Thank you.
But I have the same desire as the Lord God, that all will be saved, is that wrong, what do you think ?
I have tried to find the Cost of Creation principle on the internet and it returned zero hits, perhaps you can explain what it is.
The challenge in Christianity is not to love Jesus, it's to love Judas.
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Thank you.
But I have the same desire as the Lord God, that all will be saved, is that wrong, what do you think ?
I have tried to find the Cost of Creation principle on the internet and it returned zero hits, perhaps you can explain what it is.
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Who is offered the choice of a dead end?
No one would choose that.
Christians have the idea that people choose destruction and refuse well-being.
It looks like "blame the victim" to me, in order to white wash their horrible view of what they think God is up to.
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Remember Rev. 6:15-16? They cry for the rocks and mountains to fall on them. Take a look at the list of who it is.
Rev. 6:15-16
Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and everyone else, both slave and free, hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16 They called to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us[a] from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb!
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
@St. SteVen
There the story of Lazarus and the rich man. The punch line and purpose of the story is to convey this; 'if they do not believe Moses and the Prophets, they wont believe even if one rose from the dead.'
In the face of empirical evidence, they choose to disregard, disbelieve and reject.
There the story of Lazarus and the rich man. The punch line and purpose of the story is to convey this; 'if they do not believe Moses and the Prophets, they wont believe even if one rose from the dead.'
In the face of empirical evidence, they choose to disregard, disbelieve and reject.
Again, spoken to the Jews.
Isn't there something about all Israel being saved at some point?
Romans 11:25-27 NIV
I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters,
so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part
until the full number of the Gentiles has come in,
26 and in this way[a] all Israel will be saved. As it is written:
“The deliverer will come from Zion;
he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.
27 And this is[b] my covenant with them
when I take away their sins.”[c]
John 1:29 NIV
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said,
“Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!
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Hiddenthings
Well-Known Member
Not wrong at all!
There are many costs which God incurred in creating the earth and making man and women in it.
Can you see the cost here:
Romans 8:22–23 “For we know that the whole creation has been groaning together in the pains of childbirth until now. And not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies.” (Romans 8:22-23, ESV)
How many will be lost to free will and their choice to not draw close to their maker?
What was the greatest cost to God?
God sacrificing His only begotten Son, the Word made flesh (John 1:14), raise up out of man to atone for sin, offering his life as the ultimate sacrifice to reconcile humanity and all of creation to God.
I could write pages and pages on the Cost emotional cost God incurred in basing a creation on free will.
Hiddenthings
Well-Known Member
This warning speaks to a universal truth...God cannot be confined to a box, no matter how large.
While God has the power to save everyone, His righteousness and the gift of free will mean that only a relatively small number, compared to the billions who have lived, will be saved.
Much like adoption, the process is selective!
And not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies." Romans 8:23 (ESV)
Well said.
One step further...
What in your opinion is the key of the book of Jonah ?
Hiddenthings
Well-Known Member
Hiddenthings
Well-Known Member
@ProDeo
In Matthew 12:40, Jesus compares his own death (complete) and resurrection (to immortality) to Jonah’s three days in the belly of the whale:
"For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. (grave also known as hell)" — Matthew 12:40 (ESV)
In Luke 11:30, Jesus also refers to this "sign" as a call to repentance, much like the sign Jonah was to the Ninevites, who had 40 days to repent before destruction came. Jonah 3:4 mentions Jonah's warning to Nineveh:
"Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!" — Jonah 3:4 (ESV)
This can be linked symbolically to the 40 years between Jesus' ministry and the fall of Jerusalem in AD 70, which was another call to repentance.
Jonah’s preaching in Jonah 3:3 lasted three days and led to a significant turning point in Nineveh. Similarly, Mark 8:2 speaks of Jesus’ three days of preaching in the Decapolis, where his message had a profound effect.
In both cases, the three days symbolize a time of intense, effectual preaching that leads to repentance and transformation.
In Matthew 12:40, Jesus compares his own death (complete) and resurrection (to immortality) to Jonah’s three days in the belly of the whale:
"For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. (grave also known as hell)" — Matthew 12:40 (ESV)
In Luke 11:30, Jesus also refers to this "sign" as a call to repentance, much like the sign Jonah was to the Ninevites, who had 40 days to repent before destruction came. Jonah 3:4 mentions Jonah's warning to Nineveh:
"Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!" — Jonah 3:4 (ESV)
This can be linked symbolically to the 40 years between Jesus' ministry and the fall of Jerusalem in AD 70, which was another call to repentance.
Jonah’s preaching in Jonah 3:3 lasted three days and led to a significant turning point in Nineveh. Similarly, Mark 8:2 speaks of Jesus’ three days of preaching in the Decapolis, where his message had a profound effect.
In both cases, the three days symbolize a time of intense, effectual preaching that leads to repentance and transformation.
We know it is God's desire that everyone will repent, God notable sacrificed a part of Himself for that reason.
What if an unbeliever standing in Judgment Before the Great White Throne and begging for mercy, will God relent ?
Isn't that what God always wanted?
God stated a fact -> 40 days -> gone -> no exceptions -> no if you then.... -> nope destruction.
But then -
Jonah 3:10 When God saw what they did, how they turned from their evil way, God relented of the disaster that he had said he would do to them, and he did not do it.
God relented
- Exodus 32:14: "And the LORD relented and did not bring on his people the disaster he had threatened." This happened after Moses interceded for the Israelites.
- Joel 2:13: "...He is gracious and compassionate, slow to anger, abounding in loving devotion. And He relents from sending disaster".
- Amos 7:3 and 7:6: The LORD relented after Amos pleaded for the people, saying, "It shall not be".
Hiddenthings
Well-Known Member
Its a shame Israel didnt learn the sign at the time right Pro? Ad70 was a terrible slaughter!
Hiddenthings
Well-Known Member
Hiddenthings
Well-Known Member
He's coming again but this time on a far grander scale.
“Wicked and adulterous” described a generation marked not only by widespread physical adultery ( 2 Peter 2:14; compare John 8:9) but also by spiritual unfaithfulness toward God (James 4:4; Revelation 2:20–23).
Snatch as many from the fire while we can Pro because the Lion of the Tribe of Judah will roar from Zion!
“Wicked and adulterous” described a generation marked not only by widespread physical adultery ( 2 Peter 2:14; compare John 8:9) but also by spiritual unfaithfulness toward God (James 4:4; Revelation 2:20–23).
Snatch as many from the fire while we can Pro because the Lion of the Tribe of Judah will roar from Zion!
Indeed it was. And the famine during the siege, a mother killing her child and ate.
But punishment here on Earth automatically equals punishment in afterlife ?
Hiddenthings
Well-Known Member
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
It is happening when Jesus returns in the clouds with his mighty angels. It will be a global thing......every eye shall see him....including those who pierced him. What I deduct from 'those that pierced him' is there will be a 'special' resurrection of those people. In any case, that last bit is just conjecture on my part.
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