Dead to the Law, not the Law is Dead

[robert derrick]

There is a delusional teaching that the law of God is dead on paper, and so no man can be judged and condemned by it.

They say that no man can sin anymore against the written law of God, because it no longer exists on paper and thus has no power to condemn any man transgressing it.

Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.

There say there is no law now on paper, and so there is no possible transgression against it.

What Scripture is saying, is that if it is not written in Scripture, then it is no law of Christ, but only commandment and tradition of man added to God's word:

But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

Scripture says them receiving Christ are dead to the law, not the law of Christ is dead.

There is still the law of God written on paper in Scripture: the law of Christ written by the apostles.

The law of Christ written by Moses on stone and paper is nailed to the cross and dead, not the law of Christ written by His apostles today for His NT.

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Everyone doing these things are the unrighteous that shall not inherit the kingdom of God, and any belief that it is not so, whether by faith or grace, is just as delusional as the false teaching that the law of Christ written in Scripture is not alive with power to judge and condemn:

He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

Rejecting Christ's word written in Scripture as law on paper only, and so not to be obeyed, is already judged as a transgression, not matter what vain imagination of faith they have written into their own hearts and minds.

 

[robert derrick]

Living by faith only according to what is written in our hearts, without any objective law of Christ in Scripture to be judged by, is the vain imagination of the lawless, who desire to be a law unto themselves.

Just because we believe something, doesn't make it so, and just because we do something by our faith, doesn't make it good.

If the law of Scripture is dead, then so is the Scripture, so that no man's doctrine nor deeds can be judged by what is written.

And so it is no wonder, that them who who transgress the law of Christ written in Scripture, are the same who reject Scripture to believe what they want.

They make themselves a law and a doctrine to themselves:

Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

The law of Christ is the doctrine of Christ, that is written in and known by the Scriptures of the apostles, and them teaching their own law and doctrine are false apostles:

If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed.

The only law of Christ made know to man, is what is written in the Scriptures of Christ: everything else is false, and Christ did not write it in their hearts to teach and to do, but rather is the writing of another christ of one's own making:

For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.

I have seen many marvellously wonderful things written about the doctrine of Christ, and it is so absolutely contrary to what is written, one even wonders if they care what Scripture says.

And now, I know the answer: they don't. They really do believe that what they want to think and believe is all that matters, and so justify themselves before God.

And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.

The Jews of Jesus' days as man did so, make themselves a law unto themselves, and the Christians of Jesus' Covenant do the same today: they esteem their own thoughts and faith above that which is written in Scripture, which they declare is dead and without power of God to judge and condemn any man.

And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

There is only one true Christ and truth of His word, doctrine, and law: It is Scripture as written on paper by His apostles.

All else is unrighteous vain imagination of delusional hypocritics, who make themselves a lawless law unto themselves, to think and to do whatsoever they believe, and Scripture has absolutely nothing to say about it.

The real wonder is why they bother with Scripture at all. must less wrestling it into something they like to think and believe.

 

[Davy]

I think... the basis of what you're trying to say is true, per God's Word. But your wording is a bit unclear about it.

1. Much of God's law first given through Moses is still in effect today per Christian doctrine (by Apostle Paul). In 1 Timothy 1, Paul said the law is good, if used lawfully (i.e., in fairness). He said the law was not made for the righteous, but for the lawless and disobedient, the ungodly and sinner. And he quoted a few of the things in God's laws from the Old Testament as examples. By that Paul showed many of God's laws are still in effect today for Christian society. The reason is so those in Christ could live in peace apart from the lawless and criminal.

2. In Galatians 5, Paul taught that IF... we walk by The Spirit, then we are not under God's law. That simply means if we do the good things by The Spirit, then there is no law against that. And that is how it is meant those who walk by The Holy Spirit have become dead to the law.

3. The portion of God's laws that Lord Jesus nailed to His cross per Colossians 2, was the "handwriting in ordinances", not the whole law. Many of God's statutes and judgments are still in effect for Christian society today (like what Apostle Paul showed). What Lord Jesus nailed to His cross involves the old ceremonial and blood ordinances in the law, ritualistic worship, etc. He did not nail to His cross God's laws against murder, rape, theft, perjury, telling lies, sodomy, sedition, nor even God's health laws (meaning the bad health effects of eating outside God's healthy list, etc.)

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The Saturday Sabbath, dietary laws, circumcision, holy days have all ended when the New Covenant began with Christ’s death.
While certain moral laws (like: Do not murder, do not steal, do not covet, etcetera) have carried over into the New Testament, Believers today are to primarily focus on following the Laws or commands that come from Jesus Christ and His followers. The Old Covenant contract is no more. We are under a New Covenant with New Commands.

Granted, 1 Timothy 1:8 says the Law (Old Law) is good if a man uses it lawfully.

But we have to be able to rightly divide and discern that with God’s Spirit and by comparing it with NT Scripture. We are not under the judicial laws, or ceremonial laws in the Old Testament. Moral laws have carried over and a Moral Law is any Law that is instinctual in doing what is good and right. For the Gentiles were able to keep the Law without having it (Romans 2:14).

But we need to realize that the Law has ultimately changed (Hebrews 7:12).
We have to realize we are not under the Law (Old Law) (Romans 6:14).

 

[Behold]

There is a delusional teaching that the law of God is dead on paper, and so no man can be judged and condemned by it.

robert derrick.....If you loved the Cross as much as you love Moses Law, its possible that you'd actually be able to be a help to someone.
But not till then.

Notice,

The born again, are "not under the law".
And Christ is the "end of the law, for righteousness to/for everyone who believes"

 

[robert derrick]

I like it. Thanks.

I think... the basis of what you're trying to say is true, per God's Word. But your wording is a bit unclear about it.

I agree. I have a style of writing that makes perfect sense to me when writing it, but not so much when reading it.

1. Much of God's law first given through Moses is still in effect today per Christian doctrine (by Apostle Paul). In 1 Timothy 1, Paul said the law is good, if used lawfully (i.e., in fairness). He said the law was not made for the righteous, but for the lawless and disobedient, the ungodly and sinner. And he quoted a few of the things in God's laws from the Old Testament as examples. By that Paul showed many of God's laws are till in effect today for Christian society. The reason is so those in Christ could live in peace apart from the lawless and criminal.

Sounds good. Although, I would say the main reason to do His law, is so that we can live in peace with God first, and not be His enemy in works of the flesh along with the lawless and criminals.

2. In Galatians 5, Paul taught that IF... we walk by The Spirit, then we are not under God's law. That simply means if we do the good things by The Spirit, then there is no law against that. And that is how it is meant those who walk by The Holy Spirit have become dead to the law.

Exactly. When we die to sinning, we die to the bondage of keeping the law without having the spirit: grievously.

We are not free from the law, so as being without law of God, but are made free from being in bondage to the law of Christ while having not the Spirit:

To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

I love the King James, but even it is not perfect in translation: it is not the same as being under the law in Romans 7, but is instead speaking of being in the law, with the law: in love with the law, so that by the Spirit of Christ I do love the law.

I would say that is the perfect answer to a good conscience in being wedded to Christ: "I do".

3. The portion of God's laws that Lord Jesus nailed to His cross per Colossians 2, was the "handwriting in ordinances", not the whole law. Many of God's statutes and judgments are still in effect for Christian society today (like what Apostle Paul showed). What Lord Jesus nailed to His cross involves the old ceremonial and blood ordinances in the law, ritualistic worship, etc. He did not nail to His cross God's laws against murder, rape, theft, perjury, telling lies, sodomy, sedition, nor even God's health laws (meaning the bad health effects of eating outside God's healthy list, etc.)

I agree with the practical results you speak of: only that which is written for law of Christ by the apostles in Scripture, is still to be obeyed for law of God: all else is dead law of Moses only.

The main obscene lie of the lawless, who seek to live by faith only, is that the whole law of God on paper is dead, including the points you sepak of from the Scriptures of the apostles, who were given Jesus' commandments in Person to write down for us to read and keep from the heart:

Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen.

 

[GEN2REV]

The Saturday Sabbath, dietary laws, circumcision, holy days have all ended when the New Covenant began with Christ’s death.
While certain moral laws (like: Do not murder, do not steal, do not covet, etcetera) have carried over into the New Testament, Believers today are to primarily focus on following the Laws or commands that come from Jesus Christ and His followers. The Old Covenant contract is no more. We are under a New Covenant with New Commands.

Granted, 1 Timothy 1:8 says the Law (Old Law) is good if a man uses it lawfully.

But we have to be able to rightly divide and discern that with God’s Spirit and by comparing it with NT Scripture. We are not under the judicial laws, or ceremonial laws in the Old Testament. Moral laws have carried over and a Moral Law is any Law that is instinctual in doing what is good and right. For the Gentiles were able to keep the Law without having it (Romans 2:14).

But we need to realize that the Law has ultimately changed (Hebrews 7:12).
We have to realize we are not under the Law (Old Law) (Romans 6:14).

Why do you squeeze the Sabbath in among the Laws of Ordinances, the external Laws of washings and sacrificial preppings, etc.? Hebrews 9:10 Those things were intended to be until the time of reformation; until the time of Jesus Christ.

The Ten Commandments were never, and never will be, ended.

Can we agree that God is all-knowing and that He spoke this entire world (dimension) into existence?

Then we can agree that He wrote, and spoke, the 10 Commandments as a lasting decree (forever) for those who wished to become one of His Children; to follow His Ways and receive His Promises.

He wrote the Commandments in stone, with His very own finger, twice.

Can you imagine that an Almighty God would do something of such lasting intent, and symbolism, as a mere gesture of temporary importance?

Honestly?

And if He intended the Sabbath to be discarded, why did He write it in among the stone-inscribed Commandments and tell us to "Remember" it?

The only way somebody can disagree with these plain observations is if they are taught by man to do so.

 

[robert derrick]

Why do you squeeze the Sabbath in among the Laws of Ordinances, the external Laws of washings and sacrificial preppings, etc.? Hebrews 9:10 Those things were intended to be until the time of reformation; until the time of Jesus Christ.

The Ten Commandments were never, and never will be, ended.

Can we agree that God is all-knowing and that He spoke this entire world (dimension) into existence?

Then we can agree that He wrote, and spoke, the 10 Commandments as a lasting decree (forever) for those who wished to become one of His Children; to follow His Ways and receive His Promises.

He wrote the Commandments in stone, with His very own finger, twice.

Can you imagine that an Almighty God would do something of such lasting intent, and symbolism, as a mere gesture of temporary importance?

Honestly?

And if He intended the Sabbath to be discarded, why did He write it in among the stone-inscribed Commandments and tell us to "Remember" it?

The only way somebody can disagree with these plain observations is if they are taught by man to do so.

The services of the worldly sanctuary was also written in stone. Twice. And they were written before the ten commandments, which were only written in stone at the end of the law given on the mount.

You can go into Sabbath-keeping if you want of course, but his point is correct: only what is written by the apostles as commandment, is the doctrine and law of Christ. All else is left behind with Moses.

Sabbath keeping is not commanded by any apostles to keep, and of course judging over sabbath keeping is condemned.

Show any apostles commanding to keep the Sabbath day, even as they did to honor mother and father, and then you have a point.

 

[Davy]

The Saturday Sabbath, dietary laws, circumcision, holy days have all ended when the New Covenant began with Christ’s death.

That is not completely true. God's dietary laws are still in effect, only there is no religious or political recourse for breaking it. Eating pork and shellfish is still unhealthy for our body, it's just there's no other penalty for eating it, and praying over it will not make it healthy.

While certain moral laws (like: Do not murder, do not steal, do not covet, etcetera) have carried over into the New Testament, Believers today are to primarily focus on following the Laws or commands that come from Jesus Christ and His followers. The Old Covenant contract is no more. We are under a New Covenant with New Commands.

That's the problem, many Christian brethren are ignorant of what all is contained in God's laws by those who keep trying to say all of God's laws were about the 'old covenant'. They were not, and are not. The commandment to love thy neighbor as thyself comes from Leviticus 19, so was that for the 'old covenant'?

The Christian who uses common sense by The Holy Spirit will be able to discern what and how still existing laws in God's Word apply in Christian society. So we should not be shunned away from studying them in the Old Testament. Like Apostle Paul said, "I had not known sin, but by the law:" (Romans 7:7).

 

[GEN2REV]

The services of the worldly sanctuary was also written in stone. Twice.

Can you show that in Scripture?

And they were written before the ten commandments, which were only written in stone at the end of the law given on the mount.

That part is patently untrue.

... only what is written by the apostles as commandment, is the doctrine and law of Christ. All else is left behind with Moses.

Wrong.

Show any apostles commanding to keep the Sabbath day, even as they did to honor mother and father, and then you have a point.

I don't have to show them "Commanding" it, the Bible shows many examples of them, and other followers of Christ, doing it. And Paul was a keeper of the whole Law as a Christian.

 

[GEN2REV]

only what is written by the apostles as commandment, is the doctrine and law of Christ.

Did Jesus keep the 10 Commandments, Robert?

Are we to live as Jesus lived?

 

[Davy]

The main obscene lie of the lawless, who seek to live by faith only, is that the whole law of God on paper is dead, including the points you sepak of from the Scriptures of the apostles, who were given Jesus' commandments in Person to write down for us to read and keep from the heart:

I'm not sure what you refer to there in the underlined part.

Lord Jesus didn't come to do away with all of God's laws, as He showed in Matthew 19. So many of God's laws that are 'written' in the Old Testament are still in effect today, thus it is not wise to speak against that as if done away, remember 1 Timothy 1 that the law was not made for the righteous?

I well understand about those who think under Christ they have a license to sin. Apostle Paul dealt with those same types in his day. So how will they know IF they sin, if they don't know what God approves of and what He doesn't? Like Paul said, and I again quote, "Nay, i had not known sin, but by the law:" (Romans 7:7). Doesn't matter what Bible version you use, they all pretty much repeat that like the KJV does.

Rom 7:7
7 Well then, am I suggesting that the law of God is sinful? Of course not! In fact, it was the law that showed me my sin. I would never have known that coveting is wrong if the law had not said, "You must not covet."
New Living Translation

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Why do you squeeze the Sabbath in among the Laws of Ordinances ,

Because Colossians 2:16 mentions how we are not to let others judge us according to whether or not we keep sabbath days and this is in context to Colossians 2:14 that says how Christ nailed these ordinances to the cross. But of course you probably heard this argument before and you rejected it because you are addicted to your denomination or to the keeping of Old Laws that no longer apply anymore.

Are you SDA? Messianic? Some other Old Law keeping Christian group?

the external Laws of washings and sacrificial preppings, etc.? Hebrews 9:10 Those things were intended to be until the time of reformation; until the time of Jesus Christ.

No they weren’t. The time of reformation was when Christ died upon the cross and the temple veil was torn from top to bottom.

The Ten Commandments were never, and never will be, ended.

Nowhere did I say all of the 10 are gone. I believe 9 out of the 10 still apply (With the Saturday Sabbath command excluded). Many Christians in the Law of Moses camp who mindlessly love to push the 10 when it was actually more than 10 (It was 613 Laws in the Law of Moses) love to indirectly accuse others that we are not for any of the 10 commandments (When we made no such case that this is so). But it’s Sabbath this, and Sabbath that. And it’s the 10 this, and the 10 that. It’s like a bunch of mindless robots talking. I remember one guy getting upset and yelling in a Burger King during a bible study that all we have to do is keep the 10 commandments. I could not help but to roll my eyes because did He ever read the part in the Bible where Jesus talked about the two greatest commandments in Mark 12:29-31?

Can we agree that God is all-knowing and that He spoke this entire world (dimension) into existence?

Then we can agree that He wrote, and spoke, the 10 Commandments as a lasting decree (forever) for those who wished to become one of His Children; to follow His Ways and receive His Promises.

He wrote the Commandments in stone, with His very own finger, twice.

But these laws on the stone tablets as a whole were given to Israel and not the church. God did not write them down a third time at Pentecost.
There are no Sabbath day Commands in the New Testament. There are no sabbath day breaking sins listed alongside murder, coveting, theft, idolatry, etcetera among the list of sins Paul and John made in Scripture.

Can you imagine that an Almighty God would do something of such lasting intent, and symbolism, as a mere gesture of temporary importance?

Honestly?

And if He intended the Sabbath to be discarded, why did He write it in among the stone-inscribed Commandments and tell us to "Remember" it?

The only way somebody can disagree with these plain observations is if they are taught by man to do so.

Yep. Hebrews 7:12 says the law has changed.
Acts of the Apostles 13:39 says you cannot be justified by the Law of Moses.
Acts 15 at the Jerusalem council addressed the issue of whether or not Gentile Christians should keep the law and they said they did not have to keep it. The council was only stressing particular laws like abstaining from idols, fornication, and not to eat things strangled, from blood. If the Sabbath was a must as you say… then why didn’t they say we have to keep the Saturday Sabbath? The short answer is that it was not necessary.

 

[Davy]

That's correct, Apostle Paul in Colossians 2 said to not allow man to judge us in meat or drink, or as to the keeping of holy days, new moon, or sabbaths.

If one wants to still keep those days under Christ, they can if they want, as long as they don't try to make that requirement for Christ's Salvation, nor condemn other Christians who don't keep those things.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

That is not completely true. God's dietary laws are still in effect, only there is no religious or political recourse for breaking it. Eating pork and shellfish is still unhealthy for our body, it's just there's no other penalty for eating it, and praying over it will not make it healthy.

1 Timothy 4:4-5 says,
“For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.”

Christians are not under the Law of Moses as a whole or package deal (Romans 6:14). While certain Moral Laws have carried over (like do not murder, do not steal, do not covet, love God, and love your neighbor, etc.), we are not under the ceremonial laws (Colossians 2:14-16).
NT Scripture is clear that the Old Law is no more.

Then again, when I was new in the faith, I used to believe we also had to keep both the Old Testament Laws, and New Testament Laws like you.
But after much study, I discovered that this clearly was not the case.

While I do not agree with GCI’s view of sin and salvation, their articles on the difference between the Old and New Covenant were extremely helpful to open my eyes to the truth on the matter (with Scripture).

The Old Covenant and the Law of Moses - GCI Archive

Acts of the Apostles 13:39 says you cannot be justified by the Law of Moses.
In the Jerusalem council in Acts 15, we are told by the council that the Gentile Christians did not have to keep the Law of Moses.
The council only stressed certain laws with the Gentile Christians in abstaining from idols, fornication, and from eating things strangled, and of blood. Nothing else was mentioned. They told the Gentile Christians they did not have the keep the Law of Moses. That’s what it means, and I believe it.

That's the problem, many Christian brethren are ignorant of what all is contained in God's laws by those who keep trying to say all of God's laws were about the 'old covenant'. They were not, and are not. The commandment to love thy neighbor as thyself comes from Leviticus 19, so was that for the 'old covenant'?

Speaking of the two greatest commandments:

Actually the full 1st greatest command as given to us by our Lord in Mark 12:29-30 is close to what is in Deuteronomy 6:4-5, but it’s not exact. Deuteronomy 6:4-5 does not mention how we are to love God with all our mind like Mark 12:29-30 says. In fact, we don’t even know this is the 1st greatest commandment until Jesus came and told us. So the New Testament Scripture teaching is superior.

The Christian who uses common sense by The Holy Spirit will be able to discern what and how still existing laws in God's Word apply in Christian society. So we should not be shunned away from studying them in the Old Testament. Like Apostle Paul said, "I had not known sin, but by the law:" (Romans 7:7).

Paul says in the verse prior that we are to serve in newness of spirit and not in the oldness of the letter (Romans 7:6). The oldness of the letter is the Torah or the Law of Moses. You also have to realize that Paul is making a point in Romans 7 about his struggle with sin while he was a Pharisee under the Old Law before he came to Jesus Christ in Romans 7:14-24. Keeping the NT Law (the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus) makes us free from the Old Law (the Law of Sin and Death) (Please read Romans 8:2). The Old Law is called the Law of Sin and Death because you could be stoned for not keeping certain aspects of it. This is why we are not under the Law. The temple veil has been torn from top to bottom.

 

[GEN2REV]

Because Colossians 2:16 mentions how we are not to let others judge us according to whether or not we keep sabbath days and this is in context to Colossians 2:14 that says how Christ nailed these ordinances to the cross.

There are Sabbaths that are not THE WEEKLY 10 Commandment Sabbath. That is what that verse is talking about. Colossians 2:14 is referring to Hebrews 7:16, Hebrews 9:10 & Ephesians 2:15 in reference to EXTERNAL, CARNAL Commandments; that of the washings and sacrificial preparations.

But of course you probably heard this argument before and you rejected it because you are addicted to your denomination or to the keeping of Old Laws that no longer apply anymore.

What a strange accusation to make the first time you discuss a topic with a particular person. The irony is that people DO NOT come to the conclusions that you have come to, nor believe what you believe, on their own - by reading Scripture in an unbiased manner. They are denominationally brainwashed to see it that way.

It is taught NOWHERE in Scripture. On the contrary, just the opposite is made very clear.

Are you SDA? Messianic? Some other Old Law keeping Christian group?

Nope. None of the above. I am a Bible-believing Christian that set out to read the Bible on my own over a decade ago. I've been through it cover to cover multiple times since then and I have encountered countless Christians such as yourself who have been blinded to the mainstream churchianity lies that you have been deceived with and sadly the same unbiblical nonsense that you continue to spread.

The time of reformation was when Christ died upon the cross and the temple veil was torn from top to bottom.

Exactly, just as the verse I posted says. Hebrews 9:10 The External/Carnal Commandments, those of the sacrificial Ordinances, expired at that time due to Christ's perfect Sacrifice. His own followers observed the Sabbath Commandment the very night after His Crucifixion. Luke 23:54-56 Argue with Scripture all you like.

Nowhere did I say all of the 10 are gone. I believe 9 out of the 10 still apply (With the Saturday Sabbath command excluded).

Good. It's not, though. Jesus obeyed it and there's multiple verses to show this. John 15:10 Paul is also shown observing it multiple times and ways. Jesus' follwers obeyed it right after His death. The proof is overwhelming.

But these laws on the stone tablets as a whole were given to Israel and not the church.

Nope. They were given to everybody and the Bible makes that plain. You have been taught to get personally offended with anybody who speaks of these things, but you flat-out refuse to accept that the Bible teaches that we are to keep the 10 Commandments. It is undeniable.

This passage proves that it was given to all who wish to call themselves by God's name; those who profess to be Christians. Deuteronomy 29:14-15

And, contrary to what people like you claim, it is your side that is arrogantly judgmental about those who speak about the Commandments. We simply claim what the Bible teaches. You get all personal, cast insults and accusations and get all up in arms about the Sabbath every time somebody mentions the 10 Commandments.

Read your Bible.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

There are Sabbaths that are not THE WEEKLY 10 Commandment Sabbath. That is what that verse is talking about. Colossians 2:14 is referring to Hebrews 7:16, Hebrews 9:10 & Ephesians 2:15 in reference to EXTERNAL, CARNAL Commandments; that of the washings and sacrificial preparations.What a strange accusation to make the first time you discuss a topic with a particular person. The irony is that people DO NOT come to the conclusions that you have come to, nor believe what you believe, on their own - by reading Scripture in an unbiased manner. They are denominationally brainwashed to see it that way.

It is taught NOWHERE in Scripture. On the contrary, just the opposite is made very clear.Nope. None of the above. I am a Bible-believing Christian that set out to read the Bible on my own over a decade ago. I've been through it cover to cover multiple times since then and I have encountered countless Christians such as yourself who have been blinded to the mainstream churchianity lies that you have been deceived with and that you sadly the same unbiblical nonsense that you continue to spread.Exactly, just as the verse I posted says. Hebrews 9:10 The External/Carnal Commandments, those of the sacrificial Ordinances, expired at that time due to Christ's perfect Sacrifice. His own followers observed the Sabbath Commandment the very night after His Crucifixion. Luke 23:54-56 Argue with Scripture all you like.Good. It's not, though. Jesus obeyed it and there's multiple verses to show this. John 15:10 Paul is also shown observing it multiple times and ways. Jesus' follwers obeyed it right after His death. The proof is overwhelming. Nope. They were given to everybody and the Bible makes that plain. You have been taught to get personally offended with anybody who speaks of these things, but you flat-out refuse to accept that the Bible teaches that we are to keep the 10 Commandments. It is undeniable.

This passage proves that it was given to all who wish to call themselves by God's name; those who profess to be Christians. Deuteronomy 29:14-15

And, contrary to what people like you claim, it is your side that is arrogantly judgmental about those who speak about the Commandments. We simply claim what the Bible teaches. You get all personal, cast insults and accusations and get all up in arms about the Sabbath every time somebody mentions the 10 Commandments.

Read your Bible.

I just read the Bible and believe it. There is nothing in the context to suggest that the Saturday Sabbath was excluded in Colossians 2:16. That would be a stretch of the text to simply say that it was excluded.

Again, read Acts of the Apostles 13:39 several times. Read in Acts 15 about how the Gentile Christians are told by the Jerusalem council that they do not have to keep the Law of Moses.

The Sabbath is clearly a part of the Law of Moses, and it’s not a command explicitly repeated or given in the New Covenant by Jesus and His followers. I have heard this silly argument more than I care to count. I am simply not interested in endlessly debating this with you because of Titus 3:9. In addition: You also went and fully ignored what I said before about the 10. I said to you before that I am not against all of the 10. Yet, you went back into full accusation mode (Which is what your group does) of how I am against the 10 (When I am not against keeping 9 out of the 10).

So carry on.
I am not interested in discussing this issue with you further.

Have a great day;
And may God bless you.

 

[robert derrick]

robert derrick.....If you loved the Cross as much as you love Moses Law, its possible that you'd actually be able to be a help to someone.
But not till then.

Notice,

The born again, are "not under the law".
And Christ is the "end of the law, for righteousness to/for everyone who believes"

I hate and abhor lying: but thy law do I love. I hate vain thoughts: but thy law do I love.

As I said, it's a wonder why anyone hating any of God's law, whether that of Moses before or of Christ now, even bother with Scripture.

You want God's law ended in your life, and so you have it.

Happy sinning while you can.

 

[robert derrick]

Can you show that in Scripture? That part is patently untrue.Wrong.

The first time the 10 commandments were written in Scripture was by voice of the Lord to all the people in Ex 20. They refused to hear Him by voice, so sent Moses up get it written for them.

On stone, first were written the judgements, then the the tabernacle service, and then at the end the Sabbath commandment.

Then Moses break those commandments,a nd so God had him hew out more,a nd this time Moses rewrote everything as before, only this time including all the ten commandments, and not the Sabbath only.

So, technically the ten commandments were given by voice once, and the people drew back, then the Sabbath was written twice, with the whole ten included the second time.

You can read Gen 20-34 for yourself, and you will see for yourself it is actually written that way, so it must be true.

The thing is you're not really looking closely at what is actually written, but only speaking from things as you like to think of them according to your own tradition. It is necessary to be exact with Scripture, and not so loose with interpretations thereof.

I don't have to show them "Commanding" it, the Bible shows many examples of them, and other followers of Christ, doing it. And Paul was a keeper of the whole Law as a Christian.

Ok, You don't. I do. I only do the law of Christ and His commandments that he gave to His apostles for my benefit. You can keep whatever law and commandments you want.

Just don't preach your commandments to me. Or, of course you can, but I won't do them just because you like to.

And Paul was a keeper of the whole Law as a Christian.

And so do I as any Christian ought keep the whole law of Christ, which does not include the whole law of Moses, including the Sabbath commandment.

This thread is not only about the law of God not being dead on paper, but only the law of Moses, that is not also included in the law of Christ by His apostles.

The commandment of the Sabbath by the flesh is dead, so is worshipping a Sabbath as by law. Same as outward circumcision, and offering of blood of bulls and goats.

Those are the letters of an old law that are indeed dead, not to be obeyed anymore as by law.

But nonetheless, I hope you have a Happy Sabbath, Thanksgiving, and Merry Merry Christmas.

 

[robert derrick]

Did Jesus keep the 10 Commandments, Robert?

Are we to live as Jesus lived?

Yes, He was a good Jew. He was also raised by good Jews, who had Him circumcised on the 8th day according to the law of Moses.

You too?

Are we to live as Jesus lived?

Not as a Jew. He's my Lord and my God, not my personal Jewish Rabbi.

I keep the law of commandments He gave to His apostles for His body to keep on earth: as righteously as He did, not just in the letter only, but with His Spirit from a pure heart.