Wise Men

[LuxMundy]

Many don’t want to reason on the text.

Αnd apparently, lying is ok. (The Devil is getting - and has gotten - big kicks out of it.)

I mean, the very idea of God approving of pagan magicians & astrologers - those practicing activities that God condemns - to honor His Son, should be abhorrent!

That's rich coming from you, considering that nowhere in Scripture does it say that the Magi were pagan, nor does it say that they practiced activities that God condemns. Therefore, you are the one spreading lies. What Scripture does say is that the Magi paid homage to/worshiped the King of the Jews. (Matt. 2:11)

 

[TheHC]

That's rich coming from you, considering that nowhere in Scripture does it say that the Magi were pagan, nor does it say that they practiced activities that God condemns. Therefore, you are the one spreading lies. What Scripture does say is that the Magi paid homage to/worshiped the King of the Jews. (Matt. 2:11)

Hello, Asoul…I didn’t mean to ire you, but get everyone to think:

They “saw his star in the East”…. What star? Where’s that in the Bible?

Who look at stars for “religious enlightenment”?

From a Christian ministry site…
Who Were the Magi and Why Do They Matter? — Youth Pastor Theologian). :

“They were called Magi, which means “wise men” in Greek (Matthew 2:1). Extrapolating from the text, these men were probably astrologers as their study of the sky led them toward Jesus (Numbers 24:17, Matthew 2:9)…..
….They were probably astrologers who served in the Zoroastrian temples of Persia, searching the stars for prophecies and omens.”

(I used this ministry site, because I figured it would carry more weight / influence with you, and would appreciate their candid honesty.)

Best wishes, my cousin.

 

[LuxMundy]

They “saw his star in the East”…. What star? Where’s that in the Bible?

What star? The one mentioned in Matt. 2:2. And, I know from where in the East the Magi saw the Star from Jesus Himself, but that information isn't found in The Bible.

On February 28th, 1944, Maria Valtorta received a vision of the adoration of the Magi, and took dictation from Jesus Who gave His commentary on it. According to her writings, there were three Magi: Gaspar, Melchor, and Baldazar, "each having set out from three different points on the earth", "each of them unknown to the others", "from the far away Indies", as in "meridional Asia, where Turkey, Afghanistan, and Persia are located in our geography" (Matt. 2:2), and that then "the star guides them from the north, the east, and the south, and by a miracle of God, it proceeds for the three of them towards one point. And by another miracle of God, after many miles, it gathers them at that point, and by a further miracle, it anticipates the Pentecost Wisdom, bestowing on them the gift of understanding and making themselves understood, as it happens in Paradise, where only one language is spoken: God's", and they then proceeded together from beyond the Dead Sea towards Palestine.

After departing Jerusalem, the star reappeared and the Magi continued to follow it until it stopped over a house in Bethlehem (Matt. 2:11), which belonged to one of the twelve shepherds, Elias, who had adored the Messiah in a manger in a stable just outside the town nine to twelve months earlier (Lk. 2:16). That night of the adoration of the shepherds was when Elias invited Joseph and Mary to live with him and his wife, Anne, where they remained until their escape to Egypt (Matt. 2:13-15). (The Poem of the Man-God: Vol. I)

Who look at stars for “religious enlightenment”?

From a Christian ministry site…
Who Were the Magi and Why Do They Matter? — Youth Pastor Theologian).

“They were called Magi, which means “wise men” in Greek (Matthew 2:1). Extrapolating from the text, these men were probably astrologers as their study of the sky led them toward Jesus (Numbers 24:17, Matthew 2:9)…..
….They were probably astrologers who served in the Zoroastrian temples of Persia, searching the stars for prophecies and omens.”

(I used this ministry site, because I figured it would carry more weight / influence with you, and would appreciate their candid honesty.)

Best wishes, my cousin.

You can speculate on those verses, but they themselves aren't enough to state as fact that the Magi were pagan and practiced activities that God condemns.

 

[Aunty Jane]

You can speculate on those verses, but they themselves aren't enough to state as fact that the Magi were pagan and practiced activities that God condemns.

Neither are your gross misrepresentations from a woman who claimed to see visions……you have the words of someone manipulated by the devil to obscure the truth.

The word “magi” is where we derive the words “magic” and “magician”….practices of which were forbidden to God’s people. (Deut 18:9-12)

The star guided them to a murderous king who then implemented a plan to have the child killed. With God’s foreknowledge, why would he lead pagan astrologers to such a man, knowing that Herod would want to get rid of any threat to his own dynasty? Only after the magi had informed Herod of Jesus’ birth, did the star lead them straight to Jesus…if the star was from God, it would have led them there first…..it came to a stop right above the “house” where Jesus was now possibly a toddler, living with his parents.

Your visionary has filled in details which the Bible does not…..if those details were important, they would be contained in God’s word, not relying on an obscure woman overtaken by “the angel of light” and supposedly gaining information from Jesus’ mother.…a person hardly mentioned in Scripture because although being the vehicle chosen to bear the Messiah, she was not given any prominence in the Bible because she was not “the mother of God” but the mother of his son, sent into the world to redeem mankind. Joseph had an equal role in raising Jesus along with Mary, but neither of them have any prominence in Scripture apart from being excellent, God fearing parents.

 

[LuxMundy]

The word “magi” is where we derive the words “magic” and “magician”….practices of which were forbidden to God’s people. (Deut 18:9-12)

[...] With God’s foreknowledge, why would he lead pagan astrologers to such a man, knowing that Herod would want to get rid of any threat to his own dynasty?

Firstly, in Matt. 2:1 the Koine Greek word used is "βασιλεύς" (basileus), and its definition is "a king, monarch, one possessing regal authority".

Secondly, nowhere in Scripture does it say that the Magi were pagan. What Scripture does say is that the Magi paid homage to/worshiped the King of the Jews. (Matt. 2:1-2;11)

Thirdly, in Maria Valtorta's vision of the Magi talking to Joseph and Mary, she reiterates what she heard the eldest of the Magi explain to them about their journey. Below is an excerpt that pertains to your question:

"They had gone together to Jerusalem, because the Messiah was to be the King of Jerusalem, the King of the Jews. But over the sky of that city, the star had concealed itself and they felt their hearts breaking with pain and had examined themselves to ascertain whether they had failed to deserve God. But when their consciences reassured them, they had applied to king Herod and had asked him in which royal palace the King of the Jews was born because they had come to adore Him. And the king had gathered the chief priests and the scribes and had asked them where the Messiah might be born. And they replied: « In Bethlehem, in Judah ».

And they had come towards Bethlehem and as soon as they left the Holy City, the star had reappeared to them, and the night before their arrival in Bethlehem its brightness had increased; the whole sky was ablaze. Then the star had stopped over this house engulfing all the light of the other stars in its ray. And they had understood that the Divine New-Born Baby was there. And now they were worshipping Him, offering their gifts, and above all, their hearts, which never cease thanking God for the grace granted to them; neither would they ever stop loving His Son Whose holy human body they had now seen."

If Satan had sent the star, he was more than capable of finding men to follow it who shared the same evil blood lust as King Herod to see the King of the Jews killed and make it known then and there, considering he later found an evil man to instigate His murder: Judas Iscariot. The fact that Satan's will to see the King of the Jews killed was through the instigation of a man like Judas, a man who was unlike the Magi, to accomplish that will, it doesn't make sense for him to have chosen men like the Magi in the first place to instigate His death, especially considering the star ultimately led them to the King of the Jews so that they could accomplish their will to pay homage to/worship Him, which they did (Matt. 2:11), and Satan wouldn't have wanted that.