Why faith alone? The answer...

[Sister-n-Christ]

But not the end of it all

Not true.
However, I am not about to insist your faith values are wrong.

 

[mailmandan]

Yep, by grace through faith, however you must be obedient to the gospel, meaning, belief and faith, confession of belief, repentance, and baptism.

By grace through faith, not works. (Ephesians 2:8,9) We obey the gospel (Romans 10:16) by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 1:16) and repentance precedes faith in Christ. (Acts 20:21) Confession is a confirmation of faith (and not a work for salvation after faith) that is chronologically together with believing unto righteousness. (Romans 10:8-10) Water baptism "follows" saving belief/faith in Christ. (Acts 10:43-47)

 

[Sister-n-Christ]

By grace through faith, not works. (Ephesians 2:8,9) We obey the gospel (Romans 10:16) by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 1:16) and repentance precedes faith in Christ. (Acts 20:21) Confession is a confirmation of faith (and not a work for salvation after faith) that is chronologically together with believing unto righteousness. (Romans 10:8-10) Water baptism "follows" saving belief/faith in Christ. (Acts 10:43-47)

Amen. And the works we then do are because we are led to by Holy Spirit. They are not done so we can secure our Salvation through work.

The Gospel is freedom. How sad there are teachings that make it slavery to working to remain in grace and fear of the loss of salvation. I think that ideology is one of the best examples of sin in the flesh.

 

[DJT_47]

I have read the Hebrew letter. Which passages of scripture in the book of Hebrews would you like to discuss? Hebrews 6:4-9 or perhaps Hebrews 10:26-39? Context is important.

I don't want to discuss anything with you. The bible is clear. No discussion is warranted. Discuss it with the writers if you disagree with it.

 

[Sister-n-Christ]

I don't want to discuss anything with you. The bible is clear. No discussion is warranted. Discuss it with the writers if you disagree with it.

You're in the wrong place to have that kind of attitude. This community is all about discussion of the Bible and our faith.

 

[PS95]

Let's see what it says in James 2: (v.17) Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. The bible has been telling you all alone that you must have fruits to prove your faith. (v.18) Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. True faith goes hand in hand with good works. (v.20) But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? You can have all the faith you want, but if you have no works to go along with that faith, that faith is in vain, that faith is dead. (v.21) Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Abraham, the father of the faithful showed the Lord his faith by his works. (v.22) Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? (v.23) And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD AND IT WAS IMPUTED UNTO HIM FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS: and he was called the friend of God. (v.24) Ye see then how that by works a man is Justified, and not by faith only. (v.26) For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. Just as the body is dead when you take away the spirit (breath) so faith is dead if you have no works.

The question is are your working to be saved? Or are you saved, so you are working?

Depending on how you answer reveals whether you think Paul and James agreed or disagreed with each other.

 

[PS95]

Jesus said with his own mouth; (Matt. 24:13) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. That is until the end of your life, or until the Second Coming of the Lord.
Paul said in (1 Cor. 15:1-2) (v.1) MOREOVER, brethren, I declare unto the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; (v.2) By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. Paul is telling you right here that you are saved by the gospel that he preached unto you if you keep it in memory. So what happens if you don’t keep it in memory? Then you have believed in vain you have believed for nothing that’s what vain means.

Notice I have the verses written out for you to read

As long as you following Jesus foot steps and keeping his Commandments, Statues and Judgements, you should have no problem walking down that narrow path in truth and righteousness. But Jesus warn us that this walk is not easy. Jesus says in Matthew 10: 34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. 35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. 36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. 37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. 39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

The problem in your household starts when you began obeying all of God's laws and statues of conduct, from the ten commandments to the least commandment. We cannot choose to obey one without obeying the others. For instance, if it's still good to pay tithes (as many preach), then it is still good to obey God's dietary law (not eating pork, catfish, etc...Leviticus 11:1-47). Similarly, you cannot purposely trip a blind person (Leviticus 19:14) and claim to love your neighbor as yourself. Neither can you break God's Sabbath days (Leviticus 19:30) and claim to love God with all your heart, soul and mind.

Many, I say many fight to uphold man's traditional holidays (Sunday the 1st day as the Sabbath, Christmas, Easter and Halloween), but few are obeying God's Holy Days (Saturday the 7th day Sabbath, the Passover, Pentecost, etc...Leviticus 23:1-44). All of God's laws are still good and must be obeyed if we want eternal life and come up in the first resurrection. We might not be able to observe everything perfectly, but can fight a good fight. Paul said in (1 Cor. 9:24-27) (v.24) Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. (v.25) And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown: but we an incorruptible. Paul says that when you run in a race every body is running for a prize. But this prize that he is referring to is eternal life, that’s what he means by an incorruptible, he’s talking about an incorruptible body, a heavenly body. (v.26) I therefore so run, not as uncertainly, so fight, not as one that beateth the air: (v.27) But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. You see Paul knew exactly what was going on that why he says he has to bring his body under subjection. Under subjection to what? To God’s Law, Paul knew that if he didn’t continue to keep Gods law that even after he had preached to many that he himself could still become a castaway.

If we do this our prize awaits us at the end. "...if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments" (Matthew 19:17).

Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. 35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. 36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. 37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. 39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

Division-- uhh no. If you have problems with family over keeping OT law- then you must be telling them that they must also which is NOT true.
what is the division that Jesus spoke of?--
I was raised JW but became a Christian later. I was shunned and still am. It had nothing to do with OT laws. It had everything to do with that they utterly rob you of Jesus. So please don't tell me that by obeying the law - that is the division Jesus spoke of. He was speaking about division of families when they come to HIM. It happened then, while Jesus was on earth - when Jews disowned family for accepting Jesus, and it happens with Jews today when they come to Christ. .It happens with JWs who disown family because we accept Jesus. It happens with Muslims. It happens with Hindu.
I'm sure there are more. None of that has to do with keeping OT laws.
You may keep the festivals in the OT but never ever tell Gentile that they must. Those things will never save you. They were a shadow of the reality which is Christ!
You are crazy to suggest otherwise. Don't you read the scriptures? You must keep all of the law and not fail in one point.
600 something rules..? Are you picking and choosing which OT law to obey? You cant do that. You need the SAVIOR!!!!!

 

[DJT_47]

By grace through faith, not works. (Ephesians 2:8,9) We obey the gospel (Romans 10:16) by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 1:16) and repentance precedes faith in Christ. (Acts 20:21) Confession is a confirmation of faith (and not a work for salvation after faith) that is chronologically together with believing unto righteousness. (Romans 10:8-10) Water baptism "follows" saving belief/faith in Christ. (Acts 10:43-47)

Keep on trying your darndest trying to be relevant, twisting words, language, sequence, etc. It ain't gonna work nor will it change the truth.

 

[DJT_47]

Not true.
However, I am not about to insist your faith values are wrong.

Why, scripturally?

 

[bro.tan]

Division-- uhh no. If you have problems with family over keeping OT law- then you must be telling them that they must also which is NOT true.
what is the division that Jesus spoke of?--
I was raised JW but became a Christian later. I was shunned and still am. It had nothing to do with OT laws. It had everything to do with that they utterly rob you of Jesus. So please don't tell me that by obeying the law - that is the division Jesus spoke of. He was speaking about division of families when they come to HIM. It happened then, while Jesus was on earth - when Jews disowned family for accepting Jesus, and it happens with Jews today when they come to Christ. .It happens with JWs who disown family because we accept Jesus. It happens with Muslims. It happens with Hindu.
I'm sure there are more. None of that has to do with keeping OT laws.
You may keep the festivals in the OT but never ever tell Gentile that they must. Those things will never save you. They were a shadow of the reality which is Christ!
You are crazy to suggest otherwise. Don't you read the scriptures? You must keep all of the law and not fail in one point.
600 something rules..? Are you picking and choosing which OT law to obey? You cant do that. You need the SAVIOR!!!!!

Jesus says in John 5: 45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

 

[DJT_47]

You're in the wrong place to have that kind of attitude. This community is all about discussion of the Bible and our faith.

You're in the wrong place to have that kind of attitude. This community is all about discussion of the Bible and our faith.

Your opinion.

Just curious also. You're calling yourself "Sister-n-Christ": how is it that you're a sister in Christ? How do I or anyone else know that you are a sister in Christ? Is it because you say so? Because of mental assent as such? How did you get to be "in Christ"? How did that happen? By what means or process? Please explain how you became a scriptural, Christian, sister if you would, for my edification. Just curious.

 

[bro.tan]

The question is are your working to be saved? Or are you saved, so you are working?

Depending on how you answer reveals whether you think Paul and James agreed or disagreed with each other.

Just as you freely accepted Jesus in your life you can also freely choose to stop serving him. Jesus said with his own mouth; (Matt. 24:13) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. That is until the end of your life, or until the Second Coming of the Lord.

 

[mailmandan]

Keep on trying your darndest trying to be relevant, twisting words, language, sequence, etc. It ain't gonna work nor will it change the truth.

I twisted nothing. I simply shared the truth which you refuse to accept.

 

[Sister-n-Christ]

Just as you freely accepted Jesus in your life you can also freely choose to stop serving him. Jesus said with his own mouth; (Matt. 24:13) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. That is until the end of your life, or until the Second Coming of the Lord.

That doesn't mean Jesus will lose us.

 

[PS95]

Jesus says in John 5: 45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Read the context. He was speaking to Pharisees who were under the law of Moses.
We are under grace.

 

[PS95]

Just as you freely accepted Jesus in your life you can also freely choose to stop serving him. Jesus said with his own mouth; (Matt. 24:13) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. That is until the end of your life, or until the Second Coming of the Lord.

No kidding. But He keeps me. You sure wont snatch me. No one can. I will endure til the end.

 

[PS95]

Yep, by grace through faith, however you must be obedient to the gospel, meaning, belief and faith, confession of belief, repentance, and baptism.

Obedience to Christ is because He saved us and we love Him because he first loved us.
Seems like you have the chicken and the egg mix up. Cart before the horse kind of thinking. I have been there. it will come to you - keep praying and reading the bible.

 

[DJT_47]

Obedience to Christ is because He saved us and we love Him because he first loved us.
Seems like you have the chicken and the egg mix up. Cart before the horse kind of thinking. I have been there. it will come to you - keep praying and reading the bible.

I don't know what you mean. Those that believed confessed their belief as the Ethiopian eunuch did in Acts 8, repented, as the Jews did on the day of Pentecost in Acts 2, and were then baptized into Christ for the forgiveness of sins. Pretty straightforward.

 

[PS95]

I don't know what you mean. Those that believed confessed their belief as the Ethiopian eunuch did in Acts 8, repented, as the Jews did on the day of Pentecost in Acts 2, and were then baptized into Christ for the forgiveness of sins. Pretty straightforward.

I am not arguing a thing against that. Why would you think I am?

 

[DJT_47]

I am not arguing a thing against that. Why would you think I am?

I'm confused by your previous comment to me. What exactly did you mean then about having the chicken and egg reversed or "mixed up"?