The deconstructing of the law in the New Testament
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We do indeed turn away from looking to the law. You seem to be struggling with this. Obedience is not gained by looking to the law, it is gained by looking to Christ, and trusting him. The more we look to Christ and trust him, relying on the spirit for our sanctification, the more the fruits of the spirit grow in our lives(Gal5:22) Against that fruit there is no law(verse23) That is the way to live as God desires us to live, and we in our hearts desire to live, for God has put that desire in our hearts and minds. Jesus will be no ones saviour from sin unless they in their heart desire to live as his father wants them to live. You only get a saviour from sin because God has placed his laws in your heart, hence that is the first thing mentioned in the covenant.
Respectfully I see no point in continuing this further, having spent many years on these kinds of websites, I know no one is willing to conceive their personal beliefs could be wrong. But I do have the scriptures on my side, indeed, the core foundation upon which the new covenant stands. Even you brother, know in your mind God does not want you to steal, lie, murder etc, and you would say in your heart you do not want to those things, confirmation of what God said he would do under the new covenant. God bless
Really? if the law was written on the hearts of men at creation Adam and Eve would then have been able to differentiate between good and evil immediately, however, they had to eat the forbidden fruit first to have their eyes opened!
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There is a huge difference between disobeying an instruction of God and having your eyes opened to good and evil
Well according to the bible, and it is very plainly written adam and eve did not know of good and evil until they ate the forbidden fruit, then their eyes were opened, not before. Respectfully, if you don't accept what the bible plainly states on the matter neither will you accept anything I say
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
No Law in the Old Testament, no matter what you want to call them, applies to Christians.
More than that.....the spirit of the Law does not follow into the New Covenant with God.
On the other hand.....nothing about the Old Testament Laws have changed......But they only apply to those that are not in the New Covenant with God. They still apply to the Jews.
And odds are that most of you do not know what the Ten Commandments are. They are in chapter 34 of Exodus not chapter 20.
And the 613 Mosaic Laws that regulated polygamy and selling daughters as sex slaves only apply to the Jews.
And killing women that were raped apply only to the Jews.
And the concept that women are property and are bought as wives only applies to the Jews.
And the Mosaic Laws that apply to war, where non-virgins and children are killed and virgins are raped only apply to Jews.
The dietary Laws only apply to the Jews.
The Law regarding circumcision only applies to Jews.
And the Laws regarding sacrifices only applies to the Jews.
And most of these Laws not even the Jews observe them today. Not even dividing their cattle by color or restriction on engraved images.
More than that.....the spirit of the Law does not follow into the New Covenant with God.
On the other hand.....nothing about the Old Testament Laws have changed......But they only apply to those that are not in the New Covenant with God. They still apply to the Jews.
And odds are that most of you do not know what the Ten Commandments are. They are in chapter 34 of Exodus not chapter 20.
And the 613 Mosaic Laws that regulated polygamy and selling daughters as sex slaves only apply to the Jews.
And killing women that were raped apply only to the Jews.
And the concept that women are property and are bought as wives only applies to the Jews.
And the Mosaic Laws that apply to war, where non-virgins and children are killed and virgins are raped only apply to Jews.
The dietary Laws only apply to the Jews.
The Law regarding circumcision only applies to Jews.
And the Laws regarding sacrifices only applies to the Jews.
And most of these Laws not even the Jews observe them today. Not even dividing their cattle by color or restriction on engraved images.
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Accept what I have shown you from the bible, then I will address your question
Do you accept the bible states their eyes were only opened to good and evil once they had eaten the apple, not before?
On that I agree. You can say they sinned by eating the apple in respect of being disobedient to God, however, the biblical definition of sin, as you know is transgression of the law(or the main definition.
Of course he knew it was wrong, but that is a whole different ball game to becoming aware of good and evil in a general sense.
You're trying really hard aren't you. He knew it was wrong, but he didn't know of sin in a general sense until his eyes were opened did he. He didn't feel ashamed of being naked until his eyes were opened. And however hard you try, it was only once he ate the apple he was aware of good and evil in a general sense. A child would know it is wrong to disobey their parents, but they wouldnt generally understand much about about good and evil would they
He knew it was wrong to disobey God, just as a child knows it is wrong to disobey their parents. Would a child recognise as sin disobeying their parents? Im sure they would not. BTW, there is no immense implications here, un less that is you make a god out of head theology. Hope you don't
Adventageous
Well-Known Member
There is so much confusion upon your part in your OP, and throughout, that it is a marvel (to me) that you do not see the glaring contradictory nature inherent in your position. So saying, this is not meant to offend uneccessarily.
1. In regards Jhn. 1:17 - Joh 1:17 KJB - For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
The question to be asked in regards this text (Jhn. 1:17 KJB) is what "law" "was given by Moses", and what "grace and truth" "came by Jesus Christ"? The Bible itself answers the questions.
In regards "Moses":
Deu_28:58 If thou wilt not observe to do all the words of this law that are written in this book, that thou mayest fear this glorious and fearful name, THE LORD THY GOD;
Deu_31:9 And Moses wrote this law, and delivered it unto the priests the sons of Levi, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and unto all the elders of Israel.
Deu_31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.
Exo 24:3 And Moses came and told the people all the words of the LORD, and all the judgments: and all the people answered with one voice, and said, All the words which the LORD hath said will we do.
Exo 24:4 And Moses wrote all the words of the LORD, and rose up early in the morning, and builded an altar under the hill, and twelve pillars, according to the twelve tribes of Israel.
The "book of the law" was written by Moses at the command of God in a 'book', and placed "in the side of the ark". They contain instruction on how to keep God's eternal covenant, and what to do when it was violated (through sacrifices, ritual, atonements, &c.), as well as their own agreement (covenant), and what would happen if they violated it (curses, judgments, &c.)
In regards "Jesus":
Exo_34:6 And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, The LORD, The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth,
Exo 34:7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.
Exo 20:2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
Exo 20:5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
Exo 20:6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Deu_4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
Deu_5:22 These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and he added no more. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me.
Deu 10:1 At that time the LORD said unto me, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first, and come up unto me into the mount, and make thee an ark of wood.
Deu 10:2 And I will write on the tables the words that were in the first tables which thou brakest, and thou shalt put them in the ark.
Deu 10:3 And I made an ark of shittim wood, and hewed two tables of stone like unto the first, and went up into the mount, having the two tables in mine hand.
Deu 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spake unto you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them unto me.
Deu 10:5 And I turned myself and came down from the mount, and put the tables in the ark which I had made; and there they be, as the LORD commanded me.
1Ki_8:9 There was nothing in the ark save the two tables of stone, which Moses put there at Horeb, when the LORD made a covenant with the children of Israel, when they came out of the land of Egypt.
Deu_32:4 He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.
Exo_32:16 And the tables were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God, graven upon the tables.
Psa_119:142 Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth.
Psa_119:151 Thou art near, O LORD; and all thy commandments are truth.
1Jn_2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
The Ten Commandments (in Exo. 20:1-17 KJB), were spoken and written by God, on ROCK (Stone), and begin with Mercy, "I AM The LORD, which have brought thee out of ... bondage.", and which heart of them is of Mercy, "Keeping Mercy ... shewing mercy ... them that love me, and keep my commandments." In Exo. 33-34, when Moses asked "the LORD" (Jesus who came down and spoke with Moses "face to face") to show him the LORD's glory (Exo. 33:12-23 KJB), Jesus then proceeds to (Exo. 34:1-9 KJB) proclaim the very name of His Father, in connection with the heart of the Ten Commandments. This is why scripture states that "He is the Rock". The Ten Commandments, written by "the LORD" upon those tables of sapphire stone (originally Exo. 24:10-12, 31:18 KJB) are a written transcript of "the LORD's" own eternal unchanging perfect character. Later, another set of stones had to be made by God (Exo. 34:1 KJB), and were eventually placed inside of the Ark, beneath the Mercy Seat, where God (Truth Himself; Jhn. 14:6) sat.
2. The NIV is a terrible Jesuit (see Cardinal Carlo Maria Martini, SJ) construct, and is based in faulty, extremely 'emended' codices, & mss. of the Vatican. Demonstrable upon request.
Adventageous
Well-Known Member
Perhaps quoting the entire verse in context would help.
Mat 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.
Mat 11:2 Now when John had heard in the prison the works of Christ, he sent two of his disciples,
Mat 11:3 And said unto him, Art thou he that should come, or do we look for another?
Mat 11:4 Jesus answered and said unto them, Go and shew John again those things which ye do hear and see:
Mat 11:5 The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the gospel preached to them.
Mat 11:6 And blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me.
Mat 11:7 And as they departed, Jesus began to say unto the multitudes concerning John, What went ye out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind?
Mat 11:8 But what went ye out for to see? A man clothed in soft raiment? behold, they that wear soft clothing are in kings' houses.
Mat 11:9 But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet.
Mat 11:10 For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
Mat 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Mat 11:12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
Mat 11:13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
Mat 11:14 And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.
Mat 11:15 He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Mat 11:16 But whereunto shall I liken this generation? It is like unto children sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows,
Mat 11:17 And saying, We have piped unto you, and ye have not danced; we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented.
Mat 11:18 For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, He hath a devil.
Mat 11:19 The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.
Jesus is quoting, or referring to, at least several disctinct prophetic scriptures in the prophets Isaiah's & Malachi's writings; namely Isaiah 61:1; Mal. 3:1, 4:5 KJB:
Isa 61:1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;
Mal 3:1 Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.
Mal 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:
Thus, Jesus is stating that John the Baptist is the spiritual sucessor of Elijah, and the one who would come before Jesus and herald Jesus:
Luk_1:17 And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.
These texts originally refer to the first Advent / Coming of Jesus Christ. When Jesus says, "For", it means the reason thereof, or because (being the cause). Why is "the kingdom of heaven" suffering "violence", it is "For" (because, or the reason of) that "all the prophets" (Nevi'im), & "the law" (Torah; aka "book of the law", of Moses; through its types & shadows) "prophesied" (preached by inspiration of God) of the First Advent / Coming of Jesus Christ. The word "until" refers to a delineation, or break, or limitation. Once John the Baptist came upon the scene, as foretold, the prophesying was being then fulfilled, and was no longer future to their own time, but very present at their time. In other words, they no longer needed to look forward to the coming of the herald, or the Messiah, but could now look upon the herald (John the Baptist) and the Messiah (Jesus), who were both now present with them. The context even cites from 'the prophets'. Jesus mentions a similar pattern of the entire OT in Luk. 24:44:
Luk_24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
1. Law of Moses (Torah)
2. in the prophets (Nevi'im)
3. in the psalms (Ketuvim); and thus the whole TaNaKh (ie Hebrew 'OT') as they had then ordered them.
These are not referring to a limitation (of time) of the authority of the Ten Commandments, which were never merely for Israel or Jews (for even Moses' wife was of Midian, as well as those "mixed / mixt multitude" (Exo. 12:38; Num. 11:4 KJB) of other nations (Egyptian, Midianite, &c.) that were present at Sinai with the Israelites).
The very scriptures themselves state that Jesus would "magnify the law, and make it honourable", which refers to the Ten Commandments, as Jesus would show how deep and broad (Psa. 119:96 KJB) those spiritual (Rom. 7:7,14 KJB) '10' actually are in their eternal scope (Mat. 5-7, &c.):
Isa_42:21 The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.
This Jesus did, by His own statements, and actions.
Joh_15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
This means, that in Mat. 11:1-19, the OT texts preached of the first Advent / Coming of Jesus / Messiah, and of the herald (John the Baptist) that would preceed Him. There are even specific time prophecies that related to it (Dan. 9:24-27, &c.), and Jesus and John both mention this:
Mat 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Mar_1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
The Ten Commandments never have a time limit, being eternal.
Adventageous
Well-Known Member
The phrase "heard that it was said ..." is not a reference to that "which is written" (directly), but to that which is spoken by Pharisees / Rabbis (doctors of the law, lawyers), in their midrashes, or commentary upon the written scriptures. In other words, Jesus is contrasting the words of fallen men, with Himself "the Word", which is parallel to the written "word" of God (since it is just a word picture of Jesus).
Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
The same heaven & earth as Jesus spake of are still present to this modern (12/28/25) day. They will not pass away until the 2nd and 3rd Advents of Jesus:
Mat_24:35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
Mar_13:31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
Luk_21:33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
2Pe_3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Rev_6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
Rev_20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
The context of "Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time ..." refers to what the Rabbis / Pharisees / Laywers taught by their mouths / words out of the "law [Torah] and the prophets [Nevi'im]".
Mat 23:2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
Mat 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you [ie. out of Moses, "Torah", or what Moses actually said as written] observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say [ie. they say the words of Moses from the Torah], and do not.
Mat 23:4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.
Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Mat 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Mat 5:23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
Mat 5:24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
Mat 5:25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
Mat 5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.
Mat 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Mat 5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
Mat 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
Mat 5:33 Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:
Mat 5:34 But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne:
Mat 5:35 Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King.
Mat 5:36 Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black.
Mat 5:37 But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.
Mat 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
Mat 5:40 And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also.
Mat 5:41 And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.
Mat 5:42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.
Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
Thus, the context while citing / referring to some portions of the Torah, are really summations given / spoken by the Rabbis / Lawyers / Pharisees about the things written in the Torah, &c. Jesus is contrasting their faulty midrashic sayings / commentaries with His own Word (which Amen's the actual written words in the Torah, &c.). The Jews have thousands of midrashic sayings / commentaries even now; see Sefaria: a Living Library of Jewish Texts Online
All of the OT texts are still valid, present (though a transition from natural to spiritual has occured), until the first heaven and first earth pass away. They have not yet.
Adventageous
Well-Known Member
Jesus in no way violated the Sabbath Law (Exo. 20:8-11 KJB).
You can even read the chapter (Chapter 11, section 2, pages 43-46) on this subject in this book, here - The 7th Day The Sabbath - The Rest Of His Eternal Story (by Aaron Earnest) : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive
[1.] The Father said of Jesus:
“... This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” (Mat. 3:17, 17:5; Mar. 1:11; 2 Pet. 1:17)
[2.] Jesus said of Himself:
John 8:29 KJB - “... I do always those things that please him.” [see Isa. 58:13 KJB]
John 8:49 KJB - Jesus answered, I have not a devil; but I honour my Father, and ye do dishonour me.
John 15:10 KJB - “... I have kept my Father’s commandments, and abide in his love.”
[3.] Prophecy said of Jesus:
Isaiah 42:21 KJB - The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.
Matthew 12:18 KJB - Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.
Isaiah 44:28 KJB - That saith of Cyrus, He is my shepherd, and shall perform all my pleasure: even saying to Jerusalem, Thou shalt be built; and to the temple, Thy foundation shall be laid.
[4.] The People said that Jesus was, “holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners” (Heb. 7:26 KJB)
Jesus was that “holy thing” (Luk. 1:35)
an “holy child” (Act. 4:27,30)
Jesus was born of the “Holy Ghost” (Mat. 1:18; Luk. 1:35), even though He came in the likeness (Rom. 8:3; Php. 2:7) of sinful [fallen] flesh, yet He was without sin.
“I [Pilate], having examined him [Jesus] before you, have found no fault in this man ” (Luk. 23:14)
“lamb shall be without blemish” (Exo. 12:5)
“the innocent blood” (Mat. 27:4)
“For he knew that for envy they had delivered him.” (Mat. 27:18)
“Have thou nothing to do with that just man” (Mat. 27:19)
“Why, what evil hath he done?” (Mat. 27:23)
“I am innocent of the blood of this just person” (Mat. 27:24)
“The said Pilate “I find no fault in this man.” (Luk. 23:4)
“I have kept my Father's commandments” (Jhn. 15:10)
“in him is no sin.” (1 Jhn. 3:5)
“lo, nothing worthy of death is done unto him.” (Luk. 23:15)
“[who is] holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners” (Heb. 7:26)
“But found none: yea, though many false witnesses came, yet found they none.” (Mat. 26:60)
“God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.” (Jhn. 9:31)
“Certainly this was a righteous man.” (Luk. 23:47)
“I find in him no fault [at all].” (Jhn. 18:38)
“I find no fault in him.” (Jhn. 19:4)
“I find no fault in him.” (Jhn. 19:6)
“the obedience of one” (Rom. 5:19)
“who knew no sin” (2 Cor. 5:21)
“without sin.” (Heb. 4:15)
“this man hath done nothing amiss.” (Luk. 23:41)
“Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:” (1 Pet. 2:22)
“what evil hath he done? I have found no cause of death in him” (Luk. 23:22)
“without spot to God.” (Heb. 9:4)
[5.] The word for “broken” is “eluen”, “ελυεν” (G3089 V-IAI-3S); it generally means ‘loosed’ [as in, ‘untied’, ‘unbound’, ‘undone’, ‘set / break free’]:
loose, 15 [Mat. 16:19, 18:18; Mar. 11:2 (2),4; Luk. 13:15, 19:30-31 (2),33; Jhn. 11:44; Act. 24:25-26 (2); Rev. 5:2, 5, 9:14]
loosed, 10 [Mat. 16:19, 18:18; Mar. 7:35; Luk. 13:16; Act. 2:24, 22:30; 1 Cor. 7:27; Rev. 9:15, 20:3,7]
broken, 7 [Jhn. 5:18, 7:2, 10:35; Act. 13:43, 27:41,44; Eph. 2:14]
unloose, 3 [Mar. 1:7; *Luk. 3:16; Jhn. 1:27]
loosing, 2 [Mar. 11:5; Luk. 19:33]
destroy, 2 [Jhn. 2:19; 1 Jhn. 3:8]
put, 1 [Act. 7:33 (2)]
dissolved, 2 [2 Pet. 3:11-12 (2)]
melt, 1 [2 Pet. 3:10]break, 1 [Mat. 5:19]
off, 1 [Act. 7:33]
With this evidence, did Jesus “destroy” or “dissolve” the Sabbath? No. He clearly defends the true sabbath-keeping position (about healing); Jhn. 5:1-16; see also Mat. 12:12 KJB) and His actions from several true testimonies and witnesses. Jesus shows the appropriateness of what was permissible in / on the Sabbath day (the seventh day) by speaking of the Father’s own actions (Jhn. 5:17-24 KJB) and testimony (Jhn. 5:37-38 KJB). Furthermore, He draws upon John the Baptist’s testimony (Jhn. 5:32-35 KJB), and also from the Scriptures (Jhn. 5:39 KJB).
Did Jesus actually “break” (transgress the Law of God) the Sabbath in example (1 Pet. 2:21 KJB) for mankind to follow (1 Jhn. 2:6 KJB)? No, for that would have been sin (1 Jhn. 3:4; Rom. 7:7,14; Jam. 2:8-13 KJB), and disqualified Jesus as the spotless “Lamb” (Jhn. 1:29,36 KJB) and Messiah.
Doing so, also would have been contrary to Jesus’ own mission as stated in Prophecy (Isa. 42:21 KJB) and from His own mouth (Mat. 5:17-20 KJB), in which He would “fulfil all righteousness” (Mat. 3:15; Psa. 119:172 KJB), “magnify” the Law and make it “honourable”, thus honouring His Father (Isa. 58:13 KJB).
He would never make it dishonourable or lessened in importance and significance (Exo. 20:8-11; Deu. 5:12-15 KJB). Therefore, what does this word “broken” mean in the context of John’s statement and the Pharisaical regulations?
Jesus ignored the Pharisees man-made traditions which placed “heavy burdens” (Mat. 23:4 KJB) upon Sabbath keeping, which God never gave.
Jesus therefore indeed “broke” the Sabbath free (as in, ‘untied’, ‘unbound’, ‘undone’, ‘set / break free’) of those horrendous selfish man-made regulations which the Pharisees, &c., had burdened God’s commandment with. Jesus would never ever break the Sabbath as commanded to all men (Mar. 2:27; Col. 1:16; 1 Cor. 15:45-47 KJB). In effect, what Jesus did was give rest back to the Sabbath day, and to the people on Sabbath, thus sabbatizing the sabbath in spirit (heart) and in truth (deed). Jesus loosed the restrictions and misconceptions about sabbath keeping, and untied those toilsome knots by His teaching, example, and life; thus set the Sabbath day free (Luk. 4:14-21 KJB) to be obeyed in righteousness (Isa. 58:6-7; Mat. 11:28,30; Exo. 33:14 KJB). Jesus was indeed equal in nature (Deity), and in authority over all Creation, with His Father. As such, He knows what proper sabbath keeping is (Gen. 2:1-3 KJB), and carried it out, so that all mankind may once again rest in that sacred day with the LORD God.
[6.] The Seven Sabbath miracles of Jesus. Jesus went about demonstrating to everyone what real sabbath-keeping was, and not like the formally rigid and Pharisaical regulated way.
1. Jesus Heals Simon Peter’s Mother-in-Law (Mat. 8:14-15; Mar. 1:29-31; Luk. 4:38-39 KJB)
2. Jesus heals a man with a withered hand (Mat. 12:9-14; Mar. 3:1-6; Luk. 6:6-11 KJB)
3. Jesus heals a man born blind (Jhn. 9:1-41 KJB)
4. Jesus heals a crippled woman (Luk. 13:10-17 KJB)
5. Jesus heals a man with Dropsy (Luk. 14:1-6 KJB)
6. Jesus drives out an evil spirit (Mar. 1:21-28 KJB)
7. Jesus heals a lame man by the pool of Bethesda (Jhn. 5:1-24 KJB)
[7.] The real sinners and Sabbath breakers were those murderous (Jhn. 8:44 KJB) pharisees (&c.), who were always accusing Jesus, attempting to “fault find” in the faultless (Psa. 19:7 KJB).
Now those who follow in their steps, do the same to His law – The Ten Commandments, even today (1 Jhn. 3:4-13; Jam. 4:11 KJB). They broke God’s law to murder and take life. Jesus broke their vain and man-made traditions to give everlasting life, even rest (sabbath), back to the wearied people. Come unto Him today, and He will give you sabbath-keeping (Exo. 20:8-11, 33:14; Mat. 11:28; Heb. 4:9 KJB).
Adventageous
Well-Known Member
Joh 9:16 Therefore said some of the Pharisees, This man is not of God, because he keepeth not the sabbath day. Others said, How can a man that is a sinner do such miracles? And there was a division among them.
It was the "Pharisees" which wrongly accused Jesus in Jhn. 9:16 of being a "sinner" and "not of God", because Jesus was violating their man-made vain "traditions" in healing a man and making him whole upon the Sabbath day (the 7th day, the LORD's day), which went counter to the actual law of God given by God (Ten commandments), and the other written words of God by Moses' hand (Torah).
Joh 9:14 And it was the sabbath day when Jesus made the clay, and opened his eyes.
Jesus was not violating anything in Exo. 20:8-11 in John 9 (or anywhere else for that matter), but demonstrating how the Sabbath should be kept Holy, since He is not merely the substitute, but also the example (Jhn. 13:15; 1 Pet. 2:21 KJB). There are two kinds of 'work' in Exo. 20:8-11. The Holy 'work' in "keep[ing" the Sabbath "holy" (such as restoration / healing, showing / demonstrating mercy), and the common / profane 'work' (like mowing the grass) that may be done on any other day of the week. There is God's work therein, and man's work in it.
Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
Jesus was demonstrating that the Pharisees had the real actual commandment of God (Exo. 20:8-11) all wrong, and had allowed satan to twist its meaning until it was the opposite of what it was to be. Satan had taught the Pharisees that to heal or show mercy upon the sabbath was a violation of its meaning, but it simply is not so. Creation (Exo. 20:8-11) & Redemption (Deu. 5:12-15) are intimately and intricately bound together. God delivers out of bondage of disease, and sin, and satan tries to keep people in disease and sin.
Mat_15:3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
Mat_15:6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.
Mar_7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
Mar_7:9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
Mar_7:13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.
Col_2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
*******
As for John 5:18, this is a differing meaning altogether, for the Pharisees had made a bunch of regulations (Mat_23:4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.), based upon what they (incorrectly) thought the scriptures taught, and Jesus demonstrates the true sabbath keeping by healing the man whole on the sabbath day (which is not a violation of the Commandment, but in harmony with keeping it Holy, and in Mercy, bringing the man out of disease and sin bondage; Exo. 20:8-11). John, by the Holy Ghost, states that Jesus "broke" (loosed, unbound the heavey burdens of Pharisaical regulation) the true sabbath (Exo. 20:8-11; Gen. 2:1-3 KJB) free from the multitudinous Pharisaical regulations as taught by the lawyers, &c., by His words and actions, and thus "broke" the incorrect Pharisaical ideology of the sabbath by the same. Jesus in now way violated the actual commandment of His Father. He could not, since He is the example for all New Man. See also the previous post.
Adventageous
Well-Known Member
Consider the context:
Gal 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
Gal 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
Gal 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
What is grace & love?
Exo 20:2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
Exo 20:6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
What is truth?
1. God the Father - Deu. 32:4 KJB
2. Jesus - Jhn. 14:6 KJB
3. The Holy Ghost - 1 Jhn. 5:6 KJB
4. The Ten Commandments of God, aka Law of God - Psa. 119:142,151 KJB
5. The word of God (again Commandments of God) - Deu. 4:2; Jhn. 17:17 KJB
6. All the paths (ways) of God - Psa. 25:10; Jhn. 14:6 KJB
The very context of Gal. is the "book of the law":
Gal_3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
Gal. 3:10 is citing Deu. 27:26, and Gal. 3:13 is citing Deu. 21:23 KJB. The "works of the law" are not ever the Ten Commandments, but rather those things which dealt with the worldly sanctuary; those things of ritual, sacrifices, burning incense, &c.
Num_4:3 From thirty years old and upward even until fifty years old, all that enter into the host, to do the work in the tabernacle of the congregation.
There are no curses in the Ten Commandments, which are all promises of God in the New / Everlasting Covenant (His Covenant). There is nothing about physical "circumcision" in the Ten Commandments (Exo. 20:1-17 KJB). The Ten Commandments are never "bondage", but even begin with the words, "I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out ... of bondage.", which means that the Ten Commandments are the eternal Law of "Liberty":
Psa 119:44 So shall I keep thy law continually for ever and ever.
Psa 119:45 And I will walk at liberty: for I seek thy precepts.
Isa_61:1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;
Luk 4:16 And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read.
Luk_4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
Luk 4:21 And he began to say unto them, This day [the 7the day, the sabbath of the LORD God] is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.
Who wrote the Ten Commandments?
Exo_31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
Deu_9:10 And the LORD delivered unto me two tables of stone written with the finger of God; and on them was written according to all the words, which the LORD spake with you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly.
Luk_11:20 But if I with the finger of God cast out devils, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you.
Mat 12:28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.
2Co_3:17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
Jas_1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
Jas_2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
Sin (transgression of God's law; Rom. 7:7,14; Jam. 2:8-13; 1 Jhn. 3:4 KJB) is the bondage:
Joh 8:33 They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
Act_8:23 For I perceive that thou art in the gall of bitterness, and in the bond of iniquity.
2Pe_2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
Adventageous
Well-Known Member
Continuing:
Gal 3:15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.
Gal 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
Gal 3:17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
Gal 3:18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
Gal 3:19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
Gal 3:20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
Gal 3:21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
Gal 3:22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Gal 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Go and read Exo. 19 carefully. 2 (Two) covenants are seen therein.
[1] God's ("my covenant") eternal / everlasting (New) covenant, the promises of God written (Ten Commandments)
[2] their (old) covenant made with God, about the first, [God] "if ... then ... and ...", [peoples] "All that the LORD hath spoken we will do."
Exo 19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:
Exo 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.
Exo 19:7 And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the LORD commanded him.
Exo 19:8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.
Thus another "law" (the book of the law, their old covenant agreement to do them all) was "added" because of transgression of an already existing law (Ten Commandments).
They had promised God to do everthing God said, even before they heard aloud the Ten Commandments (3 days later). Yet, just soon after, they made the golden calf, and violated all 10 of the commandments by so doing. They broke the covenant made with them, that they had agreed to with God about Keeping His Covenant (Ten Commandments).
The laws of sacrifices, ritual, etc were added (pointing the way as a sub-teacher (schoomaster), unto (until the time of) the reality, Jesus, the Great Master Teacher, when shadow was replaced by substance, typical replaced by anti-typical, sacrifices of animals, by sacrifice of the Saviour), and placed in the side of the Ark, while the Ten Commandments were placed in the Ark, and had been violated.
This is all reiterated in Hebrews & Romans, Colossians 2, and Ephesians 2.
Paul was simply saying in Gal. that the physical circumcision (an outward symbol of a sign of faith inward), sacrifices, rituals (ceremonies) as found in the "book of the law" were merely temporary shadows that pointed out the coming of the true Redeemer, which was promised since the beginning, as "the seed of the woman" to come, and re-iterated to Abraham as "the seed" (not typical Isaac, but true Isaac / Jesus, the real rejoicing), who would circumcise the heart spiritually, since He is the cutting stone, the Rock, who cuts away "the flesh", and renews the heart/mind by the Spirit, to be able to walk in the spiritual Law of God (Ten Commandments).
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