Near death experience (NDE) and spiritual dreams and visions.

[stevesonthebay]

I am wondering where the visions from NDE come from. These are different to dreams and visions in the usual sense. Where dreams are not actually like everyday life. But more dreamlike. The person later knows that they had a dream or vision in their mind.

Whereas NDE is often described as like everyday real life. Even more real. Like I am now doing in typing this post. That real. It often dramatically changes the person. Non believers become religious and others completely change their life. Or have a complete worldview change.

Though being like everyday real life vision is often all encompassing. Experiencers find it hard to describe. But theres an ability to see 380 degrees. See through substraight and be transported instantly.

I assume this has something to do with consciousness. Consciousness is a strange phenomena we have little understanding.

But how does this fit in with say the visions of prophesy or revelations from God. Are they connected. Is consciousness itself a phenomena that can transcend into the spiritual and tap into perhaps some spiritual aspect that brings knowledge and visions. Different examples of the same basic phenomena.

 

[Taken]

Near death experience (NDE) and spiritual dreams and visions.

A so called “NDE”…IS Literally A Death of the Body.
* The Body’s “LIFE” Blood has stopped Flowing.
* The “Signal” is the Heart has stopped Beating.

WHEN a bodily Death occurs…
The “Living soul” IN the Body “Departs OUT of a “DEAD body”

The Departed Living Soul…
IS:
* Escorted TO Heaven (if saved)
Or
* Sent TO Hell (if not saved)

Such “Living Soul”, experiences…
* The pleasure of peace in Heaven
Or
* The displeasure of torments in Hell.

A Departed living Soul, “experiencing” ether, Heaven or Hell…
And THEN , by, through, of the Power of God…
Such Living Soul Returned… to its Body…
That Body “Resumes Living” ( blood flowing, heart beating).

The Living Soul and Carnal Mind… of THAT person…may or may not Recall it’s Souls Experience, while it WAS departed out of its dead body.

Such events are neither “dreams or visions”, but rather Literal Experiences of a “Departed Living Soul”.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Rockerduck]

The devil himself is deceiving many people and as many as possible for he knows his time is short. The more he can influence people to believe in something else other than Jesus. I call NDE's devil dreams. When they return to their bodies they are preaching love, and not Jesus.

 

[soberxp]

When they return to their bodies they are preaching love, and not Jesus.

What's the difference between love and Jesus?
Is love evil?

 

[Jericho]

I assume this has something to do with consciousness. Consciousness is a strange phenomena we have little understanding.

I have a working theory that the brain acts as an antenna or receiver. It is the bridge between the consciousness and the body. Some things can happen to the brain to damage it and scramble the signal, so to speak, but consciousness remains unaffected. There is the idea of non-local consciousness, that is, consciousness does not reside in the brain but outside of it, possibly in a fourth spatial dimension. So, at death, consciousness disconnects from the brain, and we become aware of the hyperdimensional world around us.

Operating at higher dimensions would explain phenomena that are otherwise unexplainable, like walking through walls as Jesus did. With an extra dimension, you would have the ability to see through things without opening them and all sorts of other strange abilities. As to how something from a higher dimension can interact with our three-dimensional world, I don't know. But when you think about it, our consciousness already does that. Something as immaterial as thoughts can affect our physical bodies and cause them to have symptoms. So, there is a verifiable link between the immaterial and the material.

I see NDEs not as visions but as actual events. Some people dismiss them as being anecdotal. To some degree that is true, but others are not so easy to dismiss. There is no logical explanation when someone experiencing an NDE sees or hears something that is impossible for them to know, and it is corroborated by others. I think they are getting a glimpse of the spiritual, hyperdimensional world around us that is imperceptible to us.

 

[Jericho]

The devil himself is deceiving many people and as many as possible for he knows his time is short. The more he can influence people to believe in something else other than Jesus. I call NDE's devil dreams. When they return to their bodies they are preaching love, and not Jesus.

Not all NDEs may be genuine. However, if it were a Satanic deception, it seems to have the opposite effect of whatever it is intended to do. It has a dramatic effect on them and changes their life for the better, and many do talk about Jesus. Can the devil cause someone to experience an NDE? I don't know. We don't know that he has that ability. But even if he can, we can't suppose every NDE is a demonic deception. Demons simply cannot be everywhere at once.

 

[Rockerduck]

Not all NDEs may be genuine. However, if it were a Satanic deception, it seems to have the opposite effect of whatever it is intended to do. It has a dramatic effect on them and changes their life for the better, and many do talk about Jesus. Can the devil cause someone to experience an NDE? I don't know. We don't know that he has that ability. But even if he can, we can't suppose every NDE is a demonic deception. Demons simply cannot be everywhere at once.

Believe me there are millions of demons around us, I've seen them. They can't touch a born-again Christian. They sure can influence us. That is why The Apostle Paul said put on the Armor to fight the fiery darts of Satanic forces. Yes, of course, demons can enter a non-believers body. Remember "LEGION". A demon can enter a body and speak through them, and give them dreams, since they have control over you..

 

[soberxp]

Believe me there are millions of demons around us, I've seen them. They can't touch a born-again Christian. They sure can influence us. That is why The Apostle Paul said put on the Armor to fight the fiery darts of Satanic forces. Yes, of course, demons can enter a non-believers body. Remember "LEGION". A demon can enter a body and speak through them, and give them dreams, since they have control over you..

No, only if a human beings allows demon control over him, No matter what one is born-again Christian or not, the demon couldn't control over one.

 

[Rockerduck]

No, only if a human beings allows demon control over him, No matter what one is born-again Christian or not, the demon couldn't control over one.

How do you know this?

 

[Rockerduck]

What's the difference between love and Jesus?
Is love evil?

You can preach love all day and not preach the salvation of Jesus who loves you and died for you.

 

[soberxp]

How do you know this?

I was once tempted by the devil, but fortunately I didn't surrender my control. It was just that fleeting thought in my mind for an instant. It's a Spiritual being as the ghost but black and many of them in one body.

I have also encountered people who were controlled by the devil and told lies all the time, and not a single word the one said could be considered logically sound and honest. The one kept attacking me with accusatory words.

 

[soberxp]

You can preach love all day and not preach the salvation of Jesus who loves you and died for you.

If it was the lovely word from(or same truth of) Jesus Christ, doesn't even matter if one must knows who Jesus Christ really Is.

Jesus Christ must knows who the one is, I don't believe that Jesus Christ shall say :"I never knew you, leave me alone."

 

[Rockerduck]

If it was the lovely word from(or same truth of) Jesus Christ, doesn't even matter if one must knows who Jesus Christ really Is.

Jesus Christ must knows who the one is, I don't believe that Jesus Christ shall say :"I don't know you, leave me alone."

They don't know Jesus. The Churches preach Love, that's it. Not salvation through Jesus Christ. You can only say Jesus is Lord by the Holy Spirit.
1 Corinthians 12:3

 

[soberxp]

They don't know Jesus. The Churches preach Love, that's it. Not salvation through Jesus Christ. You can only say Jesus is Lord by the Holy Spirit.
1 Corinthians 12:3

For the letters kill, but holy spirit gives life.
Also Jesus Christ said: not everyone who says Lord,Lord,........

Seems like only say Jesus is Lord that is not the key.

 

[stevesonthebay]

Near death experience (NDE) and spiritual dreams and visions.

A so called “NDE”…IS Literally A Death of the Body.
* The Body’s “LIFE” Blood has stopped Flowing.
* The “Signal” is the Heart has stopped Beating.

What about out of body experiences (OBE) without the person dying.

WHEN a bodily Death occurs…
The “Living soul” IN the Body “Departs OUT of a “DEAD body”

The Departed Living Soul…
IS:
* Escorted TO Heaven (if saved)
Or
* Sent TO Hell (if not saved)

I am not sure they actually go to heaven or hell. Often they experience their own bodies below them or seeing relatives. Seeing a bright light but never going in. Or they may have a life reflection or visit a loved one in real life.

Such “Living Soul”, experiences…
* The pleasure of peace in Heaven
Or
* The displeasure of torments in Hell.

A Departed living Soul, “experiencing” ether, Heaven or Hell…
And THEN , by, through, of the Power of God…
Such Living Soul Returned… to its Body…
That Body “Resumes Living” ( blood flowing, heart beating).

Another thing they mention is feeling the heaviness of themselves entering back into their bodies. As though their light spirit felt the weight of the world as they entered back in.

The Living Soul and Carnal Mind… of THAT person…may or may not Recall it’s Souls Experience, while it WAS departed out of its dead body.

Such events are neither “dreams or visions”, but rather Literal Experiences of a “Departed Living Soul”.

Glory to God,
Taken

Thankyou. But i am interested in how these experiences relate to the visions and dreams people have such as prophesy or spiritual visions. Is this entering the same realm where people experience near death or out of body visions.

Then you have normal dreams. Where do they fit. These are more psychological. Or at least regarded so. As a way to sort and store memories and sort through complicated thoughts and feelings.

Are they all related. Why should a person have dreams or visions. According to atheistic science having dreams and visions is like a computer having dreams and visions. A 3 pound lump of tissue is not suppose to have visions and dreams.

This is obviously all associated with consciousness. Is consciousness the vehicle for which all this happens. Is what God uses to give people dreams and visions.

 

[soberxp]

What about out of body experiences (OBE) without the person dying.

I am not sure they actually go to heaven or hell. Often they experience their own bodies below them or seeing relatives. Seeing a bright light but never going in. Or they may have a life reflection or visit a loved one in real life.

Another thing they mention is feeling the heaviness of themselves entering back into their bodies. As though their light spirit felt the weight of the world as they entered back in.

Thankyou. But i am interested in how these experiences relate to the visions and dreams people have such as prophesy or spiritual visions. Is this entering the same realm where people experience near death or out of body visions.

Then you have normal dreams. Where do they fit. These are more psychological. Or at least regarded so. As a way to sort and store memories and sort through complicated thoughts and feelings.

Are they all related. Why should a person have dreams or visions. According to atheistic science having dreams and visions is like a computer having dreams and visions. A 3 pound lump of tissue is not suppose to have visions and dreams.

This is obviously all associated with consciousness. Is consciousness the vehicle for which all this happens. Is what God uses to give people dreams and visions.

I once encountered the soul of my grandmother who was still alive around me.

 

[stevesonthebay]

I have a working theory that the brain acts as an antenna or receiver. It is the bridge between the consciousness and the body. Some things can happen to the brain to damage it and scramble the signal, so to speak, but consciousness remains unaffected.

I would have thought it was the opposite. That if the brain is a reciever or transmitter. Then like a radio box if its damaged the signal may be distorted or weaker. If completely detroyed then lost. Despite the radio signals still being a reality out in the universe.

Similar to consciousness. Damage to the brain may distort consciousness and complete permanate death consciousness is lost. But still consciousness exists outside that body. There may be varying levels of consciousness depending on the sophistication of the reciever. A dog has less consciousness than a human.

There is the idea of non-local consciousness, that is, consciousness does not reside in the brain but outside of it, possibly in a fourth spatial dimension. So, at death, consciousness disconnects from the brain, and we become aware of the hyperdimensional world around us.

Yes this makes sense. So do you think NDE is tapping into that dimension. Is this the same realm as where visions and dreams come from. Are visions and dreams in prophesy or spiritual revelations more or less an out of body experience.

Operating at higher dimensions would explain phenomena that are otherwise unexplainable, like walking through walls as Jesus did. With an extra dimension, you would have the ability to see through things without opening them and all sorts of other strange abilities.

Yes this is a common theme. People having supernatural abilities. The strange thing though it seems to always take place in this world. They are walking or seeing through walls in situations of this world. Often within for example the operating theatre. Floating above or seeing through to the next room or even a room down the hall.

But never some vision of a mystical place or a heaven like place. Like with visions in the bible. Though most see a bright light and some mention visions of a beautiful earthly place and some may mention bright colors shining like precious gems and crystals which is mentioned in Revelations.

As to how something from a higher dimension can interact with our three-dimensional world, I don't know. But when you think about it, our consciousness already does that. Something as immaterial as thoughts can affect our physical bodies and cause them to have symptoms. So, there is a verifiable link between the immaterial and the material.

Yes, almost like each person has a spirit in them. I am wondering if consciousness is connected to what we call the spiritual aspect of humans. That this is a sort of life force that all falls within consciousness and spirituality.

Maybe the lifeforce is the vehicle and the spirit is the conscious self that exists and goes on. Because at some point life as we know it will cease but our spirits will go on.

Is the dreams and visions in the bible and what some have relating to God tapping into this spiritual realm. I know that there can be false dreams and visions and this could also include psychological disorders. Its hard to sort it all out.

I see NDEs not as visions but as actual events. Some people dismiss them as being anecdotal. To some degree that is true, but others are not so easy to dismiss. There is no logical explanation when someone experiencing an NDE sees or hears something that is impossible for them to know, and it is corroborated by others. I think they are getting a glimpse of the spiritual, hyperdimensional world around us that is imperceptible to us.

Its so hard to work out. Its such a complicated topic. Dreams and visions can be had for various reasons from brain damage, psychodelic drugs, toxins and complications during medical proceedures. Stressful and traumatic experiences. There are so many layers.

But a common theme with NDE is that the person usually can tell between a dream or vision in the usual sense and one that is clear and real like everyday real. IT will stay with them and often completely change them. Its never fragmented or distressing.

Theres usually a life changing message and experience.

Which makes me wonder if this is sort of the same as spiritual visions and dreams. Except one is for the deification of the church and the other about the individual. But they exist in the same realm.

 

[stevesonthebay]

I once encountered the soul of my grandmother who was still alive around me.

Yes its a interesting phenomena. I believe this can happen. The spirit of a person can disembody and be experienced by another. Instantly teleported to that place because there is no time and space.

In other words the spiritual aspect is real and its not constrained to the body.

 

[Taken]

What about out of body experiences (OBE) without the person dying.

Not familiar of such claims.

I am not sure they actually go to heaven or hell. Often they experience their own bodies below them or seeing relatives. Seeing a bright light but never going in. Or they may have a life reflection or visit a loved one in real life.

I would say, a soul departing it’s body, would momentarily see it’s body and Surrounding, as it was ascending or descending.

Another thing they mention is feeling the heaviness of themselves entering back into their bodies. As though their light spirit felt the weight of the world as they entered back in.

Felt a heaviness, to me, is a physical person trying to describe a spiritual event to the best of their ability. Nothing alarming to me.

But i am interested in how these experiences relate to the visions and dreams people have such as prophesy or spiritual visions. Is this entering the same realm where people experience near death or out of body visions.

I would say…
An (Out of body experience), of the Soul Departing a dead Body and then Returning to the Body, and the Body resume Living…
Is NOTHING NEW.

As well … Dreams and Visions are NOTHING NEW.

Considering World Population 5-6 thousand years ago…( a few Ancient documented cases / Visions, Dreams, Departed Soul Experience…
Today, Billions of people, and some claiming same such experiences.
(some may be true, some may be fake…
* Interesting part…Anciently in Scriptural records…
*Visions and Dreams…Yes… broadcasted.
* Departed souls, returned to Body, (I don’t find Ancient records of Such “resumed living person”) “their word” describing “their experience”??

Most famous case…Lazarus’ … he speaks nothing of “his soul departure experience”.

Today “modern”… some claims are made, regarding a persons departed soul experience.

Then you have normal dreams. Where do they fit. These are more psychological. Or at least regarded so. As a way to sort and store memories and sort through complicated thoughts and feelings.

I would first say…an individual would have to “have” some understanding of the Difference between “his Body and his Soul” and the intent, purpose and role / for each.

I think…”regular” (as you indicate) dreams, lean more on the CARNAL MINDFUL sub-Conscious thoughts your AWAKE Mind / had a fleeting thought, experienced, and dismissed at the (awake) moment, and forgot about.
Yet, every thought, experience your Carnal Mind has thought, (imo), still exists IN the Mind….
Recalled, in Dreams (while sleeping, ie sub-conscious??) possibly…

Are they all related.

Off-hand, I would say no.
Why?
Because Carnal Minded “thoughts, visions, while awake or sleeping”…are Fleshly / Natural…
Opposed to:
Supernatural Visions, “do Not come from what you naturally See, Hear, Imagine.”
Supernatural Visions and Dreams ARE from God Who IS Spirit.. TO that part of a man that it’s Life is spiritual … ie the Soul (which it’s life IS…Gods Breath).
** and noting… Scripture “reveals”…in LAST DAYS… is When “Visions and Dreams”… on a Massive Basis;
Shall be given From God.

Why should a person have dreams or visions. According to atheistic science having dreams and visions is like a computer having dreams and visions.

All fields of “Science” is discovery and experiments and best guess conclusions.

A 3 pound lump of tissue is not suppose to have visions and dreams.

You under estimate (by a weight measurement) the phenomenal ability of Gods creation and making of a man’s Brain.

If you have ever seen or held a man’s brain (I have)… it looks like old grey stuffing, rolled into something that looks like A dredlock and fixed into two equal domed forms side by side (of sorts)… strange and dull, unassuming and unimpressive.

This is obviously all associated with consciousness. Is consciousness the vehicle for which all this happens. Is what God uses to give people dreams and visions.

Sure.
With consideration…
The difference between the NATURAL capabilities…
And
The SPIRITUAL Capabilities… God HAS Anciently Given “A Few”… and The Prophecy, not yet come to pass… “END DayS”…MASSES receiving Visions and Dreams…From The Spirit of God.

Thanks for the conversation.
God bless you.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

I once encountered the soul of my grandmother who was still alive around me.

Don’t believe that. If your grandmother was bodily alive, her soul was IN her, Not departed traveling about.

I would rather believe you experienced A Pleasant thought, smell, an object, sound that reminded you of her.

Glory to God,
Taken