Is it possible to lose salvation?

[GodsGrace]

No he wasnt because he wasnt preaching sola fide. It as if you people stop thinking when you get "saved". Do you know what the word sufficient means? None of you seem to

nedsk
Sorry but Augustine was heretical.
Want to go down the list?
Do you know that Calvin based his teachings on Augustine's writings?
Do you know that Augustine based his beliefs on the fact that he was so guilt ridden due to his previous life?

I know he's a brain and a church doctor....
but he was an gnostic and brought many of his ideas with him into the CC...10 year's worth.

When I was studying with a Catholic friar a lesson finally came up about Augustine.
He knew the reasons why I don't care for Augustine.
The day he did the lesson I was home sick. My friend said that the friar said that it was good that I wasn't there that day!

Anyway...just some thoughts you might want to look into.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

And whatever made you THINK that Catholics believe man is saved by his works??

There is NO FAITH ALONE at any time.
Paul said his faith is worhless if he doesn't have LOVE.

Add just ONE THING to faith...
and it is no longer faith alone.

1 Corinthians 13:1
1 If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal.


Thanks for posting in favor of the CC !


Thanks again!

We are saved by FAITH ALONE....

but then comes the rest of the story.

We're saved by the grace of God.

 

[GodsGrace]

Man is saved through faith and not by works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9); yet genuine faith is (evidenced) by works. (James 2:14-24) Man is saved through faith "apart from the merit of works" yet genuine faith does not remain "apart from the presence of works."

*Jesus Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works. (Romans 3:24-28; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9)

It is through faith "in Jesus Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 4:5-6; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies does not remain alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine. (James 2:14-24) *Perfect Harmony*

Here's your problem Dan.
You can't seem to distinguish between
ONLY FAITH
and
FAITH ALONE

Faith Alone TODAY does not mean what it ALWAYS has.

Today FAITH ALONE means that we don't have to do ANYTHING after salvation.
That is what it means.
I wish you would understand this.
It's a calvinist teaching....
SOLA FIDE

along with the other solas.

 

[GodsGrace]

We're saved by the grace of God.

What else could it be?

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

What else could it be?

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.

That's right. God gives us everything. Faith ,eternal life,eternal salvation.

 

[GodsGrace]

That's right. God gives us everything. Faith ,eternal life,eternal salvation.

Agreed.
Eternal salvation for as long as we want it.
Some decide to leave the faith.

 

[KUWN]

And without works no one is saved. Faith doesn't cause works. Works are a free act of the will. If faith was sufficient there would be no need to ever mention works. Nice try though. Id give you an A-

Would you mind providing me with 2 passages that imply works goes with faith for salvation?

 

[ProverbsInPink]

Agreed.
Eternal salvation for as long as we want it.
Some decide to leave the faith.

That doesn't mean God leaves them or that they lost his saving grace.

 

[GodsGrace]

Would you mind providing me with 2 passages that imply works goes with faith for salvation?

KUWN
I'll let nedsk reply,,,but your question does imply a misunderstanding of the Catholic position on salvation of the person.
I DO wonder at the source of this incorrect belief.

 

[GodsGrace]

That doesn't mean God leaves them or that they lost his saving grace.

??
I never said God leaves anyone.

I said that some persons decide to leave God.
IF someone leaves God, he is back in the same situation he was in BEFORE salvation...
he becomes lost.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

??
I never said God leaves anyone.

I said that some persons decide to leave God.
IF someone leaves God, he is back in the same situation he was in BEFORE salvation...
he becomes lost.

That's not what God says.
Which was my prior point.

 

[GodsGrace]

That's not what God says.
Which was my prior point.

What does God say?

 

[ProverbsInPink]

What does God say?

Study and come back to this forum.

 

[GodsGrace]

Study and come back to this forum.

That's very nice of you Proverbs.
It's wonderful how Christians treat each other.

What do you think the following means?
It was written by Paul.


Colossians 1:21-23
21 And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22 yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach -
23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.


Jesus has reconciled us to God...
IF we CONTINUE in the faith.

Faith is necessary for salvation...
No Faith
No salvation

No matter WHEN it happens.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

That's very nice of you Proverbs.
It's wonderful how Christians treat each other.

It is.
We are all one in Christ.
And as such we know we are eternally Saved. No one will take us from the Fathers hand. And Jesus will not lose a one of us.

If we fall from our faith this does not mean God loses faith in us. It does not mean we revert to our former state.

We Christians know this because it is written.
If we did lose our Salvation and all of those blessings that come upon us as those reborn in Christ it would also be written. But it's not. Because it doesn't happen.

We also know when we encounter those who process an anti-gospel. Those who are described in scripture as making a mockery of Christ and his sacrifice. Implying he'd have to be crucified all over again if we could lose Salvation and then later return to the fold.

Just as Jesus tells us. Those operating in their fallen state,their natural mind,do not understand the things of God.

That doesn't stop them from trying to convince Christians that they do.
We can always tell they don't.

Like when they try to insist Paul agreed if someone loses faith,leaves the fold,they're confined and back in their former fallen state.

Paul never said that. Never could say that. Because it is not of Christ.

What do you think the following means?
It was written by Paul.


Colossians 1:21-23
21 And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22 yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach -
23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.


Jesus has reconciled us to God...
IF we CONTINUE in the faith.

Faith is necessary for salvation...
No Faith
No salvation

No matter WHEN it happens.

Have a good day.

 

[mailmandan]

And scripture say you aren't saved by faith alone and you ignore it. So stop yapping

Scripture says we are saved through faith "apart from additions or modifications" (not faith and works, but not of works) hence faith alone (Ephesians 2:8,9) and justified by faith "apart from additions or modifications" (not faith and works) hence, faith alone. (Romans 5:1)

 

[mailmandan]

You havent explained WHY we need to show it if God sees our and if the works don't matter.

But we aren't tree. Works are a choice. If we don't do there is not salvation. If faith is sufficient then we don't need to show our works and there isn't any reason to even mentions works. It's amazing to watch you people twist in the wind.

I already explained it. You just don't get it.

 

[GodsGrace]

It is.
We are all one in Christ.
And as such we know we are eternally Saved. No one will take us from the Fathers hand. And Jesus will not lose a one of us.

If we fall from our faith this does not mean God loses faith in us. It does not mean we revert to our former state.

We Christians know this because it is written.
If we did lose our Salvation and all of those blessings that come upon us as those reborn in Christ it would also be written. But it's not. Because it doesn't happen.

We also know when we encounter those who process an anti-gospel. Those who are described in scripture as making a mockery of Christ and his sacrifice. Implying he'd have to be crucified all over again if we could lose Salvation and then later return to the fold.

Just as Jesus tells us. Those operating in their fallen state,their natural mind,do not understand the things of God.

That doesn't stop them from trying to convince Christians that they do.
We can always tell they don't.

Like when they try to insist Paul agreed if someone loses faith,leaves the fold,they're confined and back in their former fallen state.

Paul never said that. Never could say that. Because it is not of Christ.


Have a good day.

Before you wish me a good day...

how about providing some scripture to prove your point.
You won't find any.

Because what you're saying is that a person could go back to living a life of sin and still be saved.
If you could post some scripture that states this....it would be helpful to this conversation.

Otherwise, it is only your opinion.
And our personal opinions do not count for much.

And since you think what Paul said could not be of Christ...
perhaps we could see what Jesus said about your incorrect belief:


Matthew 7:24-27
24 "Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock.
25 "And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and yet it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock.
26 "Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.
27 "The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell -and great was its fall."


Jesus is stating that WISE MEN will ACT on His words...
IOW, they will keep His commandments.

FOOLISH MEN will NOT ACT on His words...
IOW, they will not keep His commandments.
These foolish men built their house on SAND and when the rains came
the house FELL.

Jesus said that if we disobey Him we cannot possibly be saved.

Do you believe Jesus?

 

[GodsGrace]

Scripture says we are saved through faith "apart from additions or modifications" (not faith and works, but not of works) hence faith alone (Ephesians 2:8,9) and justified by faith "apart from additions or modifications" (not faith and works) hence, faith alone. (Romans 5:1)

Unfortunately for you Dan...
We are saved FOR GOOD WORKS.

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.


And look, we have another member here that believes a person could ABANDON God and still be saved.
Check out post no. 3676....is this what Christianity has come to? Thanks to those such as yourself who espouse incorrect Christian doctrine. Here's a couple of sentences of something or other:
"We also know when we encounter those who process an anti-gospel. Those who are described in scripture as making a mockery of Christ and his sacrifice. Implying he'd have to be crucified all over again if we could lose Salvation and then later return to the fold."

WHAT does that even mean?

I repeat:

James 3:1
1 Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment.

 

[mailmandan]

Unfortunately for you Dan...
We are saved FOR GOOD WORKS.

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.


And look, we have another member here that believes a person could ABANDON God and still be saved.
Check out post no. 3676....is this what Christianity has come to? Thanks to those such as yourself who espouse incorrect Christian doctrine. Here's a couple of sentences of something or other:
"We also know when we encounter those who process an anti-gospel. Those who are described in scripture as making a mockery of Christ and his sacrifice. Implying he'd have to be crucified all over again if we could lose Salvation and then later return to the fold."

WHAT does that even mean?

I repeat:

James 3:1
1 Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment.

Saved FOR good works (Ephesians 2:10) is not the same as saved BY good works.