How are we to reckon ourselves as being dead to sin?

[Eternally Grateful]

The way the carnal religious mind turns...

I am a follower of Christ...the real Christ..not some man-made religious version of Him.

Yet you deny everything he came to do..

You are following your version of him my friend. No one has believed as you do. You can't point to one source from the time of Christ who teaches what you do

I'm wasting my time explaining this to you...but

Typical self righteous attitude I have come to expect from you.

Try to consider that the early church had only the OT for a bible. The NT was in the form of epistles...letters that contained testimonies that many were also coming into the same experience as.

The OT came to God the same way. By grace through faith. The law never saved anyone. it was all through grace (see Abraham and pauls writing in romans 4 and 5)

Fast forward a few hundred years, and the testimonials became codified as scripture...and a religion was born based on creeds and avowals of belief...but the life was gone.

Scripture is God breathed. Although religion took hold in the 300's in the form of roman paganism under Constantine, The truth of the gospel was still strong. God does not fail. His church never failed.

Now that religious version of Christianity reigns supreme...because the cost of an actual walk IN Christ is too high for a superficial modern society that looks for instant gratification.

The cost for an actual walk with Christ is humility. The tax collector showed us the cost. Jesus called it becoming bankrupt. The cost was the cross.

Sadly, you are no different than religion. You think it is all about you. Your power. Your sacrifice. Its all about you.

You no different than the religious system you attack so much..

I was baptized into Christ outside the religious system. My testimony is being born and baptized from heaven. So I don't fit into any man-inspired religious system.

If you were baptiZed into Christ. you would walk the walk. You would proclaim his word. You would live out your salvation.

You do not even believe that is the means you are reckoned as dead to sin. People try to show you this, and you mock them as unlearned, religious people.

Is that a bad thing? Quite the opposite. The problem is that genuine faith is so rare....its all mixed in with religious posturings and a name it claim it attitude that turns the bible into a religious magic book where all your wishes come true.

Genuine faith Saved, Genuine faith does not seek to walk in the spirit. It walks in the spirit. because it has been born in the spirit. Again, Your faith is in self. You procliam self. You deny the salvation that is from Christ. the imputed righjteousness whcih comes from only Christ. which makes us alive in Christ.

You think Muslims can get to heaven while denying Christ.. as long as they do good works..

Your not wasting your time. You are once again showing your true self..

The problem with the religious version is that the testimonies of the NT are real. God is real. Jesus has been resurrected from the dead. He is alive. No man-made system is needed...it just gets in the way of a real connection to God.

Then why do you follow a man made system? And deny the very christ who purchased you? and worse. lead people astray with your "religion"?

Because I have learned to have faith...actual biblical faith...I have the same kind of testimony as we read about in the NT. Is that seen as good among the superficial ones? Quite the opposite. A real living connection with God is seen now as demonic and "New Age"...such is the lack of authenticity among the modern religionists who seek to steal away grace from God. But Jesus is coming back as a thief to take it back. There will be weeping and anger.

The unbelief of so many modern "believers" is made apparent to the principalities by their hateful reaction to the truth, if not to those who are unable to discern anything that isn't self-justifying.

lol. what you have is phariseeism.. You pump your chest praising God your not like the sinner.. You refuse to get on your knees like the pharisee unable to even look up. because you acknowledge your guilt..

Sorry my friend.. Once again, Your people do not walk in the spirit. there is no power in that.. They can not walk. because they have not been given the power. they are trying to seek and earn something they can never earn..

 

[Episkopos]

Yet you deny everything he came to do..

You are following your version of him my friend. No one has believed as you do. You can't point to one source from the time of Christ who teaches what you do

Typical self righteous attitude I have come to expect from you.

The OT came to God the same way. By grace through faith. The law never saved anyone. it was all through grace (see Abraham and pauls writing in romans 4 and 5)

Scripture is God breathed. Although religion took hold in the 300's in the form of roman paganism under Constantine, The truth of the gospel was still strong. God does not fail. His church never failed.

The cost for an actual walk with Christ is humility. The tax collector showed us the cost. Jesus called it becoming bankrupt. The cost was the cross.

Sadly, you are no different than religion. You think it is all about you. Your power. Your sacrifice. Its all about you.

You no different than the religious system you attack so much..

If you were baptiZed into Christ. you would walk the walk. You would proclaim his word. You would live out your salvation.

You do not even believe that is the means you are reckoned as dead to sin. People try to show you this, and you mock them as unlearned, religious people.



Genuine faith Saved, Genuine faith does not seek to walk in the spirit. It walks in the spirit. because it has been born in the spirit. Again, Your faith is in self. You procliam self. You deny the salvation that is from Christ. the imputed righjteousness whcih comes from only Christ. which makes us alive in Christ.

You think Muslims can get to heaven while denying Christ.. as long as they do good works..

Your not wasting your time. You are once again showing your true self..



Then why do you follow a man made system? And deny the very christ who purchased you? and worse. lead people astray with your "religion"?

lol. what you have is phariseeism.. You pump your chest praising God your not like the sinner.. You refuse to get on your knees like the pharisee unable to even look up. because you acknowledge your guilt..

Sorry my friend.. Once again, Your people do not walk in the spirit. there is no power in that.. They can not walk. because they have not been given the power. they are trying to seek and earn something they can never earn..

I knew you would respond with more lies, obscurantism, and deviations...as you also do in your periodic reading of the bible. If I don't defend myself...you say I agree with your foolish religiosity. If I do defend myself you say it's all about me. As the bible speaks of answering a fool or not. It's a conundrum....trying to figure out a foolishness that people are so well versed in.

But you and your fine feathered friends keep disparaging me in MANY posts...accusing me of things you are doing yourselves....instead of looking at the issues...and considering you might not be what you think you are.

Be NOT warned then. I'm OK with that. Stay as you are. Whatever.

Leave me out of your schemes...stop puffing yourself up by knocking down my testimony...

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I knew you would respond with more lies, obscurantism, and deviations...as you also do in your periodic reading of the bible. If I don't defend myself...you say I agree with your foolish religiosity. If I do defend myself you say it's all about me

But you and your fine feathered friends keep disparaging me in MANY posts...accusing me of things you are doing yourselves....instead of looking at the issues...and considering you might not be what you think you are.

Be NOT warned then. I'm OK with that. Stay as you are. Whatever.

Leave me out of your schemes...stop puffing yourself up by knocking down my testimony...

Its not your testimony that worries people. Many people have testimonies. It does not mean it is from God.. That is how many cult leaders and denominational leaders and church leaders get people to follow them, with their mighty words and testimonies Their charismatic teachings, so on and so forth

it your gospel, which is not from God and denies the power of the cross to save people from the penalty of sin..and make them alive in Christ. where they can walk in the spirit the day they are born again. because the gospel has power. that has people coming against you in the name of Christ

I have not lied about you.

One thing I would do if I were you is to stop being the hypocrite you are. You continue to lie about others. falsly accuse them.. Stop telling people to stop doing what you fail to do yourself.

 

[Episkopos]

Its not your testimony that worries people. Many people have testimonies. It does not mean it is from God.. That is how many cult leaders and denominational leaders and church leaders get people to follow them, with their mighty words and testimonies Their charismatic teachings, so on and so forth

Well, just read the thread...without your blinders and you will se that my testimony by some...and by the approval of many...is seen as demonic or New Age. That shows how false so many are here.

it your gospel, which is not from God and denies the power of the cross to save people from the penalty of sin

You are wrong about the gospel. God did not go soft on sin. You are fully indoctrinated into the great delusion. The gospel is about the POWER over sin...not an excuse to sin.

..and make them alive in Christ. where they can walk in the spirit the day they are born again. because the gospel has power. that has people coming against you in the name of Christ

A false gospel....a false christ.

I have not lied about you.

That's all you do. You misquote me....and generally misunderstand things that are meant to be understood spiritually. You prove your own carnality in doing so.

One thing I would do if I were you is to stop being the hypocrite you are.

I am speaking the truth...you are twisting my words based on self-interest.

 

[amigo de christo]

--same here, on this platform, do you see teachings that are consistent?

Problem again--you took a snippet from my post-I said I am NOT a Calvinist and I'm not here to debate Armenian theology either.

Christ died for the sins of the whole world-but not the whole world will be saved.

Yes indeed Jesus died for the sins of the world . And that same JESUS told them those who believe will be saved
but those who do not will be damned . I like to keep it real simple .
When paul went preaching the gospel or peter or any , they always pointed to believe on Christ.
They always taught to heed His teachings . And we see in acts
when some rejected paul said things like since you count yourselves unworthy of everlasting life .......
Or your blood be upon your own heads .
Shaking the dust off as a reminder to all who denied Christ .
There is nothing confusing or complex at how they all taught and preached Christ .
The problem is that today this large universal all inclusive concept has made its way into mainstream .
And folks are getting so confused about what should have been so simple .
All we need to do to be saved is repent and believe on Christ .
Now we do need to make sure its the true JESUS we follow . Cause again many are preaching
another jesus . But that is real simple . Just stay planted in the scriptures and by the grace of GOD
one will grow and learn . Let us always remember the dire necessity to believe on Christ .
The true apostles knew this and they got up and got busy .

 

[Episkopos]

I ask all the amateur "theologians" here. What is the difference between your smug assurance of salvation in your sins....and having a conscience that has been seared as with a hot iron?

Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

 

[amigo de christo]

Its not your testimony that worries people. Many people have testimonies. It does not mean it is from God.. That is how many cult leaders and denominational leaders and church leaders get people to follow them, with their mighty words and testimonies Their charismatic teachings, so on and so forth

it your gospel, which is not from God and denies the power of the cross to save people from the penalty of sin..and make them alive in Christ. where they can walk in the spirit the day they are born again. because the gospel has power. that has people coming against you in the name of Christ

I have not lied about you.

One thing I would do if I were you is to stop being the hypocrite you are. You continue to lie about others. falsly accuse them.. Stop telling people to stop doing what you fail to do yourself.

You are right my friend . Many know the lingo and yet they come in give a wonderful sounding testimony
then they go right to work to try and transform the church right into another direction , another gospel , another jesus .
There truly are such people who feign themselves as brethren . Paul had encountered them . Perils amonst FALSE brethren .
They come in privily and they come in to decieve .
They know the lingo . Epi can say all he wants , but when one denies the dire need to believe on Christ that alone speaks volumes .
You are right my friend . We must continue to point to Christ and always test everything men do teach .
Holding firm to the truth of the LORD .

 

[amigo de christo]

Lol I quote Jesus more than anyone else in scripture and believe every word He said and taught. You have no idea if I’m a cessationist or a dispensationalist . I’m positive you have never studied neither with any depth or aptitude.

FYI- some of Jesus teachings were specific to the Jews , others His disciples , others the Pharisees and others to all men both Jews and Gentiles . A discerning mind governed by the spirit of God could discern the differences .

hope this helps !!!

He dont even know the one true gospel . rather he preaches what the social gospel calls the gospel .
If one believes we can deny the testimony that GOD gave of HIS SON , then john would say they call GOD a liar .
The one true gospel is what is under direct attack these days
as more and more try and bring what the social all inclusive go spell says is the gospel .

 

[amigo de christo]

I ask all the amateur "theologians" here. What is the difference between your smug assurance of salvation in your sins....and having a conscience that has been seared as with a hot iron?

Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

if anyone here is preaching CHRIST as a means to justify sin , DO TELL . I will rebuke them sharply .
But epi , You directly attack the one true gospel itself . So whose conscience has been seared .
you preach a gospel that was invented by men in order to decieve and transform the christain realm from within
to bring about a universal concept that all religions and atheist or any can agree upon.
a gospel that does not CENTER ON CHRIST but on a concept that simply brings people together for a common cause .
And that common cause aint gonna save them epi .
Sure it might have some good works thrown into it . But look where its headed epi .
take a look at where its headed now . THEY EMBRACE SIN epi . They gather with all religoins
and more and more now believe all paths to GOD are fine , there is no need to preach Christ .
That there is no need to believe on HIM . ITS SIN EPI . The worst kind out there , IT HAS TROD JESUS RIGHT UNDER FOOT
for a false love broad path to GOD that might have a few good works in it . Its deadly epi .

 

[Episkopos]

You are right my friend . Many know the lingo and yet they come in give a wonderful sounding testimony
then they go right to work to try and transform the church right into another direction , another gospel , another jesus .
There truly are such people who feign themselves as brethren . Paul had encountered them . Perils amonst FALSE brethren .
They come in privily and they come in to decieve .
They know the lingo . Epi can say all he wants , but when one denies the dire need to believe on Christ that alone speaks volumes .
You are right my friend . We must continue to point to Christ and always test everything men do teach .
Holding firm to the truth of the LORD .

That "amigo" guy has no understanding beyond a superficial religious ideology that makes him repeat the same endless rant over and over again.

Let's try to find any sense in his rantings...

He says something about ..."the dire need to believe on Christ"...as if that statement itself meant anything without any context. (Hint: that's how indoctrination works).

Why do people need to believe in Christ? Is that a religious formula we are to give lip service to as Amigo does? Or does his religious outbursts cover up the truth whereby we can see why we need to believe in Christ and how we are to do so?

Amigo is like a pupil in pre-school who raises up an issue that he doesn't understand. It's up to the teacher then to explain to the class what the pupil has raised up.

We need to believe INTO Christ in order to be set free from sin and walk as Jesus walked. Now the pupils will react to that because they are still in need of milk and nap time...and the subject is meant for grown men.

Now the children in the class don't understand what that level of power even consists of. They just want to be saved from hell.

Does believing in Jesus save people from hell? Yes, if the belief is genuine and the trust is maintained till the end.

But the class is still not convinced. They want to know who goes to hell...such is the morbid curiosity contained in their tiny little minds.

Well, going to hell is not by beliefs...but by what people do. No one believes themselves out of hell.

At this point there is whining and maybe a few diapers to change. OK...time for milk and a nap.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Well, just read the thread...without your blinders and you will se that my testimony by some...and by the approval of many...is seen as demonic or New Age. That shows how false so many are here.

I have read your writings for years now..
once again, its not your testimony that scares people..

You are wrong about the gospel. God did not go soft on sin. You are fully indoctrinated into the great delusion. The gospel is about the POWER over sin...not an excuse to sin.

Your right, he did not go soft on sin. The penalty of sin is death.

But the love of God was so deep. He gave his only son, that whoever believes in him will not perish, but will live forever.

The penalty of sin is death, the gift of God is life.

Only through Christ can you be saved.. from the penalty of sin..

You must be born again. Or you will not like your eternity

A false gospel....a false christ.

Yet you scream of how powerful your gospel is

My gospel has power. it changes people. Yours does not.

That's all you do. You misquote me....and generally misunderstand things that are meant to be understood spiritually. You prove your own carnality in doing so

I just state the facts of what you say my friend.. Funny though, You never correct me by showing me how I misrepresent you. You just make blank accusations.. That alone proves your trying to hide.

I am speaking the truth...you are twisting my words based on self-interest.

Your speaking your truth. I have no self interest. My interest is getting the gospel out so people can be saved..

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I ask all the amateur "theologians" here. What is the difference between your smug assurance of salvation in your sins....and having a conscience that has been seared as with a hot iron?

Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

whats the difference

We acknowledge our sin, and how every day we wake up and are not in hell, is a glorious day. because that us where we deserve to be

We don;t hide behind our sin. Pump ourselves up. water down the law of God. and think we will get to God in-spite of our sins..

Your water down the law and excuse your own sin.. and claim you do not need anyone to pay for your sin.

look inside my friend. Stop applying things to others you yourself hold dear.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

That "amigo" guy has no understanding beyond a superficial religious ideology that makes him repeat the same endless rant over and over again.

Let's try to find any sense in his rantings...

He says something about ..."the dire need to believe on Christ"...as if that statement itself meant anything without any context. (Hint: that's how indoctrination works).

Why do people need to believe in Christ? Is that a religious formula we are to give lip service to as Amigo does? Or does his religious outbursts cover up the truth whereby we can see why we need to believe in Christ and how we are to do so?

Amigo is like a pupil in pre-school who raises up an issue that he doesn't understand. It's up to the teacher then to explain to the class what the pupil has raised up.

We need to believe INTO Christ in order to be set free from sin and walk as Jesus walked. Now the pupils will react to that because they are still in need of milk and nap time...and the subject is meant for grown men.

Now the children in the class don't understand what that level of power even consists of. They just want to be saved from hell.

Does believing in Jesus save people from hell? Yes, if the belief is genuine and the trust is maintained till the end.

But the class is still not convinced. They want to know who goes to hell...such is the morbid curiosity contained in their tiny little minds.

Well, going to hell is not by beliefs...but by what people do. No one believes themselves out of hell.

At this point there is whining and maybe a few diapers to change. OK...time for milk and a nap.

Yet if you do not go to the cross for forgiveness of all sin.

You will die dead in your sin.

You must be born again.. As moses lifted the serpent. so you too much look up to the cross.

Your gospel has no power to saved..

 

[Episkopos]

I have read your writings for years now..
once again, its not your testimony that scares people..

Maybe not you personally...

Your right, he did not go soft on sin. The penalty of sin is death.

But the love of God was so deep. He gave his only son, that whoever believes in him will not perish, but will live forever.

Exactly! On this we agree.

The penalty of sin is death, the gift of God is life.

Yes.

Only through Christ can you be saved.. from the penalty of sin..

NO. Not the penalty of sin...the power of sin. The gospel is not in word but in power. You are missing the power. You deny the power. Admit it. You don't believe that through grace a regular man can walk as Jesus walked...without sin. Admit your unbelief.

You must be born again. Or you will not like your eternity

That's not true. There are the saved of the nations that will thank God forever for His mercy. Unlike you...God is merciful. He looks after the poor... Read the story of Lazarus and the rich man. Now tell me what beliefs, or doctrinal theology, saved Lazarus.

Yet you scream of how powerful your gospel is

Amen. My gospel is the gospel of both Christ AND Paul. Yours comes from Luther.

My gospel has power. it changes people. Yours does not.

First...I don't have people and neither do you. You are imagining yourself to be a kind of cult leader of sorts. But I know that no one listens to you..Ok maybe the family pet.

And the people who hear the truth I teach change immeasurably. They go from being hypocrites...like yourself at the present time...to being honest, humble, and God-fearing people. I don't have the power to translate people into the kingdom realm. God does that. But that doesn't mean that being saved from a damnation of an eternal outer darkness into the saved nations is not a huge step forward.

Your speaking your truth. I have no self interest. My interest is getting the gospel out so people can be saved..

Your truth can only confine people to the same religious bondage that you are in. Wait till judgment day and the fire of testing. Many will weep and gnash their teeth at you for leading them astray. And then you will have to spend an eternity with them in the wilderness of darkness. Not very pleasant. I counsel you to repent of your shallow religious aspirations and look to God who can give you power over sin, the devil and the world.

 

[ChristisGod]

I have read your writings for years now..
once again, its not your testimony that scares people..

Your right, he did not go soft on sin. The penalty of sin is death.

But the love of God was so deep. He gave his only son, that whoever believes in him will not perish, but will live forever.

The penalty of sin is death, the gift of God is life.

Only through Christ can you be saved.. from the penalty of sin..

You must be born again. Or you will not like your eternity


Yet you scream of how powerful your gospel is

My gospel has power. it changes people. Yours does not.

I just state the facts of what you say my friend.. Funny though, You never correct me by showing me how I misrepresent you. You just make blank accusations.. That alone proves your trying to hide.

Your speaking your truth. I have no self interest. My interest is getting the gospel out so people can be saved..

ditto

 

[ChristisGod]

I ask all the amateur "theologians" here. What is the difference between your smug assurance of salvation in your sins....and having a conscience that has been seared as with a hot iron?

Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

I ask the amateur and self appointed overseer/episkopos what is the gospel ?

speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron

 

[Lizbeth]

That "amigo" guy has no understanding beyond a superficial religious ideology that makes him repeat the same endless rant over and over again.

Let's try to find any sense in his rantings...

He says something about ..."the dire need to believe on Christ"...as if that statement itself meant anything without any context. (Hint: that's how indoctrination works).

Why do people need to believe in Christ? Is that a religious formula we are to give lip service to as Amigo does? Or does his religious outbursts cover up the truth whereby we can see why we need to believe in Christ and how we are to do so?

Amigo is like a pupil in pre-school who raises up an issue that he doesn't understand. It's up to the teacher then to explain to the class what the pupil has raised up.

We need to believe INTO Christ in order to be set free from sin and walk as Jesus walked. Now the pupils will react to that because they are still in need of milk and nap time...and the subject is meant for grown men.

Now the children in the class don't understand what that level of power even consists of. They just want to be saved from hell.

Does believing in Jesus save people from hell? Yes, if the belief is genuine and the trust is maintained till the end.

But the class is still not convinced. They want to know who goes to hell...such is the morbid curiosity contained in their tiny little minds.

Well, going to hell is not by beliefs...but by what people do. No one believes themselves out of hell.

At this point there is whining and maybe a few diapers to change. OK...time for milk and a nap.

"Believe INTO Christ.." Is that the same thing as "grow up INTO the Head in all things, which is Christ...."?

But I have to ask, is this what a holy man sounds like? I don't think holiness involves disdaining and belittling the flock of Christ the way that is being done here, but would have a care and concern and a love for it.

 

[Episkopos]

"Believe INTO Christ.." Is that the same thing as "grow up INTO the Head in all things, which is Christ...."?

Both are located IN Christ. One cannot grow up INTO Christ unless one abides IN Christ. This is the major league, the upper level of walk, that Paul describes in his epistles. Of course there is a parallel walk on the lower level of carnal strength. One must not confuse the two...unless one wants to miss the high calling in Christ altogether.

But I have to ask, is this what a holy man sounds like?

I'm an honest man. A rarity in religious circles. I don't claim to be anything but an unprofitable servant. But no amount of hypocrites and religious schemers can take away what an honest man can stand by when inspired by God.

I don't think holiness involves disdaining and belittling the flock of Christ the way that is being done here, but would have a care and concern and a love for it.

You have to realize that you and many others here are spoiled and rich and deluded by various man-inspired doctrines. As such, you need to first be demolished in your way of thinking ....and THEN built back up. You want to adorn yourself with approvals...which you will get from the underside of religious affinities.

A disciple of Christ is willing to suffer, to repent, to be corrected, and even to die. There is no stopping a true faith in Christ.

But what I see here are children playing in mud puddles and having hizzy-fits over having to go to God...as if He was a mean principal who was only seeking to punish them for their filthy state. Ironically, it is that very filthy state that will see so many rich spoiled Westerners cast into outer darkness.

My concern is enough that I put up with the vitriol I receive here for speaking a truth that is so far above them, that they can only mock in response.

 

[ChristisGod]

"Believe INTO Christ.." Is that the same thing as "grow up INTO the Head in all things, which is Christ...."?

But I have to ask, is this what a holy man sounds like? I don't think holiness involves disdaining and belittling the flock of Christ the way that is being done here, but would have a care and concern and a love for it.

Correct a real overseer builds up believers, encourages them in their walk and does not tear them down. They correct with gentleness and patience not with insults, belittling, mocking, ad hominems etc........ There are lots of scripture that affirms this is true. And we will know them by their fruits. When the fruit of the spirit is missing so is God from their teachings.

 

[ChristisGod]

This is the major league, the upper level of walk, that Paul describes in his epistles. Of course there is a parallel walk on the lower level of carnal strength. One must not confuse the two...unless one wants to miss the high calling in Christ altogether.

I'm an honest man. A rarity in religious circles.

More nonsense again. Its not even little league. There is no higher walk and lower walk which is another one of your fallacies. There is nothing in the bible which makes that false distinction. Its your man made ideas you are peddling that no one is buying.

You cannot/will not even tell us what the GOSPEL is and what it means.

So who is in the major/minor league ?

Who is projecting ?

oh the irony epi.................

hope this helps !!!