In Defense of OSAS – Why "Once Saved, Always Saved" Is the Heart of the Gospel

[BeforeThereWas]

What I have established... is how many brethren HAVE SLID AWAY FROM THE ACTUAL WRITTEN BIBLE SCRIPTURE, and instead have allowed men's doctrines to put your fallacy theories into their minds, turning them into followers of men instead of followers of God in His written Word.

Once again, 1 John 1 reveals we are STILL TO REPENT OF FUTURE SIN WE MAY COMMIT.

In Luke 11 Jesus gave us the prayer to pray, which INCLUDES ASKING FORGIVENESS OF SIN.

In 1 Timothy 1 and 1 Corinthians 6, Apostle Paul showed that brethren who commit those sins he listed there SHALL NOT ENTER INTO THE KINGDOM OF GOD.

In 2 Thessalonians 2:1-4, Apostle Paul taught that MANY will become 'apostates' when the "man of sin" shows up in Jerusalem proclaiming himself as GOD, working lying signs and wonders.

In Matthew 7, Jesus said not everyone who will say to Him in that day of His return, "Lord, Lord", will enter into the Kingdom of Heaven, for many will claim how they did many wonderful works in His Name, cast out devils in His Name, yet He will say to them, "Get away from Me, ye that work iniquity." Their iniquity is their STILL UNFORGIVEN SINS THEY REFUSED TO REPENT TO HIM ABOUT, PER 1 JOHN 1. THEY DID NOT CONTINUE THEIR DAILY WALK WITH JESUS IN REPENTANCE.

Per John in 1 John 1, he declared those who CLAIM THEY HAVE NO SIN CALL JESUS A LIAR, AND THERE IS NO TRUTH IN THEM.

Like I said before, nobody here has presented even one verse whereby there is any mention of the seal of Holy Spirit being withdrawn nor too weak to remain upon the one whom had been sealed. If you think there is such a verse, then please quote it here.

BTW

 

[Davy]

If you think you can possibly do the works to retain your salvation, then go for it. Do your best. I'll cheer you on as you try to accomplish it.

BTW

Ah... you well know... what I'm saying has NOTHING to do with any idea of Salvation by works! You're just trying to make EXCUSES for heeding men's false OSAS doctrine so you don't have to REPENT of future sins you may commit! Sound like you don't LIKE the idea of being under the Authority of Jesus Christ with WALKING WITH HIM the way you believe. You might try and read up on the Galatians 5 Chapter by Apostle Paul also, where he covered this walking by The Spirit matter.

 

[Davy]

Like I said before, nobody here has presented even one verse whereby there is any mention of the seal of Holy Spirit being withdrawn nor too weak to remain upon the one whom had been sealed. If you think there is such a verse, then please quote it here.

BTW

And still... you prefer to MAKE UP YOUR OWN IDEAS away from what the actual Bible Scriptures teach!

The OSAS doctrine of man isn't about The Holy Spirit being 'withdrawn'. It is about the believer HAVING STOPPED HEEDING... THE HOLY SPIRIT. Thus it is the BELIEVER than can cut off The Holy Spirit unction from working in their lives! How exactly does that work?

It's simple. When one believes man's false OSAS theory, they are told they cannot have sin anymore, and thus no longer have further need to repent of sin. (And I heard a preacher teach that on the radio just the other day! Moody Radio I think, a Pre-trib Rapture network). And what that means those on OSAS no longer EXAMINE themselves for sins they may commit. That false doctrine instead tells them they are ALREADY COVERED for all future sin by Christ's Sacrifice. But 1 John 1 doesn't tell us that. And when Jesus included the asking forgiveness of sin in the prayer given to His disciples and to His Church per Luke 11, that also shows OSAS is a fluke.

You should have easily understood that per New Testament Scripture, like Galatians 5, but you obviously are listening to some foreigner only claiming to teach from The Bible with your foreign doctrines.

 

[BeforeThereWas]

Ah... you well know... what I'm saying has NOTHING to do with any idea of Salvation by works! You're just trying to make EXCUSES for heeding men's false OSAS doctrine so you don't have to REPENT of future sins you may commit! Sound like you don't LIKE the idea of being under the Authority of Jesus Christ with WALKING WITH HIM the way you believe. You might try and read up on the Galatians 5 Chapter by Apostle Paul also, where he covered this walking by The Spirit matter.

You're avoiding the issue. To say that one can lose his salvation is indeed works-based salvation, no matter how you try to slice and dice it, meander around corners of avoidance, the fact remains that if one must apply personal effort to retain salvation, then it must also have been earned on the basis of personal effort.

Who have you ever known who allegedly lost their salvation, and how did you prove it? Talking only about possibilities fails to script a legitimate defense for the LOS (loss of salvation).

I'm intrigued by whatever defense of your position you think there might be from scripture...not from the things spoken to Israel when we were under the Kingdom Gospel, but all of us under the Gospel of Grace.

BTW

 

[BeforeThereWas]

And still... you prefer to MAKE UP YOUR OWN IDEAS away from what the actual Bible Scriptures teach!

The OSAS doctrine of man isn't about The Holy Spirit being 'withdrawn'. It is about the believer HAVING STOPPED HEEDING... THE HOLY SPIRIT. Thus it is the BELIEVER than can cut off The Holy Spirit unction from working in their lives! How exactly does that work?

It's simple. When one believes man's false OSAS theory, they are told they cannot have sin anymore, and thus no longer have further need to repent of sin. (And I heard a preacher teach that on the radio just the other day! Moody Radio I think, a Pre-trib Rapture network). And what that means those on OSAS no longer EXAMINE themselves for sins they may commit. That false doctrine instead tells them they are ALREADY COVERED for all future sin by Christ's Sacrifice. But 1 John 1 doesn't tell us that. And when Jesus included the asking forgiveness of sin in the prayer given to His disciples and to His Church per Luke 11, that also shows OSAS is a fluke.

You should have easily understood that per New Testament Scripture, like Galatians 5, but you obviously are listening to some foreigner only claiming to teach from The Bible with your foreign doctrines.

I specifically stated to you the SEAL of Holy Spirit, and you're avoiding that. Why? I never said we never sin under sealed salvation. I have yet to see anyone state that in this forum, so why bring that up? It's nothing but a straw man argument of rabbit holes in the field to trip up those who dare to walk through it. I'm not going to walk that field. Let's deal with what I have actually stated to you rather than cast all these red herring about in an attempt to distract away from the questions you continue to avoid.

Please explain to us how the Blood of Christ is sufficient for saving a man guilty of a million murders in the past before the point of salvation, but is not sufficient after salvation and stealing a candy bar at the local store, running out in front of a car, killed, and then...

Can you do that? I'm hoping you will stop the shuck and jive nonsense and simply state what it is you believe, where you got it from within scripture, and then perhaps we can go from there.

BTW

 

[Davy]

You're avoiding the issue.

Oh, I have well proven by the many Bible Scriptures I have shown that I definitely AM NOT THE ONE AVOIDING THE ISSUES.

 

[Davy]

I specifically stated to you the SEAL of Holy Spirit, and you're avoiding that.

Now you are LYING, because you said to me about the WITHDRAWAL of The Holy Spirit.

Those on man's false OSAS ARE NOT SEALED WITH GOD'S SEALING, simply because they have CUT OFF THE HOLY SPIRIT IN THEIR LIVES! They don't LISTEN NOR HEED THE HOLY SPIRIT, because one of the jobs of THE HOLY SPIRIT is to CONVICT us of SIN when we mess up! OSAS says instead you have NO SIN, NO NEED TO EXAMINE YOURSELF, NO NEED TO REPENT. Only a DEVIL could come up with such a false doctrine.

 

[BeforeThereWas]

Oh, I have well proven by the many Bible Scriptures I have shown that I definitely AM NOT THE ONE AVOIDING THE ISSUES.

Then copy and paste those proofs, if there are any, paste them here so that we can have a structured study of the subject here for those who are onlookers here and now.

BTW

 

[BeforeThereWas]

Now you are LYING, because you said to me about the WITHDRAWAL of The Holy Spirit.

Those on man's false OSAS ARE NOT SEALED WITH GOD'S SEALING, simply because they have CUT OFF THE HOLY SPIRIT IN THEIR LIVES! They don't LISTEN NOR HEED THE HOLY SPIRIT, because one of the jobs of THE HOLY SPIRIT is to CONVICT us of SIN when we mess up! OSAS says instead you have NO SIN, NO NEED TO EXAMINE YOURSELF, NO NEED TO REPENT. Only a DEVIL could come up with such a false doctrine.

Withdrawal of the seal is what I stated...the SEAL of Holy Spirit. You failure to actually quote me is itself suspect, but now you have clarification of what I'm saying. Show to me any verse where the SEAL of Holy Spirit upon all the saved is ever withdrawn.

BTW

 

[Davy]

Then copy and paste those proofs, if there are any, paste them here so that we can have a structured study of the subject here for those who are onlookers here and now.

BTW

I've already given enough Bible Witness on the matter. If you won't listen to what is written in God's Word about it, then of course you won't listen to me quoting that Bible evidence. Debate over.

 

[BeforeThereWas]

I've already given enough Bible Witness on the matter. If you won't listen to what is written in God's Word about it, then of course you won't listen to me quoting that Bible evidence. Debate over.

That's a non answer...likely because you have nothing with which to defend your position on this. Ok. I just wanted to see you say it. You believe in YOUR mind that you have effectively defended your position, which is no proof at all. It is what it is.

BTW

 

[Rockerduck]

So now you want to 'insert' Calvinism into The Bible? That's just another set of men's doctrines by those who don't understand what all God's Word teaches. You should study ALL of Apostle Paul's New Testament Epistles, especially the parts where Paul rebukes the apostates who fall away from Christ. Thus Calvinism falls flat when listening to Apostle Paul.

(For those brethren who don't understand when their church system is bombarding them with doctrines from Calvin, he believed that all that are going to be saved were called to be saved, and can never lose their Salvation, i.e., never fall away. It's is a belief that once anyone confesses Jesus Christ as their Savior that they can never fall away or lose their Salvation, which actually means those in Christ MADE NO FREE WILL DECISION TO BELIEVE ON JESUS. That theory is a theory from men, and is not written in God's Word, certainly not by any of the Apostles.)

That's funny calling Jesus a Calvinist. Jesus said it, not me.

 

[Davy]

That's funny calling Jesus a Calvinist. Jesus said it, not me.

It's actually YOU... that is calling Lord Jesus a CALVINIST.

When Lord Jesus said He shall not lose any who are given to Him, except Judas, that means ONLY those who REMAIN IN THE FAITH WAITING FOR HIM.

And as Jesus said, many are called, but FEW are chosen.

And as Jesus said, that not everyone that says, "Lord, Lord", to Him on that day (of His future return), will enter into the Kingdom of Heaven...

Matt 7:21-23
21 Not every one that saith unto Me, "Lord, Lord", shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of My Father Which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to Me in that day, "Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Thy name? and in Thy name have cast out devils? and in Thy name done many wonderful works?"

23 And then will I profess unto them, "I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity."
KJV


Notice what those say in 'green'. Just who... would it be that would be prophesying in Christ's Name? or casting out devils in Christ's Name? or doing many wonderful works in Christ's Name? BELIEVERS ON CHRIST JESUS! of course.

Yet Jesus says there that He will tell those to get away from Him when He returns. Why?

The matter is actually very simple, for those who keep Jesus' Word that is. He warned us about a coming pseudo-Christ that comes first working supernatural miracles that many will claim is Him. Jesus and His Apostles showed that we must WAIT on Jesus' coming afterwards. And even His Apostles Paul and John repeated that warning in The New Testament. And in the Old Testament prophets, that coming false one at the END of this world is witnessed and warned of also!

What else need Lord Jesus do then, for His servants, if they won't listen to Him in His Word, but would rather listen to the stupidity of men's false doctrines?

 

[Behold]

we are STILL to ask forgiveness of FUTURE SIN we may

So you are just one more confused person who is trying to keep yourself saved by confessing sin...

That is self saving, and it can't be done.
Give up trying.

Now.........Can confessing sin, save you to begin with?
NOPE.
So Then, how can it keep you saved, ?

Also, because """"Jesus is the ONE TIME..= ETERNAL Sacrifice for sin""""....why are you confessing what He has ETERNALLY dealt with for you, 200O yrs ago on The Cross?

Why dont you trust in Christ to keep you saved?
Why dont you explain that to Him before you run back in here and try to prove you are trying to keep yourself saved by repenting and confessing sin. @Davy

Listen,
= some liar told you ........"Well, Jesus only forgave your sins, up to the day of your Salvaiton, and now you have to confess them over and over ... to keep being forgiven......sort of 'Re-saved" over and over".
See that nonsense?

Now....Look again.....= "Jesus is the ONE TIME..>ETERNAL SACRIFICE.>>FOR SIN">....because ""GOD hath made JESUS to BE SIN.. for us""".

Now, once you can comprehend "one time", and "eternal" and "Sacrifice for sin" then you have the potential to correctly understand the finished work of Jesus on The Cross, and get some REAL FAITH in Christ. @Davy

 

[Rockerduck]

That's a non answer...likely because you have nothing with which to defend your position on this. Ok. I just wanted to see you say it. You believe in YOUR mind that you have effectively defended your position, which is no proof at all. It is what it is.

BTW

I posted Jesus' words from scripture. You are calling Jesus Calvinist, not me. I use scripture only. So, you don't believe a word Jesus says. Only you are sounding like the Brady bunch. Calvin, Calvin, Calvin.

 

[BeforeThereWas]

I posted Jesus' words from scripture. You are calling Jesus Calvinist, not me. I use scripture only. So, you don't believe a word Jesus says. Only you are sounding like the Brady bunch. Calvin, Calvin, Calvin.

Perhaps the better way to state what I said is that, even though quoting Jesus, misapplication is still a means for introducing error.

BTW

 

[Rockerduck]

Perhaps the better way to state what I said is that, even though quoting Jesus, misapplication is still a means for introducing error.

BTW

I disagree. Jesus' is the Word of God. There are no mistakes in His perfect Will of the Father. You cannot disagree with one thing Jesus said. It is as solid as He is the Rock.

 

[DJT_47]

What are we initially saved from when we are saved? It's our past sins, not future sins that may be committed subsequent to our initial salvation.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Man's OSAS doctrine is NOT Biblical. Don't be deceived brethren, because some of those churches on that doctrine like to claim there is NO MORE NEED FOR REPENTANCE of future sin. Some of them no longer even hold Communion with Christ. I've even had some of their followers ask me what Communion is!

Look at what Lord Jesus said with how to pray...

Luke 11:1-4
11 And it came to pass, that, as He was praying in a certain place, when He ceased, one of His disciples said unto Him, "Lord, teach us to pray, as John also taught his disciples."

2 And He said unto them, "When ye pray, say, Our Father Which art in heaven, Hallowed be Thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth.

3 Give us day by day our daily bread.

4 And forgive us our sins; for we also forgive every one that is indebted to us. And lead us not into temptation; but deliver us from evil.
KJV


If OSAS were true, then there should never been any future need to pray for forgiveness of sin. Yet Lord Jesus put that in the prayer He gave His disciples, and us, His Church. That means HE KNEW we would still slip up and commit future sin, and need to repent and ask forgiveness.

And the 1 John 1 Chapter is a Lesson on what to do when we catch ourselves in a future sin. We are to repent, and ask Jesus forgiveness. And He is Just to forgive us and cleanse us.

So don't be fooled when the OSAS crowd start bringing up the idea of being saved by God's Grace only, for that specific point is indeed true, our works do not save us, but that does not mean we are not to have works in Christ, which is a natural byproduct of our Faith.

OSAS is true ! but for people or Satanist who work to bastardise it ! and add their load of BS to such ?
I have come across such people who peddle another form of OSAS load of total BS ! They claim to be born again ? but what they claim born again, is another load of total BS ! as well !

So in what they peddle is that one gets born again by, you reapeating what they tell you what to say and after that Bingo you are what they call born again ? But that is totaly false in fact and Satanic !

Then they demand that now, one is then open to do what ever you please for they claim you are going to Heaven regardless now ? so do what ever, Kill whoever you want etc, because such are going to Heaven regardless !

But such as That is total BS ! Because one who is truly born again, does not go against that of Christ Jesus ! Jesus never aproved of killing others !

If you kill a person your Soul is in grave trouble ! that's a fact ! that will mess with your mined for sure !
and you do not have licence to Kill anyone !
Why would one who is Save want to kill anyone ? They only want others to be Saved !

How does one become truly born again ? well their is a change in you and you seek strongly to know of Jesus, that's strong faith in him, that's for starters but you still do grow and when one becomes Saved you know Christ Jesus and He knows you ! so you are abiding regardless, you can not turn away, because no one can snatch you out of his hand !

Not to mention one still grows regardless ! that never ends !

Not to mention once you truly know that he is Christ Jesus 100% then you are born again. because he is your Lord and Saviour, now at that point you are Saved ! but you is still learning ? Jesus comes to you ! that's how you know ! you will be blowen away by it, you will never forget it !

No one makes you born again in fact never ever ! as it's truly a working of the Holy Spirit in fact ! nothing to do with that of mans works ever !

Now if you have 99.99% faith in Jesus is the Christ, that is not Saved ! you must have faith that can move mountains in fact, as that is God given !

We do not believe in Man ? we abide in Christ Jesus as we do his will as he does just that such in us ! we do not seek the Glory but that of Him ! is given ! all of the Glory in fact ! because it's not us that do the workings ? it's him in us ! That's the Power of the Holy Spirit ! it's this one that can move mountains ! and it clearly does or can do if we abide in him !

That Mob who peddled the BS OSAS nonsense, they would alwasy say look at what, they see as workings of their gods ? such was of Mans works in fact ! I can clearly see that, but not them ! they demanded works ? but also said demanded they rejected works ? but they were all truly about mans works ? just they wrapped it up differently for fools ? I can see what is of Gods works and what is of mans works in fact ! but they clearly can not !

Not to mention they Idolise the so called Jews ! and are all about the 2ed coming ! for they do not have faith in Christ Jesus in fact and that is clear to me ! for if one did have Salvation, you would know that you are Saved ? so why Idolise the 2ed coming ? for the 2ed coming is of Satan, as Satan comes first in fact = The Hell fire ! but They are under the delusion that they are going to be raptured up ? saved from the Hellfire that they sowed the seed of ? They want to kill people, that's who they truly are ! nothing to do with Jesus ? but they have another Jesus ? he is not the Christ Jesus !

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

What are we initially saved from when we are saved? It's our past sins, not future sins that may be committed subsequent to our initial salvation.

Saved from the power of Sin !

So one has a handel on the workings of the powers of Sin ?

Like brushing apon a poisions vine say, so you will take note before hand and see it for what it truly is in fact. saving from an inflicting pain produced from ignorance, not understanding the nature of such workings can produce.

So knowing what not to stand in, one is best served that ends ?

The Salvation is the Key for your Soul, so such is not Lost !

Satanist work to destroy ones Soul ! or to keep it depraved of strength ! a weak or feble Sould can be manipulated by them of the darkness. for they can not bear the Light ! being exposed !