Can any of you link or share a good argument against FULL preterism?

[3 Resurrections]

Then consider this fact. The church at Laodicea is represented as existing under conditions of great wealth. She was rich and had need of nothing (3:17). In A.D. 60, though, Laodicea had been almost entirely destroyed by an earthquake. Surely it would have required more than eight or nine years for that city to have risen again to the state of affluence described in Revelation.

The AD 60 Laodicean earthquake merely proves that Revelation was written shortly BEFORE that disastrous AD 60 earthquake, while the Laodicean church still had a cocky self-assurance of wealth and prosperity. God told them that He was "about to spue you out of my mouth", in a soon-coming judgment of that Laodicean church by the AD 60 earthquake.

The passage in Revelation 17:10 suggests that it was written during the rule of the sixth king, Galba, who ruled 68–69 AD.
The five Roman rulers before him were Julius Cesar, Tiberius, Caligula, Claudius and Nero (54–68).

Those seven and the eighth "kings of the earth" (Rev. 17:18) which were connected to the Scarlet Beast in Revelation 17:10 were not the Roman emperors. They were the eight high priests of the house of Annas who monopolized the high priesthood from AD 6 until AD 66 (Annas, Eleazar, Caiaphas, Jonathan, Theophilus, Matthias, Ananus, and Mattathias). Scripture gives the high priests the title of "the kings of the earth" (tes ges - the land of Israel - not monarchs of the world at large). The sixth high priest "king" that was still alive when John was writing Revelation was Theophilus, to whom the books of Luke and Acts were addressed. Five high priest "kings of the earth" (Annas, Eleazar, Caiaphas, Jonathan, and Matthias) had already died by the time John was writing Revelation, no later than early AD 60.

(The Rev. 17 Scarlet Beast is a different beast than the Rev. 13 Sea Beast, which was connected with the Roman empire and its ten crowned emperor horns.)

Remarkably, the text also states that the seventh king would have a short reign. This seventh king was Otho, who ruled for only three months during 69 AD.

The seventh high priest "king" was Ananus, who had not yet come into office, but would be appointed high priest in AD 63 for a "short space" of three months only before he was deposed by Rome for overstepping the bounds of his authority as high priest. This means Revelation was definitely written at some point before AD 63.

 

[HealthyShape]

Scripture gives the high priests the title of "the kings of the earth" (tes ges - the land of Israel - not monarchs of the world at large).

Where?

 

[Truth7t7]

The AD 60 Laodicean earthquake merely proves that Revelation was written shortly BEFORE that disastrous AD 60 earthquake, while the Laodicean church still had a cocky self-assurance of wealth and prosperity. God told them that He was "about to spue you out of my mouth", in a soon-coming judgment of that Laodicean church by the AD 60 earthquake.

No it doesn't

Just as the early church fathers stated, John wrote the revelation while jailed at Patmos under Emperor Domitian 81-96AD

 

[rwb]

Answer The Direct Questions Below?

1.) What is meant by "Their Dead Bodies"?

2.) What is meant by "The Street Of The Great City, Where Also Our Lord Was Crucified"?

Revelation 11:8KJV
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

How does Scripture define bodies? Are you aware the Church is referred to as "the body of Christ"? After the two witnesses (Law, Prophets, Church, Spirit) have finished the task of building spiritually the Kingdom of God in heaven, the Church (two witnesses) is killed. IOW the Church (bodies of Christ) are faithful unto death, their mission on earth finished, the Kingdom of God in heaven complete. This is the end of this age of grace; the end of time symbolized a thousand years the Church on earth is given for preaching the gospel of the Kingdom of God unto all the earth. For a very short (SYMBOLIC) time, three and a half days there will be no message to the earth from heaven, then Christ shall return, and the Church will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air as the fire of God's wrath comes down to burn up all that is left alive on this earth.

Ephesians 5:23 (KJV) For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

Colossians 1:18 (KJV) And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Colossians 1:24 (KJV) Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

According to the Revelation the "great city" is spiritually called Sodom and Egypt where our Lord was crucified, and it is also called Babylon that great city, and is called the woman that is a great city which reigns over the kings of the earth, and also called that great city the holy Jerusalem, that descends out of heaven from God.

Then we have one more passage to consider where the author speaks of Mount Sion as the city of the living God that is the heavenly Jerusalem inhabited by an innumerable company of angels as well as the general assembly (Church) of the firstborn which are written in heaven, spirits of men justified by Jesus, the Mediator of the New Covenant.

Hebrews 12:22-24 (KJV) But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

The texts tell us the great city was at one time considered to be holy and blessed of God, but had SPIRITUALLY become like Sodom and Egypt, which in Scripture typically (spiritually) refers to places of great ungodliness. The great city had fallen making all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication because she reigns over all of them. At one time the light of the candle (Church) shone brightly in her, the voice of the bridegroom (Christ) and the bride (faithful saints) shall no longer be heard in her, because through fornication (spiritual adultery) she deceived all the nations of the earth and in her is found the blood of prophets, saints and all that are slain upon the earth. The saints receive warning from heaven to "Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues."

Revelation 18:4 (KJV) And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

Revelation 18:23-24 (KJV) And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived. And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

This is not a city that shall be in the distant future where two human witnesses for Christ shall be physically killed as you assume!

 

[HealthyShape]

Just as the early church fathers stated, John wrote the revelation while jailed at Patmos under Emperor Domitian 81-96AD

It would make no sense. Who would be the 5 kings in Rev 17 before Domitian? And what catastrophic events happened soon after 81 in Judea that would correspond with the content of the book?

 

[Scott Downey]

No it doesn't

Just as the early church fathers stated, John wrote the revelation while jailed at Patmos under Emperor Domitian 81-96AD

I have always believed in a late date, ever since we had a youth pastor claim Nero was the antichrist, and the world was getting better and better until the Day of Christ. The entire world had to be Christianized with no unbelief remaining by the church and until then Christ could not return. He taught the church would present the kingdom of God to Christ at the return of Christ, a fully converted world. He taught the sudden destruction of this world will never happen as it already did in 70 ad, so yeah, he was a full preterist. Nothing I said to him would change his mind, they are very stuck in the ideology.

The only good thing for me is it made me look into the scriptures to a deeper degree, and helped me conform my mind to the scriptures, not strange doctrines of men about the second coming.

Honestly that youth pastor is a nice fellow, but none of the elders had problems with those strange teachings either, so I got out of there.

 

[rwb]

I have always believed in a late date, ever since we had a youth pastor claim Nero was the antichrist, and the world was getting better and better until the Day of Christ. The entire world had to be Christianized with no unbelief remaining by the church and until then Christ could not return. He taught the church would present the kingdom of God to Christ at the return of Christ, a fully converted world. He taught the sudden destruction of this world will never happen as it already did in 70 ad, so yeah, he was a full preterist. Nothing I said to him would change his mind, they are very stuck in the ideology.

The only good thing for me is it made me look into the scriptures to a deeper degree, and helped me conform my mind to the scriptures, not strange doctrines of men about the second coming.

Honestly that youth pastor is a nice fellow, but none of the elders had problems with those strange teachings either, so I got out of there.

I think so many of us share similar testimony! The Free Will Baptist Church where I met and came to believe the gospel did not teach what they had LEARNED by self-study. They believed and taught what they had been taught. Sadly, many churches in this world have come to rely almost entirely on what they were taught in seminaries (Dallas Theological comes to mind), while this seminary clings to the works of John Nelson Darby and the Scofield reference Bible. They don't try to rewrite the Bible as so many modern translations do, instead they rely on the reference notes by C.I. Scofield inserted into the KJB. That's how and when the doctrine of premill dispensationalism became popular and spread exponentially throughout the church, throughout the ages.

 

[Scott Downey]

I think so many of us share similar testimony! The Free Will Baptist Church where I met and came to believe the gospel did not teach what they had LEARNED by self-study. They believed and taught what they had been taught. Sadly, many churches in this world have come to rely almost entirely on what they were taught in seminaries (Dallas Theological comes to mind), while this seminary clings to the works of John Nelson Darby and the Scofield reference Bible. They don't try to rewrite the Bible as so many modern translations do, instead they rely on the reference notes by C.I. Scofield inserted into the KJB. That's how and when the doctrine of premill dispensationalism became popular and spread exponentially throughout the church, throughout the ages.

And pastors can have influence over who is an elder. So the strange doctrines get locked into their particular understandings. So when you bring up something other than what they believe as the truth, you are the one who is divisive, they get offended. That youth pastor wanted me to shut up. Often false teachers are that way. And he is now the church pastor. But he is careful not to talk much about his strange doctrines in sermons, he saves that stuff for confidants.
I know many in the church would be shocked about what he really believes, only way I found out, is he taught my kids and then when I started asking him what he meant, it really floored me.

Even so my kids don't believe it, and the pastor told me even his parents told him he was crazy! I had some other parents I talked with, one guy recognized it was off, but refused to speak to anyone about it. I did talk to some elders and wrote letters, but it went no where. They like the guy. One parent complained to the elders I was speaking against the 'Lord's anointed'

Maybe he will change his mind! Even though he told me never!

2 Peter 3, guy says this is not about the earth burning, the elements melting were the Jewish temple alter and silverware.

 

[3 Resurrections]

Where?

The Scriptures give the title of the "kings of the earth" to the high priests of the land of Israel in Psalms 2:2 (the kings of the earth who desired to break the bands of Israel's covenant with God and cast His cords away from themselves. The Roman governors and emperors never had such a covenant "band" or "cords" which bound them to the Lord as His people, so these "kings of the earth" taking counsel against the Lord and His anointed could not be referring to the Romans, but to the high priests.)

Also, Matthew 17:24-26, where the high priest "kings of the earth" and their sons were exempt from having to pay the annual Temple Tax as every other adult male in Israel was supposed to do. The high priests and their sons were the beneficiaries of that yearly Temple Tax, and were "free" from having to pay it.

Also, in Lamentations 4:12, neither the high priest "kings of the earth", nor the inhabitants of the world could believe that the enemy should have entered into the gates of Jerusalem and overcome it during the Babylonian invasion. It was those high priests rulers of the people in Jerusalem who denied that the city could ever be overtaken by disasters (Isaiah 28:14-19).

Also, in Revelation 16:14, the "kings of the earth" are mentioned as being distinct from the kings of the "whole habitable world". They would all be deceived by those spirits of devils, to be gathered to battle each other in the great day of God Almighty.

Conclusion: The number of seven and the eighth "kings of the earth" on the Scarlet Beast in Revelation 17 were the seven and eighth high priests of the house of Annas - not the emperors of Rome, which belonged on the other Rev. 13 Sea Beast instead.

 

[HealthyShape]

The Scriptures give the title of the "kings of the earth" to the high priests of the land of Israel in Psalms 2:2 (the kings of the earth who desired to break the bands of Israel's covenant with God and cast His cords away from themselves. The Roman governors and emperors never had such a covenant "band" or "cords" which bound them to the Lord as His people, so these "kings of the earth" taking counsel against the Lord and His anointed could not be referring to the Romans, but to the high priests.)

Also, Matthew 17:24-26, where the high priest "kings of the earth" and their sons were exempt from having to pay the annual Temple Tax as every other adult male in Israel was supposed to do. The high priests and their sons were the beneficiaries of that yearly Temple Tax, and were "free" from having to pay it.

Also, in Lamentations 4:12, neither the high priest "kings of the earth", nor the inhabitants of the world could believe that the enemy should have entered into the gates of Jerusalem and overcome it during the Babylonian invasion. It was those high priests rulers of the people in Jerusalem who denied that the city could ever be overtaken by disasters (Isaiah 28:14-19).

Also, in Revelation 16:14, the "kings of the earth" are mentioned as being distinct from the kings of the "whole habitable world". They would all be deceived by those spirits of devils, to be gathered to battle each other in the great day of God Almighty.

Conclusion: The number of seven and the eighth "kings of the earth" on the Scarlet Beast in Revelation 17 were the seven and eighth high priests of the house of Annas - not the emperors of Rome, which belonged on the other Rev. 13 Sea Beast instead.

You interpret some verses to mean what you claim them to mean, but the verses are not saying it explicitly. Therefore, it is a circular reasoning.

And those places are not being commonly interpreted in your way, so it seems to be too private interpretation to me.

For example, Psalm 2:2 is a royal/enthronement oracle addressing foreign “kings” and “rulers” who oppose YHWH and the Davidic anointed king (see standard commentaries). It functions as royal coronation/anti‑nations rhetoric, not a title for Israel’s priesthood.

 

[3 Resurrections]

For example, Psalm 2:2 is a royal/enthronement oracle addressing foreign “kings” and “rulers” who oppose YHWH and the Davidic anointed king (see standard commentaries). It functions as royal coronation/anti‑nations rhetoric, not a title for Israel’s priesthood.

That is not how the early church in Jerusalem understood the "kings of the earth" term. In Acts 4, when the disciples had just been threatened by all the family members of the high priest (Annas, Caiaphas, John, Alexander, etc.) not to speak in Jesus's name, the believers in Acts 4:24-30 recited the Psalms 2:1-2 prophecy about the conspiracy of the "kings of the earth" and directly connected it to their own situation of being threatened by those high priest "kings". Actually, it was not Pilate or Herod who conspired together to kill Christ. Herod actually sent Christ back to Pilate, and Pilate was laboring to free Christ from the hands of the Jewish high priesthood and the Sanhedrin who had conspired to kill Christ Jesus, ever since He raised Lazarus from the dead (John 11:53 - "Then from that day forth, they took counsel together for to put him to death.")

Even the 1 Samuel 2:10 testimony of Hannah in the LXX referred to God giving strength to "our kings", and Saul the first monarch of Israel had not even been born yet. The "ruler of the people" is also a title of the high priests, as Paul mentioned when he was on trial before the high priest Ananias in Acts 23:5.

And those places are not being commonly interpreted in your way, so it seems to be too private interpretation to me.

The "kings of the earth" being the high priests of the land of Israel is not my private interpretation. Even Dr. Gentry teaches this on his website. In Psalms 2:6, God setting His "king" upon His holy hill of Zion is speaking of Christ being consecrated as our Great High Priest in heaven at His resurrection-day ascension to the Father. God called Israel "a kingdom of priests" in that her royalty was originally established in her high priesthood, and not in a monarch such as the nations round about her.

 

[HealthyShape]

That is not how the early church in Jerusalem understood the "kings of the earth" term. In Acts 4, when the disciples had just been threatened by all the family members of the high priest (Annas, Caiaphas, John, Alexander, etc.) not to speak in Jesus's name, the believers in Acts 4:24-30 recited the Psalms 2:1-2 prophecy about the conspiracy of the "kings of the earth" and directly connected it to their own situation of being threatened by those high priest "kings". Actually, it was not Pilate or Herod who conspired together to kill Christ. Herod actually sent Christ back to Pilate, and Pilate was laboring to free Christ from the hands of the Jewish high priesthood and the Sanhedrin who had conspired to kill Christ Jesus, ever since He raised Lazarus from the dead (John 11:53 - "Then from that day forth, they took counsel together for to put him to death.")

Even the 1 Samuel 2:10 testimony of Hannah in the LXX referred to God giving strength to "our kings", and Saul the first monarch of Israel had not even been born yet. The "ruler of the people" is also a title of the high priests, as Paul mentioned when he was on trial before the high priest Ananias in Acts 23:5.


The "kings of the earth" being the high priests of the land of Israel is not my private interpretation. Even Dr. Gentry teaches this on his website. In Psalms 2:6, God setting His "king" upon His holy hill of Zion is speaking of Christ being consecrated as our Great High Priest in heaven at His resurrection-day ascension to the Father. God called Israel "a kingdom of priests" in that her royalty was originally established in her high priesthood, and not in a monarch such as the nations round about her.

Even though mainstream scholarship has no dominant opinion or consensus who the 7 kings were, the view that those were Roman emperors is quite frequent.

However, the view that those were high priests is basically nonexistent.

1. Revelation’s immediate imagery links the heads to “seven mountains” (Rev 17:9), a strong association with Rome’s seven hills, not with Jerusalem/temple.
2. Terms like “kings,” crowns, horns, and authority over nations align with royal/imperial motifs, not priestly office.
3. The connection with the beast from the Revelation 13 is obvious and that beast comes from the sea (Gentile nations). Nero fits it well, but no high priest does.

 

[3 Resurrections]

1. Revelation’s immediate imagery links the heads to “seven mountains” (Rev 17:9), a strong association with Rome’s seven hills, not with Jerusalem/temple.

Jerusalem was also known for the seven hills which it sat upon from antiquity, long before Rome became established on its own set of seven hills as a city on the Tiber.

2. Terms like “kings,” crowns, horns, and authority over nations align with royal/imperial motifs, not priestly office.

The high priesthood wore a crown on their forehead with "holiness to the Lord" engraved upon it. And the high priesthood WAS the authority over the nation of Israel as God originally instituted that role. The high priesthood was called "the ruler of the people" in Exodus 22:28 and by Paul in Acts 23:5. The high priesthood was also called "the Prince of the host" and "the Prince of princes" in Daniel 8:11, 25 and simply the "Prince" in Ezekiel 46:4. Christ being called "the King of kings" means that He is superior to any other Levitical high priest that ever served in that office, because He became a high priest after the deathless order of Melchizedek.

3. The connection with the beast from the Revelation 13 is obvious and that beast comes from the sea (Gentile nations). Nero fits it well, but no high priest does.

You are making the common mistake in conflating the Rev. 13 Sea Beast with the Rev. 17 Scarlet Beast. These were not the same beast. They had different origins, differences in features, different lifespans, different activities, and different fates. There were actually THREE Beasts in Revelation - not just two.

I agree that Nero does fit well as one of the ten crowned horns upon the Rev. 13 Sea Beast, but he is not featured as one of the Rev. 17 Scarlet Beast's UNcrowned 10 horns - none of which had yet received a kingdom as of the time John was writing Revelation (which could not be said of Nero).

 

[HealthyShape]

Jerusalem was also known for the seven hills which it sat upon from antiquity, long before Rome became established on its own set of seven hills as a city on the Tiber.

But it was not known under such "name" as widely as Rome. Ancient Jerusalem was not literally built on seven distinct hills in the clear, consistent sense that Rome was. Ancient sources and modern topography portray Jerusalem as a city of ridges and valleys (notably two main hills) though later traditions sometimes enumerated seven hills for symbolic or rhetorical reasons.

The high priesthood wore a crown on their forehead with "holiness to the Lord" engraved upon it. And the high priesthood WAS the authority over the nation of Israel as God originally instituted that role. The high priesthood was called "the ruler of the people" in Exodus 22:28 and by Paul in Acts 23:5. The high priesthood was also called "the Prince of the host" and "the Prince of princes" in Daniel 8:11, 25 and simply the "Prince" in Ezekiel 46:4. Christ being called "the King of kings" means that He is superior to any other Levitical high priest that ever served in that office, because He became a high priest after the deathless order of Melchizedek.

True but needs nuance. The high priest had major religious authority (sacrificial rites, Temple ministry, oracle access). Civil and governmental authority often rested with judges, elders, prophets, and kings. The high priest did sometimes exercise political influence (especially in the late Second Temple and priestly-led periods), but was not the sole national ruler.

You are making the common mistake in conflating the Rev. 13 Sea Beast with the Rev. 17 Scarlet Beast. These were not the same beast. They had different origins, differences in features, different lifespans, different activities, and different fates. There were actually THREE Beasts in Revelation - not just two.

I agree that Nero does fit well as one of the ten crowned horns upon the Rev. 13 Sea Beast, but he is not featured as one of the Rev. 17 Scarlet Beast's UNcrowned 10 horns - none of which had yet received a kingdom as of the time John was writing Revelation (which could not be said of Nero).

I would not say that the two beasts are the same image, only that they are related. While the Rev 13 beast is solely one person, Nero, the Rev 17 beast is rather the whole of the Roman rulers, but also somehow especially impersonation of Nero, the vision of John becomes a bit blurred regarding this concept:
The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven...

I guess we will need to agree to disagree. Because there is hardly some 100% proof which view works better. We agree that the book was written before 70 AD, at least.

 

[3 Resurrections]

I would not say that the two beasts are the same image, only that they are related. While the Rev 13 beast is solely one person, Nero, the Rev 17 beast is rather the whole of the Roman rulers, but also somehow especially impersonation of Nero, the vision of John becomes a bit blurred regarding this concept:
The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven...

The Rev. 13 Sea Beast was not a single person, but a corporate entity that included features of the lion, bear, and leopard kingdoms of Babylon, Medo-Persia, and Greece as well as Rome. The Rev. 13 Sea Beast and the Rev. 17 Scarlet Beast were counterparts of each other. The Sea Beast with its seven hills was definitely connected to Rome in its final phase of existence, but the other Scarlet Beast was definitely connected to Judea and its wilderness setting and to the harlot city Jerusalem sitting on its seven hills - not to Nero.

As of the time John was writing Revelation, the Sea Beast had a continual 666-year record of existence ever since Nebuchadnezzar and the first "lion" kingdom, in contrast to the Scarlet Beast which had a fluctuating pattern of existence. The Scarlet Beast once "was" in existence (under the Maccabees as an independent kingdom of Israel for about 80 years), then it "Is NOT" in existence in John's days, but was "about to arise" from the abyss (during the AD 66 Zealot rebellion) and also to "go into destruction" shortly afterwards in AD 70. This is why the disciples asked Christ in Acts 1, "Wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?" because at that time, the Scarlet Beast kingdom of Israel "is NOT" in existence as it once had been before Pompey subjugated Judea as a client kingdom to Rome in 63 BC.

The eighth high priest "king" of the Scarlet Beast was Mattathias ben Theophilus, grandson of Annas. Mattathias was "of the seven" because he was a genealogical descendent of Annas's family line of seven former high priest "kings". And Mattathias the eighth "king" was also given the name of the Scarlet Beast as well, because he was the high priest who was appointed in AD 66. Mattathias served as the titular head of the Scarlet Beast when the Zealot rebellion in AD 66 revived the independent kingdom of Israel once again that year. The Revelation 17:11 language fits the high priest Mattathias as the eighth "king" exactly.

But it was not known under such "name" as widely as Rome. Ancient Jerusalem was not literally built on seven distinct hills in the clear, consistent sense that Rome was.

God spoke of Jerusalem in Psalms 125:2. "As the mountains surround Jerusalem, So the Lord surrounds His people from this time forth and forever." This predates Rome's reputation for sitting on its own set of seven hills later on.

 

[IndianaRob]

​

Reading more surrounding verses shows more context.
Earlier Jesus sends out His disciples just to those of Israel, gentiles specifically excluded.

Matthew 10
5 These twelve Jesus sent out and commanded them, saying: “Do not go into the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter a city of the Samaritans. 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven [c]is at hand.’ 8 Heal the sick, [d]cleanse the lepers, [e]raise the dead, cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give. 9 Provide neither gold nor silver nor copper in your money belts, 10 nor bag for your journey, nor two tunics, nor sandals, nor staffs; for a worker is worthy of his food.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
But then a switch, where it talks about enduring to the end, Jesus is talking of bearing witness to the gentiles, and the things that will happen up to the end of this world. While some of these things did happen in the first century, more of them happened in the centuries following, and still are happening today

Specifically
v23, shows cities in the land of Israel will also be evangelized right up until the very end of the world.
v26, reveals the coming Day of judgement, when secrets out of men's hearts will be revealed.

This is how I think about these verses.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Matthew 10
16 “Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves. Therefore be wise as serpents and harmless[f] as doves. 17 But beware of men, for they will deliver you up to councils and scourge you in their synagogues. 18 You will be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. 19 But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; 20 for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.

21 “Now brother will deliver up brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. 22 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved. 23 When they persecute you in this city, flee to another. For assuredly, I say to you, you will not have gone through the cities of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

24 “A disciple is not above his teacher, nor a servant above his master. 25 It is enough for a disciple that he be like his teacher, and a servant like his master. If they have called the master of the house [g]Beelzebub, how much more will they call those of his household! 26 Therefore do not fear them. For there is nothing covered that will not be revealed, and hidden that will not be known.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Romans 2
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

I don’t see how that could be future when Jesus is talking to the twelve disciples saying “you (12 disciples) will not have gone to the cities of Israel before the son of man be come”?

What Jesus said to the disciples is like me saying “Scott before you finish responding to this post, the son of man will return”.

​

Reading more surrounding verses shows more context.
Earlier Jesus sends out His disciples just to those of Israel, gentiles specifically excluded.

Matthew 10
5 These twelve Jesus sent out and commanded them, saying: “Do not go into the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter a city of the Samaritans. 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven [c]is at hand.’ 8 Heal the sick, [d]cleanse the lepers, [e]raise the dead, cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give. 9 Provide neither gold nor silver nor copper in your money belts, 10 nor bag for your journey, nor two tunics, nor sandals, nor staffs; for a worker is worthy of his food.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
But then a switch, where it talks about enduring to the end, Jesus is talking of bearing witness to the gentiles, and the things that will happen up to the end of this world. While some of these things did happen in the first century, more of them happened in the centuries following, and still are happening today

Specifically
v23, shows cities in the land of Israel will also be evangelized right up until the very end of the world.
v26, reveals the coming Day of judgement, when secrets out of men's hearts will be revealed.

This is how I think about these verses.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Matthew 10
16 “Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves. Therefore be wise as serpents and harmless[f] as doves. 17 But beware of men, for they will deliver you up to councils and scourge you in their synagogues. 18 You will be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. 19 But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; 20 for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.

21 “Now brother will deliver up brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. 22 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved. 23 When they persecute you in this city, flee to another. For assuredly, I say to you, you will not have gone through the cities of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

24 “A disciple is not above his teacher, nor a servant above his master. 25 It is enough for a disciple that he be like his teacher, and a servant like his master. If they have called the master of the house [g]Beelzebub, how much more will they call those of his household! 26 Therefore do not fear them. For there is nothing covered that will not be revealed, and hidden that will not be known.

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Romans 2
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

I can’t ignore these very plain, easy-to-understand words. How is there any ambiguity in that statement? There isn’t. And there is not one single verse in the Bible that contradicts another.

The best approach is to hold to what is 100% clear and then consider how other verses can harmonize with it. That’s what I did, and I’m glad I did, because the truth turned out to be so much better than what I had been taught in my Southern Baptist church.

Matthew 10:23 (KJV)
“But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.”

 

[Scott Downey]

I don’t see how that could be future when Jesus is talking to the twelve disciples saying “you (12 disciples) will not have gone to the cities of Israel before the son of man be come”?

What Jesus said to the disciples is like me saying “Scott before you finish responding to this post, the son of man will return”.

I can’t ignore these very plain, easy-to-understand words. How is there any ambiguity in that statement? There isn’t. And there is not one single verse in the Bible that contradicts another.

The best approach is to hold to what is 100% clear and then consider how other verses can harmonize with it. That’s what I did, and I’m glad I did, because the truth turned out to be so much better than what I had been taught in my Southern Baptist church.

Matthew 10:23 (KJV)
“But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.”

Often there is a dual message in prophetic scripture, near term application and far off in the future.

 

[Truth7t7]

How does Scripture define bodies? Are you aware the Church is referred to as "the body of Christ"?

It talks about "Dead Bodies" laying in a street where Jesus was crucified, that doesn't equate to the church being dead in a street and you know it, your moving into the symbolic allegorical realm of Sci-Fi, your claims could rival the best of stories from pre-millennialist

Your Claim Again: Dead Bodies In A Street Equals "The Church"

Revelation 11:8KJV
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

 

[Truth7t7]

Often there is a dual message in prophetic scripture, near term application and far off in the future.

Often there is only one message and persons change God's words to suit their specific doctrine and belief

For some reason reformed theology and Daniel's AOD Matthew 24:15 being Antiochus Epiphanies in 167BC comes to mind, just another false teaching to put in the waste basket

 

[rwb]

I don’t see how that could be future when Jesus is talking to the twelve disciples saying “you (12 disciples) will not have gone to the cities of Israel before the son of man be come”?

On the day of Pentecost did Christ come to them through His Spirit?

Christ in sending them out to the lost sheep of the house of Israel, instructed them to preach, saying "The Kingdom of heaven is at hand." The message they were sent out to proclaim does not speak of the second coming of Christ that will come on the last day. They and we are instructed to proclaim the gospel of the Kingdom of God that Christ has come with. They and every disciple after them are to go out unto all the nations of the earth showing telling all that hear them the way that all who receive the gospel might know and enter the spiritual Kingdom of God when they are born again, and receive everlasting life through Him.

Matthew 10:5-7 (KJV) These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Matthew 10:20 (KJV) For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

The message the twelve disciples were given to proclaim did not reach all the cities of Israel before the Son of man, through His Spirit had come into them. While Christ was alive, through His power He kept them, but after He departed from this world, they would need and receive power from on high through the Spirit He would send to them. In this way the message through the gospel of the Kingdom of God would grow exponentially and finally be complete when the Son of man shall come again after the Kingdom of God in heaven is complete.

John 15:26-27 (KJV) But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.