Doctrine of Predestination

[brightfame52]

Lets please look at Eph 1:5

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Unto the adoption of Children or the placing as a Son.

Paul writes in Gal 3:26

For ye are all the children/sons of God by faith in Christ Jesus

This therefore tells us that Faith in Christ Jesus, which reveals ones Son-ship with God comes as a result of having been predestinated unto the adoption of Sons.

So Faith in Christ is a blessing of predestination ! And yet many so called believers don't even believe in predestination ! 1

 

[brightfame52]

So those who don't get saved... God decided to not predestine them and they go to hell because God decided to create them for no other purpose than to go to hell?

Yes the non elect were created by God for the purpose of being made vessels of wrath fitted for destruction. It's also for His own Glory!

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Yes the non elect were created by God for the purpose of being made vessels of wrath fitted for destruction.

How do you know that YOU are one of the ones God decided will go to heLL???

You are teaching false doctrine from that murderer John Calvin who got it from the heretic Augustine

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Limited Atonement is FALSE Doctrine
It is in fact DOCTRINES OF DEVILS

Romans 8:29,30
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

NOTE - Romans 8:29,30 is not saying all are automatically saved which would be the false doctrine of universalism, but rather is teaching us that God has in fact provided opportunity for all to be saved which is evident in the scripture references below

Romans 5:17,18
For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.
Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

NOTE - Romans 5:17,18 is clearly telling us that the free gift came upon all men agreeing with Titus 2:11,12

Ephesians 5:1
Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children

Romans 1:19-21
Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Titus 2:11,12
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to ALL men,
Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

1 John 2:2
Jesus is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance.

1 Timothy 2:1-4
I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior;
Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2 Corinthians 5:19,20
To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto Himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth ALL men every where to repent:

John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.

Hebrews 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that He by the grace of God should taste death for EVERY man.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave His only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 12:3
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

 

[One 2 question]

NOTE - Romans 8:29,30 is not saying all are automatically saved which would be the false doctrine of universalism, but rather is teaching us that God has in fact provided opportunity for all to be saved which is evident in the scripture references below

Aren't there 2 events, 2 purposes, 2 kingdoms, 2 groups of redeemed beings?

Event 1. One kingdom with one purpose involving 1 group of beings = Jesus's kingdom of 1 age of 1000 years. With the purpose of restoring all things on earth. Involving those Jesus redeems from every tongue, tribe people and nation, chosen, called, predestined, elected to carry out their role as king/priest.

Event 2. The Father's kingdom with the purpose of restoring and completing the rest of creation, all the other planets that are groaning having been subjected to decay. This will require every being the Creator has brought into existence. Therefore according to His eternal purpose and will, ALL will be saved, including those in the lake of fire (those not chosen to participate in the first event).

 

[One 2 question]

Limited Atonement is FALSE Doctrine
It is in fact DOCTRINES OF DEVILS

Romans 8:29,30
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

NOTE - Romans 8:29,30 is not saying all are automatically saved which would be the false doctrine of universalism, but rather is teaching us that God has in fact provided opportunity for all to be saved which is evident in the scripture references below

Romans 5:17,18
For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.
Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

NOTE - Romans 5:17,18 is clearly telling us that the free gift came upon all men agreeing with Titus 2:11,12

Ephesians 5:1
Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children

Romans 1:19-21
Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Titus 2:11,12
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to ALL men,
Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

1 John 2:2
Jesus is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance.

1 Timothy 2:1-4
I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior;
Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2 Corinthians 5:19,20
To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto Himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth ALL men every where to repent:

John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.

Hebrews 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that He by the grace of God should taste death for EVERY man.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave His only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 12:3
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

If atonement is limited then it is only for a limited time and for a limited purpose.

Then these limitations will be lifted and removed so that everyone will repent and experience atonement and all the benefits which come from that. Redemption and reconciliation, mercy and grace, peace and joy, a relationship with their Creators Divine Father and Son.

 

[brightfame52]

How do you know that YOU are one of the ones God decided will go to heLL???

If I were you I would worry about myself

 

[brightfame52]

That Faith in Christ is a blessing of Gods predestination is seen when we consider this blessed promise Rom 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

This is a promise that the Just shall live by Faith This statement is in future indicative , indicating that something will certainly occur in the future. Now what makes it certain ? Gods predestination. Remember some had been predestinated to the adoption of children/sons which is manifested by Faith in Christ !

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Is it's like when Paul said, But to the rest I, not the Lord, say: If any brother has a wife who does not believe....
Now about virgins: I have no command from the Lord, but I give a judgment as one who by the Lord’s mercy is trustworthy. Because of the present crisis, I think that it is good.....
In my judgment, she is happier if she stays.....

Exactly. And Paul didn't say God does not allow a women to speak. Paul said, I don't allow a woman to speak.

 

[One 2 question]

So those who don't get saved... God decided to not predestine them and they go to hell because God decided to create them for no other purpose than to go to hell? This is what the devil people that follow John Calvin teach.

Have you seen the scriptures where the Lord says ALL are called unto salvation??

And have you seen in God's Word WHY some do not get saved???

All are predestined for Father's kingdom. But not all are chosen to reign as king priests in Jesus preceding kingdom. Yes, all will be saved eventually. But before that only some will enjoy the fantastic experience of joining the President and King on His global mission.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Paul said, I don't allow a woman to speak.

And the Lord authorized that to be put in to His Canon.

Reckon the Lord allowed statements and teachings He does not agree with to be put in to His Word?

That would be claiming the Lord authorized false doctrine to be a part of His Word.

If I were you I would worry about myself

Well you're not me so you should still be worried about yourself.

That false doctrine you're following is leading you someplace you do not want to go.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

If God actually decided only a few would be saved and all others are to be assigned to hell, this would not even be in God's Word because "the just shall live by faith" is a call to action that holds the person accountable to actually live by faith.

Romans 6:16
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

 

[brightfame52]

Well you're not me so you should still be worried about yourself.

Well mind your own business this thread is about predestination

 

[brightfame52]

If God actually decided only a few would be saved and all others are to be assigned to hell, this would not even be in God's Word because "the just shall live by faith" is a call to action that holds the person accountable to actually live by faith.

Romans 6:16
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

You don't make a better sense to me

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Well mind your own business this thread is about predestination

It's in a public forum inviting others to comment.

You should take the conversation private and only allow yes men to participate if you don't want to hear what God's Word says

You don't make a better sense to me

Those following the false doctrines of reformed theology obviously cannot understand God's Word.

Romans 6:16
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

Romans 6:16 is one of many passages that refute limited atonement

 

[brightfame52]

Not only were they predestinated to Faith, but predestinated to be saved They were saved already in the purpose of God before the world began 2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,


Eph 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.1

 

[One 2 question]

Not only were they predestinated to Faith, but predestinated to be saved They were saved already in the purpose of God before the world began 2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,


Eph 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.1

God's personal invitation to each individual chosen person will be responded to and like Noah they will enter the ark of God, Christ. Those who did not enter the ark did not get that personal direct invitation for the Saviour. The ark wasn't large enough for more that God chose. Just male and female of each animal and 8 humans. God had no desire or plan to save any more than that otherwise the ark would've been massive, maybe the size of a country like the USA.

God's purpose determines who and how many will be saved.

 

[brightfame52]

Another scripture that puts forth the truth of faith or believing being the result of predestination is Acts 13:48

48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

This word ordained is tassō

to draw up in order, arrange
Usage: (a) I assign, arrange, (b) I determine; mid: I appoint.
as many as were appointed (A. V.ordained) (by God) to obtain eternal life, or to whom God bad decreed eternal life,

The word ordained here is also synonym to destine !

Now when was eternal life arranged and promised ? Before the world began Titus 1:1-2

Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Promised is closely akin to agreement, arrangement, covenant

The ISV reads:

48 When the gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord. Meanwhile, all who had been destined to eternal life believed

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

For by grace are ye saved through faith

And no faith equals no salvation.

Sure God has called all to be saved, but Jesus said the road that leads to life is narrow and FEW BE THAT FIND IT

Limited Atonement is FALSE Doctrine
It is in fact DOCTRINES OF DEVILS

Romans 8:29,30
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

NOTE - Romans 8:29,30 is not saying all are automatically saved which would be the false doctrine of universalism, but rather is teaching us that God has in fact provided opportunity for all to be saved which is evident in the scripture references below

Romans 5:17,18
For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.
Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

NOTE - Romans 5:17,18 is clearly telling us that the free gift came upon all men agreeing with Titus 2:11,12

Ephesians 5:1
Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children

Romans 1:19-21
Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Titus 2:11,12
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to ALL men,
Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

1 John 2:2
Jesus is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance.

1 Timothy 2:1-4
I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior;
Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2 Corinthians 5:19,20
To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto Himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth ALL men every where to repent:

John 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.

Hebrews 2:9
But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that He by the grace of God should taste death for EVERY man.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave His only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 12:3
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Well mind your own business this thread is about predestination

this False doctrine has been refuted

All of Calvin's doctrine is false