Is it possible to lose salvation?

[Marymog]

the apostles and Christ as i said many times all over my posts on all threads.

I agree with you. Christ is more believable when he said this IS my body.

I agree with you. The Apostle Paul is more believable when he said it IS a participation in the body/blood of Christ.

A student of the Apostle John is more believable than your Protestant men.

What more is there to say...

 

[LoveYeshua]

Soooo let me see if understand you correctly. 2,000 years ago Jesus said this IS my body/blood and you say YES, it is, figuratively.

30 years later Paul then said it IS His body/blood and you say YES, it is, figuratively.

Neither of them said it was figurative, but you say it is!

That is your argument?

The Church and I and @nedsk agree with Jesus and say YES, it is your body/blood.

The Church and I and @nedsk agree with Paul and say YES, it is His body/blood.

Approximately 70 years after Paul said it is His body and blood a student of the Apostle John says it is His body/blood. 500 years ago your men declared that it isn't His body/blood so you listen to those men instead of Jesus, Paul and a student of John?

According to your logic I and The Church and @nedsk are wrong for agreeing with all of them, but you and your Protestant men are right for disagreeing with them?

Hmmmm.......This makes no sense.

Mary, if you want to debate this no problem. That is not the purpose of this thread you can do so here;

Eat My Flesh, Drink My Blood — What Did Jesus Really Mean?

The Bread of Life, the Blood of Atonement, and the Secret Hidden Since the Manna in the Wilderness When Jesus said in John 6:53–57, “Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you… Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life,” He was not...

www.christianityboard.com

PLease read the O.P. , I explain what I mean there. you can reply there also.

 

[nedsk]

Soooo let me see if understand you correctly. 2,000 years ago Jesus said this IS my body/blood and you say YES, it is, figuratively.

30 years later Paul then said it IS His body/blood and you say YES, it is, figuratively.

Neither of them said it was figurative, but you say it is!

That is your argument?

The Church and I and @nedsk agree with Jesus and say YES, it is your body/blood.

The Church and I and @nedsk agree with Paul and say YES, it is His body/blood.

Approximately 70 years after Paul said it is His body and blood a student of the Apostle John says it is His body/blood. 500 years ago your men declared that it isn't His body/blood so you listen to those men instead of Jesus, Paul and a student of John?

According to your logic I and The Church and @nedsk are wrong for agreeing with all of them, but you and your Protestant men are right for disagreeing with them?

Hmmmm.......This makes no sense.

Yes our friend here thinks we should listen to them and not Jesus. We should listen to them and not Paul. We should listen to them and not all the church fathers who defended the church from every form of heresy for 1500 years. This is the level of strangeness we are dealing with. They opposed all the people I mentioned because they were told to. They really can't help it.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Lets go back to the original post of this thread;

Is it possible to lose salvation?​

Jesus had a lot to say about and this taught that the path to eternal life is narrow and that few find it. In Matthew 7:13-14, He said;
"Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."
This shows that salvation is not guaranteed for everyone, and only those who stay faithful and follow His teachings will enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

Jesus also warned that some would hear the word and believe for a while, but eventually fall away. In the Parable of the Sower, He explained;
"But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles." (Matthew 13:20-21).
This illustrates that some will start their walk with God but will not persevere when faced with trials or temptations.

In John 15:6, Jesus made it even clearer, saying;
"If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."
Here, Jesus compares Himself to a vine and believers as branches. A branch must remain connected to the vine to stay alive and bear fruit. If a person disconnects from Christ through disobedience or unbelief, they wither spiritually and face eternal judgment.


The original apostles also confirmed this truth. Peter warned in 2 Peter 2:20-21;
"For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them."
This shows that a person who was once saved and returns to sin is in a worse condition than before they knew the truth.

James also affirmed this truth when he said;
"Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins."
(James 5:19-20).
This verse reveals that a believer can wander away from the truth and face spiritual death unless they repent and return to God.

The Bible does provide examples of those who lost their salvation. Judas Iscariot was one of the twelve apostles chosen by Jesus, yet he betrayed the Lord for thirty pieces of silver. Jesus Himself said about Judas;
"It would have been good for that man if he had not been born." (Matthew 26:24).
This shows that Judas was once in the faith but fell away and was lost.

Another example is Balaam, a prophet who once heard from God but later led Israel into sin for personal gain. Peter referred to him, saying,
"They have forsaken the right way and gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Beor." (2 Peter 2:15). King Saul is yet another example; he was chosen and anointed by God but later disobeyed and rebelled, and the Spirit of God departed from him (1 Samuel 16:14)

Jesus' words make it clear that salvation is not a one-time event but requires endurance and faithfulness until the end. As He said in Matthew 24:13, "But he who endures to the end shall be saved." Therefore, those who abide in Christ, obey His commandments, and remain faithful will receive eternal life. However, those who turn away from Him and return to sin risk losing their salvation and facing eternal separation from God: "Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus."Rev 14:12

Blessings.

 

[nedsk]

Mary, if you want to debate this no problem. That is not the purpose of this thread you can do so here;

Eat My Flesh, Drink My Blood — What Did Jesus Really Mean?

The Bread of Life, the Blood of Atonement, and the Secret Hidden Since the Manna in the Wilderness When Jesus said in John 6:53–57, “Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you… Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life,” He was not...

www.christianityboard.com

this time read the O.P. please, i explain what i mean there. you can reply there also.

That's the problem YOU explain what Jesus meant. You need to show evidence that you possess the authoritative understanding of Jesus words. Only by doing so would I be willing to reconsider what the church fathers taught, which contradicts you, for 1500 years. Ill wait for the documentation.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Thats not what Jesus said. I love how you people just ignore what Jesus said. You've been led to the gates of hell but you think you're good. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad. Show us evidence of anyone in the church who was teaching what you believe before the 1500s.

Here is what Jesus said.
Why do you refuse to answer., You focus on 7 words. why do you reject most everyting in Blue?

Your not going to sit here and falsly accuse people of denying what Jesus said, when you do that very thing.



The words of Jesus


In black is the command

In blue is what the one who follows the command will receive


27 Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, ,

Command – Labor for this food that Jesus came to give

Result – The food will endure forever

33 For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.”

What is this food?

He who comes down from heaven

Result – Life is offered to the world


35: “I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.

Jesus is the one who came down from heaven He is the bread of life

Command: Come to him –

Result. You will never hunger

Command – Believe

Result – Never thirst


the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

Command – Come to me

Result – You will never be cast out


39: that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.

Fact – All who are given to God

Result – Will never be lost, and will be raised on the last day


40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”

Command – See and believe

Result – You will live forever and you will be raised on the last day


47 Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.

Command – Believe in him

Result – You will live forever (eternal life)



50 This is the bread which comes down from heaven, that one may eat of it and not die.

Command – Eat the bread

Result – you will never die

51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever;

Command – Eat this bread

Result – Live forever

and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world.”

What is this bread? My life I give

Result – Life of the world

53 Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you.

Command – Fail to eat the flesh and blood (the bread)

Result – you have no life in you (your dead)

54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.

Command – Eat my flesh and blood (the bread)

Result – You will live forever (eternal life) and you will be raised on the last day


56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him.

Command Eat my flesh and drink my bood

Result – You will abide in him, and he will abide in you. As he lives you will live also

57 As the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, so he who feeds on Me will live because of Me.

Command – Feed on him

Result – You will live

58: He who eats this bread will live forever.”.

Command – Eat this bread

Result – You will live forever

Jesus came to give life. He said whoever eats this bread (feeds on him ) will get life. So what is it that gives life?

Jesus answers this also

62 What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

Jesus said he was the bread sent down from heave

• Jesus asked, what if you see him ascend back to heaven (which many of them would in the future after his death)
• The thing that gives life (the food, the bread, the flesh and blood) is given by the spirit.
• The food which gives life ARE THE WORDS JESUS SPEAKS as given by the spirit

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Yes our friend here thinks we should listen to them and not Jesus. We should listen to them and not Paul. We should listen to them and not all the church fathers who defended the church from every form of heresy for 1500 years. This is the level of strangeness we are dealing with. They opposed all the people I mentioned because they were told to. They really can't help it.

Niether one of you listen to jesus

You listen to 7 words he says and rejects every other things he said

again, You are not going to sit here and falsly accuse people of doing what you yourself are doing.. that is called hypocrisy.

Own up and respond why you reject what Jesus said

 

[Eternally Grateful]

That's the problem YOU explain what Jesus meant. You need to show evidence that you possess the authoritative understanding of Jesus words. Only by doing so would I be willing to reconsider what the church fathers taught, which contradicts you, for 1500 years. Ill wait for the documentation.

lol

All he has to do is read the word.

We have answered you word for word what Jesus said

You will not even discuss it..

History will not help you.. If your putting your eternity in the hands of men who wrote history to fit their belief system. Then you are in serious danger..

 

[nedsk]

lol

All he has to do is read the word.

We have answered you word for word what Jesus said

You will not even discuss it..

History will not help you.. If your putting your eternity in the hands of men who wrote history to fit their belief system. Then you are in serious danger..

I have read it and the church fathers reinforced the teaching of Jesus in this regard. I'm not sure what you don't understand. You have some options to convince me you're right. One is show how it is you have the authoritative understanding of Jesus words OR you can show evidence of anyone in the church who taught what you believe in this regard before the 1500s. If you can't provide either then you're nothing more than a noisy gong and a clanking bell.

 

[Marymog]

Mary, if you want to debate this no problem. That is not the purpose of this thread you can do so here;

Eat My Flesh, Drink My Blood — What Did Jesus Really Mean?

The Bread of Life, the Blood of Atonement, and the Secret Hidden Since the Manna in the Wilderness When Jesus said in John 6:53–57, “Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you… Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life,” He was not...

www.christianityboard.com

PLease read the O.P. , I explain what I mean there. you can reply there also.

The topic of this thread is "Is it possible to lose salvation?". In your OP you quoted "If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."

Yes, it is possible to lose salvation if you don't abide in Him and his teachings. Sooooo my "debate" is in line with this thread.

You also quoted "Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.". To deny that it IS His body and blood, like he said, is to wander from the truth so you and your ilk have wandered from the truth.

I think I'm good in staying in line with the "purpose of this thread".

Keeping it real......mary

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I have read it

Yet you totally refuse to answer anything I have asked. or actually I think the right word, is you CAN'T Answer, because if you could. I am sure you would without hesitation

and the church fathers reinforced the teaching of Jesus in this regard. I'm not sure what you don't understand. You have some options to convince me you're right. One is show how it is you have the authoritative understanding of Jesus words OR you can show evidence of anyone in the church who taught what you believe in this regard before the 1500s. If you can't provide either then you're nothing more than a noisy gong and a clanking bell.

yawn.

The jews used history to crucify Christ.. You want to make that mistake feel free.

Again, Until you answer why what Jesus said in blue will not come true. and why Jesus lied. and why you refuse to take those words of Jesus literally.

You are on your own. you have lost all credibility. and if you keep attacking people of not taking Jesus literally. you condemn yourself as a hypocrite

 

[Marymog]

Yet you totally refuse to answer anything I have asked. or actually I think the right word, is you CAN'T Answer, because if you could. I am sure you would without hesitation

yawn.

The jews used history to crucify Christ.. You want to make that mistake feel free.

Again, Until you answer why what Jesus said in blue will not come true. and why Jesus lied. and why you refuse to take those words of Jesus literally.

You are on your own. you have lost all credibility. and if you keep attacking people of not taking Jesus literally. you condemn yourself as a hypocrite

You and your ilk use 500 year "history to crucify Christ" soooooo there's that!

 

[Marymog]

Here is what Jesus said.
Why do you refuse to answer., You focus on 7 words. why do you reject most everyting in Blue?

Your not going to sit here and falsly accuse people of denying what Jesus said, when you do that very thing.



The words of Jesus


In black is the command

In blue is what the one who follows the command will receive


27 Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, ,

Command – Labor for this food that Jesus came to give

Result – The food will endure forever

33 For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.”

What is this food?

He who comes down from heaven

Result – Life is offered to the world


35: “I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.

Jesus is the one who came down from heaven He is the bread of life

Command: Come to him –

Result. You will never hunger

Command – Believe

Result – Never thirst


the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

Command – Come to me

Result – You will never be cast out


39: that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.

Fact – All who are given to God

Result – Will never be lost, and will be raised on the last day


40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”

Command – See and believe

Result – You will live forever and you will be raised on the last day


47 Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.

Command – Believe in him

Result – You will live forever (eternal life)



50 This is the bread which comes down from heaven, that one may eat of it and not die.

Command – Eat the bread

Result – you will never die

51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever;

Command – Eat this bread

Result – Live forever

and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world.”

What is this bread? My life I give

Result – Life of the world

53 Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you.

Command – Fail to eat the flesh and blood (the bread)

Result – you have no life in you (your dead)

54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.

Command – Eat my flesh and blood (the bread)

Result – You will live forever (eternal life) and you will be raised on the last day


56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him.

Command Eat my flesh and drink my bood

Result – You will abide in him, and he will abide in you. As he lives you will live also

57 As the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, so he who feeds on Me will live because of Me.

Command – Feed on him

Result – You will live

58: He who eats this bread will live forever.”.

Command – Eat this bread

Result – You will live forever

Jesus came to give life. He said whoever eats this bread (feeds on him ) will get life. So what is it that gives life?

Jesus answers this also

62 What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

Jesus said he was the bread sent down from heave

• Jesus asked, what if you see him ascend back to heaven (which many of them would in the future after his death)
• The thing that gives life (the food, the bread, the flesh and blood) is given by the spirit.
• The food which gives life ARE THE WORDS JESUS SPEAKS as given by the spirit

Hey EG. What man, that you are following, came up with this interpretation of Scripture?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

History will not help you.. If your putting your eternity in the hands of men who wrote history to fit their belief system. Then you are in serious danger..

Lol...hold on....HOLD ON COWBOY.....Pull the reins back on your horse.

"History will not help you."? Soooo if @nedsk and I repeat the history of a student of the Apostle John, that will not help us? But if you and your ilk like @LoveYeshua repeat the 500-year history of Protestant men........You are vindicated? YOU and your ilk are right but a student of an Apostle is wrong?

Ummmmm.......can you explain that logic?

Curious Mary

PS......Sorry I have to prove you wrong again with logic.

 

[Marymog]

My teaching.....

YOUR teaching????

Scripture says that the church is the pillar and foundation of truth. Are YOU the church?

 

[nedsk]

Yet you totally refuse to answer anything I have asked. or actually I think the right word, is you CAN'T Answer, because if you could. I am sure you would without hesitation

yawn.

The jews used history to crucify Christ.. You want to make that mistake feel free.

Again, Until you answer why what Jesus said in blue will not come true. and why Jesus lied. and why you refuse to take those words of Jesus literally.

You are on your own. you have lost all credibility. and if you keep attacking people of not taking Jesus literally. you condemn yourself as a hypocrite

Do you can't show any authoritative understanding of Scripture nor any evidence that what you believe existed before the 1500s. Thanks.

 

[nedsk]

Lol...hold on....HOLD ON COWBOY.....Pull the reins back on your horse.

"History will not help you."? Soooo if @nedsk and I repeat the history of a student of the Apostle John, that will not help us? But if you and your ilk like @LoveYeshua repeat the 500-year history of Protestant men........You are vindicated? YOU and your ilk are right but a student of an Apostle is wrong?

Ummmmm.......can you explain that logic?

Curious Mary

PS......Sorry I have to prove you wrong again with logic.

They seem to genuinely believe their position is the correct one even though for 1500 years the only ones who believed what they do were heretics. It's fascinating isn't it? That poster even told me I only focus on what Jesus said. What horror LOL. You can't make this stuff up.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

He doesn't cast His sheep out of His fold. You cast yourself out by sinning, not doing good works etc. If you repent, He then takes you back into His fold......Just like Scripture says.Jesus said no one can pluck us out of His hands!

So you believe in losing your salvation, getting it back, losing it, getting it back, etc.etc. ad- nauseum.

If no one can pluck us out of His hands, how can you pluck youself out of His hands. Are you not a person?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I asked you one question in that post, and you didn't answer it. Instead, you focused on my accusation. Here is the question again:

Scripture says that the church is the pillar and foundation of truth. What Church did you get your teaching from Ronald?

Well it wasn't the Roman church! And nowhere in Scripture does it say the church is the pillar and foundation of the truth. The foundation is the apostles and prophets with jesus being the chief cornerstone which the entire building is fitly framed.

That is where I got the truth from. Not a sectarian denomination.

 

[nedsk]

So you believe in losing your salvation, getting it back, losing it, getting it back, etc.etc. ad- nauseum.

If no one can pluck us out of His hands, how can you pluck youself out of His hands. Are you not a person?

We can decide anytime to walk away. (The prodigal son) Gods mercy is endless and we can go and come back as often as we choose. God NEVER force us to stay.