Is it possible to lose salvation?

[Muna]

Ephesians 2:10 - For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

Happy Thanksgiving.

Titus 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people,
zealous of good works.

Titus 3:8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.

Happy Thanksgiving to you too

 

[GodsGrace]

@LoveYeshua

Over 4,000 posts!!
I do believe this is the longest thread I've ever seen.
Did the Admin give you a prize??
LOL

 

[LoveYeshua]

@LoveYeshua

Over 4,000 posts!!
I do believe this is the longest thread I've ever seen.
Did the Admin give you a prize??
LOL

only if It reaches 5000!

 

[Muna]

only if I reach 5000!

Hey, The happy thread will still have that beat by 6000, why set your sights so low?

But then again, I guess its actually sad there seems to be no concensus by the first page of things (if you think about it)

 

[Christian Soldier]

Sure, faith first, but works have more merit.

So, now you're putting the cart before the horse and suggesting that salvation is "by works". I'm not suggesting that saved people don't do good works. To the contrary, born again believers are the only ones who's works are accepted as good by God.
The good works of unbelievers are as filthy rags in Gods sight, because they are done with a sinful motive. But the good works which believers do, are done through The Holy Spirit, who leads us into all truth. So God is actually doing good works through His people.

Gods people don't do good works in order to earn our salvation, no we're glad do them because God saved us while we were His enemies.

James 2:18 "But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works".

 

[Christian Soldier]

Posting your opinion with no scripture indicates that your doctrine is based on whatever you decide to think, and not scripture.

And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. John 3:14-17


God loves the unsaved people of the world.

Whoever means whoever, and does not preclude anyone based on nationality.

Yes, agreed "whosoever" does mean whosoever, but the awful truth remains that only those whom God chose before time began and wrote their names in His book of life are given the gift of faith., The rest are not given the gift of faith, so they have no hope of salvation, and they remain ion their condemned sate forever.

I know the truth is awful when we first receive it, but we come to love the truth as we grow.
Here are some verses of scripture to help you accept God Word as it is. I appreciate it may taste like bitter medicine, but that's to be expected.

Romans 8:29-30: This passage discusses those whom God foreknew, predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, called, justified, and glorified.
Romans 8:33: Mentions God's elect and God as the one who justifies them.

• Romans 9:11-13: Refers to God's purpose according to election, not based on works but on His call, citing the example of Jacob and Esau.
• Romans 9:15-16: States that God has mercy and compassion on whomever He chooses, highlighting that it is not based on human will or effort.
• Romans 11:5: Speaks of a remnant according to the election of grace.
• Ephesians 1:4-6: Describes God choosing believers in Christ before the world's foundation, predestining them for adoption according to His good pleasure and grace.
• Ephesians 1:11: States that in Christ, believers have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to God's purpose and will.
• Matthew 22:14: Notes that many are called, but few are chosen.
• John 6:37: Asserts that all whom the Father gives to Jesus will come to Him.
• John 15:16: Jesus tells His disciples that they did not choose Him, but He chose them and appointed them to bear fruit.
• Acts 13:48: Records that as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.
• Colossians 3:12: Addresses believers as the elect of God.
• 1 Thessalonians 1:4: Mentions God's election of the brethren.
• 2 Thessalonians 2:13: Gives thanks because God chose them for salvation from the beginning through sanctification and belief.
• 2 Timothy 1:9: Attributes salvation and a holy calling not to works, but to God's purpose and grace given in Christ before time began.
• Titus 1:1: Paul writes as an apostle according to the faith of God's elect.
• 1 Peter 1:1-2: Refers to believers as elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father.
• 2 Peter 1:10: Encourages believers to make their call and election sure.

 

[JLB]

Romans 9:11-13: Refers to God's purpose according to election, not based on works but on His call, citing the example of Jacob and Esau.

‘Yes election according to purpose not salvation.


The Jews are called the elect for that reason.


They were chosen to be the bloodline lineage of Christ.


God preferred Jacob over Esau to be the lineage of Christ.


Thats the context.


God blessed Esau and gave him and his descendants land just as He did the children of Israel.


God did not “hate“ Esau in the way you mean, anymore that He expects you to literally “hate“ your family.


The Lord wants us to prefer or chose Jesus Christ over our family if it comes down to doing what He tells us to do over what our parents or wife or children want us to do.

 

[MonoBiblical]

So, now you're putting the cart before the horse and suggesting that salvation is "by works".

Salvation is by miracles, not works.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes, agreed "whosoever" does mean whosoever, but the awful truth remains that only those whom God chose before time began and wrote their names in His book of life are given the gift of faith., The rest are not given the gift of faith, so they have no hope of salvation, and they remain ion their condemned sate forever.

I know the truth is awful when we first receive it, but we come to love the truth as we grow.
Here are some verses of scripture to help you accept God Word as it is. I appreciate it may taste like bitter medicine, but that's to be expected.

Romans 8:29-30: This passage discusses those whom God foreknew, predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, called, justified, and glorified.
Romans 8:33: Mentions God's elect and God as the one who justifies them.

• Romans 9:11-13: Refers to God's purpose according to election, not based on works but on His call, citing the example of Jacob and Esau.
• Romans 9:15-16: States that God has mercy and compassion on whomever He chooses, highlighting that it is not based on human will or effort.
• Romans 11:5: Speaks of a remnant according to the election of grace.
• Ephesians 1:4-6: Describes God choosing believers in Christ before the world's foundation, predestining them for adoption according to His good pleasure and grace.
• Ephesians 1:11: States that in Christ, believers have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to God's purpose and will.
• Matthew 22:14: Notes that many are called, but few are chosen.
• John 6:37: Asserts that all whom the Father gives to Jesus will come to Him.
• John 15:16: Jesus tells His disciples that they did not choose Him, but He chose them and appointed them to bear fruit.
• Acts 13:48: Records that as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.
• Colossians 3:12: Addresses believers as the elect of God.
• 1 Thessalonians 1:4: Mentions God's election of the brethren.
• 2 Thessalonians 2:13: Gives thanks because God chose them for salvation from the beginning through sanctification and belief.
• 2 Timothy 1:9: Attributes salvation and a holy calling not to works, but to God's purpose and grace given in Christ before time began.
• Titus 1:1: Paul writes as an apostle according to the faith of God's elect.
• 1 Peter 1:1-2: Refers to believers as elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father.
• 2 Peter 1:10: Encourages believers to make their call and election sure.

2 Peter 1:10 Your verse....
How does one make their call and election sure IF it's God that will make him persevere till the end because he is an "elected" one?

In your belief system,,,don't you believe that you WILL persevere till the end?

 

[GodsGrace]

Hey, The happy thread will still have that beat by 6000, why set your sights so low?

But then again, I guess its actually sad there seems to be no concensus by the first page of things (if you think about it)

The Happy Threads and the Derail Threads are always very long...so I don't count them.

Consensus?
No consensus.

I think you saw my post on the definition of "Christian".
Forget doctrinal issues...we're even losing that!

 

[GodsGrace]

Salvation is by miracles, not works.

What does this mean??

 

[MonoBiblical]

What does this mean??

Miracles save, not faith or works.

 

[GodsGrace]

Miracles save, not faith or works.

LOL
I know....
you said that.

What I'm asking is:
WHAT does this mean?

Ephesians states that our faith saves us.

So apart from the fact that it seems you don't believe Paul....
What do you mean by miracles save?

Do you mean that it's a miracle that anyone is saved??

 

[MonoBiblical]

LOL
I know....
you said that.

What I'm asking is:
WHAT does this mean?

Ephesians states that our faith saves us.

So apart from the fact that it seems you don't believe Paul....
What do you mean by miracles save?

Do you mean that it's a miracle that anyone is saved??

I really doubt Paul said that without an infinitive verb. I believe when God saves, it is a miracle. None are safe.

 

[GodsGrace]

I really doubt Paul said that without an infinitive verb. I believe when God saves, it is a miracle. None are safe.

What is an infinitive verb?

If none are safe,,,then you believe the NT does NOT give instruction on how to be saved?
Then what did Jesus preach during His ministry?
Isn't this what the beatitudes was about?
(finding a precious pearl,etc)

 

[MonoBiblical]

What is an infinitive verb?

If none are safe,,,then you believe the NT does NOT give instruction on how to be saved?
Then what did Jesus preach during His ministry?
Isn't this what the beatitudes was about?
(finding a precious pearl,etc)

It gives instructions on how to save Israel from Rome and tells even Roman god-fears how to do that.
The Beattitudes are prophecies about Israel.

 

[GodsGrace]

It gives instructions on how to save Israel from Rome and tells even Roman god-fears how to do that.
The Beattitudes are prophecies about Israel.

Never heard this before.
So when Jesus said He came to give us a life more abundant...what did He mean?

Not going to debate this...its a bit off the rails. Pretty shocking to be honest.

You believe no one can know theyre saved?

And what about the infinitive verb?
Eph 2:8
Read it in different versions in two languages....same meaning.

 

[MonoBiblical]

And what about the infinitive verb?
Eph 2:8
Read it in different versions in two languages....same meaning.

This verse is definitely talking about a supernatural event.

2:8 τῇ γὰρ χάριτί ἐστε σεσῳσμένοι διὰ τῆς πίστεως· καὶ τοῦτο οὐκ ἐξ ὑμῶν θεοῦ τὸ δῶρον·
Since with a favor we are the ones saved through a trust, and the other such (masc antecendent in grk, σεσῳσμένοι) not from us rather of the God a gift.

Verse 5 preps 8;
Tools

Eph 2:5
Even when we were dead (i.e ones becoming corpses) in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
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Ephesians 2:5 Interlinear
2:5 καὶ ὄντας ἡμᾶς νεκροὺς τοῖς παραπτώμασιν συνεζωοποίησεν τῷ Χριστῷ χάριτί ἐστε σεσῳσμένοι

τοῖς παραπτώμασιν = with blunders, in this case.

We are not as lucky.

 

[Christian Soldier]

‘Yes election according to purpose not salvation.


The Jews are called the elect for that reason.


They were chosen to be the bloodline lineage of Christ.


God preferred Jacob over Esau to be the lineage of Christ.


Thats the context.


God blessed Esau and gave him and his descendants land just as He did the children of Israel.


God did not “hate“ Esau in the way you mean, anymore that He expects you to literally “hate“ your family.


The Lord wants us to prefer or chose Jesus Christ over our family if it comes down to doing what He tells us to do over what our parents or wife or children want us to do.

no, that can't be true because I have given you scriptures which confirm that 'election" only refers to salvation. God only elected His people for salvation only. Naturally God chose His people for the purpose of saving them and transforming the into the image of His Son. So yes there is a very important purpose in Gods choice.

There are many different contexts in which the word "hate" is used in the bible, so we can't use the broad brush and apply it in the same way all the time.

These verses indicate that God's "hate" is a divine opposition to what is contrary to His nature. The Bible includes verses like

Psalm 5:5, "You hate all who do wrong,"
Psalm 11:5, "The wicked and the one who loves violence, His soul hates".
Proverbs 6:16-19 lists specific things the LORD hates, such as a proud look and a lying tongue.
Malachi 1:2-3 mentions, "Jacob I have loved; But Esau I have hated".

I know it's not popular or pleasant to remind folks that God actually hates all who do wrong. We can't make the truth go away, just because we don't like it.

 

[MonoBiblical]

no, that can't be true because I have given you scriptures which confirm that 'election" only refers to salvation. God only elected His people for salvation only. Naturally God chose His people for the purpose of saving them and transforming the into the image of His Son. So yes there is a very important purpose in Gods choice.

There are many different contexts in which the word "hate" is used in the bible, so we can't use the broad brush and apply it in the same way all the time.

These verses indicate that God's "hate" is a divine opposition to what is contrary to His nature. The Bible includes verses like

Psalm 5:5, "You hate all who do wrong,"
Psalm 11:5, "The wicked and the one who loves violence, His soul hates".
Proverbs 6:16-19 lists specific things the LORD hates, such as a proud look and a lying tongue.
Malachi 1:2-3 mentions, "Jacob I have loved; But Esau I have hated".

I know it's not popular or pleasant to remind folks that God actually hates all who do wrong. We can't make the truth go away, just because we don't like it.

Are you sure God has much hate, and very little disregard?