IS THE NEW TESTAMENT AND THE NEW COVENANT THE SAME?

[Doug]

[Hebrews 9:15 KJV] 15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions [that were] under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

[Hebrews 12:24 KJV] 24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than [that of] Abel.

There are some of the opinion that a testament and a covenant are the same and interchangeable.
There is a difference between them.
A testament is the last will and is in effect only at the death of the testator.
A covenant is a contract between parties, or a promise made. A covenant does not depend on death.

In both verses Jesus is said to be mediator. Mediator of the new testament and the new covenant, so they conclude that the new testament and the new covenant refer to the same thing, and are interchangeable.

They neglect the fact that Jesus could be the mediator of both the new testament and the new covenant, and they are different.

 

[Muna]

Shows both

diatheke

• a disposition, arrangement, of any sort, which one wishes to be valid, the last disposition which one makes of his earthly possessions after his death, a testament or will
• a compact, a covenant, a testament
  
  1. God's covenant with Noah, etc.
• covenant 20, testament 13

 

[Jay Ross]

If Her 9:15 speaks of a refreshed covenant, then in Heb 12:24, for consistency, it cannot speak about a new covenant.

I would suggest that Heb 12:24 should be understood in this manner.

Hebrews 12:24: - 24 And to Jesus, the new mediator of the covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaks of better things than that of Abel.

Perhaps more work is required by all when considering these two verses.

 

[Muna]

Covenant and testament are used interchangably

Spoken of this way in Hebrews as covenant

Heb.9
[1] Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.

Spoken of this way in Exodus as covenant

Ex 24:7 And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD hath said will we do, and be obedient.
Ex 24:8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

The first covenant is referred to as the first testament

Heb 9
[18] Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
[19] For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,
[20] Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.

Here are both as the new testament and the first testament

Heb 9
[14] How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
[15] And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
[16] For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.

Matt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

The one is done away

Heb 9:17 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

In contrast to one another (tables of stone verses fleshly tables of the earth)

2Cr 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

The ministration of death verses the ministration of life

2 Cr 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance;
which glory was to be done away:

2 Cr 3:8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

The ministration of condemnation and the ministration of righteouesness

2 Cr 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
2 Cr 3:10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
2 Cr 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

Worldly sanctuary, the first covenant

Heb.9
[1] Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.

Heavenly sanctuary

Heb.8
[1] Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens;
[2] A minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.

One serving unto the example and shadow of the true

Heb 8
[5] Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

Mediator of the better covenant, which follows after the first

Heb 8
[6] But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.
[7] For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

New covenant not according to the covenant made with their fathers

Heb 8
[8] For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
[9] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
[10] For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

Written by the Spirit of the living God

2Cr 3
3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

A New covenant made the first old

Heb 8
[11] And every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, (John 6:45 Isaiah 54:1-13, Jerm 31:31-34)
[12] For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
[13] In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

 

[Doug]

Shows both

diatheke

• a disposition, arrangement, of any sort, which one wishes to be valid, the last disposition which one makes of his earthly possessions after his death, a testament or will
• a compact, a covenant, a testament
  
  1. God's covenant with Noah, etc.
• covenant 20, testament 13

Yes testament and covenant are the same greek word but there is a difference in scripture
Testament requires death of the one making the testament to be in effect covenant doesnt require death

 

[Behold]

[Hebrews 9:15 KJV] 15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions [that were] under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

[Hebrews 12:24 KJV] 24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than [that of] Abel.

There are some of the opinion that a testament and a covenant are the same and interchangeable.
There is a difference between them.
A testament is the last will and is in effect only at the death of the testator.
A covenant is a contract between parties, or a promise made. A covenant does not depend on death.

In both verses Jesus is said to be mediator. Mediator of the new testament and the new covenant, so they conclude that the new testament and the new covenant refer to the same thing, and are interchangeable.

They neglect the fact that Jesus could be the mediator of both the new testament and the new covenant, and they are different.

Jesus's sacrfice is the New Covenant, or the "Blood Atonemet"., that is our Salvation.

The NT is a Testimony or a TESTAMENT.... of the New Covenant, as well as the history.

 

[Muna]

Yes testament and covenant are the same greek word but there is a difference in scripture
Testament requires death of the one making the testament to be in effect covenant doesnt require death

There was blood in the first covenant

Exodus 24:8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

The blood of Christ in the new coveant.

You believe the shedding of blood of the animals in the first lived?

Like bled out but they patched them up with bandaids?

 

[Doug]

Jesus's sacrfice is the New Covenant, or the "Blood Atonemet"., that is our Salvation.

The NT is a Testimony or a TESTAMENT.... of the New Covenant, as well as the history.

That the blood of Christ was also applied to us is a mystery revealed by Christ thru Paul
The new testament blood ,not covenant, was applied to us

 

[Doug]

There was blood in the first covenant

Exodus 24:8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

The blood of Christ in the new coveant.

You believe the shedding of blood of the animals in the first lived?

Like bled out but they patched them up with bandaids?

There was sometimes blood to ratify a covenant and a testament
The new testament and new covenant are dependent upon each other
The new testament shed blood for the remission of sins was needed for God to forgive the sins of Israel in the new covenant

 

[Muna]

There was sometimes blood to ratify a covenant and a testament
The new testament and new covenant are dependent upon each other
The new testament shed blood for the remission of sins was needed for God to forgive the sins of Israel in the new covenant

Testament blood

Matt.26
[28] For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Mark.14
[24] And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
Luke.22
[20] Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.
1Cor.11
[25] After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.
Heb.9
[18] Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
[20] Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.

Covenant blood

Exod.24
[8] And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.
Ezek.44
[7] In that ye have brought into my sanctuary strangers, uncircumcised in heart, and uncircumcised in flesh, to be in my sanctuary, to pollute it, even my house, when ye offer my bread, the fat and the blood, and they have broken my covenant because of all your abominations.
Zech.9
[11] As for thee also, by the blood of thy covenant I have sent forth thy prisoners out of the pit wherein is no water.
Heb.10
[29] Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Heb.12
[24] And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
Heb.13
[20] Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

 

[Doug]

Testament blood

Matt.26
[28] For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Mark.14
[24] And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
Luke.22
[20] Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.
1Cor.11
[25] After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.
Heb.9
[18] Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
[20] Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.

Covenant blood

Exod.24
[8] And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.
Ezek.44
[7] In that ye have brought into my sanctuary strangers, uncircumcised in heart, and uncircumcised in flesh, to be in my sanctuary, to pollute it, even my house, when ye offer my bread, the fat and the blood, and they have broken my covenant because of all your abominations.
Zech.9
[11] As for thee also, by the blood of thy covenant I have sent forth thy prisoners out of the pit wherein is no water.
Heb.10
[29] Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Heb.12
[24] And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
Heb.13
[20] Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

Sorry but what are you trying to say

 

[Muna]

Sorry but what are you trying to say

You said in post #5

Yes testament and covenant are the same greek word but there is a difference in scripture
Testament requires death of the one making the testament to be in effect covenant doesnt require death

In post # 10 it shows blood for both in OT and NT between them (whether covenant or testament is shown).

Blood meant somethings death (whether the blood of beasts or a man)

 

[Doug]

You said in post #5

Yes testament and covenant are the same greek word but there is a difference in scripture
Testament requires death of the one making the testament to be in effect covenant doesnt require death

In post # 10 it shows blood for both in OT and NT between them (whether covenant or testament is shown).

Blood meant blood required death (whether the blood of beasts or a man)

A testament is not in force until the death of the testator but can be dedicated with blood
A covenant does not require death nor always blood

 

[Muna]

A testament is not in force until the death of the testator but can be dedicated with blood
A covenant does not require death nor always blood

The sprinkling of blood of the covenant shown in the OT

Ex 24:8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

The sprinkling of blood of the new covenant in the NT

Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

Which is the the blood of Christ of the new testament in the NT

Matt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Whereupon (blood) even the first testament was dedicated

Heb 9:18 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.

The blood is shown in both, covenant or testament, in OT and in NT

Blood would mean that something (whether beast or man) needed to die in order for its blood to be sprinkled between the two of them.

 

[LoveYeshua]

When we read that Jesus is the mediator of the new covenant and also the mediator of the new testament, we must see that Scripture speaks of two connected but not identical truths. A covenant is a binding promise or agreement between God and His people. From the beginning God made covenants, such as with Noah, Abraham, and Israel at Sinai. These covenants were living agreements based on obedience and faith. A testament, on the other hand, is like a will, which only becomes effective after the death of the one who made it. This is why Hebrews explains that the new testament came into force through the death of Christ, because only by His blood could the promised inheritance be given to those who are called.

So when Hebrews 9:15 speaks of Jesus as the mediator of the new testament, it points to His death, through which the inheritance of eternal life becomes ours. A testament requires the death of the testator, and in this case, Jesus gave His life so that what He promised could be received by those who belong to Him. But when Hebrews 12:24 speaks of Jesus as the mediator of the new covenant, it is showing that He also stands between God and man as the one who brings a better covenant than the old one at Sinai. That old covenant was sealed with the blood of animals, but this new one is sealed with His own blood that speaks better things than the blood of Abel. Abel’s blood cried out for justice, but the blood of Jesus cries out for mercy and forgiveness.

The mistake is when people say the covenant and the testament are the same thing, and therefore interchangeable. The Word of God shows they are not the same, though they are joined in Christ. He is the one who gave His life to establish the testament of our inheritance, and He is also the one who mediates the covenant of mercy and life between God and His people. To deny the difference is to miss the fullness of what His sacrifice means. Through His death He gave us the right to the inheritance, and through His life and priesthood He continues to mediate the covenant that reconciles us to God.

 

[Doug]

The sprinkling of blood of the covenant shown in the OT

Ex 24:8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

The sprinkling of blood of the new covenant in the NT

Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

Which is the the blood of Christ of the new testament in the NT

Matt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Whereupon (blood) even the first testament was dedicated

Heb 9:18 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.

The blood is shown in both, covenant or testament, in OT and in NT

Blood would mean that something (whether beast or man) needed to die in order for its blood to be sprinkled between the two of them.

[Heb 9:18, 22 KJV] 18 Whereupon neither the first [testament] was dedicated without blood. ... 22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
[Mat 26:28 KJV] 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

[Exo 24:8 KJV] 8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled [it] on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.
[Heb 12:24 KJV] 24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than [that of] Abel.

The first testament was animal sacrifices and was dedicated with blood
The first covenant as well

I think it is because the blood in the first testament and the first covenant pictured the blood of Christ shed for the new covenant and new testament........remmission of sins is found in both and require blood

 

[Muna]

[Heb 9:18, 22 KJV] 18 Whereupon neither the first [testament] was dedicated without blood. ... 22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
[Mat 26:28 KJV] 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

[Exo 24:8 KJV] 8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled [it] on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.
[Heb 12:24 KJV] 24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than [that of] Abel.

The first testament was animal sacrifices and was dedicated with blood
The first covenant as well

I think it is because the blood in the first testament and the first covenant pictured the blood of Christ shed for the new covenant and new testament........remmission of sins is found in both and require blood

Yeah, there was blood in both, requiring somethings death.

In the first there is this reocurring theme that whenever anyone sin you must kill a beast (again and again). In contrast to Jesus Christ (the lamb of God) who was offered just once, Who "taketh away" the sin of the world. It does say that it was not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins, but rather, that in those sacrifices we are told there is actually a remembrance again made of sins every year.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

[Hebrews 9:15 KJV] 15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions [that were] under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

[Hebrews 12:24 KJV] 24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than [that of] Abel.

There are some of the opinion that a testament and a covenant are the same and interchangeable.
There is a difference between them.
A testament is the last will and is in effect only at the death of the testator.
A covenant is a contract between parties, or a promise made. A covenant does not depend on death.

In both verses Jesus is said to be mediator. Mediator of the new testament and the new covenant, so they conclude that the new testament and the new covenant refer to the same thing, and are interchangeable.

They neglect the fact that Jesus could be the mediator of both the new testament and the new covenant, and they are different.

Sorry but they are the same.

But elaborate on the hows they are different to support your conclusion.