Revelation 20:1-15 & the 1,000 years (aka Millennium) Bible Study

[Hiddenthings]

The only Jerusalem that Jesus has His eyes set on is the New, heavenly Jerusalem. There's nothing to look forward to on this current sin- cursed earth.

Correct and it's this New Jerusalem which he is bring down to earth.

21:2 And I saw the holy city the new Jerusalem descending out of heaven from God, made ready like a bride adorned for her husband. Re 21:2.

Numbers 14:21 and Hab 2:14 will be fulfilled!

 

[Davidpt]

Peter was not speaking symbolically in 2nd Peter 3. You are mistaken. It's not apocalyptic text like in the book of Revelation. What do you think, that Peter was comparing something symbolic with something literal in 2 Peter 3:6-7? Why would he do that? No, he was directly comparing one past physical global event with a future physical global event.


See above. It's very simple. You are unable to discern even simple things like this. It makes me wonder what can you discern?


Not at all.

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 ¶Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?


Revelation 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.


In light of how you are interpreting 2 Peter 3:10-12, how are you then interpreting Revelation 6:13-14? Do you think both accounts are involving the same events? Do you think one account is meaning in the literal sense, the other account is symbolic not literal?

BTW, does not Revelation 6:12-14 echo what is recorded in the OT?

Isaiah 13:10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Then consider the following, that which Isaiah 13:10 is referring to.

Isaiah 13:6 Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

Also consider the following.

Isaiah 13:16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.


Then compare with the following.

Zechariah 14:2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.


Keeping in mind Zechariah 14:1---Behold, the day of the LORD cometh

Of course though, you couldn't care less, would be my guess. Too much work and too much thinking involved in order to also consider the OT before fully deciding what all might be meant in the NT regarding the same subject matter. Way easier to interpret the NT based on what the NT alone says rather than what both the NT and OT combined say.

IMO, it is absurd to interpret 2 Peter 3:10-12 in one manner, then interpret Revelation 6:12-14 and Isaiah 13 in an entirely different manner when the subject matter is the same in all 3 accounts, that being the day of the Lord.

 

[WPM]

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 ¶Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?


Revelation 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.


In light of how you are interpreting 2 Peter 3:10-12, how are you then interpreting Revelation 6:13-14? Do you think both accounts are involving the same events? Do you think one account is meaning in the literal sense, the other account is symbolic not literal?

BTW, does not Revelation 6:12-14 echo what is recorded in the OT?

Isaiah 13:10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Then consider the following, that which Isaiah 13:10 is referring to.

Isaiah 13:6 Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

Also consider the following.

Isaiah 13:16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.


Then compare with the following.

Zechariah 14:2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.


Keeping in mind Zechariah 14:1---Behold, the day of the LORD cometh

Of course though, you couldn't care less, would be my guess. Too much work and too much thinking involved in order to also consider the OT before fully deciding what all might be meant in the NT regarding the same subject matter. Way easier to interpret the NT based on what the NT alone says rather than what both the NT and OT combined say.

IMO, it is absurd to interpret 2 Peter 3:10-12 in one manner, then interpret Revelation 6:12-14 and Isaiah 13 in an entirely different manner when the subject matter is the same in all 3 accounts, that being the day of the Lord.

You are incapable of discussing any clear and literal New Testament passage without explaining it away with your mistaken understanding of Zechariah 14. Your obsession with that and Revelation 20, even though neither correlate, show how bankrupt Premillennialism is. It is a non-corroborative private interpretation, and should be rejected by all.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 ¶Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?


Revelation 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.


In light of how you are interpreting 2 Peter 3:10-12, how are you then interpreting Revelation 6:13-14? Do you think both accounts are involving the same events? Do you think one account is meaning in the literal sense, the other account is symbolic not literal?

Yes, of course. One account is contained in the most highly symbolic book in the entire Bible and the other is not. Peter compared the future event of fire dissolving the heavens and the elements and burning up the earth directly to the flood in Noah's day. He was not comparing a literal event from the past to a symbolic event in the future. That would be ridiculous. No, he was comparing similar events (both are literal, physical, global events).

BTW, does not Revelation 6:12-14 echo what is recorded in the OT?

Yes, there's a lot of symbolism in OT prophecies, also.

Isaiah 13:10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Then consider the following, that which Isaiah 13:10 is referring to.

Isaiah 13:6 Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

Also consider the following.

Isaiah 13:16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.

Hello? That is referring to the end of the Babylonian empire. Notice the verse after verse 16...

Isaiah 13:17 “Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them, Who will not regard silver; And as for gold, they will not delight in it.

It was the Medes and Persians (Media-Persian empire) that displaced the Babylonian empire long ago. That is what Isaiah 13 is about. It's referring to a day of the Lord, not the day of the Lord that passages like 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3, 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3 and 2 Peter 3:10-12 refer to.

Then compare with the following.

Zechariah 14:2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.


Keeping in mind Zechariah 14:1---Behold, the day of the LORD cometh

That isn't "the day of the Lord". Other translations have "a day is coming for the Lord" and similar to that. It's not referring to the future day of the Lord.

Of course though, you couldn't care less, would be my guess.

I couldn't care less if you disagree with me since I know you're wrong.

Too much work and too much thinking involved in order to also consider the OT before fully deciding what all might be meant in the NT regarding the same subject matter.

Nonsense. You cause the OT and NT to contradict each other. You are clearly the one who needs to adjust his thinking.

Way easier to interpret the NT based on what the NT alone says rather than what both the NT and OT combined say.

LOL. Nonsense. Let me know if you ever decide to get serious.

IMO, it is absurd to interpret 2 Peter 3:10-12 in one manner, then interpret Revelation 6:12-14 and Isaiah 13 in an entirely different manner when the subject matter is the same in all 3 accounts, that being the day of the Lord.

It's not absurd at all when you consider that 2nd Peter is not a highly symbolic book while Revelation and Isaiah undeniably are highly symbolic books. But, that's too difficult of a concept for you to consider, apparently.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You are incapable of discussing any clear and literal New Testament passage without explaining it away with your mistaken understanding of Zechariah 14. Your obsession with that and Revelation 20, even though neither correlate, show how bankrupt Premillennialism is. It is a non-corroborative private interpretation, and should be rejected by all.

He insists on interpreting the text of highly symbolic books literally and the text from a very literal book like 2nd Peter symbolically. Premills lack the discernment to be able to differentiate between literal and symbolic text and that is why they are so confused and cause contradictions in scripture.

 

[Hiddenthings]

IMO, it is absurd to interpret 2 Peter 3:10-12 in one manner, then interpret Revelation 6:12-14 and Isaiah 13 in an entirely different manner when the subject matter is the same in all 3 accounts, that being the day of the Lord.

The issue is @Spiritual Israelite picks and chooses which symbol they want to interpret. Everywhere Heaven and Earth is reference carries deep theological meaning.

10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens (ruling powers) will disappear with a roar; the elements (rebellious peoples) will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare.

Spiritual fails to understand that every good and perfect gift comes down from above, and that there is nothing in Heaven that requires destruction.

They also miss the well-established symbolic meaning found in Deuteronomy 32:1.

At the heart of the issue, God is speaking one language, and @Spiritual Israelite is trying to interpret it using an entirely different one. The result is inevitable: the message will never align, because the framework for understanding is wrong from the start.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The issue is @Spiritual Israelite picks and chooses which symbol they want to interpret. Everywhere Heaven and Earth is reference carries deep theological meaning.

10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens (ruling powers) will disappear with a roar; the elements (rebellious peoples) will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare.

Spiritual fails to understand that every good and perfect gift comes down from above, and that there is nothing in Heaven that requires destruction.

They also miss the well-established symbolic meaning found in Deuteronomy 32:1.

At the heart of the issue, God is speaking one language, and @Spiritual Israelite is trying to interpret it using an entirely different one. The result is inevitable: the message will never align, because the framework for understanding is wrong from the start.

LOL. I don't just randomly pick and choose. I interpret the scriptures according to their context. Your interpretation of 2 Peter 3:10-12 is a complete joke. The elements represent "rebellious peoples"? LOL. What is that based on? Look at 2 Peter 3:6-7. You would have us believe that he compared a symbolic event to a literal global event? No. That would be ridiculous. You are not to be taken seriously. Remember that.

 

[Hiddenthings]

LOL. I don't just randomly pick and choose. I interpret the scriptures according to their context. Your interpretation of 2 Peter 3:10-12 is a complete joke. The elements represent "rebellious peoples"? LOL. What is that based on? Look at 2 Peter 3:6-7. You would have us believe that he compared a symbolic event to a literal global event? No. That would be ridiculous. You are not to be taken seriously. Remember that.

Your line of reasoning is incongruent with the many examples of Scripture.

For example, if I were to ask why you believe the literal heavens must be destroyed, and to show both the evidence and the means by which this would occur, you would likely respond with a fanciful idea, such as layers of heaven. If I then asked where Scripture actually teaches the existence of these layers, no supporting evidence would be produced. What remains are merely imagined concepts, held onto as though they were established truth.

You continue to repeat these baseless notions not because they are demonstrated in Scripture, but because they were handed to you by a teacher who, in turn, received them from another.

What you hold to is a dogma developed over time from a mix of ancient cosmology, Jewish thought, and later philosophical interpretations.

Own it...then relook at Deut 32:1 which you now understand and apply it as the Apostle clearly did with inspiration.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Your line of reasoning is incongruent with the many examples of Scripture.

There are many examples of scripture that refer to the literal heavens and earth. Many more examples than refer to the heavens and earth symbolically.

For example, if I were to ask why you believe the literal heavens must be destroyed, and to show both the evidence and the means by which this would occur, you would likely respond with a fanciful idea, such as layers of heaven.

I never mention layers of heaven. I mentioned three heavens. Because scripture does. Paul referenced the third heaven and indicated that it's also called paradise. I get that from scripture, but you get your ideas from your imagination.

If I then asked where Scripture actually teaches the existence of these layers, no supporting evidence would be produced.

Where do you get this "layers of heaven" stuff from? You were shown that Paul referenced the third heaven/paradise in 2 Corinthians 12:2-4, so don't tell me that no supporting evidence would be produced. You just ignore the supporting evidence.

What remains are merely imagined concepts, held onto as though they were established truth.

You continue to repeat these baseless notions not because they are demonstrated in Scripture, but because they were handed to you by a teacher who, in turn, received them from another.

LOL. No one taught me what I believe. Your rambling foolishness does nothing to support your case.

What you hold to is a dogma developed over time from a mix of ancient cosmology, Jewish thought, and later philosophical interpretations.

Own it...then relook at Deut 32:1 which you now understand and apply it as the Apostle clearly did with inspiration.

LOL. I'm not going to waste any more time on your foolishness. You want me to believe that Peter compared a future symbolic event to a literal event in 2 Peter 3:6-7. I know Peter would not do something that nonsensical.

 

[Hiddenthings]

If you spent less time laughing and more time actually with your head in the Word you wouldn't have time for these pointless posts!

 

[Hiddenthings]

I never mention layers of heaven. I mentioned three heavens. Because scripture does. Paul referenced the third heaven and indicated that it's also called paradise. I get that from scripture, but you get your ideas from your imagination.

Explain to me what you think the third heaven means? And then explain the second heaven and the first.

You don't know what you know that's the issue.

 

[Hiddenthings]

Back on Topic!

Our present age is one of three “heavens and earths” spoken of in Scripture. Many interpretations have been proposed regarding their nature. In Revelation 21, John records a new vision and includes the angel’s explanation of its significance.

“And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the former heaven and the former earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.” (Rev 21:1)

The previous “heaven and earth,” having passed away, are replaced by a new heaven and a new earth, described as the final dwelling place of the redeemed. In this chapter, New Jerusalem is shown descending out of heaven, prepared as a bride for her husband. John is invited to examine the vision more closely and records details concerning the city’s walls, foundations, gates, and glory.

The expression “I saw a new heaven and a new earth” connects directly with the preceding chapter, where John states that “the earth and the heaven fled away” (Rev 20:11). This clearing away prepares for the new heaven and earth, in which sin and death are finally abolished and New Jerusalem is revealed in its completed glory.


It is essential to understand that this “new heaven and earth” is political and symbolic, not literal!!!!!

Scripture is not describing the annihilation of the physical heavens and earth, but rather a new order of divine society on earth, governed by a righteous King reigning from Jerusalem (Deut 32:1; Isa 65:17; Dan 12:3). The literal heavens and earth are consistently declared to endure forever (Eccl 1:4; Ps 125:1; 148:6; Isa 45:18).

The phrase “the former heaven and the former earth were passed away” (Rev 21:1), when read alongside Rev 20:11, confirms the symbolic nature of the language. The Greek term rendered “first” is better understood as “former,” indicating succession rather than destruction.

This places the new heaven and earth at the conclusion of Christ’s millennial reign, when sin and death are finally removed (Rev 21:4). Verse 4 reflects conditions that arise after the thousand years and identifies the prior arrangement as the “former heaven and earth” now ready to pass away. This final state corresponds to what Paul describes as the “third heaven” in relation to his vision of future glory (2 Cor 12:2).

The Three Heavens and Earths

1. The First Heaven and Earth
   This was the Kingdom of God established under the Law of Moses, symbolically described as a heaven and earth (Deut 32:1; Isa 1:2). It was presided over by Israel’s kings, with David as the righteous king whose seed would inherit the throne (Luke 1:27, 32). This symbolic heaven and earth came to an end with the destruction of the Jewish state in A.D. 70 (2 Pet 3:7), when the Law and sacrificial system were removed and the people scattered—until Israel’s regathering and statehood in 1948.
2. The Second Heaven and Earth
   This will be established at Christ’s return, with the restoration of the Kingdom of God and the Kingdom to Israel (Acts 1:6; 2 Pet 3:13).
3. The Third Heaven and Earth
   This occurs at the close of Christ’s reign, when the perfected Kingdom is delivered to the Father, “that God may be all in all” (1 Cor 15:24).

“And There Was No More Sea”

The phrase “there was no more sea” signifies the removal of sinful, mortal nations from the earth (Rev 17:15). God, through Christ, makes a full end of the nations, though not of Israel (Jer 30:11).

Throughout Scripture, the sea is a well-established symbol of nations in varying conditions:

1. Nations in turmoil—“like the troubled sea, when it cannot rest” (Isa 57:20)
2. Nations at peace—pictured after Armageddon (Rev 15:2)
3. Nations purified—represented as “clear as crystal” (Rev 4:6)
4. Nations removed entirely—here in Revelation 21, where only immortal spiritual Israel remains!

Those once described as “strangers from the commonwealth of Israel” (Eph 2:12) are brought in through baptism, becoming part of spiritual Israel, heirs of the promises to Abraham (Gal 3:28–29). In this final state, sin and death are no more, and the great declarations of Scripture are fulfilled completely and forever (Num 14:21; Hab 2:14).

 

[WPM]

The issue is @Spiritual Israelite picks and chooses which symbol they want to interpret. Everywhere Heaven and Earth is reference carries deep theological meaning.

10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens (ruling powers) will disappear with a roar; the elements (rebellious peoples) will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare.

Spiritual fails to understand that every good and perfect gift comes down from above, and that there is nothing in Heaven that requires destruction.

They also miss the well-established symbolic meaning found in Deuteronomy 32:1.

At the heart of the issue, God is speaking one language, and @Spiritual Israelite is trying to interpret it using an entirely different one. The result is inevitable: the message will never align, because the framework for understanding is wrong from the start.

What nonsense! Just butcher what you disagree with in Scripture and change it to what you have been taught. How handy! You can literally make the Bible say what you want.

 

[WPM]

Explain to me what you think the third heaven means? And then explain the second heaven and the first.

You don't know what you know that's the issue.

The third heaven is where God, the angels and the dead in Christ dwell.
The second heaven is where the planets and stars function.
The first heaven is the atmospheric heavens where birds fly.

 

[Hiddenthings]

What nonsense! Just butcher what you disagree with in Scripture and change it to what you have been taught. How handy! You can literally make the Bible say what you want.

In the same manner in creating layers of Heavens and assigning what you will to those layers. The hypocrisy is rife!

 

[WPM]

In the same manner in creating layers of Heavens and assigning what you will to those layers. The hypocrisy is rife!

You are describing your theology.

 

[Hiddenthings]

The third heaven is where God, the angels and the dead in Christ dwell.
The second heaven is where the planets and stars function.
The first heaven is the atmospheric heavens where birds fly.

Plenty of textual support there WPM!

So with each of these passing away what is left lol!

You don't understand the context of heaven and earth and I doubt you ever will.

 

[WPM]

Plenty of textual support there WPM!

So with each of these passing away what is left lol!

You don't understand the context of heaven and earth and I doubt you ever will.

Where is the 3rd heaven?

 

[jeffweeder]

Where is the 3rd heaven?

 

[Hiddenthings]

Where is the 3rd heaven?

I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago (whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows) was caught up to the third heaven. 12:3 And I know that this man (whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, God knows) 12:4 was caught up into paradise and heard things too sacred to be put into words, things that a person is not permitted to speak. 2 Co 12:2–4.

Context:

Some have suggested that this experience occurred during Paul’s time in Arabia (cf. Gal 1:17; 2:1). A more compelling proposal, however, is that it coincides with Paul’s vision of Christ in Acts 18:9–10, during his ministry in Corinth. There the Lord appeared to Paul in a vision, encouraging him not to fear but to continue speaking, assuring him of divine protection and revealing that many in the city belonged to God. As a result, Paul remained in Corinth for a year and a half, teaching the word of God.

Paul’s visions of Christ are not so frequent that this alignment is likely coincidental. While the phrase “fourteen years ago” (2 Cor 12:2) may have meant little to newer members of the Corinthian community, it would have carried significant weight for those whom Paul himself baptized during his extended stay. For them, it served as a powerful reminder that their conversion was grounded in a genuine and direct “vision and revelation of the Lord” (2 Cor 12:1). Without such divine assurance, Paul might well have moved on quickly from Corinth rather than establishing the ecclesia there.

Questions:

Does caught up mean caught away?
Where is Paradise located?
Why is it called third heaven?
Heard things to sacred to put into words!

Contextual question:

Did Paul, during the “vision and revelation” described in Acts 18:9, receive a view of the Kingdom—understood as the third-heaven and earth period when God is “all in all”—similar to the vision Christ granted to Peter, James, and John at the Transfiguration (Matt 16:28)?

While I have my own conclusions, it is more constructive to weigh the evidence within the text itself and to review the various heaven and earth periods in which former things pass away and new governance is introduced as in Isaiah 65 & Rev 21.