Should we as Christians support the State of Israel ?

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amigo de christo

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This is prophesy....so what is the bigger picture? Who are “God’s people Israel” in our day?
Are they the same nation of “God’s people” that the whole of the OT is about?

The apostle Paul tells us the story....he likens what Jehovah originally had in mind to the development of an olive tree, a tree common to his native land of Israel...... the root of this typical olive tree was Abraham himself. The tree stock, or trunk, that sprang up from Abraham was made up of his son Isaac, his grandson Jacob, (or Israel), and the 12 sons of Jacob, who were the fathers of the 12 tribes of Israel.

By natural descent, members of those 12 patriarchs were branches in that typical olive tree. As such, they were directly in line to become the promised “seed of Abraham” by means of whom “all the families and nations of the earth would be blessed” according to Jehovah’s promise. But what they did not know about this “seed” was that it was not going to be a fleshly seed by natural descent from the patriarch Abraham.....it was to be a spiritual “seed.”...Jesus had to be born as a human descendant of Abraham, and he was legally as the perceived son of Mary and Joseph.....but he was not related to Abraham biologically at all, because he was “the son of God”. His parents knew that.

Those who were chosen to rule with Christ in heaven, were not going to only be natural Israelites by fleshly descent from Abraham, because the natural Jews murdered their own Messiah, that was the last straw for God...Jesus had already sealed their fate. (Matt 23:33, 37-39)

Who was Jesus sent to? “None by the lost sheep of the house of Israel”....these “lost” ones were to be the foundation of spiritual Israel, joined later by gentiles who came to Christ. (Acts 10:34-35) These became “the Israel of God”. (Gal 6:16)

God used the adoption laws in Israel to choose a new family of “sons” to fulfill his purpose....as natural Israel were serial covenant breakers....these sons, taken into a new covenant, would not let him down.
A child by adoption was viewed in the same way as a child by blood.

As was prophesied, only a small “remnant” of the natural Jews were “saved” to be the seed of God’s promise to Abraham, to be heirs of his “promise,” as foretold in Isaiah 10:22. Paul quotes this prophecy in Romans 9:27 to show us what it meant in that later fulfilment. Only a remnant of the natural Jews accepted Jesus as Messiah. And those saved would be spiritual Israel, not the incorrigible nation that murdered their own Messiah, after a history of continued disobedience.

God originally accepted them as his people on one condition...that they strictly obeyed his laws....as soon as they broke them, they invalided their side of their legally binding covenant. Their spiritual decline over the centuries merited God’s abandonment, after he had lived up to his side of the agreement.

God owes natural Israel, nothing. He transferred his love and blessings to a new spiritual nation.....why would he keep serial offenders in existence when his law was clear.
Obey and live...disobey and die.....this was the only two options available to them...they chose their own destiny.
Will we emulate them by our own disobedience?
look at your first question . Verily verily i say unto thee and unto all
NOT all of israel is OF ISRAEL and all who are OF ISRAEL BELIEVE THE TESTIMONY OF GOD that HE gave OF THE SON .
that ought to be simple enough .
 
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amigo de christo

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This is what most people miss....when God abandoned the Jews, he handed them over to the god they chose to serve....the ones who thought that ancestry carried weight that disobedience did not invalidate.

They were wrong! Their ancestry carried no weight at all when Christ came, which is why John the Baptist could say to that disobedient nation.......
“And do not presume to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father,’ for I tell you, God is able from these stones to raise up children for Abraham. Even now the axe is laid to the root of the trees. Every tree therefore that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.” (Matt 3:9-10 ESV)

What “fruitage” have this nation produced throughout their sad and sorry history?

When God was with them, no nation could defeat them...they did not have to rely on worldly nations to back them up.....their God alone was all the backup they needed, but when they made alliances with worldly nations out of fear and lack of faith, God left them to the consequences of rejecting him...he allowed their enemies to conquer them. If the nations of today like the USA failed to provide backup, Israel on its own would be lost....but they are still lost due to their own disobedience and reliance on others.....where is their God fighting for them?

Jesus said to them.....
“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! See, your house is left to you desolate. For I tell you, you will not see me again, until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’” (Matt 23:37-39 ESV)

The house of Israel was left to them, desolate......that “house” (nation) would not see Jesus again until it recognises Jesus as Messiah, who came in the name of Yahweh, his Father.
For the last 2000 years Israel has denied Jesus as the Christ....and many hate Christians for pointing out to them that their Messiah is not coming....he’s been and gone and is due back again, “appointed by God as judge of the living and the dead.”

Israel are just as much a part of the world as any other nation. They are not special, nor are they “saved” because Abraham is their ancestor.....God raised up another nation to replace them as his “people”.
This nation is exclusively God’s property and no ethnicity is required to become part of its citizenry.

Acts 10:34-43....
“So Peter opened his mouth and said: “Truly I understand that God shows no partiality, but in every nation anyone who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him. As for the word that he sent to Israel, preaching good news of peace through Jesus Christ (he is Lord of all), you yourselves know what happened throughout all Judea, beginning from Galilee after the baptism that John proclaimed: how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power. He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with him. And we are witnesses of all that he did both in the country of the Jews and in Jerusalem. They put him to death by hanging him on a tree, but God raised him on the third day and made him to appear, not to all the people but to us who had been chosen by God as witnesses, who ate and drank with him after he rose from the dead. And he commanded us to preach to the people and to testify that he is the one appointed by God to be judge of the living and the dead. To him all the prophets bear witness that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.” (ESV)

There is so much in that passage of Scripture....what is “the good news of peace” that was preached in Israel so that they could be free of the conflicts and adverse judgments that had always plagued them due to their disobedience?

When God was with Israel, they prospered, but when they disobeyed, God abandoned them to their enemies, and they were helpless....defeated and lost, until he rescued them time and again. Why did he put up with their continued disobedience, when such conduct invalided his covenant with them?

His purpose in connection with them had to fulfill prophesy...they were the ones through whom the Savior would be born. And as Peter stated.... “They put him to death by hanging him on a tree, but God raised him on the third day and made him to appear, not to all the people but to us who had been chosen by God as witnesses“.

Those who support the physical nation of Israel today, are those who expect a reward for that support....the so called “Christian nations” who still believe what the Bible says, pertains to literal the inhabitants of Jerusalem....

Zechariah 8: 20-23 from the ASV....
“Thus saith Jehovah of hosts: It shall yet come to pass, that there shall come peoples, and the inhabitants of many cities; and the inhabitants of one city shall go to another, saying, Let us go speedily to entreat the favor of Jehovah, and to seek Jehovah of hosts: I will go also. Yea, many peoples and strong nations shall come to seek Jehovah of hosts in Jerusalem, and to entreat the favor of Jehovah. Thus saith Jehovah of hosts: In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold, out of all the languages of the nations, they shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you, for we have heard that God is with you.

This is prophesy....though like many prophesies, not fully understood until after its fulfilment.

We see this today as the non-Jewish nations placating Jehovah for a reward for hanging onto the coattails of natural Jews, when speaking prophetically of a time when the natural Jews (as a nation) would be abandoned, as incorrigible....just as Jesus said. (Matt 23: 13-15, 33)

This is not a prophesy about literal Israel, but spiritual Israel, adopted as “sons of God” who will rule with Christ, not in literal Jerusalem but in heavenly Jerusalem.

Hebrews 12:22-26....
“But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to innumerable angels in festal gathering, and to the assembly of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel. See that you do not refuse him who is speaking. For if they did not escape when they refused him who warned them on earth, much less will we escape if we reject him who warns from heaven. At that time his voice shook the earth, but now he has promised, “Yet once more I will shake not only the earth but also the heavens. (ESV)

How do we understand the warning here?

God is about to bring his purpose to fulfilment.....to “shake” up not only the earth, where the rebellion took place, but also the heavens, where the first rebel originated, and took a third of the angels with him.
Israel is warning example to Christendom....

All mankind are about to face the end of this satanically controlled world, and the imprisonment of satan and his angels....so that they cannot interfere with his purpose any longer....this is in order to bring us back to Eden....to our beginning....and to the life God first intended for the human race. (Rev 21:2-4) A restoration.

Under the rulership of the “Prince of Peace”, all who love war, and who are involved in the filthy politics and bloodshed of this corrupt world, will have no place. (John 18:36)

Will we be among the saved or the lost? By our own decisions we determine our own destiny.
look at your last question and last st atment .
THEN REMEMBER , CHOOSE YE THIS DAY WHOM YE SHALL SERVE
as for the sheep ITS GONNA BE THE CHRIST OF GOD ALL MIGHTY . SO choose ye this day
whom ye shall believe
will it be men of the ecumeincal interfaith interreligious who say ALL RELIGOINS are serving the same GOD differently
and thus follow a LIE
or will it be THE GOD WHO TESTIFIED ON THE SON . That YE MUST ABSOLUTELY BEIEVE ON HIM .
the sheep CHOSE JESUS and chose RIGHT . the cinos choose wrong as does every other false religoin .
ONLY JESUS SAVES and to be saved YE MUST BELEIVE ON HIM . and if we BELIEVE ON HIM, we had BELIEVED HIS WORDS
we had BELIEVED TRUTH .
FOR HE CAME TO TESITFY OF TRUTH . so hope that helps this wayward inclusive false love ecumeincal generation
TO GET THE HECK OUTTA that camp fast .
 
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amigo de christo

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Stop posting lies.
You are worse than your saviour Trump
Trump cannot save himself let alone any other .
The nar realm cannot save themselves let alone any other .
The RCC and her ecumeincal cup of fornication will save none .
JESUS sav es . SO i suggest ITS HE WE PREACH , HIS GOSPEL , HIS WORDS we teach .
Just a friendly reminder to us all . NOw to the trenches one and all .
 
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amigo de christo

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Absolutely, no matter what they do as a nation to stay blessed. Otherwise, we will be cursed and incur the wrath of God.
you sure about that . Israel as a nation supports that which is of anti christ and its ecumiencal lie .
NOW had we truly l oved them or any other people of any other nation
WE HAD FOCUSED ON THE HEAVENLY and had preached THAT MESSAGE , THAT KINGDOM
THAT CHRIST , THAT GOSPEL . i suggest we all be on guard . Cause i sure did try and warn even YOU
that they are creeping into ALL CAMPS now . Just a friendly , but dire necessary reminder .
 
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amigo de christo

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Jesus came under the law to fulfill all prophesy, the Jews rejected Jesus. Then Jesus got rid of Mosaic law and even foretold that the temple would be destroyed and told His disciples to flee when they see the troops surround Jerusalem 40 yrs later. Pentecost changed everything., now only Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. Paul said there is neither Jew, nor Greek anymore, we are one in Christ. Everyone on earth must come to salvation in Jesus. There is no plan for any nation anymore. When Christ returns, He is going to destroy the earth. Then there will be a new Heaven and a new earth. Why would today's Israel want to build a temple and go back to the Mosaic law? They still violently reject Jesus.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-8 - and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, 8 dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.

2 Peter 3:10-13 - But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar and the elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and its works will be burned up. Since all these things are to be destroyed in this way, what sort of people ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness, looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be destroyed by burning, and the elements will melt with intense heat! 13
But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells.

Revelation 21:1 -Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and there is no longer any sea.
FRIEND , STAY GLUED TO CHRIST . a massive and world wide delusion has fast grown and fast came upon the nations of the world
their churches and the false religoins , even athiest and etc .
AND ITS NOT GONNA POINT THEM TO JESUS THE CHRIST either .
ITS GONNA POINT THEM TO THEIR OWN KINGDOM NOW WORLD UTOPAI ANTI CHRIST LED peace plan .
WHICH WILL LEAD THEM ALL TO PERDTION on the day OF GOD ALL MIGHTY and THE LAMB
STAY GLUED to the gospel . STAY GLUED TO THE HEAVENLY KINGDOM and THAT MESSAGE , THAT CHRIST , THAT GOSPEL
cause all else is vain and will not profit them at all ON the day OF THE LORD .
 
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amigo de christo

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What about this?

Amos 9:14-15
"I will restore the fortunes of my people Israel, and they shall rebuild the ruined cities and inhabit them; they shall plant vineyards and drink their wine, and they shall make gardens and eat their fruit. 15 I will plant them on their land, AND THEY SHALL NEVER AGAIN BE UPROOTED out of the land that I have given them,” says the Lord your God.
and guess who quoated this in acts . JAMES DID
when talking about even the gentiles being added into THIS KINGDOM . AND BELIEVE ME ITS A HEAVELY ONE .
read acts . read all about it . IT WAS ALWAYS PONTING TO CHRIST JESUS .
Go and behold , i believe it is the fifteenth chapter . Some of us READ and love to read our bibles .
SO FEEL Free to ask questions . and DO TEST my answers , but do it against THE BIBLE please .
 
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amigo de christo

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Stop posting lies.
You are worse than your saviour Trump
many moons and years ago , before two thousand and seven
and shortly after Nine ELEVEN
a man spoke . HE t old the peoples what the elites , the rothschilds had revealed to him .
That the war on terror would be a means to get us all into a digital trap .
And that america would end up going into five major countries .
IF memory serves me he mentioned Afhganistain , iraq , pakisttan , now pull your boots on and sit down
cause HE also said VENEZUALA and IRAN . AND TRUMP ACCOMPLISHED THE LATTER TWO
and folks GOT AMENSIA and thinks HE DOING the will of a savoir .
N O HE AINT . HE DOING THE WILL OF THE VERY ONE WORLD ORDER HE cliams to be against .
THEY ARE ALL DECIEVING EVERY LAST ONE OF US . NONE of them cares about us , nOT YOU
not me , NOT THE RIGHT , not the left . ITS ALL FOR POWER AND cONTROL .
AND GUESS What , THE DIGITAL IS GOING TO BE THAT VERY SOLUTION OF ALL THE NATIONS .
 
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amigo de christo

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When o when is this people gonna stop trusting in men
and s tart trusting ONLY IN GOD , IN HIS CHRIST .
CURSED is the man , whether right or left WHOSE TRUST IS IN MAN
Blessed is the man whose HOPE BE IN GOD and THUS WOULD HAVE BEEN IN HIS CHRIST . bible time folks
 
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amigo de christo

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Absolutely, no matter what they do as a nation to stay blessed. Otherwise, we will be cursed and incur the wrath of God.
Here is who shall incur the wrath of GOD .
ALL WHO DENIED HIS SON . and that lil lady IS A FACT . whether a jew or gentile THEY WILL WAIL .
May i , m ight i , SUGGEST we all return to preaching OF JESUS THE CHRIST
and by all means get everyone out anything connected in any way to anything ecumeincal and NOW .
as in NOT LATER NOW but RIGHT NOW .
 
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amigo de christo

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Stop posting lies.
You are worse than your saviour Trump
if one agrees not with trump , didnt you know they must be communist
just like if one does not agree with liberal , dont ya know they must be a hater of democracy , as even biden has said and others .
But you wanna know what both camps will soon have in common
and in part already do .
HEY IF YOU AGREE WITH THE BIBLE , THAT DOCTRINE , THAT JESUS
YOU JUST NEEDS TO BE RIDDED FROM THE EARTH . fundamental biblical christanity
IS their enemy and THAT JESUS .
Both sides gonna be real happy to be rid of men like me in the days ahead
EVEN beliving they do the will of GOD , OF LOVE and FOR PEACE N SAFETY .
ITS ALL been a snare . its all been a delusion to make ready this world
for a digital solution and to rid the earth of ALL who did not conform .
 
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Boog2

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Lol. We “should do” what the spirit inside us tells us to do. The answer is not the same for everyone. ‘Goodness’ is obvious, but after that each individual’s heart holds their answer………
 

Reggie Belafonte

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Impotent rage of Australians, China's Type 055 destroyer is right at your doorstep, yet you are helpless. You rely on the United States to help you, but you are nothing more than America's lapdog and gangster henchmen.

May God protect you, for in the face of real war, that will be the fruits you deserve. At least for now, it's just a warning.
Why thank you kindly ! because I know that is in fact the Truth !

We are not against the People of China at all, It's that people like me do not like Dictators because we value Virtue ! for True Chrisians we are no ones Cattle.

I may even have some respect for China's Leader in regards that he is a better Leader for his own Nations people, than our PM who is a total Jerk himself ! a boy man.

But China's Leader is clearly on an insane path, that will not go down well for anyone in fact ! unless if one has no value for peoples lives.

Your Communism is a Death Cult in fact ! Communism has killed howmany people in China alone ? you want to wake up to yourself ! and snap out of it !
Communism in China is only being played on This footing for it's ends ! but if it's ends come to play, you will see all such tactics change and turn 180 deg for you and your people. and the wealthy in China will have everything taken off them. because that's true Communism to keep everyone down.

Not to mention Socialism is just a tool that leads to Communism and it's all about a Mob of Tyrants that only want to make Slaves of all who are under them in fact !

So if one is totaly Possessed, such a one would support crap like Communism ! and want to be at the Top ?

Sure we have Issues with Capitalism because of trash people and uneducated dolts that are clearly Lost ! such are criminal minded slobs.

Have a nice day ! and try not to drag people down ! but try and lift them up, for their own health and everyones true foundations of welbeing ! For what is sick is in fact just only sick.
 

Reggie Belafonte

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Stop posting lies.
You are worse than your saviour Trump
Don't you know that you are a supporter of Communist ? or at least a Socialist dupe.
Maybe your just an anti Capitalist ? one who sees only the evil in such, is that it ?

I can see the evil in Capitalism ! but such is out of control because the people are lead astray. uneducated on the subject, just as any Socialist or Communist that are under such Delusions, because who works to creat all such deceptions ?

You know if I were to talk to you personaly we may get on just fine.

You know my best mate, we would argue till the cowes came home for years, because he was a lefty ! look he taught me some things that I agree with for sure that I was once wrong about, but he is not a lefty anymore. and I am not so far right. For such as They do not fool us anymore. because we bothered to talk throught all such in depth, regardless how angered we got at each other.
 

Aunty Jane

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The "bigger picture" is that Israel was extinct for 1,900 years and, as promised, it was restored. Obviously, Israel remains an integral part of God's plan, your word-salad dissertation notwithstanding.
You are missing an important point.....”the nation of Israel” today is not that “Israel”. The fleshly Jews of today are not worshippers of the God of Abraham.....any more than the Pharisees of Jesus day, were true worshippers of Jehovah.....(Matt 23:13-15; 33)

“Salads” are healthy but only if you eat them....the Bible is a big “word salad”....how much of it have you bothered to digest?

“The Israel of God” is not today’s “nation of Israel”....and the Kingdom in which they were to be “kings and priests”, is from heaven over redeemed mankind on earth.

OT Jews had no concept of this arrangement....they believed that the Kingdom would be earthly, ruling from earthly Jerusalem....but Jesus showed his disciples a whole new way to look at what the kingdom was...who would share rulership and priesthood with High Priest Jesus Christ, and where they would be ruling from....earthly Jerusalem no longer figures in God’s plans for the future as the “holy land” is so polluted with hatred and bloodshed, that it is abhorrent to the God of this new “Israel”, who are now found in every nation on earth.
“Heavenly Jerusalem” is clean and ready to take over earth’s rulership....right now, as we await the final judgment soon to come.

1948 was a red herring...a distraction to move attention away from the true “Israel of God”.....this is a popular tactic of the devil....get people so distracted by stirring up their love of war, and their own nation’s place in the world, that they can’t see past the end of their noses...patriotism, contrary to popular belief, is not something Christians were ever encouraged to adopt...in fact it is a smoke screen, using carefully orchestrated emotions to replace the true Christian personality. This indoctrination begins in childhood.

Only those nations who are so engrossed in their own superiority will promote it. That way they always have martyrs to give their life for the ego and will of rich politicians....”for God and country” is not a motto ever promoted by Jesus...they are polar opposites when you know who rules the world. (1 John 5:19)

Those who support military bloodshed are “part of the world”.....those who consent to the bloodshed, even if they never fire a weapon, are complicit.

Being “NO part of the world” means not engaging in its primary activities....corrupt politics...greedy commercialism and false religion, who are all fleecing the ‘sheeples’ of their hard earned money to aggrandise themselves....and so many are fooled into becoming the casualties and honoured dead people that naturally result from man’s inhumanity to man. Honouring the dead when they have died in loyal obedience to their government, but sadly disobedient and disloyal to God.

The war mongers on these forums are betrayed by their complete lack of obedience to the Christ; those who would rather serve the interests of their governments, than the one they claim as their King....the “Prince of Peace”.

Neutrality is the only “Christian” position to take. The affairs of this world are none of our business....God has it all well in hand...or don’t you believe that?

Soon the end will come for Satan’s wicked world. How Jehovah will protect his people in the fear-inspiring ‘day of his anger’? (Zeph 2:3) Regardless of where we are and what our situation is at that time, however, we can be sure that our survival will depend on our faith in Jehovah and our obedience to him....not in the intervention of men with weapons of mass destruction.

Referring to the enemy hordes, coming against God’s people in ancient times, they were told....“Tomorrow go down against them. . . . You will not need to fight in this instance. Take your position, stand still and see the salvation of Jehovah in your behalf. O Judah and Jerusalem, do not be afraid or be terrified. Tomorrow go out against them, and Jehovah will be with you.” (2Chron 20:16-17)

To go out against an army of trained military men, unarmed except for their faith that God’s word, takes courage...it does not rely on the weapons of men but on God Jehovah, whose strength and military might will make the weapons on men look like water pistols.

Is Jehovah in control...or not? Does Jesus ever tell us to meddle in politics?
 
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RepentingChristian

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“Heavenly Jerusalem” is clean and ready to take over earth’s rulership....right now, as we await the final judgment soon to come.

Amos 9:14-15 esv doesn't say that God is creating a "new Jerusalem" (as does Revelation); it says that God will restore Israel and that's what he did.

Here is the YLT version of that same scripture which essentially has the same translation.

Amos 9:14-15 YLT
14 And I have turned back [to] the captivity of My people Israel, And they have built desolate cities, and inhabited, And have planted vineyards, and drunk their wine, And made gardens, and eaten their fruit.

15 And I have planted them on their own ground, And they are not plucked up any more from off their own ground, That I have given to them, said Jehovah thy God!

I believe that you are trying to force scriptures to fit your personal theology rather than going to where it takes you.
 

Dan Clarkston

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We “should do” what the spirit inside us tells us to do. The answer is not the same for everyone.

Reckon "god" is leading some to racist against Jewish people?

That would be the god of this world doing that, the devil.
 

Marvelloustime

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When o when is this people gonna stop trusting in men
and s tart trusting ONLY IN GOD , IN HIS CHRIST .
CURSED is the man , whether right or left WHOSE TRUST IS IN MAN
Blessed is the man whose HOPE BE IN GOD and THUS WOULD HAVE BEEN IN HIS CHRIST . bible time folks
@amigo de christo
save-image.png
 
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