THE CHURCH IS NOT THE BRIDE OF CHRIST

[GracePeace]

When Paul was talking about Gentiles being grafted in he was talking about Gentiles in the remnant of Israel not the body of Christ
He was talking about Gentiles who believed the preaching of Peter as in Acts 10 not believers of Paul's gospel

Nope, or else he wouldn't have said he was trying to fulfill Dt 32:21 in magnifying his ministry to the Gentiles (Ro 11)--the prophecy is that God's people had made God jealous by choosing another God, and, so, in like manner, God would make those very same people (who had made Him jealous) jealous by choosing another people; accordingly, Paul wants to move HIS FELLOW COUNTRYMEN to jealousy, so as to save them, by magnifying his ministry to THE GENTILES. These are two completely different groups, or else God choosing another people could not move the ones who had chosen another god to jealousy.

Again, you don't have a clue.

 

[GracePeace]

@Doug Keep pushing, keep being recalcitrant, so you can get tuned up in front of everyone.

There isn't a point you have raised that hasn't been thoroughly debunked; the same will apply with every other objection you raise. Keep it up, you're helping everyone see how incoherent your view is.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

When Paul was talking about Gentiles being grafted in he was talking about Gentiles in the remnant of Israel not the body of Christ

Speculation and eisegesis at it''s finest - adding one's opinion to God's Word to try to make it say something it does not say!

Sorry pal, God grafted the gentiles in to His family.

Ephesians 2:11-15
Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

This explains how Jesus abolished the law of commandments and decrees to create in himself one new man out of the two, Jews and Gentiles

LOL Doug are you actually a Black Hebrew Israelite? LOL! The dumbest cult, comprised of the lowest average IQ people, on earth?

Exactly, just because many of the descendants of Abraham had dark skin, they does not mean they are descendants of black africans or that Jesus was a negro

By the same token it does not mean Jesus was a cracker either!

 

[Nancy]

I am not going to say I know but my thought is the guests may be both believing and unbelieving Israel........just like the wheat and tares illustrate that believing and unbelieving Israel are together til the harvest

Why would the tares be welcomed into the feast of the Lamb? I would think they would be tossed into outer darkness as tares would not be wearing proper wedding garments, but thanks for your reply.

 

[GracePeace]

Why would the tares be welcomed into the feast of the Lamb? I would think they would be tossed into outer darkness as tares would not be wearing proper wedding garments, but thanks for your reply.

He's really sounding like a "Black Hebrew Israelite"--literally the dumbest, most bereft, emotion-based, system ever created--as far as I can tell. He hasn't clarified. Maybe he was influenced by them, but isn't, himself, one. IDK

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

He's really sounding like a "Black Hebrew Israelite"--literally the dumbest, most bereft, emotion-based, system ever created--as far as I can tell. He hasn't clarified. Maybe he was influenced by them, but isn't, himself, one. IDK

Well as you may have noticed, the marxists are doing their best to try and hijack Christianity and make Jesus out to be a black guy that drinks the booze, smokes the weed, is a transgender gay fornicator that teaches marxism and communism.

These people are known as liberals or democrats.

 

[GracePeace]

When Paul was talking about Gentiles being grafted in he was talking about Gentiles in the remnant of Israel not the body of Christ
He was talking about Gentiles who believed the preaching of Peter as in Acts 10 not believers of Paul's gospel

If they were "Gentiles" who were "of the remnant of Israel" (LOL!), he would use the same language as he used of the branches that had been broken off from THEIR OWN olive tree, which they are native to--that they were being grafted back in--but, as we see, he describes these Gentile believers as having sprung from wild olive trees (outsider nations), and, then, grafted in to the cultivated olive tree CONTRARY TO NATURE.

Romans 11:24For if you were cut off from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these who are the natural branches be grafted into their own olive tree?

The Gentiles are WILD olive tree branches grafted in to the CULTIVATED olive tree, contrary to nature, but HOW MUCH MORE (this is different) will the NATURAL BRANCHES be grafted back in to THEIR OWN OLIVE TREE?

But yeah you aren't interested in submitting to Scripture. Everyone else can enjoy the response though.

 

[Marilyn C]

It's just an allegory, not literal. And the church is only the bride collectively/corporately. Individually we are guests or bridesmaids at the wedding, in other allegories. The bridegroom came first to the nation of Israel to invite her be His bride, but she sadly refused His hand, except for a remnant which was the early church made up initially of mainly Jews. As Isaiah said, "though the number of the Israelites be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant will be saved." Natural Israel (Israel after the flesh) isn't the bride, but the "Israel of God" is, which is a commonwealth because it includes Gentile believers who are "grafted into" it.

Now where is the Body of Christ grafted into Israel?

 

[Marilyn C]

They do need Christ, but sadly rejected Him. Therefore as Jesus said,

Mat 21:42-43

Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?

Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

That nation bringing forth the fruits of the kingdom is the "Israel of God", a commonwealth of both Jew and Gentile, one new man. It is not "Israel after the flesh"....because the flesh profits nothing But this was always in the sovereign plans and purposes of God, it didn't thwart His plans/purposes.....He works in mysterious ways. It had been prophesied to happen this way:

Rom 11:30-33

For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:

Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.

For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!


Rom 9:6-8

Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

(It has always really been about a remnant from both Israel and the nations who would believe.....the elect, those foreknown by God and thus "appointed unto salvation".)

So, fallen man in Israel is able to negate God`s purpose for them?

 

[Marilyn C]

People that are blinded by false doctrine wouldn't accept what God's Word clearly says on the topic.






People not accepting what the Lord says in His Word are tares.

The Lord instructs His people to ignore the false teachings of the tares

But by all means you do you and see where self leads to for those that don't believe what God's Word very clearly says:

Revelation 19:7
Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready

Revelation 21:2
And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband

Matthew 25:1
Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom

Revelation 21:9
And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb’s wife

The `tares` are who the devil sows among Israel. The Body of Christ was NOT known then. I think you need to work on who is speaking to whom.

 

[Marilyn C]

Are you really curious or just being nitpicky about what teh bible says.

I cannot tell you how we are the bride. I can only tell you we are teh bride, Just like Israel the ethnic people were the wife of Jehovah!

But Paul tells us by the Holy Spirit for 4 chapters in Ephesians that we are the New Man and will come to the Perfect Man.

Do you disregard that doctrine?

 

[Marilyn C]

I have no problem telling a male believer we are part of teh bride of christ.

I would not tell a homosexual that until after they got saved. For they are not part of the bride if they are a practicing unrepentant hojosexual.

So why does Jesus need to marry millions of men and women?

 

[Marilyn C]

Christ is the Head of His church/body just as a husband is head of his wife. A body has a head, true? It's just an allegory to help us understand that we are one with Him.....or at least betrothed with having the firstfruits (earnest) of the Spirit until the marriage is consummated so to speak. Not to be taken too literally of course it's just an allegory, a kind of parable......we don't have to make too much of it, just as the bible doesn't make too much of it. What matters is the truth it is portraying in a word picture/parable/allegory.

And what truth is that?

 

[Marilyn C]

LOL The "bride" is New Jerusalem. What was "Jerusalem" known for being? The dwelling place of God :

Revelation 21: 2I saw the holy city, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying:
“Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man,
and He will dwell with them.
They will be His people,

So, His people are His dwelling place, New Jerusalem, the NEW place where God dwells. They are Christ's body, but His body is the Temple of God (Jn 2).

It's perfectly clear!

`Then I John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem coming down out of heaven FROM GOD...` (Rev. 21: 2)

God is everywhere by His Spirit however His seat of power and authority His throne is in the third heaven. The city comes down from their but God`s seat of power is still there. God`s throne, authority is in the city but it is NOT His seat of power and authority.

 

[GracePeace]

`Then I John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem coming down out of heaven FROM GOD...` (Rev. 21: 2)

God is everywhere by His Spirit however His seat of power and authority His throne is in the third heaven. The city comes down from their but God`s seat of power is still there. God`s throne, authority is in the city but it is NOT His seat of power and authority.

How does this argument do anything to address or debunk anything I stated about the Church being Christ's own body and bride?

 

[Marilyn C]

How does this argument do anything to address or debunk anything I stated about the Church being Christ's own body and bride?

You said -

So, His people are His dwelling place, New Jerusalem, the NEW place where God dwells. They are Christ's body, but His body is the Temple of God (Jn 2).

So, I showed that the city came out of heaven FROM God. yes, God will dwell there by His Holy Spirit, but the third heaven is where His seat of authority and power is situated.

 

[GracePeace]

You said -

So, His people are His dwelling place, New Jerusalem, the NEW place where God dwells. They are Christ's body, but His body is the Temple of God (Jn 2).

So, I showed that the city came out of heaven FROM God. yes, God will dwell there by His Holy Spirit, but the third heaven is where His seat of authority and power is situated.

You agreed He dwells in New Jerusalem by His Spirit.

God dwells in us. We are New Jerusalem.

LOL

1 Corinthians 3:16Do you not know that you yourselves are God’s temple, and that God’s Spirit dwells in you?

Jerusalem was known for what? Being the place where God dwelled. Today, God dwells in us.

1 Peter2L5you yourselves like living stones are being built up as a spiritual house, to be a holy priesthood, to offer spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

John 2:20The Jews then said, “It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?” 21But He was speaking of the temple of His body. 22So when He was raised from the dead, His disciples remembered that He said this; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had spoken.

If Christ's body is the Temple, and the Church is Christ's body, then the body of Christ is the Temple of God--as Peter and Paul have said.

Revelation 19:7“Let us rejoice and be glad and give the glory to Him, for the marriage of the Lamb has come and His bride has made herself ready.” 8It was given to her to clothe herself in fine linen, bright and clean; for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

 

[Marilyn C]

You agreed He dwells in New Jerusalem by His Spirit.

God dwells in us. We are New Jerusalem.

God dwells by His Holy Spirit throughout ALL His great kingdom in the New Heavens and New Earth.

There is NO mention of the Body of Christ in the New Jerusalem.

 

[GracePeace]

God dwells by His Holy Spirit throughout ALL His great kingdom in the New Heavens and New Earth.

There is NO mention of the Body of Christ in the New Jerusalem.

The body of Christ is His bride (the one mentioned in Revelation).
Just as Adam's bride was his own body, "bone of my bone, flesh of my flesh".

Read Ephesians 5, where it draws the parallel between the relationship of a husband and wife and Christ and the Church.
No man hates his own body, but nourishes and cherishes it, and, since "the two become one flesh", he should also nourish and cherish, not hate, his own body, which is his wife--just as Christ loved the Church, which is His body, His bride.

You guys who deny this are simply, for what ever reason, intentionally detaching yourselves from reality.
I really can't understand the resistance you all have to this obvious truth--it's no different, to me, than the gays who try to argue God is OK with being gay. I don't get how you all deny simple reality.