We've Grown More Outside of Church

[Wynona]

So, we've explored many church traditions (Orthodoxy, Pentecostalisn, Baptist, Presbyterian not in that order)

Orthodoxy is the closest to what we strive to embody. But for the last several years, we felt led to not be members of a church. We studied the Bible from cover to cover and strove to apply it.

A Few issues with churches around us are unbiblical tithing, lack of charity, divorce and remarriage gone wild, once saved always saved doctrine, calvinist doctrine, feminist influence, and worship being more of a show. A lot of "believe this" but very little action.

Ive seen a lot more growth just studying the Scriptures. There's a lot of emphasis on obedience and good works that I was simply never taught in church or was directly taught against those things in favor of "grace".

 

[Bob]

Thank you!! (From a former regular church attendee.)

Only one addition: being able to discuss scripture in this forum has been an excellent way to understand the Bible more thoroughly and to verify one’s interpretations.

Blessings.

 

[Rockerduck]

So, we've explored many church traditions (Orthodoxy, Pentecostalisn, Baptist, Presbyterian not in that order)

Orthodoxy is the closest to what we strive to embody. But for the last several years, we felt led to not be members of a church. We studied the Bible from cover to cover and strove to apply it.

A Few issues with churches around us are unbiblical tithing, lack of charity, divorce and remarriage gone wild, once saved always saved doctrine, calvinist doctrine, feminist influence, and worship being more of a show. A lot of "believe this" but very little action.

Ive seen a lot more growth just studying the Scriptures. There's a lot of emphasis on obedience and good works that I was simply never taught in church or was directly taught against those things in favor of "grace".

Jesus calls me to churches to go to. I stay and call out all the errors I see unbiblical. I do not argue over doctrines
It's more about letting the world into the Church. Getting the world out of the church forces everyone to a more biblical understanding and teaching. The dress code on the stage (altar) of God has gotten out of hand, letting the worlds styles into the church as well as songs.

 

[Wynona]

Jesus calls me to churches to go to. I stay and call out all the errors I see unbiblical. I do not argue over doctrines
It's more about letting the world into the Church. Getting the world out of the church forces everyone to a more biblical understanding and teaching. The dress code on the stage (altar) of God has gotten out of hand, letting the worlds styles into the church as well as songs.

Respectfully, are you an evangelist?

We were members of a Church of God and the evangelist would travel to different churches to call for a higher level of Godliness.

 

[Rockerduck]

Respectfully, are you an evangelist?

We were members of a Church of God and the evangelist would travel to different churches to call for a higher level of Godliness.

Where Jesus tells me to go I go. Yes, I evangelize. All the churches have strayed from the normal church growth to the world growth. Pastors should be paid, but not worried about attendance. Preach the truth and people will come. The word will get out, "that church is the way I was brought up". Ask you Grandmother or aunt how church was when they grew up. A congregation that sings together, worships together, and prays together is the best church that Christians want to be part of. Gone is the choir and congregation singing together. Gone are the pew bibles that everyone reads the same scripture, instead of 20 different translations. Yes, it is different nowadays, and many don't know the way back.

 

[Pearl]

I've only ever belonged to two church fellowships. The first was just after I was saved and was Anglican/Church of England. It was led by a born again and spirit filled vicar and gave me a solid foundation. The other was a non-denominational group which started life in peoples' homes. And even today, 40 years later, it's where I still go occasionally.

But I feel that I have become closer to God outside of any group. When Ray said he wanted to leave the church I was devastated but called to submit to my husband. It was a big thing for me and I well remember walking through the park one day with this on my mind and God telling me that He is my Shepherd. And I have trusted to that Psalm 23 ever since. We both found that we grew stronger in our faith outside the fellowship and when years later we felt it was the right time to go back we did and found new roles.

I mostly go now to keep my son company when he wants to take his girls and still feel close to God even though I give church a miss most weeks.

 

[Wynona]

I've only ever belonged to two church fellowships. The first was just after I was saved and was Anglican/Church of England. It was led by a born again and spirit filled vicar and gave me a solid foundation. The other was a non-denominational group which started life in peoples' homes. And even today, 40 years later, it's where I still go occasionally.

But I feel that I have become closer to God outside of any group. When Ray said he wanted to leave the church I was devastated but called to submit to my husband. It was a big thing for me and I well remember walking through the park one day with this on my mind and God telling me that He is my Shepherd. And I have trusted to that Psalm 23 ever since. We both found that we grew stronger in our faith outside the fellowship and when years later we felt it was the right time to go back we did and found new roles.

I mostly go now to keep my son company when he wants to take his girls and still feel close to God even though I give church a miss most weeks.

I used to feel very self conscious about not having a church. I almost forgot that. It was my husband who led us at, similar to you.

 

[Taken]

We've Grown More Outside of Church

Clarifying.
My response is specific to a (man built church).

I do not go to man built churches.

I am aware every domination has a headquarters, that presets and distributes/ or otherwise notifies the churches associated with them…a specific agenda to be preached, covered, in the weekly sermon.

I recognize the intent is to keep a cohesive / similarity topic regardless of physical location.

I further realize a Minister has a great task “before him”… expressly meaning:
believers,
nonbelievers,
saved,
non saved,
male,
female,
old,
young,
single,
married,
parents,
childless,
wealthy,
poor,
healthy,
ill,
sad,
happy,
smart,
ignorant,
…coughing, talking, texting, sleeping, fidgeting, walking about, money collectors, etc. / distractions…
eyes and ears toward the “distractions”.
* That is “The Congregation” before the Minister.

The “Ministers JOB” ??

Speak the Word of God, in such a fashion, manner, that every “person” in attendance will benefit from the message of Gods Word.

My past experience…few ministers have the knack to capture the attention of a whole congregation to the benefit of all the congregation.

Daily reading, studying at home, is my preference, any hour, no waiting for an unlocked door, no dress code, my choice of topic specific.

Missing out on “fellowshipping”?
No.

(Visitors)
family, friends, neighbors

(shopping, parking lot, marina, gas station, bank, bar, airplane, waiting lines, retirement homes, hospitals, prisons, restaurants, anywhere…)
strangers

God is Good. When armed with the Truth, and willing to engage with a stranger for just a minute… you may be the answer to a prayer a stranger asked to cross their path with a Truth and a kindness that sparks their interest in learning more or about the Lord God.

That, to me, is more so of Gods Desire… than the all so usual for so many, who fret about what to wear, sit next to the same people, gossip/ whisper, about others in a traditional man built church.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[amigo de christo]

So, we've explored many church traditions (Orthodoxy, Pentecostalisn, Baptist, Presbyterian not in that order)

Orthodoxy is the closest to what we strive to embody. But for the last several years, we felt led to not be members of a church. We studied the Bible from cover to cover and strove to apply it.

A Few issues with churches around us are unbiblical tithing, lack of charity, divorce and remarriage gone wild, once saved always saved doctrine, calvinist doctrine, feminist influence, and worship being more of a show. A lot of "believe this" but very little action.

Ive seen a lot more growth just studying the Scriptures. There's a lot of emphasis on obedience and good works that I was simply never taught in church or was directly taught against those things in favor of "grace".

you have seen a lot more growth in just doing what my dear sister .
And now you know why i been pratically begging and pleading for all to do JUST THAT .
Get back into the bible to learn for themselves .
Cause sadly much of christendom is now being fleeced , not taught up in the way of GOD and of sound doctrine .
Yeah sure is different when we read the bible and them compare that to what we see getting done and praticed
and allowed to be done in churches .

 

[Marvelloustime]

you have seen a lot more growth in just doing what my dear sister .
And now you know why i been pratically begging and pleading for all to do JUST THAT .
Get back into the bible to learn for themselves .
Cause sadly much of christendom is now being fleeced , not taught up in the way of GOD and of sound doctrine .
Yeah sure is different when we read the bible and them compare that to what we see getting done and praticed
and allowed to be done in churches .

@amigo de christo

 

[amigo de christo]

It be LORD praising and thanking time in the building .

 

[quietthinker]

So, we've explored many church traditions (Orthodoxy, Pentecostalisn, Baptist, Presbyterian not in that order)

Orthodoxy is the closest to what we strive to embody. But for the last several years, we felt led to not be members of a church. We studied the Bible from cover to cover and strove to apply it.

A Few issues with churches around us are unbiblical tithing, lack of charity, divorce and remarriage gone wild, once saved always saved doctrine, calvinist doctrine, feminist influence, and worship being more of a show. A lot of "believe this" but very little action.

Ive seen a lot more growth just studying the Scriptures. There's a lot of emphasis on obedience and good works that I was simply never taught in church or was directly taught against those things in favor of "grace".

Ahhhh, 'obedience', that hoary old adage.....and I would ask, obedience to what and to whom?
Isn't it true that we all love to be obedient to something from our own desires to the king.... so to speak.

I'm all in favour of obedience but it's not the obedience the religious promote by their lives or the obedience demanded by political entities.
So, what is the obedience necessarily in line with LIFE?

 

[ScottA]

So, we've explored many church traditions (Orthodoxy, Pentecostalisn, Baptist, Presbyterian not in that order)

Orthodoxy is the closest to what we strive to embody. But for the last several years, we felt led to not be members of a church. We studied the Bible from cover to cover and strove to apply it.

A Few issues with churches around us are unbiblical tithing, lack of charity, divorce and remarriage gone wild, once saved always saved doctrine, calvinist doctrine, feminist influence, and worship being more of a show. A lot of "believe this" but very little action.

Ive seen a lot more growth just studying the Scriptures. There's a lot of emphasis on obedience and good works that I was simply never taught in church or was directly taught against those things in favor of "grace".

Indeed, growth is better One on one or as a couple with God. And I understand the grievances--most deserve what they get.

However, that all only speaks of us. While the other, perhaps greater need and reason for our gathering together...is that--if we make ourselves available--God has something more in mind that is not about us. It's about what He made us for--for His body--not ours--His body, even that group that doesn't deserve it.

And then again--there's us.

 

[Hiddenthings]

I'm all in favour of obedience but it's not the obedience the religious promote by their lives or the obedience demanded by political entities.
So, what is the obedience necessarily in line with LIFE?

“You are my friends if you do whatever I command you.” John 15:14

LIFE is within the commandment and obedience is the only means of gaining comfort.

 

[quietthinker]

“You are my friends if you do whatever I command you.” John 15:14

LIFE is within the commandment and obedience is the only means of gaining comfort.

I wonder what it was on the top of the 'whatever' list that Jesus commanded us to do? What I mean by that is, not just give a verbal ascent to......like the Son who promised to do his father's will but never went out to do it. Matthew 21:28-32
...and was there a top of the list?

 

[Hiddenthings]

I wonder what it was on the top of the 'whatever' list that Jesus commanded us to do? What I mean by that is, not just give a verbal ascent to......like the Son who promised to do his father's will but never went out to do it. Matthew 21:28-32
...and was there a top of the list?

Great question!

If this "Greater love hath no man than this: that a man lay down his life for his friends" came as a result of Jesus obeying the two great commandments and upon these two hangs all the Law and the Prophets, then the list is short.

On one is written, “Love God,” and on the other, “Love your neighbor as yourself.” By these two principles he lived and died, and he calls us to do the same, to strive within ourselves, as best we can, to embody the measure of the perfect man.

We have been children: petulant, selfish, and impatient. Let us now grow into maturity and put away childish ways. In our reflections, we have seen only blurred images of the perfect man striving to be born in us. But one day, we will see him face to face, and in an instant, his gaze will reveal whether we have made his love our guiding example.

It is the measure by which we shall ultimately stand or fall.

 

[quietthinker]

Great question!

If this "Greater love hath no man than this: that a man lay down his life for his friends" came as a result of Jesus obeying the two great commandments and upon these two hangs all the Law and the Prophets, then the list is short.

On one is written, “Love God,” and on the other, “Love your neighbor as yourself.” By these two principles he lived and died, and he calls us to do the same, to strive within ourselves, as best we can, to embody the measure of the perfect man.

We have been children: petulant, selfish, and impatient. Let us now grow into maturity and put away childish ways. In our reflections, we have seen only blurred images of the perfect man striving to be born in us. But one day, we will see him face to face, and in an instant, his gaze will reveal whether we have made his love our guiding example.

It is the measure by which we shall ultimately stand or fall.

From what I can tell, Jesus had a love which flowed in and out of him like breathing, ie he absorbed his Father's love and reflected it to us. He even went further than laying down his life for his friends. Paul tells us that while we were enemies he laid down his life for us. Romans 5:8, 10.
If Jesus lays down his life for the enemy, one would conclude that he doesn't see us as his enemies but rather we see him as the enemy.

Conclusion: God has never been alienated from us but rather we have been alienated from God.
God has been seen as a threat by us, one who judges, one who condemns.
It is our view of God that is faulty not God's view of us.

 

[Hiddenthings]

From what I can tell, Jesus had a love which flowed in and out of him like breathing, ie he absorbed his Father's love and reflected it to us. He even went further than laying down his life for his friends. Paul tells us that while we were enemies he laid down his life for us. Romans 5:8, 10.
If Jesus lays down his life for the enemy, one would conclude that he doesn't see us as his enemies but rather we see him as the enemy.

Conclusion: God has never been alienated from us but rather we have been alienated from God.
God has been seen as a threat by us, one who judges, one who condemns.
It is our view of God that is faulty not God's view of us.

I especially agree with the imagery of God exhaling and Jesus inhaling the Word, it’s a beautiful expression of their shared reality.

God loved; Christ died.

Paul explains the red text here...

Colossians 1:21–23 "Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil actions. But now he has reconciled you through the physical body of Christ by his death, to present you holy and blameless before him, free from accusation — provided that you continue in your faith, established and steadfast, and not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard.”

The sad reality is that so few Christians truly understand how God reconciled them through the physical body of Christ, even though the Apostles mention it repeatedly. My hope is that one day all will come to grasp this profound truth.

The challenge is finding God's view and not our own.

 

[amigo de christo]

I especially agree with the imagery of God exhaling and Jesus inhaling the Word, it’s a beautiful expression of their shared reality.

God loved; Christ died.

Paul explains the red text here...

Colossians 1:21–23 "Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil actions. But now he has reconciled you through the physical body of Christ by his death, to present you holy and blameless before him, free from accusation — provided that you continue in your faith, established and steadfast, and not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard.”

The sad reality is that so few Christians truly understand how God reconciled them through the physical body of Christ, even though the Apostles mention it repeatedly. My hope is that one day all will come to grasp this profound truth.

The challenge is finding God's view and not our own.

The scriptures are huge on showing us HOW GOD does view things .
And the reminders of the truth will surely help us .
God is Truth , His word is Truth , His Spirit is Truth and his words are truth .
My words are spirit and they are life .
To whom shall we go , for you have the words of life .
It is more important than ever we stick to the scriptures and be refreshed and stirred up
and stirring one another up WITH those reminders . For every Word of the LORD is good for our soul .
From Ever promise to even every dire warning , it is for the good of the sheep .
God knows HOW to keep His safe and from falling . Let us take heed unto ourselves and the doctrine .
Never allow men to remove and omit any part of His words and His pattern . He knows HOW to keep one safe .

 

[amigo de christo]

I wonder what it was on the top of the 'whatever' list that Jesus commanded us to do? What I mean by that is, not just give a verbal ascent to......like the Son who promised to do his father's will but never went out to do it. Matthew 21:28-32
...and was there a top of the list?

Jesus said go ye and preach the gospel to all .
Yet many seem to say we beleive , but its not necessary that others did as they clambor under a false gospel
which is not going to save the false religoins , atheists , or this world and worse they do it in his Name .
Let us not be as the oprahs and the popes and scores of protesetants
who make a cliam WE BELEIVE , but then imply OH but its not necessary . That aint what JESUS said
Time to be hearers and doers of the Word .
Time to double down on all sound doctrine and not omit any of it .
Time to actually HONOR HE who has saved us , for we do owe HIM all .
And always remember , no matter how loving a lie sounded , A LIE will never honor GOD .
A lie cannot save .
JESUS CAN and its high time HE and His doctrine be taught again .