How did the Trinity doctrine develop in the early church?

[Jack]

If you look at God’s character, you see that He challenges and develops people spiritually, and the fact that Jesus grew in wisdom speaks to His agency. You can read Scripture for yourself and observe how God works with those He loves.

It's possible your God grows in wisdom but mine does not...only those who act on his behalf grow in wisdom (agency)

You're denying Jesus is God?

From the CYB Statement of Faith: "We believe that God is the Creator, Sustainer, and Ruler of the universe. We attest that God has eternally existed in three persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. These three are co-equal and are one God. (Genesis 1:1, 26-27, Genesis 3:22, Deuteronomy 6:4, Psalm 90:2, John 1:1, John 10:30, Romans 3:30, II Corinthians 13:14, I Peter 1:2)"

 

[Jack]

The devil likes nothing more than having people believe that he does not exist

That's a fact!

2 Corinthians 11:14
14 Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.

 

[RLT63]

If you look at God’s character, you see that He challenges and develops people spiritually, and the fact that Jesus grew in wisdom speaks to His agency. You can read Scripture for yourself and observe how God works with those He loves.

It's possible your God grows in wisdom but mine does not...only those who act on his behalf grow in wisdom (agency)

Genesis 6:6 (KJV)
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

It is not deceptive. Deception is intentionally causing someone to believe something that is false or misleading.

The shield is a helpful tool that is imperfect. Because no graphical representation or verbal example can represent the mystery of Trinity fully.

That's because it doesn't exist in Scripture. God's telling us that when man tries to put in symbol what does not exist in His Kingdom.
Tritheism is paganism.

 

[RLT63]

List of Pro-Trinity/Deity of Christ Bible Passages - Berean Patriot

Below is a list of basically every verse in the whole bible that touches on the Trinity. I didn’t compile this list, but a reader of this website did and it’s posted here with his permission. (There’s actually a short/cool story behind it.) OR keep reading to get to the list of verses without...

www.bereanpatriot.com

 

[Hiddenthings]

That's a fact!

2 Corinthians 11:14
14 Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.

Yes, the Pharisees pretended to be that which they were not. Plagued Paul's ministry!

 

[RLT63]

Yes, the Pharisees pretended to be that which they were not. Plagued Paul's ministry!

And no marvel; for Satan HIMSELF is transformed into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

 

[Hiddenthings]

And no marvel; for Satan HIMSELF is transformed into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Yes, the context is very clear RLT - you need to read the whole letter to understand who and what the adversary was here.

The Satan in this passage is not a rebel angel but rebellious Jewish adversaries who were undermining Paul’s influence within the Corinthian church (Look up 2 Cor. 10:2, 10–18; 11:3–26). As Paul writes: ‘For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for even Satan—the chief opponent—disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is not surprising if his servants, his misguided supporters, also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness’ (vv. 13–15, RSV). This same adversary is mentioned earlier in 2 Corinthians 2:11: ‘Lest Satan should get an advantage of us, for we are not ignorant of his devices

Sorry, RLT—this is one of those doctrines where the more you try to prove it, the deeper into error you end up going

 

[RLT63]

Yes, the context is very clear RLT - you need to read the whole letter to understand who and what the adversary was here.

The Satan in this passage is not a rebel angel but rebellious Jewish adversaries who were undermining Paul’s influence within the Corinthian church (Look up 2 Cor. 10:2, 10–18; 11:3–26). As Paul writes: ‘For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for even Satan—the chief opponent—disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is not surprising if his servants, his misguided supporters, also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness’ (vv. 13–15, RSV). This same adversary is mentioned earlier in 2 Corinthians 2:11: ‘Lest Satan should get an advantage of us, for we are not ignorant of his devices

Sorry, RLT—this is one of those doctrines where the more you try to prove it, the deeper into error you end up going

"this is one of those doctrines where the more you try to prove it, the deeper into error you end up going"
That's exactly what you're doing.
Do you go to a Church that teaches this or is this something you have come up with on your own?

 

[Hiddenthings]

"this is one of those doctrines where the more you try to prove it, the deeper into error you end up going"
That's exactly what you're doing

The issue is that you’re not considering the context of the passage, but instead overlaying your own assumptions onto the text.

The adversaries here are false teachers who pretend to messengers of light.

 

[Hiddenthings]

@RLT63

Here is the context of the letter - read carefully! The adversaries of Paul were human not invisible evil angels LOL

2 Corinthians 3:1
Are we beginning to commend ourselves again? Or do we need, as some do, letters of recommendation to you, or from you?

2 Corinthians 10:2
I beg of you that when I am present I may not have to show boldness with such confidence as I count on showing against some who suspect us of walking according to the flesh.

2 Corinthians 10:3
For though we walk in the flesh, we are not waging war according to the flesh.

2 Corinthians 10:10
For they say, “His letters are weighty and strong, but his bodily presence is weak, and his speech of no account.”

2 Corinthians 10:12
Not that we dare to classify or compare ourselves with some of those who are commending themselves. But when they measure themselves by one another and compare themselves with one another, they are without understanding.

2 Corinthians 10:17
“Let the one who boasts, boast in the Lord.”

2 Corinthians 10:18
For it is not the one who commends himself who is approved, but the one whom the Lord commends.

2 Corinthians 11:3
But I am afraid that as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts will be led astray from a sincere and pure devotion to Christ.

2 Corinthians 11:4
For if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it readily enough.

2 Corinthians 11:18
Since many boast according to the flesh, I too will boast.

2 Corinthians 11:19
For you gladly bear with fools, being wise yourselves!

2 Corinthians 11:20
For you bear it if someone makes slaves of you, or devours you, or takes advantage of you, or puts on airs, or strikes you in the face.

2 Corinthians 11:21–23
To my shame, I must say, we were too weak for that! But whatever anyone else dares to boast of—I am speaking as a fool—I also dare to boast of that. Are they Hebrews? So am I. Are they Israelites? So am I. Are they offspring of Abraham? So am I. Are they servants of Christ? I am a better one—I am talking like a madman—with far greater labors, far more imprisonments, with countless beatings, and often near death.

 

[RLT63]

@RLT63

Here is the context of the letter - read carefully! The adversaries of Paul were human not invisible evil angels LOL

2 Corinthians 3:1
Are we beginning to commend ourselves again? Or do we need, as some do, letters of recommendation to you, or from you?

2 Corinthians 10:2
I beg of you that when I am present I may not have to show boldness with such confidence as I count on showing against some who suspect us of walking according to the flesh.

2 Corinthians 10:3
For though we walk in the flesh, we are not waging war according to the flesh.

2 Corinthians 10:10
For they say, “His letters are weighty and strong, but his bodily presence is weak, and his speech of no account.”

2 Corinthians 10:12
Not that we dare to classify or compare ourselves with some of those who are commending themselves. But when they measure themselves by one another and compare themselves with one another, they are without understanding.

2 Corinthians 10:17
“Let the one who boasts, boast in the Lord.”

2 Corinthians 10:18
For it is not the one who commends himself who is approved, but the one whom the Lord commends.

2 Corinthians 11:3
But I am afraid that as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts will be led astray from a sincere and pure devotion to Christ.

2 Corinthians 11:4
For if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it readily enough.

2 Corinthians 11:18
Since many boast according to the flesh, I too will boast.

2 Corinthians 11:19
For you gladly bear with fools, being wise yourselves!

2 Corinthians 11:20
For you bear it if someone makes slaves of you, or devours you, or takes advantage of you, or puts on airs, or strikes you in the face.

2 Corinthians 11:21–23
To my shame, I must say, we were too weak for that! But whatever anyone else dares to boast of—I am speaking as a fool—I also dare to boast of that. Are they Hebrews? So am I. Are they Israelites? So am I. Are they offspring of Abraham? So am I. Are they servants of Christ? I am a better one—I am talking like a madman—with far greater labors, far more imprisonments, with countless beatings, and often near death.

This doesn't help your case. Do you go to a Church that teaches there is no devil or is this something you have concluded on your own?

 

[RLT63]

This doesn't help your case. Do you go to a Church that teaches there is no devil or is this something you have concluded on your own?

Ephesians 6:12 (KJV)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places].

 

[Hiddenthings]

This doesn't help your case. Do you go to a Church that teaches there is no devil or is this something you have concluded on your own?

The reason you can’t identify your creature is that the first-century churches knew exactly who their enemy was—the same people who crucified the Lord and were seeking to imprison and kill many believers.

You just don't have any evidence RLT....and I do!

 

[Hiddenthings]

Ephesians 6:12 (KJV)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places].

Again, you keep posting verses which speak of the evil spiritual rulers of their time. Christ has more than shown who and what those powers were and you seem to want to create your own back story!

Ephesians 4:14
Paul warns the ecclesia not to be misled by deceptive teachers: “So that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning, by craftiness in deceitful schemes.”

Ephesians 5:6 A direct warning about false words and empty teaching: “Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.”

3. Ephesians 6:11–12 Paul warns about “schemes” that oppose the believers this includes false teaching: “Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the schemes of the devil.(false accusers)”

I don't understand why you would invent false notions and overlay them as truth when the truth is clearly defined for you.

Makes no sense!

 

[Hiddenthings]

So obvious it hurts to watch you stumble around in the dark.

 

[RLT63]

So obvious it hurts to watch you stumble around in the dark.

You really need to get over yourself

 

[RLT63]

Again, you keep posting verses which speak of the evil spiritual rulers of their time. Christ has more than shown who and what those powers were and you seem to want to create your own back story!

Ephesians 4:14
Paul warns the ecclesia not to be misled by deceptive teachers: “So that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning, by craftiness in deceitful schemes.”

Ephesians 5:6 A direct warning about false words and empty teaching: “Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.”

3. Ephesians 6:11–12 Paul warns about “schemes” that oppose the believers this includes false teaching: “Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the schemes of the devil.(false accusers)”

I don't understand why you would invent false notions and overlay them as truth when the truth is clearly defined for you.

Makes no sense!

Ephesians 6:11–12 Paul warns about “schemes” that oppose the believers this includes false teaching: “Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the schemes of the devil.(false accusers)”
You added false accusers, now you are adding to the Word of God. Revelation warns us not to do that

 

[Jack]

The reason you can’t identify your creature is that the first-century churches knew exactly who their enemy was—the same people who crucified the Lord and were seeking to imprison and kill many believers.

You just don't have any evidence RLT....and I do!

So, do you or don't you believe the Devil is real? Do you believe Jesus is God? Do you believe in Hell Fire? Don't be evasive, again.

 

[Hiddenthings]

You really need to get over yourself

The issue is your inability to read and understand the context of the letter itself let alone how the Apostle uses the word adversary.