Do the Ten Commandments still apply under the new covenant today?

[saved by grace 101]

you have your credibility here a long time ago Bob.

Who is Bob?

 

[saved by grace 101]

I think he's very serious about what he believes.
I just don't understand that way of thinking about what Jesus taught.

And I had some fun back there too.

It might even be sinful !!

For both of us!

 

[GodsGrace]

I come from a different background from yours Im sure, I got crushed badly when I was young, by trying to be good enough for God, it had a terrible effect on me. It changes your views, it has to

Oddly enough,
I've been debating this with a member that is also on this Forum for about 10 years now.
He happens to have had the same experience as you.

Like I said in a previous post, we can't let personal experience cloud the Word of God.
It's fne if it helped you to read something Paul wrote...
but it's not correct to pass it on to others.

I'll just leave you with the fact that the method of obedience has changed...
but obedience will always be required.

I fear some will be derailed by incorrect messages.

Did Sturgeon mention if the one pastor preached that God did NOT have to be obeyed?
I doubt it.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

News flash, Jesus died for our sins/our transgressions of the law, he did not die to abolish what is holy, just and good(Rom7:12) that got placed in believers hearts and minds
Christ is the end of the law UNTO RIGHTEOUSNESS (not full stop), for everyone who believeth Rom10:4

We live under the New Covenant now as Jesus took the old covenant away

We all sin BB...
even you.

I never said I don't have sin on my record from before I got born again that the Lord chooses to not remember due to the Blood of Jesus

You claim you are a sinner. As such you won't be going to Heaven because sinners won't be allowed in to Heaven because they continue to live in sin and apparently are very proud to be living in sin as they go around telling everyone they are sinners.

1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

James 4:17
Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

I got crushed badly when I was young, by trying to be good enough for God

Too bad you never learned to submit the the leading of the Holy Spirit and went back to living in sin.

You claim to be a sinner who lives in sin daily, right?

 

[saved by grace 101]

Oddly enough,
I've been debating this with a member that is also on this Forum for about 10 years now.
He happens to have had the same experience as you.

Like I said in a previous post, we can't let personal experience cloud the Word of God.
It's fne if it helped you to read something Paul wrote...
but it's not correct to pass it on to others.

I'll just leave you with the fact that the method of obedience has changed...
but obedience will always be required.

I fear some will be derailed by incorrect messages.

Did Sturgeon mention if the one pastor preached that God did NOT have to be obeyed?
I doubt it.

Who does God really want? People who only obey for fear of hell if they don't?
Or people who obey out of love and gratitude for a free salvation?
However I do take your point. But in my experience, people do not change their minds on the internet about their beliefs

 

[saved by grace 101]

We live under the New Covenant now as Jesus took the old covenant away




I never said I don't have sin on my record from before I got born again that the Lord chooses to not remember due to the Blood of Jesus

You claim you are a sinner. As such you won't be going to Heaven because sinners won't be allowed in to Heaven because they continue to live in sin and apparently are very proud to be living in sin as they go around telling everyone they are sinners.

1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

James 4:17
Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.




Too bad you never learned to submit the the leading of the Holy Spirit and went back to living in sin.

You claim to be a sinner who lives in sin daily, right?

But Im sure I hold the law to the pristene level it is set at, you do not, as you believe you do not commit sin

 

[GodsGrace]

I never said I don't have sin on my record from before I got born again that the Lord chooses to not remember due to the Blood of Jesus

You claim you are a sinner. As such you won't be going to Heaven because sinners won't be allowed in to Heaven because they continue to live in sin and apparently are very proud to be living in sin as they go around telling everyone they are sinners.

1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

James 4:17
Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

Great verses.

Did you happen to read the verses from John that state taht we have an advocate?

What do you think we have an advocate for if we have all our sins forgiven at one time only?

Also, my relationship with God is none of your business...

HOWEVER, I never said I'm a sinner.

I'm a child of God, just as John stated, in that very same letter.
A child of God that sins.

Just like you do.

 

[saved by grace 101]

We live under the New Covenant now as Jesus took the old covenant away

Of course we do, but some of us are conscious of sin.
Through the law we become conscious of sin Rom3:20

 

[Grailhunter]

Its you want now, not you must. And with that belief and knowledge:
By their fruits ye shall know them

2nd Corinthians :5:10: For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad..

Matthew 18:9 And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire.

So then, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling; Philippians 2:12

1st Corinthians 6:9-10 “Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor those habitually drunk, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God”

Galatians 5:19-21 Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: sexual immorality, impurity, indecent behavior, idolatry, witchcraft, hostilities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions, envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Ephesians 5:3-5 But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people. Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk or coarse joking, which are out of place, but rather thanksgiving. For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person—such a person is an idolater—has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

John 5:28-29 Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice, and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

 

[saved by grace 101]

2nd Corinthians :5:10: For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad..

Matthew 18:9 And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire.

So then, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling; Philippians 2:12

1st Corinthians 6:9-10 “Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor those habitually drunk, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God”

Galatians 5:19-21 Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: sexual immorality, impurity, indecent behavior, idolatry, witchcraft, hostilities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions, envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Ephesians 5:3-5 But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people. Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk or coarse joking, which are out of place, but rather thanksgiving. For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person—such a person is an idolater—has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

John 5:28-29 Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice, and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

The bible gives assurances and warnings.
In my view, they are for different people, some need warnings, and some don 't

 

[Grailhunter]

Sure Jesus is mentioned.
Some just don't want to see Him there.
Is He anywhere in Isaiah?
Is He the Wonderful Counselor, the Mighty God....

yeah.
I think so. Try Isaiah 9

First off Jesus cannot be mentioned because no one knows where this name came from and there are no J's in the scriptures and Yeshua is not mentioned by name or action in the Old Testament....nothing directly.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

some of us are conscious of sin.

Well, that's on you then.

You should put on Christ as the scripture instructs us to and put off the old man

Why do you insist on being disobedient to the leading of the Lord and continue walking after the flesh???

What makes us children of God is IF we answer the Father's call to abide in Christ having turned away from our old life of sin and walk with Him in newness of life

Ephesians 5:1
Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;

Ephesians 4:22-24
put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Romans 13:14
put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.

Colossians 3:10
And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of Him that created Him:

2 Corinthians 6:17
come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.

This is what baptism is supposed to be about... making a covenant with the Lord, a public declaration of faith, a commitment to put off the old man and put on the new man and to walk in newness of life

Romans 6:4
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

We are called to cooperate with the Lord, to be co-laborers with Him. He made us in His Image, so we have free will... the Lord desires for us to willingly choose to turn away from our old life of sin and come abide In Christ and not turn away, ever!

1 Corinthians 3:9
We are laborers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

It's God's work, His power, His ability... but WE have to choose to accept His offer to be His children and turn from darkness to walk with Him in the Light.

John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

2 Corinthians 5:21
For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Getting born again is the introduction and the starting point and if one truly believes and dies moments after getting born again, yes they would go to Heaven.

But few die immediately after getting born again so it remains to be seen... will WE to choose to accept His offer to be His children and turn from darkness to walk with Him abiding In Him until the end of our lives so that we might be saved???

Matthew 24:13
But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Endure to the end as in... DON'T fall away!

 

[saved by grace 101]

Well, that's on you then.

You should put on Christ as the scripture instructs us to and put off the old man

Why do you insist on being disobedient to the leading of the Lord and continue walking after the flesh???

What makes us children of God is IF we answer the Father's call to abide in Christ having turned away from our old life of sin and walk with Him in newness of life

Ephesians 5:1
Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;

Ephesians 4:22-24
put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Romans 13:14
put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.

Colossians 3:10
And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of Him that created Him:

2 Corinthians 6:17
come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.

This is what baptism is supposed to be about... making a covenant with the Lord, a public declaration of faith, a commitment to put off the old man and put on the new man and to walk in newness of life

Romans 6:4
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

We are called to cooperate with the Lord, to be co-laborers with Him. He made us in His Image, so we have free will... the Lord desires for us to willingly choose to turn away from our old life of sin and come abide In Christ and not turn away, ever!

1 Corinthians 3:9
We are laborers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

It's God's work, His power, His ability... but WE have to choose to accept His offer to be His children and turn from darkness to walk with Him in the Light.

John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

2 Corinthians 5:21
For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Getting born again is the introduction and the starting point and if one truly believes and dies moments after getting born again, yes they would go to Heaven.

But few die immediately after getting born again so it remains to be seen... will WE to choose to accept His offer to be His children and turn from darkness to walk with Him abiding In Him until the end of our lives so that we might be saved???

Matthew 24:13
But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Endure to the end as in... DON'T fall away!

Sorry, but the people closest to God grieve the most over their imperfections, those who claim they haven't got any, well

 

[Grailhunter]

The bible gives assurances and warnings.
In my view, they are for different people, some need warnings, and some don 't

Writing of sin is a sure way to end up in Hell.

 

[Grailhunter]

No Old Testament Law or Commandment apply to Christians unless they are specifically taught in the New Testament. The moral code in the New Testament are defined by teachings not by the system of Law. And we are to obey the teachings of Yeshua and the Apostles.

 

[rockytopva]

Doctrinal squabbles...

But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. - 2 Corinthians 11:3

I believe such teachings as being taught in this thread lead to spiritual coldness.... And in the words of the minister below @29:00, "Folks are coming into the church, and they are coming for something, but it is so dead and cold in our churches, until you can ice-skate down to the pulpit! And whose standing behind that pulpit yawl? Rev Polar Bear! Cold as ice! The first church of frigid-air! No deliverance! No Life! No Holy Ghost!"

So how do you know you are in the incorrectness of a church? Just examine the spirituality! And to add a thought of the minister....People are coming to the church looking like totem poles!

 

[JLB]

We have to be sorry for our sin in order to confess it.

Could you explain the difference?

Being sorry sounds worldly to me...
we might do something that costs us in some way and so we are sorry that we took some action or omitted an action.

Then there is remorse.
This is when we are regretful for a wrong-doing.

However, everyone uses the word sorry, even if incorrectly.

Confessing with our mouth our sin tells the Lord we acknowledge that we sinned, and that He will forgive us and cleanse us.


Confession is activating our faith.

 

[Button]

THIS is the problem here.
You feel you cannot keep the commandments and so you read something of Paul's that sounds good and decide that you will become obsessed with that while never really understanding what it even means.

Jesus comes first.
We must listen to Him,,,hear Him,,,and obey HIM.

Jesus offers practical advice for those that wish to be saved.

We go to Paul to learn about the Crhistian theology.
Paul did not go to the cross...Jesus did.

I come across persons on these boards that believe in Paul instead of believing in Jesus.

Those that fear sin and feel they could not conquer sin will go to the difficult scripture of Paul that SOUNDS good, but he is saying exactly what Jesus taught but with deeper ideas.

This attitude is most unfortunate in the Christian faith because Paul HIMSELF taught that we are NOT OF PAUL and NOT OF APOLLOS...
we belong to Christ.

1 Corinthians 3:4-5
4 For when one says, "I am of Paul," and another, "I am of Apollos," are you not mere men?
5 What then is Apollos? And what is Paul? Servants through whom you believed,

Paul is a SERVANT THROUGH WHOM WE BELIEVE.
It is JESUS that we believe and follow for salvation.


Do you realize that what you post sounds like we do not need to obey the Commandments?
When the NT is full of instruction to be obedient.
Have I not posted sufficient scripture?

You've had a personal experience that has helped you.
Instead of concentrating on the commandments, you concentrated on Jesus.
THIS is what Paul is speaking of...
the differnece between law and grace.
But you ARE now being obedient....

And who told you you had to be perfect?
Did you not read 1 John?
Did you not read the story of the Prodigal Son in Luke 15?

You've created your own theology based on your own personal experience.
I've met several that do this.
They feel guilty, so they change what Paul teaches....
as if he taught something differently than Jesus.

As if Paul taught that we do not have to obey God's commandments.

Hebrews states that God will put the law in our MINDS AND IN OUR HEARTS.
Hebrews 8:10

We must believe with the heart in order to have success....(the difference between the law and grace)
but BELIEVE means TO OBEY.

If we believe God wrote his laws,commandments,on our hearts so that we would never be far from them,what laws,commands,are these?

Jesus said to love the Lord God with all our heart and mind,and our neighbor as ourselves. Upon those two commands hang all the laws,which would include the moral ten commandments,and the prophets.

Therefore,and especially given the text,directives,of the ten commandments, which are moral instructions,I don't believe we can say the ten commandments no longer are in effect.

In fact, I don't know how a claim that moral instruction no longer applies in the Christian persons life could ever be argued as correct and righteous truth.

It's just the opposite.

 

[Button]

Doctrinal squabbles...

But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. - 2 Corinthians 11:3

I believe such teachings as being taught in this thread lead to spiritual coldness.... And in the words of the minister below @29:00, "Folks are coming into the church, and they are coming for something, but it is so dead and cold in our churches, until you can ice-skate down to the pulpit! And whose standing behind that pulpit yawl? Rev Polar Bear! Cold as ice! The first church of frigid-air! No deliverance! No Life! No Holy Ghost!"

So how do you know you are in the incorrectness of a church? Just examine the spirituality! And to add a thought of the minister....People are coming to the church looking like totem poles!

I think some people intend to make God in their image and like ess by altering his instruction to the lifestyle they prefer to live.

 

[saved by grace 101]

why is it you cannot understand scripture?

And what is your understanding, to tell people to do what you do not even try to do yourself?
In over fifty years I have met no one who even tried to obey each and every command of Christ in the gospels, but I read many comments on the internet making the statement we must obey Christ's commands. That is never qualified with an admittance the person making the statement does not themself try and obey all the commands themself.
You do not obey each and every command of Christ in the gospels and the TC do you. Why not? Are you in wilfull rebellion against God? Or do you just know you cannot fully obey them all? So how is someone going to feel if you insist to them they must obey all the commands mentioned? Well if they are sincere, they will get crushed if they believed you, they may believe you yourself are obeying all the commands you insist they must. They then get crushed by their inability to do what you cannot do.
Maybe you think it is fine to make statements, insist of others what you cannot do yourself, I cannot do that, I have many faults, but not that. I know how crushed people get by the insistances of others who do not practice what they preach. It is not obeying the second greatest commandment.
Best way to approach Jesus commands is as Paul tells us:
Carry each others burdens(love them) and so fulfill the law of Christ Gal6:2
The more you love someone the more you will be prepared to carry a heavy load for them not one mile but two
The more you love someone the more you will prepared to lend to them without expecting anything back.
The more you love your enemy, the more likely you are to offer him more than what he stole from you
The more you love beggars, the blind and lame the more likely you are to invite them home for a meal. etc
Much better to say that, than make statements such as you must obey Christ's commands when you are not trying to do that yourself.
Maybe thinking of the harm you could do others doesn't matter, all that matters is insisting of them what you do not insist of yourself