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

Jesus only had to die once. Communion is a memorial of His death, not a repeat of it. He does not have to die over and over.
Heb 9:28
So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

 

[Philip James]

Jesus only had to die once. Communion is a memorial of His death, not a repeat of it. He does not have to die over and over.
Heb 9:28
So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

Hi Cassandra,

Who said anything about Jesus dying again?

We offer the Lamb who ONCE was slain and now lives forever. (Rev 5:6)

The Lamb, whom our Father, in His goodness has given us..

To His ONE sacrifice we unite our thanksgiving and praise, yes even our very selves.. (Rom 12:1)

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding feast of the Lamb of God!

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Hello Romald,

You think not?
For 2000 years our brothers and sisters have recognized the sacrifice of the Eucharist as the fulfilment of Malachi 1:11.
If there is no more sacrifice to be offered, how then is Malachi 1:11 fulfilled?

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding feast of the Lamb of God!

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

Well I shall be at teh wedding feast!

but Malachi is speaking of the millenial kingdom and the temple sacrifices to be performed in the 1000 year kingdom when Jesus reigns! Many of the minor prophets speak of the this.

We cannot offer Jesus up again. He was offered once for all!

 

[bbyrd009]

Usually, I have learned to deal with such problems myself. If I had to pay prices for outside help each time someone messed with me or my computer, I would have given up on the Internet long ago. I am extremely careful in any searches I do or in opening unknown links, but I am no computer whiz. They still get me now and then.

i gotta say that i miss pc sometimes, but ipad makes all that moot, and thats pretty cool

 

[amadeus]

i gotta say that i miss pc sometimes, but ipad makes all that moot, and thats pretty cool

I will have to take your word for it. I cannot even tell you what ipad is and my brain is already overloaded in too many areas. I guess I am stuck in Windows 95, whatever that was... Everything after that...??? LOL

 

[Philip James]

but Malachi is speaking of the millenial kingdom and the temple sacrifices to be performed in the 1000 year kingdom when Jesus reigns!

No for there is no more sacrifice to be offered!

Make up your mind Ronald. Is there a new covenant sacrifice to be offered or not?

Well for 2000 years the Church has recognized the offering of the Eucharist as the sacrifice fulfilling Malachi 1:11.

~The Didache~

Psst.. Jesus reigns NOW!

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

 

[Cassandra]

Dishonest..... Lets see.... You are LYING. Do you teaching yourself?

Joh 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
Joh 5:23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

Heb 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
Heb 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

There is no judgement without the Son. You are a liar just like your father Satan.

YOU WILL FALL INTO THE HANDS OF THE LIVING GOD.... Jesus Christ.

You should be afraid. VERY afraid.

Joh 5:23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

Hi Cassandra,

Who said anything about Jesus dying again?

We offer the Lamb who ONCE was slain and now lives forever. (Rev 5:6)

The Lamb, whom our Father, in His goodness has given us..

To His ONE sacrifice we unite our thanksgiving and praise, yes even our very selves.. (Rom 12:1)

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding feast of the Lamb of God!

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

Then why do you not consider the bread and wine as symbolic? It is not the true body and blood of Christ. If it were, since the first communion was done when Hr was alive, where was it removed from? Christ was offered as a lamb without blemish. He lost no flesh nor blood during that communion.

 

[bbyrd009]

I will have to take your word for it. I cannot even tell you what ipad is and my brain is already overloaded in too many areas. I guess I am stuck in Windows 95, whatever that was... Everything after that...??? LOL

get an ipad imo, even an old one from tigerdirect or whatever. you wont go back

 

[Illuminator]

Then why do you not consider the bread and wine as symbolic? It is not the true body and blood of Christ. If it were, since the first communion was done when Hr was alive, where was it removed from? Christ was offered as a lamb without blemish. He lost no flesh nor blood during that communion.

The sacrifice at the Last Supper is one and the same sacrifice as the Crucifixion. There is no room for symbolism. Symbols can't give eternal life. A pure offering cannot mean symbolic, as in the prophecy of Malachi 1:11.

Luke 22:19; 1 Cor. 11:24-25 – the translation of Jesus’ words of consecration is “touto poieite tan eman anamnasin.” Jesus literally said “offer this as my memorial sacrifice.” The word “poiein” (do) refers to offering a sacrifice (see, e.g., Exodus 29:38-39, where God uses the same word – poieseis – regarding the sacrifice of the lambs on the altar). The word “anamnesis” (remembrance) also refers to a sacrifice which is really or actually made present in time by the power of God, as it reminds God of the actual event (see, e.g., Heb. 10:3; Num. 10:10). It is not just a memorial of a past event, but a past event made present in time.

In other words, the “sacrifice” is the “memorial” or “reminder.” If the Eucharist weren’t a sacrifice, Luke would have used the word “mnemosunon” (which is the word used to describe a nonsacrificial memorial. See, for example, Matt. 26:13; Mark 14:9; and especially Acts 10:4). So there are two memorials, one sacrificial (which Jesus instituted), and one non-sacrificial.

Lev. 24:7 – the word “memorial” in Hebrew in the sacrificial sense is “azkarah” which means to actually make present (see Lev. 2:2,9,16;5:12;6:5; Num.5:26 where “azkarah” refers to sacrifices that are currently offered and thus present in time). Jesus’ instruction to offer the bread and wine (which He changed into His body and blood) as a “memorial offering” demonstrates that the offering of His body and blood is made present in time over and over again.

Num. 10:10 – in this verse, “remembrance” refers to a sacrifice, not just a symbolic memorial. So Jesus’ command to offer the memorial “in remembrance” of Him demonstrates that the memorial offering is indeed a sacrifice currently offered. It is a re-presentation of the actual sacrifice made present in time. It is as if the curtain of history is drawn and Calvary is made present to us.
THE EUCHARIST - Scripture Catholic
The Mass is not a show.

 

[Philip James]

Hi Cassandra,

Then why do you not consider the bread and wine as symbolic?

The celebration of the Eucharist is full of symbolism.

For example, the separation of the Bread and the Cup symbolizes and represents the separation of Christ's body and blood during His passion and crucifixtion.

During the doxology, as we offer our praise and thanksgiving to our Father, the Chalice and the Host are elevated held apart, representing the separation of Christs blood from His body. For only through, with and in, the offering of our High Priest and victim, is our own offering made acceptable..

Later, just before communion, the Host and Chalice are elevated together, representing that Christ is risen, and they are no longer separated..

It is not the true body and blood of Christ.

God speaks the universe into existence, and so it is!

Jesus says 'this is my body' 'this is my blood' and so it is...


But there are some of you who do not believe." Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him.

If it were, since the first communion was done when Hr was alive, where was it removed from? Christ was offered as a lamb without blemish. He lost no flesh nor blood during that communion.

You misunderstand. We do not receive bits of Christ or pieces of Him. We receive His whole person, Body,Blood, Soul and Divinity. Jesus is not diminished in any way by giving Himself to us..

St.John places the Bread of Life discourse immediately after the miracle of the multiplication of the loaves for a reason..

If Jesus can multiply bread and fish to feed our bellies, He can certainly multiply Himself to feed our souls!

At the last supper, at the time proscribed by Moses 'when the hour had come', in front of the whole house of Israel (the twelve apostles), Jesus offered Himself as the paschal Lamb, of which we must partake to have life..

Jesus said to them, "Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day.

For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

 

[amadeus]

get an ipad imo, even an old one from tigerdirect or whatever. you wont go back

Does it have a full keyboard for the ten fingers of my two hands? If not, I will stay with a desktop or at worst a laptop. I have trouble with cell phones of any kind. I have learned call out on one and to answer one finally. I missed a lot of phone calls until I finally learned to that. To use it for anything else is something I won't try anymore.

 

[Marymog]

@amadeus

All men who are converted IN Christ, receive the gift of Gods Word Within them...(Gods Spirit of Truth).
In Scripture (2 Tim 3:16), for refreshing, verifying, trust it, believe it, and are a disciple given a gift to speak, minister Gods word one to another.

1 Pet 4:
[10] As every man hath received the gift, even so minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.
[11] If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God; if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

@Marymog is either not acquainted with that method or does not believe that method, but expresses ONLY particular people are chosen by succession, to be authorized to teach and decide what others will hear by such “succession” ...and all the People MUST hear, trust, believe them.
And likely why SHE can not answer Scriptural Questions with her words, but must go see what they say, and refer us to Their words.

God Bless,
Taken

Time for a bible lesson Taken.

As you know (or actually probably don't know) Timothy and Titus are pastoral letters. That means those instructions (Scripture is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness) are for pastors. For you see when Protestant men use your theory that you have been taught by your Protestant men that every Christian can use scripture for rebuking, correcting and training of a fellow Christian we end up with....well...Protestantism. We end up with Christianity divided into thousands of different denominations teaching hundreds of different salvific doctrines. To that end EVERY denomination thinks they are the pillar and foundation of truth and EVERY denomination thinks they have the ex-communication authority of Matthew 18:17. Your theory is not workable or logical. Can you now see how what you have been taught is a lie?

You have been taught by your Protestant men to twist 2 Timothy and 1 Peter into the same instruction for all Christians. Twisting shows the weakness of your argument and you do it to your own destruction. Those two verses have nothing to do with each other. It is true that we are to minister the same one to another as good stewards, but that does not make us all ministers (pastors). If your theory were true then there would only be shepherds and no sheep. And the "gift" spoken of in vs 10 in Peter is NOT the gift of teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness spoken of in vs 16 in 2 Tim 3. Sadly you have been taught to twist those two verses into one and feel righteous by doing it.

Bible study Mary

The Pastoral Letters (cliffsnotes.com)
Pastoral epistles - Wikipedia
What Are the Pastoral Epistles? (christianity.com)

 

[Marymog]

So all yu oare try9ing to nudge me to is that we must conform on salvific issues? Which ones? I believe in eternal security. If you are a good catholic, you don't which simply means that Jesus did not pay the price for all your sins!

I believe in unity, but not conformity in all issues. I believe in what are called teh 5 fundamentals of the faith. They are intensely biblical.

So you can never nudge me to your concept of thinking my logic is illogic. You have not even moderately quried me as to my stance. You are making assumptions based on less than a paragraph of information. Presumptuous at least.

Thanks Ronald.

Logically and according to Scripture we "must conform on salvific issues". Right? Isn't that what Jesus and the Apostles taught? If we didn't conform to the teachings of the Apostles we won't be saved. Jesus said this about the Apostles: He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despises you despises me; and he that despises me despises him that sent me. So to answer your question: Yes, I am trying to nudge you to eternal salvation.

If Jesus paid the price for all our sins then that means there is no need for Penance?

Eternal security? Is that the OSAS theory that Calvin started? Why do you accept the writings of Calvin but reject the writings of the men who walked and talked with the Apostles (Apostolic Fathers)?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

You certainly do not want any open two-way discussion here...do you?

Lol...Yes, I do want an open two-way discussion. That is why I don't do like you do; Answer questions with a question. THAT is not conducive to and open discussion.

 

[Marymog]

Do you ever believe it is necessary for you to go to confession? Now I have answered another of your questions with a question.

And asking a question to answer a question is NOT conducive to an open two-way discussion. But, I will play your game!

The answer to your question: Must we do what Scripture tells us to do? Is confession in Scripture?

Mary

 

[Marymog]

I have had a long day. I am tired of your nit picking as if your logic and knowledge was going to change what God has given me. I am not walking on eggshells nor on thin ice. I am living for God seven days a week... with His help moving toward praying without ceasing and rejoicing in Him always.

Well, actually amadeus, I just asked you a question based on your own admittance and your own words. If my question is "nit picking" and causes you to dodge my question and not give an answer to my legitimate question.... then so be it. You are the one that said some "are following the wrong head and are wrong" and admitted "That would certainly include me". I don't think it is unreasonable to ask if it is POSSIBLE that this may be one of those situations that it "would certainly include you".

Continue rejoicing in Him without ceasing! He appreciates it.

 

[Marymog]

No! You do not have it right and you have no real interest in discussing any points of disagreement. Find someone who wants to argue with you. I do not. I want to focus on serving the One I love and becoming more like Him. I am willing to help people who want what God may have to offer them through me.

OK...I don't have it right!! But you are not going to tell me were I got it wrong? I am trying to have a discussion with you. You have rejected me. Let the record show that YOU ended this discussion even though in post #459 you asked me: You certainly do not want any open two-way discussion here...do you?

Keeping it real...Mary

 

[Marymog]

@Marymog reality, she is always right.
Does that make you a Republican?

I thought the Libertarians were always right?

 

[Taken]

Time for a bible lesson Taken.

As you know (or actually probably don't know) Timothy and Titus are pastoral letters. That means those instructions (Scripture is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness) are for pastors.

And? Nothing new to me, as you imply.
Well aware what is IN Scripture IS God Approved Scriptural teaching.
Not once Have I said or indicated otherwise.

For you see when Protestant men use your theory that you have been taught by your Protestant men

Lie. Not once have I said, I was taught by Protestant men.

that every Christian can use scripture for rebuking, correcting and training of a fellow Christian we end up with....well...Protestantism.

Lie. Not once have I said:

“every Christian can use scripture for rebuking, correcting and training of a fellow Christian”.

we end up with....well...Protestantism.

“we” You speak for yourself, NOT me.

We end up with Christianity divided into thousands of different denominations teaching hundreds of different salvific doctrines. To that end EVERY denomination thinks they are the pillar and foundation of truth and EVERY denomination thinks they have the ex-communication authority of Matthew 18:17. Your theory is not workable or logical.

“We” You are still speaking for yourself, NOT me.

Can you now see how what you have been taught is a lie?

Lie. You are speaking for yourself, Not me.
Lie. You are making claims for me, I did not make.
Lie. You are trying to include me, in what you claim, which I have not claimed.

Bible study Mary

Uh huh winking Mary, pretending your false claims are a Bible study.

It has been pointed out to you before.
...You make claims for me, I have not made.
It has been told to you before.
...Stop speaking for me, what I have not said.
This forum is designed for you to post a persons OWN words,
...and IN your OWN words make your response.
Repeatedly YOU SPEAK FOR others, then respond to what YOU have said.

That IS giving a FALSE Testimony for another!

Here’s a real Bible Scripture for you to ponder.

Proverbs 14:
[5] A faithful witness will not lie: but a false witness will utter lies.

 

[Taken]

I thought the Libertarians were always right?

A Republican is a person who identifies with a Republican Political Party, which the Party always identifies as RIGHT.

A Democrat is a person who identifies with a Democrat Political Party, which the Party always identifies as LEFT.

A Libertarian is a person who identifies with a Libertarian Political Party, which the Party neither identifies as RIGHT or LEFT.

Pretty well known facts, you seem to not know.